Without PAP there is no Singapore today!!

[bigbossman]

Without PAP there is no Singapore today!!

I would rather say, without Singapore, there is no PAP today!!

 

[twinseeker]

Take a look at the stock exchange page of the Straits TImes and count the number of companies listed on the SGX today. It numbers into e hundreds. If you were going to invest your money into a listed company - I am sure you would want the independent directors to be a)honest, b) business savvy, c) financially independent, d) really smart. Hence, some PAP MP's sit on board of Directors, but also - many do not. Anyway, most listed companies Directors (Executive or Independent) are mostly senior lawyers, senior accountants, or bankers - NOT MP's! FYI - Ministers do not sit on any board of directors - except for those 100% owned by the Singaporean citizen (Temasek, GIC etc..). Lets face it, MP's all have day jobs too so being on a Board of Directors does not conflict with their duties as MP's since MP's do not formulate policies. Independent Directors are normally nominated by the company and serve terms of 2 to 5 years and come up for re-election to the board - which the shareholding public also puts in their inputs in a vote. Hope this helps!

Thanks for the enlightenment. The irony somehow is also questionable for some of the so called citizen owned organizations. Who accounts for the losses incurred? Are there means to recover the losses, or are the losses written off out of convenience?

 

[Fkapore]

Singapore will outlast the PAPeee. PAPee can rot & die with the death of LeeScumYew but Singapore will continue & be better.

 

[michael_368]

As far as i am concerned, PAP has done extrem well.

 

[kakowi]

well everyone is entitled to their opinions...

perhaps one point every singaporean who has a stake in the country should consider: "Could it have been better?"

 

[suteerak1099]

As far as i am concerned, PAP has done extrem well.

extremely well, compared against who? what? to be fair, 1 must compare apple to apple, or durian to durian, to justify how good is good... or in your case, extremely well?

 

[9IronBiatch]

no comments sia.. later tio charged.. haha

 

[jacker]

I totally agree without PAP there is no Singapore Today but come past is to remember it consider history of Singapore. i thanks PAP Old timer. u can't keep controlling your child one day he or she will rebel. this is happening now. your time is over enjoy your life and rest alot, let go all your burden pass to the new generation and don't interfere. We thanks u for what Singapore is today. I want real Democracy.


scare singaporean

 

[Wins88]

thanks for the heads up, but i still think its not necessary for public figures to be on those boards. besides listed companies, there're also other organizations. we should have noticed by now, that even if it wasnt a public figure involved, some1 related be it bloodlines or spouse may also be involved directly or indirectly.

if there was total transparency to begin with, there wouldnt be so much doubt following suit too. agree?

To be fair, there is a huge degree of transperancy and all is there for us to check - except - no one wants to check! From what little bit I know, we can actually get all these info from the Elections dept with regards to MP's and Ministers - all the way to gifts accepted! (Seem's these guys gotta report all gifts - even Xmas presents from friends!)
Anyway, Singapore is a small dot, and I truly believe that we gotta all stick together whether we like it or not - to make this whole place work for the better of all! Democracy follows prosperity - we are prospering now, and we are quite democratic now (when compared to the 80's and 90's) and things will change for sure. But I also believe that we gotta watch that ricebowl of ours carefully as this Country has no resources (no water, oil, food, etc..).

 

[Wins88]

Thanks for the enlightenment. The irony somehow is also questionable for some of the so called citizen owned organizations. Who accounts for the losses incurred? Are there means to recover the losses, or are the losses written off out of convenience?

That's a good point. Well, like every "unit trust fund" out in the market, I think it works in the same way. Some investments you win, some you lose - I doubt there is any "pow chiak" deals in this World leh. Of course, I too would love to see the top 20 holdings our govt. has and its performance just like a unit trust! But looking at how Singapore has prospered - I think it is in good hands so far! But yes, some form of report card should be published quarterly! On the other hand, the FED or Bank of England does not publish its holdings, loans or investments too! Maybe it is considered state secrets by USA and UK too!

 

[phouse3]

This must be one of the longest running urban legends in Singapore.

Let me ask: -
1. Who built the schools?
2. Who built the roads, the bridges, the ports?
3. Who built the legal system?
4. Who built the banking system?
5. Who built the public amenities?
6. Who built the houses?

PAP? hahahahahahaha. For goodness' sake, Singapore was founded in 1819, not 1963!

 

[Wins88]

This must be one of the longest running urban legends in Singapore.

Let me ask: -
1. Who built the schools?
2. Who built the roads, the bridges, the ports?
3. Who built the legal system?
4. Who built the banking system?
5. Who built the public amenities?
6. Who built the houses?

PAP? hahahahahahaha. For goodness' sake, Singapore was founded in 1819, not 1963!

Alamak, the answer is simple - Singaporeans lah!
Anyway, most of the schools were built after 1963, most of the roads, bridges, ports, highways were built after 1970, legal system was inherited from the British, ,odern banking system evolved in the late seventies, public ammenities is definitely after 1965, houses - majority - HDB.
But all built by Singaporeans for Singaporeans.

 

[Big Sexy]

let me put it this way...
is it easier to buy a new car or easier to maintain it??

PAP? hahahahahahaha. For goodness' sake, Singapore was founded in 1819, not 1963!

 

[Big Sexy]

i dont have the time these day to go thru all the posts.. but from the little i have read.. i believes he was referring to our neighbouring countries. Alot of which were better equipped to success than us.

If you were to ask me if i agrees with the younger PAP lot.. i tell you.. 'hell NO'.. but we cannot deny credits where it is due. The old guards have done a very good job.. There will be no modern Singapore without them, We would probably be a communist country.

I think many of you may need to refocus your rose tinted specs, like i always says, get the facts correct. Perspective is a 2-way street. Being tightly focused into the rose-tinted outlook all the time isn't good..

extremely well, compared against who? what? to be fair, 1 must compare apple to apple, or durian to durian, to justify how good is good... or in your case, extremely well?

 

[suteerak1099]

To be fair, there is a huge degree of transperancy and all is there for us to check - except - no one wants to check! From what little bit I know, we can actually get all these info from the Elections dept with regards to MP's and Ministers - all the way to gifts accepted! (Seem's these guys gotta report all gifts - even Xmas presents from friends!)
Anyway, Singapore is a small dot, and I truly believe that we gotta all stick together whether we like it or not - to make this whole place work for the better of all! Democracy follows prosperity - we are prospering now, and we are quite democratic now (when compared to the 80's and 90's) and things will change for sure. But I also believe that we gotta watch that ricebowl of ours carefully as this Country has no resources (no water, oil, food, etc..).

duly noted. just for clarity sake, i think ppl r nt complaining for the sake of complaining, neither r ppl ungrateful for wat the govt have done in the past. nobody can please everybody... bt looking at the number of headcount in the cabinet... if we observe carefully, not many of them are truly serving at the ppl's interest, bt to certain degree, perhaps could be viewed as profit driven.... hence, there's surely room for improvements.

 

[suteerak1099]

i dont have the time these day to go thru all the posts.. but from the little i have read.. i believes he was referring to our neighbouring countries. Alot of which were better equipped to success than us.

If you were to ask me if i agrees with the younger PAP lot.. i tell you.. 'hell NO'.. but we cannot deny credits where it is due. The old guards have done a very good job.. There will be no modern Singapore without them, We would probably be a communist country.

I think many of you may need to refocus your rose tinted specs, like i always says, get the facts correct. Perspective is a 2-way street. Being tightly focused into the rose-tinted outlook all the time isn't good..

of cos we dont discredit the govt for wat's been done in the past. however, life is such where we should be looking ahead, instead of staring at the rear view mirror admiring the past. if we shoul plot the progress on a chart, we can see that gradient has significantly lessen... n if there's no means to ensure it surges upwards... the next thing that comes along is a downhill gradient (steep or gentle... subjected to wat happens around us, n in the world)

 

[Wins88]

duly noted. just for clarity sake, i think ppl r nt complaining for the sake of complaining, neither r ppl ungrateful for wat the govt have done in the past. nobody can please everybody... bt looking at the number of headcount in the cabinet... if we observe carefully, not many of them are truly serving at the ppl's interest, bt to certain degree, perhaps could be viewed as profit driven.... hence, there's surely room for improvements.

Yes. Most of us has a bone or two to pick with the govt (just like citizens in all other nations - some more, some less). Yes, there are surely room for improvements - but I hope we don't make those improvements at the cost of our development and survival. I would not think that any of our cabinet members are profit driven and truly - my personal experience at a meet the peoples session (I needed MP help on some matters) tell me that these guys are actually a really nice and caring lot. But of course, different people have differing experiences with different MP's or Ministers, and we are all entitled to our own opinions.
I for one believe that the "instant American democracy" route is one principal which SHOULD never be applied to any Nation which has diverse populations or ethnics groups (Iraq, Afghanistan, Sierra Leone, Rwanda, Russia - in the nineties) as old rivalries and cultural hatred and blood feuds re-surface.
I think our Singaporean model of democracy works best, and as we prosper economically, we prosper democratically along the same pace to ensure that we protect our growth and wealth. Many Western Nations are taking pot shots at us today as we are testament that their brand of democracy has its pitfalls.

 

[Big Sexy]

Excellent piece of common sense suteerak1099...that was what i was saying and what the thread title suggests..... the old guards did they part and should be given credit for it.. hence i dont understand why people here are bashing LKY off.... slate off the young guns for all i care....

of cos we dont discredit the govt for wat's been done in the past. however, life is such where we should be looking ahead, instead of staring at the rear view mirror admiring the past.

 

[Big Sexy]

sadly i used to think the same about min yi as well..:(

but your 2nd point is spot on.. cannot agree more..

I would not think that any of our cabinet members are profit driven and truly

I for one believe that the "instant American democracy" route is one principal which SHOULD never be applied to any Nation which has diverse populations or ethnics groups

 

[suteerak1099]

Yes. Most of us has a bone or two to pick with the govt (just like citizens in all other nations - some more, some less). Yes, there are surely room for improvements - but I hope we don't make those improvements at the cost of our development and survival. I would not think that any of our cabinet members are profit driven and truly - my personal experience at a meet the peoples session (I needed MP help on some matters) tell me that these guys are actually a really nice and caring lot. But of course, different people have differing experiences with different MP's or Ministers, and we are all entitled to our own opinions.

well, i guess meet the ppl sessions r designed to hear the ppl out, n it was introduced since the early days. its quite similiar what is practiced in the SAF soldier monthly interview. we cant dismiss the fact that ppl from all walks of life have got concerns that may/may nt require redress from the relevant authorities, bt have u noticed the growth in the queues for meet the ppl session in recent yrs too?

I for one believe that the "instant American democracy" route is one principal which SHOULD never be applied to any Nation which has diverse populations or ethnics groups (Iraq, Afghanistan, Sierra Leone, Rwanda, Russia - in the nineties) as old rivalries and cultural hatred and blood feuds re-surface.
I think our Singaporean model of democracy works best, and as we prosper economically, we prosper democratically along the same pace to ensure that we protect our growth and wealth. Many Western Nations are taking pot shots at us today as we are testament that their brand of democracy has its pitfalls.

nobody's perfect, no legislative system can ever be perfect, all of which has its own unique flaws. however, if conceived proper in an avid attempt to be a lil more hollistic, there'd also be less to complain about, let alone knit-picking.

take for example how many new bills n regulations introduced in recent months, have they proven to be effective? if so, how much improvement? or have the new legislations caused more problems than before being introduced?

ie: the densitiy of ppl working in the CBD has increased steadily, naturally traffic flow to the city is inevitable. regardless how many more layers ERP gantries they erect, ppl still have to go to work. perhaps, the breakpoint comes 1 day, when ppl decide to change jobs n work in other parts of the island.... or if not, overseas.

ie: HDB was established to provide affordable housing for the population, but in the recent yrs, look how ridiculous have the prices become? approx 700k for a unit in AMK? with that same amount, wat's stopping ppl from getting condominiums instead?

ie: ppl keen to settle for affordable new neighborhood in punggol sector r also experiencing problems, where amenities r evidently remote n require personal mode of transport to run errands. r we nt convinced that the town planning in itself has short-comings as well?