What 6.9 million? It is 8 million!

[Agoraphobic]

That's the practice in the company. And I'm sure you're noticed many job ads say "....salaries commensurate with experience." I am not saying that my company pays exceptionally well (I could use a higher salary myself), but if the person can bring in more sales, s/he can confidently talk to the boss for higher pay or benefits, that I am sure of.

Cheers!

Sorry, but that's BS.

Salaries are often posted on job ads, usually a range or limit is quoted......

 

[Agoraphobic]

I did not say that my company could not hire anyone, we just couldn't get any local applicants but had shitloads of applicants from India, Myanmar, Vietnam, Philippines. The reason I was looking for a local was becase my colleagues felt that Hokkien would be an advantage. And all our applicants had University degrees! The reason I can think of that Singaporeans didn't even apply was that qualified Singaporeans would choose to work for a big name large multinational corporations. This is not my own concoction, when I speak to my nephews and nieces in uni, that is what they have in mind and not some local Ah Beng company. They have a choice to choose.

Cheers!

rubbish. then why does jobcentral have them? you want good workers fast post a salary. and this is how salaries go up natural when there is competition. Is this why your company could not hire anyone? Because they think you were hiding something?

 

[rushifa666]

and we are suppose to just take your word for it? look, either show the ad or end the topic. there must be a sample at least somewhere. the company is totally not hiring people?

 

[winnipegjets]

I did not say that my company could not hire anyone, we just couldn't get any local applicants but had shitloads of applicants from India, Myanmar, Vietnam, Philippines. The reason I was looking for a local was becase my colleagues felt that Hokkien would be an advantage. And all our applicants had University degrees! The reason I can think of that Singaporeans didn't even apply was that qualified Singaporeans would choose to work for a big name large multinational corporations. This is not my own concoction, when I speak to my nephews and nieces in uni, that is what they have in mind and not some local Ah Beng company. They have a choice to choose.

And they don't want to work for Ah Beng company because there is no prospect. Ah Beng companies have to make themselves attractive with better management, efficient, good career path and the prospect that the Ah Beng small fry will become Ah Beng Inc.

 

[winnipegjets]

It's already happening. The private sector is ahead of the government in this. Many years ago, some of my commercial associates moved their operations to various locations in Johor. Now, regular blokes are moving their residences there. Only one thing is preventing them from doing it more "wholesomely" - their kid's education.

Cheers!

Good luck to them. Investing in Mudland is like playing Russian roulette.

Someday, ethnic clashes will breakout like that in Serbia and ethnic cleansing commences ...lhttp://www.themalaysianinsider.com/malaysia/article/putrajaya-to-probe-claims-that-ridhuan-tee-conducted-lessons-on-ethnic-clea

 

[winnipegjets]

Definitely. The world is getting smaller and working in another country is getting quite normal. The problem the gov't faces will be complicated by the CPF issue. If one took up another citizenship and still retain Sg citizenship, would that person be allowed to withdraw their CPF?

Cheers!

Globalization will end ...with the majority of people in developed countries being hurt by globalization, it is when not will it.

 

[winnipegjets]

Welcomed or not, that is up to the sentiment of the day. The factors sorrounding the labour factor will determine where the labour force heads to. My company advertised for sales engineers early in 2013, by July, we were still awaiting locals to apply (ability to converse in Hokkien is an advantage but not necessary). By August, my boss had it with waiting and we employed two foreigners. Neither societal sentiments nor government policy dictates the decision for this, economic needs take over.

Cheers!

The PAP government made it easy for your company to hire foreigners. That is the problem.
If the regulations stipulate that foreigners must earn a minimum of $15k a month, I doubt your company will hire the foreigner.
We don't hire foreign expertise but foreign leeches.

 

[winnipegjets]

Nope. My coy is a Singapore company, wholly owned by Singaporeans, with regional operations, international representations. Majority of the staff are Singaporeans. In the last few years, a number of employeers are Malaysians. Only this year did we employ PRCs, and so far, their performance equals any locals we could have got.

Cheers!

How much are they paying the Ah Tiongs?

 

[winnipegjets]

Salaries are not posted on the job ads. This part of the employment contract is open to negotiation between the imcumbent and management, and it is natural for both sides to maximise what is to their benefit. In this case, I go through the applicants and shortlist them for the first interview and do the first round selection. After that, the selected person comes in for another interview with a panel, and it is up to him/her to ask for what he/she thinks s/he is worth and convince the panel, which may or may not include the company's finance manager (he signs the pay/claims approvals). Sorry, I am unable to post the ad, you want to view it, wait for the next round we need to hire, or look in Job Market on the internet.

Cheers!

You can bet the Ah Tiong applicant will undercut the local.

 

[winnipegjets]

Commercial (B2B) goods to the manufacturing sector. Sales in this sector to Singapore manufacurers involves working with purchasers and sometime technical staff in the production or R&D. English is mostly used but sometimes especially when the interaction moves on to "small talk," it is in casual Hokkien, or rather Singlish. Once the relationship is established and ongoing, the conversation on business essentials only involves delivery schedules on repeat orders, stock replenishment. Sales visits comes down to periodic goodwill visits and year-end or festive "gifts."

Yes, the demand for the goods due to other factors dictate the volume of sales, but the relationship forged by the salesperson with the customers keeps the business from going to the competitor. In this, sometimes speaking Hokkien (or other local lingos) help. Of course when speaking to the decision maker in a large MNC, you won't need it. All our local sales people are able to switch between English and a couple of Chinese dialects. Our company I believe pays a fair "market rate." Else our sales blokes would run off to our competitors.

Cheers!

So, how will the Ah Tiongs sales people be able to do the job?
I would urge procurement managers out there, as a service to the country, to shun Ah Tiongs and Ah Neh sales rep.

 

[winnipegjets]

I can't visualize a right-winged group in Singapore. The military commanders who join politics are PAP supporters, and general or not I don't see any of them able to handle a school-yard brawl let alone beat up foreigners (I can tell, I am not a fighter but I can take on one-to-one any of your military generals). There are no right or left winged politics in Singapore. Singaporeans have been de-politicised two generations ago.

Cheers!

The PAP is a right-wing party and sinkees have been conditioned to accept right-wing ideology. Lately there has been an awakening because the right-wing bs does not jive with reality.

 

[tanwahtiu]

old fart loong is in his 60s now and not much stamina to lead.

Yes, how can he lead at his age pass 70s and he is one of the members of aging population.

At the rate they get SAF scholars to be leaders, wait till we get one mad military man to lead Singapore to war. Soldiers are train for wars not economic?

I wonder why anyone will want to let PAP survive till 2030. Even with constant garbage like this. Make a guess what your pay will be then with even more foreign workers

 

[Agoraphobic]

If you're so interested, go look in Job Street Jan 2013, I am not interested or bothered to prove this further than saying it.

Cheers!

and we are suppose to just take your word for it? look, either show the ad or end the topic. there must be a sample at least somewhere. the company is totally not hiring people?

 

[Agoraphobic]

It's their choice who they want to work for, its an open market. For both sides.

Cheers!

And they don't want to work for Ah Beng company because there is no prospect. Ah Beng companies have to make themselves attractive with better management, efficient, good career path and the prospect that the Ah Beng small fry will become Ah Beng Inc.

 

[Agoraphobic]

Investing is taking a chance, or calculated risk. We do what we can today based on what we know today, tomorrow is anyone's guess.

Cheers!

Good luck to them. Investing in Mudland is like playing Russian roulette.

Someday, ethnic clashes will breakout like that in Serbia and ethnic cleansing commences ...lhttp://www.themalaysianinsider.com/malaysia/article/putrajaya-to-probe-claims-that-ridhuan-tee-conducted-lessons-on-ethnic-clea

 

[Agoraphobic]

I suppose you're right, the world will end one day. And until that day, life goes on. We do what we can while we can under whatever circumstances we're in. Those who wish to wait for the world to end, they can jolly well wait. The rest of us have a life to live.

Cheers!

Globalization will end ...with the majority of people in developed countries being hurt by globalization, it is when not will it.

 

[Agoraphobic]

Your government is your problem, or your blessing depends on how you wish to look at it. From what I know, they were selected by popular vote in fair elections. I only come here to work.

Cheers!

The PAP government made it easy for your company to hire foreigners. That is the problem.
If the regulations stipulate that foreigners must earn a minimum of $15k a month, I doubt your company will hire the foreigner.
We don't hire foreign expertise but foreign leeches.

 

[Agoraphobic]

I did not ask. But I believe they are paid about what a fresh grad from NUS might be getting, rough guess is around 3K plus or minus one or two hundred.? Just guessing.

BTW, I am of the school of thought that workers can claim what they're worth after they've proved it, not before showing they can work just based on some academic credentials. People skills are worth more than paper qualifications in the working world.

Cheers!

How much are they paying the Ah Tiongs?

 

[Agoraphobic]

The market is open. What's to stop another country from charging less that what Singapore can offer to the world? If someone who charges less and gives the same performance, we will pay him or her more before s/he goes to our competition. That's they way capitalism work. If Hyundai makes a car as good as Honda for a lesser price, which would you buy?

Cheers!

You can bet the Ah Tiong applicant will undercut the local.

 

[Agoraphobic]

From my observation, they are trying very hard. Friendly with the other staff, polite and obliging to customers, punctual for work, do not report sick. I am unable to find any fault in them so far. Our customers are not concerned about the nationality of their suppliers. They are only concerned with the standard of the service received.

Before you go around running down these foreigners working in Singapore, spare a thought for your Singapore brothers and sisters working in PRC and how they might be treated there if Chinese nationals are harassed here in Singapore.

Cheers!

So, how will the Ah Tiongs sales people be able to do the job?
I would urge procurement managers out there, as a service to the country, to shun Ah Tiongs and Ah Neh sales rep.