TKL or TCB? Which is the lesser of two evils?

[AndroAsc]

Ok I'm going to assume we are all anti-PAP here. pro-PAP dogs can fuck off from this thread. And I know the EP has no real power and the president erections is just a sham... but anyway makes a good discussion material.

None of us are going to vote for Tony Tan the fucker. So it's left between TCB and TKL. My logic for votes is to vote for the lesser evil. So what are forumers opinion on this?

TKL
- Is an opportunistic and cunning bastard. I believe this is 90% true. I reckon he's been planning for EP all along. He jumped onto the minibond fiasco to make him look good, and he's trying to portray the image of the "reluctant leader", being forced to serve the people for the good of Sinkies. However, this is not necessarily a bad thing.
- Doesn't take criticism against him very well. This is 100% true, and I can tell from my non-political email interactions with him (on financial matters). However, the positive side is most of the stuff he has said or claimed is more right than wrong.
- Supposedly had a fallout with the PAP and now he wants to "get revenge". Not sure how true is this... but if it's true there's an old saying that "the enemy of my enemy is my friend". Ok fine, maybe he's an opportunistic and cunning bastard, but if he makes life hard for the PAP he's our bitch, not the PAP's bitch.
- However, the risk of such opportunistic bastards is that if he becomes EP, the PAP top brass may strike a deal with him. Give him lots of money and power and face, and in return he will "wayang" a bit to keep his promises but never hit on the hard issues.

TCB
- Don't know much about his character. Shitty Times have been saying he is kind hearted, give free medical care, etc... I'm not sure if I fully buy into it, but I think he's less opportunistic and less cunning than TKL... which again may not be a good thing.
- Supposedly doesn't toe the party line very well, based on Shitty Times and other internet rumors. However, the fact that he's still with the PAP shows that he has not enough balls to do what is right. No moral courage at all.
- In terms of qualifications I think TCB will be clueless of how to fuck PAP about the reserves. He's a fucking doctor for god's sake. At least TKL with experience in finances will know how to dig out shit... TCB might not even recognize shit when he sees it! Besides... I think this guy is low on promises. WTF has he promised so far?
- Supposedly he is the preferred candidate of the "PAP grassroot" faction, that are unhappy with the "PAP elite" faction. Assuming that this is true, making him EP may open up a fifth column, where the PAP grassroots will give trouble or even better take on the PAP elites. Best possible scenario is that there will be an internal split amongst the PAP... but unlikely. There's also a risk that since this TCB has a track record of lack of moral courage, the PAP may just find someway to keep him quiet and the fifth column will die out even before it begins.

So who is the lesser of the two evils? Let's discuss! I'm inclined to vote for TKL. We need a fucker like him to take on the PAP fuckers, not some pussy dick backbencher MP like TCB. My argument is that I don't really give a fuck about how fucked up TKL character is, as long as he makes PAP's life hard I will be happy. Allied forces worked with Stalin (a fucker) in WW2 to fight Hitler (the bigger fucker)... I think the analogy is a good one here!

 

[pinkpanther7]

Ok I'm going to assume we are all anti-PAP here. pro-PAP dogs can fuck off from this thread. And I know the EP has no real power and the president erections is just a sham... but anyway makes a good discussion material.

None of us are going to vote for Tony Tan the fucker. So it's left between TCB and TKL. My logic for votes is to vote for the lesser evil. So what are forumers opinion on this?

TKL
- Is an opportunistic and cunning bastard. I believe this is 90% true. I reckon he's been planning for EP all along. He jumped onto the minibond fiasco to make him look good, and he's trying to portray the image of the "reluctant leader", being forced to serve the people for the good of Sinkies. However, this is not necessarily a bad thing.
- Doesn't take criticism against him very well. This is 100% true, and I can tell from my non-political email interactions with him (on financial matters). However, the positive side is most of the stuff he has said or claimed is more right than wrong.
- Supposedly had a fallout with the PAP and now he wants to "get revenge". Not sure how true is this... but if it's true there's an old saying that "the enemy of my enemy is my friend". Ok fine, maybe he's an opportunistic and cunning bastard, but if he makes life hard for the PAP he's our bitch, not the PAP's bitch.
- However, the risk of such opportunistic bastards is that if he becomes EP, the PAP top brass may strike a deal with him. Give him lots of money and power and face, and in return he will "wayang" a bit to keep his promises but never hit on the hard issues.

TCB
- Don't know much about his character. Shitty Times have been saying he is kind hearted, give free medical care, etc... I'm not sure if I fully buy into it, but I think he's less opportunistic and less cunning than TKL... which again may not be a good thing.
- Supposedly doesn't toe the party line very well, based on Shitty Times and other internet rumors. However, the fact that he's still with the PAP shows that he has not enough balls to do what is right. No moral courage at all.
- In terms of qualifications I think TCB will be clueless of how to fuck PAP about the reserves. He's a fucking doctor for god's sake. At least TKL with experience in finances will know how to dig out shit... TCB might not even recognize shit when he sees it! Besides... I think this guy is low on promises. WTF has he promised so far?
- Supposedly he is the preferred candidate of the "PAP grassroot" faction, that are unhappy with the "PAP elite" faction. Assuming that this is true, making him EP may open up a fifth column, where the PAP grassroots will give trouble or even better take on the PAP elites. Best possible scenario is that there will be an internal split amongst the PAP... but unlikely. There's also a risk that since this TCB has a track record of lack of moral courage, the PAP may just find someway to keep him quiet and the fifth column will die out even before it begins.

So who is the lesser of the two evils? Let's discuss! I'm inclined to vote for TKL. We need a fucker like him to take on the PAP fuckers, not some pussy dick backbencher MP like TCB. My argument is that I don't really give a fuck about how fucked up TKL character is, as long as he makes PAP's life hard I will be happy. Allied forces allied with Stalin (a fucker) in WW2 to fight Hitler (the bigger fucker)... I think the analogy is a good one here!

Yes, it is a difficult choice for me to choose between TKL and TCB. I will have to watch closely during the campaigning period to see who can really serve as a counter balance to the PAP. Tony Tan is out for me.

 

[sharingan83]

Ok I'm going to assume we are all anti-PAP here. pro-PAP dogs can fuck off from this thread. And I know the EP has no real power and the president erections is just a sham... but anyway makes a good discussion material.

None of us are going to vote for Tony Tan the fucker. So it's left between TCB and TKL. My logic for votes is to vote for the lesser evil. So what are forumers opinion on this?

TKL
- Is an opportunistic and cunning bastard. I believe this is 90% true. I reckon he's been planning for EP all along. He jumped onto the minibond fiasco to make him look good, and he's trying to portray the image of the "reluctant leader", being forced to serve the people for the good of Sinkies. However, this is not necessarily a bad thing.
- Doesn't take criticism against him very well. This is 100% true, and I can tell from my non-political email interactions with him (on financial matters). However, the positive side is most of the stuff he has said or claimed is more right than wrong.
- Supposedly had a fallout with the PAP and now he wants to "get revenge". Not sure how true is this... but if it's true there's an old saying that "the enemy of my enemy is my friend". Ok fine, maybe he's an opportunistic and cunning bastard, but if he makes life hard for the PAP he's our bitch, not the PAP's bitch.
- However, the risk of such opportunistic bastards is that if he becomes EP, the PAP top brass may strike a deal with him. Give him lots of money and power and face, and in return he will "wayang" a bit to keep his promises but never hit on the hard issues.

TCB
- Don't know much about his character. Shitty Times have been saying he is kind hearted, give free medical care, etc... I'm not sure if I fully buy into it, but I think he's less opportunistic and less cunning than TKL... which again may not be a good thing.
- Supposedly doesn't toe the party line very well, based on Shitty Times and other internet rumors. However, the fact that he's still with the PAP shows that he has not enough balls to do what is right. No moral courage at all.
- In terms of qualifications I think TCB will be clueless of how to fuck PAP about the reserves. He's a fucking doctor for god's sake. At least TKL with experience in finances will know how to dig out shit... TCB might not even recognize shit when he sees it! Besides... I think this guy is low on promises. WTF has he promised so far?
- Supposedly he is the preferred candidate of the "PAP grassroot" faction, that are unhappy with the "PAP elite" faction. Assuming that this is true, making him EP may open up a fifth column, where the PAP grassroots will give trouble or even better take on the PAP elites. Best possible scenario is that there will be an internal split amongst the PAP... but unlikely. There's also a risk that since this TCB has a track record of lack of moral courage, the PAP may just find someway to keep him quiet and the fifth column will die out even before it begins.

So who is the lesser of the two evils? Let's discuss! I'm inclined to vote for TKL. We need a fucker like him to take on the PAP fuckers, not some pussy dick backbencher MP like TCB. My argument is that I don't really give a fuck about how fucked up TKL character is, as long as he makes PAP's life hard I will be happy. Allied forces worked with Stalin (a fucker) in WW2 to fight Hitler (the bigger fucker)... I think the analogy is a good one here!

Lesser of two evils I agree but what variables are you taking into account in arriving at your decision?

e.g level of perceived independence, financial savvy, 'track record'. list them out and lets rationalise this together.

 

[Unrepented]

.....

So who is the lesser of the two evils? Let's discuss! I'm inclined to vote for TKL. We need a fucker like him to take on the PAP fuckers, not some pussy dick backbencher MP like TCB. My argument is that I don't really give a fuck about how fucked up TKL character is, as long as he makes PAP's life hard I will be happy. Allied forces worked with Stalin (a fucker) in WW2 to fight Hitler (the bigger fucker)... I think the analogy is a good one here!

<iframe width="425" height="349" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/zCfyOXJf3ZM" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

 

[bhoven]

<iframe width="425" height="349" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/zCfyOXJf3ZM" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

We may well be exercising our minds for naught as I suspect both will not get the COE ( their eligibilty rests on thin grounds ). All I want is that they just pay the guy a nominal retainer ( by all means let him live in the Istana and host open days on public holidays, read out speeches prepared for him at Parliamentary openings, travel round the world but not in an Airforce 1, meet foreign dignatories after extensive MFA briefings and midnight cramming on aide memoires, host gala dinners attired in Saville Row outfits and what not BUT for goodness sake pay him no more than 'peanuts' as defined by Mrs GCT as this is just a sinecure ceremonial and symbolic non job no more no less.

 

[karmabear]

I find TKL more of a pussy in the way he conducted his campaign. I dun like flip floppers... Even if you have an opinion that I disagree with, I expect you to defend it as a political candidate. Example GMS might be a total idiot, but he sticks to his guns. I dunno why TKL never learn from him.

I will be supporting TCB as I find his track record of standing up for issues he believes in admirable. He was like the Lily Neo of the 1980s. Not so easy to stand up to the old man. So far only TCB and Lily Neo come to mind. Generally, I prefer medical doctors, at least they started out with some kind of heart. Most finance guys are motherfuckers since birth.

 

[leoman]

no nid discuss
by hook-or-by crook .... 1 of 'em will b president [whether u like it or not]
"they" may try 2 disqualify tan kl ... [reasons we all know well]

since ep is a "puppet" n pap propoganda .... [n fm recent 'blare-off' fm our non-loving-outgoing president]


nid it b ..... let 'em f**, argue, qns, probe, scrutinize [or watever] each other 4 all they want
den
we can c d "inner devil" of either parties, if there r

aft all, our lives IS OREADY SCREW-UP by d ruling pap
so
wat's d matter if let in another "little screws"

i m with u on d vote !! [coz i never vote a president endorsed, support n recommend by ruling pap]

Ok I'm going to assume we are all anti-PAP here. pro-PAP dogs can fuck off from this thread. And I know the EP has no real power and the president erections is just a sham... but anyway makes a good discussion material.

None of us are going to vote for Tony Tan the fucker. So it's left between TCB and TKL. My logic for votes is to vote for the lesser evil. So what are forumers opinion on this?

So who is the lesser of the two evils? Let's discuss! I'm inclined to vote for TKL. We need a fucker like him to take on the PAP fuckers, not some pussy dick backbencher MP like TCB. My argument is that I don't really give a fuck about how fucked up TKL character is, as long as he makes PAP's life hard I will be happy. Allied forces worked with Stalin (a fucker) in WW2 to fight Hitler (the bigger fucker)... I think the analogy is a good one here!

 

[jw5]

We may well be exercising our minds for naught as I suspect both will not get the COE ( their eligibilty rests on thin grounds ).

Why does TCB's eligibility rest on thin grounds?
He has been the chairman of Chuan Hup Holdings Ltd, a SGX listed company with paid up capital more than $100 Million for many years.

One thing about TKL.
Why do so many people assume that there will be an antangonistic relationship between pap government and TKL and he will take them on?
What if the pap government treat him with the utmost respect and deference?

 

[scroobal]

Though TCB qualifies and did not seek eligibility under a special category like TKL. The committee can still rule that it does not meet the quality criteria.

Chuan Hup is not the type of company that they had in mind. It is essentially a family run business albeit listed. It has a 5 man board of directors oh which 3 are independent. One of the "independent" directors is Prof Tan Cheng Han who also sits on the remuneration committee. Yet his wife is the most senior management staff who is not a director and who heads legal and is the company secretary. Apparently he sits out when they discuss his wife's pay. Similar to the Malaysian cabinet minister who sat out while bumi shares were granted to her son. The financials also seem to indicate speculative investments that seem outside their core business and thus higher than usual volatility.

I found it amazing and more so that he is an SC and Dean of law faculty and it is a listed company.

This Presidential elections seemed to show woeful lack of competency in the English Language with people struggling with the meaning of "smears" and "independents".

The company accounts will be scrutinised before they make a decision. The way the qualifications are spelt out is poor when it comes to the private sector and any decision in this space can lead to a court challenge.

Why does TCB's eligibility rest on thin grounds?
He has been the chairman of Chuan Hup Holdings Ltd, a SGX listed company with paid up capital more than $100 Million for many years.

One thing about TKL.
Why do so many people assume that there will be an antangonistic relationship between pap government and TKL and he will take them on?
What if the pap government treat him with the utmost respect and deference?

 

[sense]

The other perspective one should seriously consider is who has inflicted more pain to the PAP while they were benefiting from the Govt, ie.
(1) while TCB was drawing his MP allowance from the Govt,
(2) while TKL was drawing his monthly salary while still in NTUC Income, indirectly related to PAP

One can make a lot of hoo-ha after their association with the Govt because they no longer have vested interest to obey... it's what they do (or NOT do) while they still have vested interest during the past that really counts.

Don't let the short-term illusion fool you.

 

[jw5]

Though TCB qualifies and did not seek eligibility under a special category like TKL. The committee can still rule that it does not meet the quality criteria.

This quality criteria is a subjective one?
Perhaps it's not the type of company they had in mind, but it could also be argued that
all the more reason TCB was needed to do a good job on corporate governance and accountability/transparency.

Chuan Hup Holdings started off as a shipping and marine logistics company, then listed its offshore marine company supporting oil and gas industry CH Offshore. Now, Chuan Hup has diverse investments in marine, property, manufacturing, etc, hence it's inevitable that the earnings will fluctuate. Don't really think that this will be a critical factor, otherwise it will be very restrictive to the number of candidates available. Even SPH now has property and mall rental business, which is very different from their original media business.

 

[jw5]

The other perspective one should seriously consider is who inflicted more pain to the PAP while they were benefiting from the Govt,

One of the forummers considered the perspective of who would inflict more pain on the pap if he became president.
Why does so many people assume it would be TKL?

My perspective is who the pap will inflict more pain on if he became president, i.e. who would become most concerned or flustered by the pap's actions.

 

[annexa]

I am a bit suspect you are a pappy try to discord between TKL and TCB, make them angry and fight each other so both will lose. But I answer you. You see why.

TKL
- Is an opportunistic and cunning bastard. I believe this is 90% true. I reckon he's been planning for EP all along. He jumped onto the minibond fiasco to make him look good, and he's trying to portray the image of the "reluctant leader", being forced to serve the people for the good of Sinkies. However, this is not necessarily a bad thing.
- Doesn't take criticism against him very well. This is 100% true, and I can tell from my non-political email interactions with him (on financial matters). However, the positive side is most of the stuff he has said or claimed is more right than wrong.
- Supposedly had a fallout with the PAP and now he wants to "get revenge". Not sure how true is this... but if it's true there's an old saying that "the enemy of my enemy is my friend". Ok fine, maybe he's an opportunistic and cunning bastard, but if he makes life hard for the PAP he's our bitch, not the PAP's bitch.
- However, the risk of such opportunistic bastards is that if he becomes EP, the PAP top brass may strike a deal with him. Give him lots of money and power and face, and in return he will "wayang" a bit to keep his promises but never hit on the hard issues.

TKL also has fault that he "listens to my supporter" very much. He almost got no blog post that is not "according to my supporter". Who the fuck is this supporter? Puppet master?

TKL finance is very power. This one I like.

TCB
- Don't know much about his character. Shitty Times have been saying he is kind hearted, give free medical care, etc... I'm not sure if I fully buy into it, but I think he's less opportunistic and less cunning than TKL... which again may not be a good thing.
- Supposedly doesn't toe the party line very well, based on Shitty Times and other internet rumors. However, the fact that he's still with the PAP shows that he has not enough balls to do what is right. No moral courage at all.
- In terms of qualifications I think TCB will be clueless of how to fuck PAP about the reserves. He's a fucking doctor for god's sake. At least TKL with experience in finances will know how to dig out shit... TCB might not even recognize shit when he sees it! Besides... I think this guy is low on promises. WTF has he promised so far?
- Supposedly he is the preferred candidate of the "PAP grassroot" faction, that are unhappy with the "PAP elite" faction. Assuming that this is true, making him EP may open up a fifth column, where the PAP grassroots will give trouble or even better take on the PAP elites. Best possible scenario is that there will be an internal split amongst the PAP... but unlikely. There's also a risk that since this TCB has a track record of lack of moral courage, the PAP may just find someway to keep him quiet and the fifth column will die out even before it begins.

So who is the lesser of the two evils? Let's discuss! I'm inclined to vote for TKL. We need a fucker like him to take on the PAP fuckers, not some pussy dick backbencher MP like TCB. My argument is that I don't really give a fuck about how fucked up TKL character is, as long as he makes PAP's life hard I will be happy. Allied forces worked with Stalin (a fucker) in WW2 to fight Hitler (the bigger fucker)... I think the analogy is a good one here!

I agree with you most what you say TCB. But I got corrected by forummer here before, so I correct you now. TCB is independent director of Chuan Hup, $100million company. He last time also Director in this big European bank that come Singapore. I think is the German one. So you cannot say "he is only a medical doctor".

Scroobal also point out that he is one of 3 who man a machine gun nest in parliament. He has track record of making it pain for PAP even when he was PAP. Now he no more PAP, I think he will have laser gun and bombardment gun.

 

[Windsor]

I am a bit suspect you are a pappy try to discord between TKL and TCB, make them angry and fight each other so both will lose. But I answer you. You see why.



TKL also has fault that he "listens to my supporter" very much. He almost got no blog post that is not "according to my supporter". Who the fuck is this supporter? Puppet master?

TKL finance is very power. This one I like.



I agree with you most what you say TCB. But I got corrected by forummer here before, so I correct you now. TCB is independent director of Chuan Hup, $100million company. He last time also Director in this big European bank that come Singapore. I think is the German one. So you cannot say "he is only a medical doctor".

Scroobal also point out that he is one of 3 who man a machine gun nest in parliament. He has track record of making it pain for PAP even when he was PAP. Now he no more PAP, I think he will have laser gun and bombardment gun.

Haha...TS has an agenda. Don't believe what he saying. He is here as a disguised TKL supporter pretending to be unbiased.

 

[Rogue Trader]

I was actually neutral until TKL's online campaigning began. Now I am quite sure I will not vote for him.

 

[Unrepented]

....

We may well be exercising our minds for naught as I suspect both will not get the COE ( their eligibilty rests on thin grounds ).

At least thru this EP election we get to see the true face of certain factions within the opposition camp. Their perception of the intellect level of opposition supporters, as well as their feeble attempts trying to fuck with our minds.

 

[bhoven]

Though TCB qualifies and did not seek eligibility under a special category like TKL. The committee can still rule that it does not meet the quality criteria.

Chuan Hup is not the type of company that they had in mind. It is essentially a family run business albeit listed. It has a 5 man board of directors oh which 3 are independent. One of the "independent" directors is Prof Tan Cheng Han who also sits on the remuneration committee. Yet his wife is the most senior management staff who is not a director and who heads legal and is the company secretary. Apparently he sits out when they discuss his wife's pay. Similar to the Malaysian cabinet minister who sat out while bumi shares were granted to her son. The financials also seem to indicate speculative investments that seem outside their core business and thus higher than usual volatility.

I found it amazing and more so that he is an SC and Dean of law faculty and it is a listed company.

This Presidential elections seemed to show woeful lack of competency in the English Language with people struggling with the meaning of "smears" and "independents".

The company accounts will be scrutinised before they make a decision. The way the qualifications are spelt out is poor when it comes to the private sector and any decision in this space can lead to a court challenge.

Tks...I believe he is a non Executive Chairman

 

[neddy]

This quality criteria is a subjective one?

My NTUC informer asked me ...

Who exactly is TKL? What does he really stand for?

TKL is a cunning smiling tiger who in his NTUC days used the inhouse forum to get ideas, he used different aliases to solicit others' views of him. His loyalists were happy for him to "steal" their ideas. This guy really know how to get information and use them. Too bad, this post reveal this aspect of him.

TKL is an working class opportunist who just happened to be at the right place at the right time. He started as a programmer at GE Life. Is he talented?

How does he run Income? Anyone working there will tell you that he runs the company like a Chinaman - micromanaging the managers, doing underhanded things - like sacking people he does not like & favoritism for his pet agents and certain managers.

Eg A female Financial manager sidelined by moving her into a corner desk and then forced to resign for political reasons. Her connection with a PAP MP who scrutinise his shady activities in Income.

Why didn't TKL run for MP under the NTUC banner? LKY does not like him?
Is that why he stand together with GCT, using NTUC to sponsor things in Marine Parade eg noticeboards at lift lobbies?
Why did he left Income, was he pushed?

What is his relationship with Chinese company, eBao? Is there conflict of interest here?

All these told to me by a reliable source who used to work on a certain floor in Bras Basah building where TKL loved to patronise - because of all the good-looking ladies were there.

In the end, TKL comes from the same mould as the average PAP people of his generation. He will make a poor choice as EP, a Chinese prataman. Luckily, neither my informer or I no longer live in Singapore and are spared the agony of electing a dud.

** TKL character flaw include rehabbing a certain corrupted PAP buddy and return him back to NTUC back into procurement role where suspicious things happened. That guy also got TKL a Merc to replace an old Volvo provided by NTUC. My informer told me something about Fort Canning Country club scandal but I cannot recall much **


Yes NTUC building in Bras Basah has a swimming pool & gym on the rooftop, accessible by staircase.

 

[scroobal]

No need to be exec Chairman to qualify. Just Chairman of $100m company can do.

Tks...I believe he is a non Executive Chairman

 

[CannonFairy]

TCB. He has proven himself to be a people's person despite being associated with the MIW. TKL, on the other hand is an opportunists.