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The use of the word "Allah". Please be sensitive when you offer your views.

FuckSamLeong

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The ongoing saga of the Roman Catholic Church of Malaysia use of the word "Allah" in their newsletter, what are your views?

The Malaysian High Court had suspended it's own order to allow the Catholic Church to use the word "Allah" pending the outcome from the Court of Appeal.

There is great outrage among many Muslims in Malaysia who construed the action on the part of the Church as being an insult and a challenge to "Muslim Malay" pride.

Are there fair and valid grounds to such an angry response?

Having been brought in a Singapore where racial and religious harmony is held with the most critical of regards, I am inclined to see things on the side of Muslim Malays.

Personally, I would frown on any attempt to proselytise a Malay Muslim. It's just too much like pouring kerosene from a tank just to have a bigger fire. Do not seek but be found.

That said, if the Catholic newsletter is printed in Malay, how should they address God?
 

kingrant

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The ongoing saga of the Roman Catholic Church of Malaysia use of the word "Allah" in their newsletter, what are your views?

The Malaysian High Court had suspended it's own order to allow the Catholic Church to use the word "Allah" pending the outcome from the Court of Appeal.

There is great outrage among many Muslims in Malaysia who construed the action on the part of the Church as being an insult and a challenge to "Muslim Malay" pride.

Are there fair and valid grounds to such an angry response?

Having been brought in a Singapore where racial and religious harmony is held with the most critical of regards, I am inclined to see things on the side of Muslim Malays.

Personally, I would frown on any attempt to proselytise a Malay Muslim. It's just too much like pouring kerosene from a tank just to have a bigger fire. Do not seek but be found.

That said, if the Catholic newsletter is printed in Malay, how should they address God?

Acc to what I have read, it seems the Catholic priests have been preaching the Catholic faith to Dayak followers in Bahasa Melayu and have been using "Allah" as a translation for God all these years. The source did not say why such a controversial term was chosen and why it is now becoming an issue. Dr Mahathir now said instead of Allah, they could have used "Tuhan".

But guts-wise, given the sensitivities, indeed Allah should not be used. Others who argue dispassionately on an intellectual property rights platform may be right, but with these things, there is no room for dispassionate discourse. Allah when used by non-Muslims does tend to be inflammatory and should be discontinued.
 

shOUTloud

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I think the Catholics are trying to be too clever here. In this case, it is not as if there are no alternatives. They are all using romanised characters so using the word God is understandable enough. I understood Allah to be the Islam god so Catholics using Allah is a bit too confusing.
 

FuckSamLeong

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what about those 'muslim' screaming Allah Akbar while exploding the bomb in front of innocent civilians at the same time? you think they are inflammatory and degrading to Allah?

Those are not Muslims! They are lunatics! Just like someone with a grinning cat avatar that I know in this forum!:mad:
 

FuckSamLeong

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Allah ruling: Najib, be a '1Malaysia PM'Jan 3, 10 7:57am'The Christian citizens in Sarawak have been using the word 'Allah' in their worship for ages as the local natives are all schooled in Bahasa, thus the churches have to conduct their worship in BM.'


PM's Dept to appeal 'Allah' ruling

Theraykatiswatching: Mr Prime Minister, are you prime minister for Malay Muslims only or prime minister of all Malaysians? If you are PM of all Malaysians, please be one.

The Christian citizens in Sarawak have been using the word 'Allah' in their worship for ages as the local natives are all schooled in Bahasa Malaysia, thus the churches have to conduct their worship in BM, and the words, 'Allah', 'Maha Esa', etc, are often used.

Even the name of the church is in BM - the Sidang Injil Borneo. Please be reminded that the Dayak natives are the majority and Malay Muslims constitute only about 20 percent of the population of Sarawak. I believe it is the same in Sabah. Also East Malaysians provide you 50 percent parliamentary seats, so don't bully us!

Ahmad Iqhbal: Read this - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Allah#Pre-Islamic_Arabia

Fly Emirates: Ahmad Iqbal is spot on... there are tonnes of material in the Internet about the term 'Allah' and I suggest Umno politicians especially should do well to read and research further before opening their big mouths to save themselves from embarrassment!

Professor: Of course, Muslims don't really like it if Christians seek to confuse or woo their fellow Muslims into converting to Christianity using the word Allah. If this happen, then the worry and concern of the Muslims are true. Time will tell.

Let us be honest to oneself. Don't make the word 'Allah' to become the hidden agenda of others. I understand the concern of Muslims. But still, the word 'Allah' belongs to all.

Md Imraz Muhammed Ikhbal: A true Muslim would celebrate at the thought of other religions employing the same term for God that they worship! It is an open affirmation of their religious faith and a giant step closer to uniting mankind.

So discern for yourself what Umno's divisive religious faith is for verily it is anything but Islam!


Mohd Fadli Hamid: Maybe one thing that we need to know... so far, I personally have never heard friends of mine whom I know to be Christian saying the word 'Allah' in their daily lives. 'Oh my God!'... that's common. [How about alamak!]

Among the Muslims, I always heard the word 'Allah' use in azans, masha Allah, innalillah, ya Allah, etc. In the Malaysian perspective, why the Catholic Christians want to purposely use the word 'Allah' in public? Why?

Habib RAK: Tun Mahathir Mohamad, I agree it is a very delicate matter. Despite clear explanations given by the likes of YB Khalid Samad, many Muslims are still not accepting the literal written message in the holy Quran about the usage of 'Allah' by non-Muslims. Care and tact is key.

Anak Malaysia: My dear Muslim friends, I hope this issue will not be manipulated into a Christian vs Muslim issue. It is not. It has never been. Let not our politicians use this court decision to gain political mileage.

The Catholic Church is not against Muslims or Islam. They are merely asking that their long held practice of calling God in Bahasa by the name they have been using for centuries not be stopped.

It is the politicians who went on the offensive against the Christians when they started banning the use of 'Allah' by Christians (and confiscating Bahasa Bibles and materials) thus seriously affecting BM-speaking Christians who have grown up calling God 'Allah'.

May justice and fairness be our guiding light, not paranoid and fear.

Lee Heng Soon: Why the fuss about all this 'Allah' thing? If someone wants to call God by your God's name, welcome him. There is no harm if your God, or Allah, helps him.

Charles Chia: Calling on all our Malaysian Muslims, please tell our Home Minister you are not so ignorant and silly not to know the difference between the 'Allah' in the Al-Quran and the Al-Kitab. That you are not so naive to be easily confused by just the usage of the word 'Allah'.


Geronimo: Umno has only one choice to make: Either they pursue the case in the Appeal Court and which we know they will win, and stand to lose an almost one million votes in the coming 13GE (general election), and most likely the two states in East Malaysia as well, or let the case be and move forward.

Put your '1Malaysia' sloganeering where your mouth is. No more no less.
 

kingrant

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what about those 'muslim' screaming Allah Akbar while exploding the bomb in front of innocent civilians at the same time? you think they are inflammatory and degrading to Allah?

The act of screaming Allah Akbar is not inflammatory or degrading to me. Blowing themselves up is also not inflammatory or degrading. But when they blow themselves up amongst innocent civilains, they should be stopped, whether it is inflamm or not, degrading or not.

If you cry Oh my God when you jerk off, is that inflammatory or degrading?
 

AhBengBoyBoy

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The term "Tuhan" was already suggested as a workable alternative and solution.

I should reckon the Supreme Being Himself is not fussy about what man calls Him, as long as all recognise Him as The Supreme Being.

But since each culture has their own special character and because of the social complexity of the issue of religion, contextual sensibility must reign supreme.

Thus there is no absolute right or wrong in this matter. But all should work under the principle of fostering overall peacefulness and elimination of friction rather than win with intellectual arguments and logic alone.

Personally, I think that any other local religion, and not just Christians, should not use the term "Allah" to address The Supreme Being even if they choose to.

Just my 2c.
 

kingrant

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Well said.


The term "Tuhan" was already suggested as a workable alternative and solution.

I should reckon the Supreme Being Himself is not fussy about what man calls Him, as long as all recognise Him as The Supreme Being.

But since each culture has their own special character and because of the social complexity of the issue of religion, contextual sensibility must reign supreme.

Thus there is no absolute right or wrong in this matter. But all should work under the principle of fostering overall peacefulness and elimination of friction rather than win with intellectual arguments and logic alone.

Personally, I think that any other local religion, and not just Christians, should not use the term "Allah" to address The Supreme Being even if they choose to.

Just my 2c.
 

Boliao

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This is nonsense. They are referring to the same God (The Quran is the first 5 books in the old testament)....
 

Ramseth

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Allah is simply Arabic for God. Just as God is simply English for Allah. I don't see what's the problem. These terms are just in different languages referring to the same One.
 

HellAngel

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But if there is no Malay translation of the Christian God?

Then how? Use what to express the Christian God?

If they used Jesus, the scope is too narrow how did the Koran describe Jesus in relation to Allah?...:biggrin:

In the 1st place, Allah is not a Malay word, it is an Arabic word.

God (English) = Allah (Arabic).

Jesus (English) = Isa (Arabic)
 

commoner

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it would be impossible for muslim to accept:

1. Allah has a son
2. Allah died on the cross
3. God becomes man

Is there another word for God in malay?

will another word be able to better represent God in malay language? another new word? probably not, since Allah is the easiest in that language for the people to understand the term God.

maybe it is time for the christians to be persecuted to call God Allah. Go and protest the protestors for your christian rights,,,,,,,,,, yeah....
 

HellAngel

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In the 1st place, to fight in court over the word only shows how narrow-minded people can be when it comes to religion. It is totally unproductive.

You think God really cares what people call HIM or address HIM? It is how you refer to him deep down in your heart when you pray.
 

IR123

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Personally, I would frown on any attempt to proselytise a Malay Muslim. It's just too much like pouring kerosene from a tank just to have a bigger fire. Do not seek but be found.


If Muslims believe they worship the same God as Christians, and if 'Allah' is used by them to refer to that God, then it should be used equally by all.

Not to do so is not right of them.



To deny their own people the right to information or to mislead is also wrong.

It all hinges on whether 'Allah' refers to the God worshipped by Christians.

If it does, then using a different word is a misrepresentation to their own Muslims.


The issue by the Malaysian Muslims appear to be that Christians do not worship 'Allah'. In that case, all they need to do is to come forth and say they worship different gods.
 
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Ramseth

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In the 1st place, Allah is not a Malay word, it is an Arabic word.

God (English) = Allah (Arabic).

Jesus (English) = Isa (Arabic)

In all three Abrahamic religions (Islam, Christianity and Islam), God isn't supposed to be referred to by name, but by title only, i.e. Lord, God, Almighty or Allah. He is simply the "I Am". Christianity and Judaism did record the Name of God as Jehovah and Yahweh respectively. In Christianity, Jehovah is occasionally used but not frequently. In Judaism, to address God as Yahweh is practically forbidden; just know it but don't use it (e.g. you know a king's name but never address him by name, always as Your (or His) Majesty). In Islam, I understand that the taboo on the Name of God is so strict that there's no written record. So through the centuries, the generic Arabic term for God, i.e. Allah, became associated to the Name of God in the Muslim world, particularly the non-Arab Muslim world with their less than perfect mastery of Arabic.
 

IR123

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In the 1st place, to fight in court over the word only shows how narrow-minded people can be when it comes to religion. It is totally unproductive.

You think God really cares what people call HIM or address HIM? It is how you refer to him deep down in your heart when you pray.


People are even more narrow-minded over PAP.
 

IR123

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Those are not Muslims! They are lunatics! Just like someone with a grinning cat avatar that I know in this forum!:mad:

They were Muslims just as Osama and Mas Selamat are Muslims.

Since when did the Goverment say Mas Selamat is a lunatic?
 
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