Tan Kin Lian replies to "smears"

[victoros]

Your claim of FiSCA is a walking disaster is your perspective. You do not represent those members and those whom benefit from joining this association. In our opinion, the FiSCA is so much independent compare to Financial Industry Disputes Resolution Centre Ltd (FIDReC).

It looks to me that you are all out to discredit Tan Kin Lian by criticizing in everything that he does, even by distorting facts or allege claims. As I mentioned in my earlier posts, you are hiding behind anonymously targeting Tan Kin Lian. This is an ungentlemanlike act. You are not genuine at all.

Hence, unless you are willing to come out (from your hiding place) and be known, you are just an untrustworthy person. I will then be more than happy to engage with you more seriously.

I will try again to explain why the whole FISCA is a walking disaster. We are all looking for transparency and FISCA was announced in the press by TKL as a financial consumer advocacy body that was going to be independent and not for profit.

There is no information of value and no indication how it is run. Now you claim that the committee members do not want to reveal their involvement.

Seems to me like straight from the PAP SOP.

 

[longbow]

In my POV, Tony Tan represents the old PAP going into the last election - "we tell you he is independent and he is so". That is despite fact that TT was, until just a few days ago, deputy Chairman of Gov of Singapore Investment Corp.

TCB is where PAP wants to be in the next GE. Able to criticize parts of the establishment (gov policies) but not the most sensitive areas (why are relatives in various position of power). TCB will not rock the boat and when push comes to shove he will back off. He knows his place. That was what happened when he was MP. "MM Lee was very angry. He scolded me and asked everyone whether he or I could lead Singapore better. Of course he is a much bigger man than me! I didn’t want to quarrel with him,so we had a very very formal relationship." Problem here is that the Presidential powers if acted upon will confront GIC and or Temasek (where reserves are invested) - both of these org are headed by MM (former GIC chairman), PM (current GIC chairman) and Tony Tan (until a few days ago Deputy GIC chairman). Question is whether TCB will stand his ground or back down.

TKL - has an axe to grind and has political ambition. He is an attack dog that will use his presidential powers. He is the one PAP fears most. TKL could very well launch his own party in the next GE using the Presidency as a platform.

So if we want an independent check against use of reserves, TKL is the man. He has blemishes and all. Some say he is power hungry - so he could very well use every single clause provided for in the Presidency. But he would have swallowed the 3rd key, armed with a club saying "you have to get through me".

I for one do not care who the wife is.

It is almost as if PAP fielded 2 candidates - the old school establishment PAP candidate, PAP lite - TCB and TKL is the wild card that stepped into the ring because of good opposition sentiments.

 

[kukubird58]

Your claim of FiSCA is a walking disaster is your perspective. .

hahaha....don't waste time trying to debate intellectually with an ah neh prataman......
he can flip faster than you blink your eyes....

 

[jw5]

is it really a plus for TKL?...i wonder??...it seems TKL only found his balls when he left NTUC Income...big deal...

TCB on the otherhand had the guts n gumption to come out openly n criticise PAP/govt in parliament no less...as early as the 80s...so i do not think there is any minus agst TCB...

I was only referring to the time that they resigned from the party, when giving the relative plus and minuses.
The reasons why they resigned and their behaviour, action and speeches in or out of the party would be separate factors.

In assessing the candidates, there should be more weightage of the candidates as people. This position is more about one man making decisions and blocking moves based on his integrity and conscience. It's not so much about him setting policies or finding solutions to difficult problems.

Of the candidates, I like TCB the person most. As an MP, I'm not totally convinced that some of the criticisms were not things the party bigwigs already knew about and were glad to debate. Can't even be bothered to discuss TT.

 

[jw5]

I wonder whether it is in the Act that Tan Kin Lian must collect the EP forms personally ?

You hit the nail on the head without realising it.
You are absolutely right, it's not in any legislation that the candidate must collect the forms personally.

BUT, EVERYONE is watching the candidates closely and it's actions (or inactions) like these that form impressions.
For pete's sake, even TT the yaya former ministar type, went down himself to collect, and he even brought along his wife!

 

[victoros]

Thank you for your respond. Let me ask you further, since the netizens here love to question :

1. Why did TCB went ED without his wife ? Does his wife disapproves to his endeavor to contest for EP too ?

2. TT was the last candidate (among the 3 presently) to collect those forms from ED. Why so late ? He has to seek approval from PAP and the US before he could collect the PE forms ?

Tan Kin Lian was the first candidate to collect the PE forms. He even requested his friends to collect the forms on his behalf because he was unavailable. It goes a long way to explain that Tan Kian Lian was serious with the PE because he acts promptly. The rest of going down personally and bringing wife to ED are merely just for show, it was play-acting only.

You hit the nail on the head without realising it.
You are absolutely right, it's not in any legislation that the candidate must collect the forms personally.

BUT, EVERYONE is watching the candidates closely and it's actions (or inactions) like these that form impressions.
For pete's sake, even TT the yaya former ministar type, went down himself to collect, and he even brought along his wife!

 

[jw5]

Tan Kin Lian was the first candidate to collect the PE forms. He even requested his friends to collect the forms on his behalf because he was unavailable. It goes a long way to explain that Tan Kian Lian was serious with the PE because he acts promptly. The rest of going down personally and bringing wife to ED are merely just for show, it was play-acting only.

TCB was the first candidate to collect the forms. Please check your facts.

He actually told the reporters that a presidential candidate should collect his own forms. That was before TKL sent Png to collect the forms.

 

[victoros]

TCB went to collect the PE forms without his wife. So, my question is still valid : Does his wife disapproves to his endeavor to contest for EP too ? TT was the last candidate to collect the EP forms because he has to seek approval from PAP and went to collect the EP forms after visiting the US for support ?

TCB was the first candidate to collect the forms. Please check your facts.

He actually told the reporters that a presidential candidate should collect his own forms. That was before TKL sent Png to collect the forms.

 

[jw5]

TCB went to collect the PE forms without his wife. So, my question is still valid : Does his wife disapproves to his endeavor to contest for EP too ?

1. TKL sent someone else to collect his forms. Apparently, one reason was that his wife disapproved.

2. TT went to collect the forms with his wife, obviously his wife approves.

TCB went to collect the forms without his wife. How does point 1 or point 2 indicate whether his wife approves or disapproves?
I would think she approves right, otherwise why would he collect the forms himself. Like TKL, he would have sent someone else right?

Sorry, but I don't really understand what you are getting at.

Btw, have you checked your facts? Was it not TCB who collected the forms first?

 

[victoros]

You are avoiding my question. Why TT requires to go round the world before he decides to collect the PE forms ? Is he really interested to stand or because PAP and subsequently, the US approves him to stand for EP ? TCB went to collect the forms without his wife. It shows his wife may not support his endeavor to contest for EP.

You are correct. TCB collected the EP forms on 1 June. TT was still the last (or maybe not) and very much later to collect the forms than TCB and TKL.

1. TKL sent someone else to collect his forms. Apparently, one reason was that his wife disapproved.

2. TT went to collect the forms with his wife, obviously his wife approves.

TCB went to collect the forms without his wife. How does point 1 or point 2 indicate whether his wife approves or disapproves?
I would think she approves right, otherwise why would he collect the forms himself. Like TKL, he would have sent someone else right?

Sorry, but I don't really understand what you are getting at.

Btw, have you checked your facts? Was it not TCB who collected the forms first?

 

[Unrepented]

.......deleted......

 

[Unrepented]

......I am an ordinary member and I know the committee members. The last time we gathered was in May 2011 during the AGM. ........ It was a group decision not to publish the committee members list on the website as some of the committee members do not wish to openly disclose their involvement with FiSCA as it may conflict with their employment. Tan Kin Lian respects their request.

1. See the words highlighted. Are you trying to bait a response or sabotage people you support?

2. In the event a person is unsure if his/her external office or post is in conflict with his/her present employment, they should notify their employer and seek clarification. Otherwise people will question their integrity.

3. If relevant individuals don't know of this basic principle. It is in their interest that they must be advised to do so from someone who is expected to know. Respecting their request is not helping them. Principle and code of conduct may be questioned.

4. If your account is true, then I am quite surprised by the oversight in proper governance.

As an average vote and trying to be as reasonable as one is able, I just question the fundamentals.:o

 

[Unrepented]

Notwithstanding TKL, personally I have a concern of publishing the GIC accounts to the public because it would compromise our nation’s position in the international arena.

IMO, a closed door committee elected by the citizens and govt representatives would be more appropriate to review the GIC. This is as far as I an average citizen would ask for transparency and accountability for now. We have to weigh transparency and security of information.

TKL - has an axe to grind and has political ambition. He is an attack dog that will use his presidential powers. He is the one PAP fears most. TKL could very well launch his own party in the next GE using the Presidency as a platform.

So if we want an independent check against use of reserves, TKL is the man. He has blemishes and all. Some say he is power hungry - so he could very well use every single clause provided for in the Presidency. But he would have swallowed the 3rd key, armed with a club saying "you have to get through me".

 

[longbow]

It is irrelevant who goes and collect the papers. It does not reflect on the person. Do not forget that the most important criteria for being President is independence and back bone to stand up to the ruling powers.

I really do not know why you guys are reading so much into who goes pick up the info. I could just as well say that TCB and TT made a personal appearance to get media coverage and that they are prima donna publicity hounds (pretty sure they must have informed the media that they were going). But I do not think that is the case. TKL might not have want to go down there because he does not want to be grilled by media so early (keeping views close to chest) and so send down a friend.

As for background - lets leave the commission to dig up the dirt. I am pretty sure that they will do a good job on TKL.

So if TKL passes muster then we can safely say that he is clean. So just focus on independence and backbone. Forget about wives, ability to look Presidential, etc etc etc.

The pressures from the ruling party will be tremendous nor to mention the ability to stand up to MM and PM. How many people in the party have the backbone to stand direct interogation from MM or PM (I suspect none are still living or mentally coherent).

I have not formed my opinion over whether it will be TCB or TKL. TT is definately out since he is not independent.

 

[scroobal]

Couple of points bro.

I think it is a given that nearly everyone agrees that TT is not independent at all. All his actions, in cabinet, in Parliament and all his life, he followed the establishment to the hilt. Even GCT, tended to meander with some of his statements and not this guy. The very fact that he became SPH chairman is huge redflag - custodian of the state controlled propaganda unit.

TKL remained silent for more than 30 years, retired and then began speaking up. However very little substance in what he says. TCB before, during and after he was firing away with his remarks at the establishment - consistent.

The wife for the office is president is unlike any other public office. Even wife of the PM does not come close. Protocol requires her to carry out state duties. This is fundamental to most heads of state around the world. That is the reason why when you first attended kindergarten you would see the photo of the president and his consort. It is not there because the photo frame is cheap.

In my POV, Tony Tan represents the old PAP going into the last election - "we tell you he is independent and he is so". That is despite fact that TT was, until just a few days ago, deputy Chairman of Gov of Singapore Investment Corp.

.

 

[victoros]

I am trying not to sabotage anyone. However, I see a need to clarify this point rather than the netizens keep blaming Tan Kin Lian regarding this matter. There is Financial Industry Disputes Resolution Centre Ltd (FIDReC) claiming to protect consumer rights. Many consumers did not receive reasonable assistance from them. They said it was because FIDReC was sponsored by those financial institutions and banking institutions in Singapore.

FiSCA was not sponsor by any financial institutions and banking institutions but strictly on membership basis.

You must understand that it is not easy to get appropriate professionals to come forward and providing free assistance to FiSCA independently. However, if you are a member of FiSCA, you will know the committee members or at least, the person whom is assisting you with your issue.

1. See the words highlighted. Are you trying to bait a response or sabotage people you support?

2. In the event a person is unsure if his/her external office or post is in conflict with his/her present employment, they should notify their employer and seek clarification. Otherwise people will question their integrity.

3. If relevant individuals don't know of this basic principle. It is in their interest that they must be advised to do so from someone who is expected to know. Respecting their request is not helping them. Principle and code of conduct may be questioned.

4. If your account is true, then I am quite surprised by the oversight in proper governance.

As an average vote and trying to be as reasonable as one is able, I just question the fundamentals.:o

 

[scroobal]

Bro, I did realise that this chap does not understand basic principles. Thus his arguments tend to run counter to what is conventionally and by reason quite entrenched.

1. See the words highlighted. Are you trying to bait a response or sabotage people you support?

2. In the event a person is unsure if his/her external office or post is in conflict with his/her present employment, they should notify their employer and seek clarification. Otherwise people will question their integrity.

3. If relevant individuals don't know of this basic principle. It is in their interest that they must be advised to do so from someone who is expected to know. Respecting their request is not helping them. Principle and code of conduct may be questioned.

4. If your account is true, then I am quite surprised by the oversight in proper governance.

As an average vote and trying to be as reasonable as one is able, I just question the fundamentals.:o

 

[scroobal]

Couple of questions. I was not aware that FISCA has resolution centre. How does it operate and how does it rate better than the other one. By the way, I have no clue about the other one. Who are they?

I am certainly out to discredit TKL and that was obvious from the start. His background, conduct and the way he manipulates people tells that he is an opportunist. It is something that we all must do in a democracy if there are good grounds to do so.

The fact that he is struggling to bat away this allegations is quite telling. He also cannot say what his achievements except for mini-bonds is also no surprise.

In our opinion, the FiSCA is so much independent compare to Financial Industry Disputes Resolution Centre Ltd (FIDReC).

It looks to me that you are all out to discredit Tan Kin Lian by criticizing in everything that he does, even by distorting facts or allege claims. As I mentioned in my earlier posts, you are hiding behind anonymously targeting Tan Kin Lian. This is an ungentlemanlike act. You are not genuine at all.

 

[victoros]

I am not surprised by your remark. Your postings have always been alleging people and without concrete evidences to support your claims. Hence, in this situation, you commenting rubbish again.

Bro, I did realise that this chap does not understand basic principles. Thus his arguments tend to run counter to what is conventionally and by reason quite entrenched.

 

[karmabear]

this victoros is a real loser man. Don't have the intellectual ability to support and defend TKL, start attacking people calling them fools, dishonest, vulgar... Use own 5 year old son to validate his points... fucking disgraceful. What FISCA??? that "tupperware" club is dead. You know why? Cus TKL and his band of supporters are kosong. You know what is kosong? It means without substance. Nobody is buying your wares. And it doesn't help when 3rd rate supporters sabotage the TKL brandname with their incompetence, insulting the very forum they try to raise support.

What a terrible business model. Selling kosong product using kosong salesman... No wonder the petition failed miserably. This fucker TKL has no sincerity man. Just look at the other candidates...

TCB so old still every weekend go walkabout, post on FB, do youtube video interview... Tony Tan got his PAP prostitutes to give him the kiss of death endorsement. Not just any PAP dog hor... Emeritus SM(wtf does that mean), PM, IT boi CCS, Prataman... What does TKL come up with? GMS, victoros... Wah piang... really NTUC standard... the kosong standard.

TKL: Vote for me for a kosong President

:oIo::oIo::oIo::oIo: