Recession in 2013?

[jubilee1919]

Are you saying that SATS doesnt know the number of passengers coming into and leaving SG

Of course not. It is CIAS that runs the airport not SATS.

 

[TracyTan866]

NOL usually is in the red and not representative of the cargo business in Singapore, whereas PSA is. Neither is SIA for air cargo. You should know the difference.

I have not touch your point 4 about tourists arrivals as yet and you say I am nit picking. Just admit there are some errors on your part. It is ok to admit mistakes you know?

which points in post 1 do you think do not reflect the true picture in 2012?

 

[jubilee1919]

are you saying that no one knows the number of ships calling at SG ports nor the amount of cargo unloaded and loaded?

Not NOL for sure.

 

[TracyTan866]

Of course not. It is CIAS that runs the airport not SATS.

go understand what SATs do

 

[jubilee1919]

are you saying that no one knows the number of ships calling at SG ports nor the amount of cargo unloaded and loaded?

Are you not aware that all cargo that is going into and out of Singapore are either through the causeway, Changi Airport and PSA?

 

[TracyTan866]

Not NOL for sure.

that shows how much you know abt MPA, NOL, etc

 

[TracyTan866]

Are you not aware that all cargo that is going into and out of Singapore are either through the causeway, Changi Airport and PSA?

u r referring to land transport, air transport and sea transport.

there is still another cargo point u do not know...go figure out...come back when you have figured it out

 

[CELLULAR]

NOL usually is in the red and not representative of the cargo business in Singapore, whereas PSA is. Neither is SIA for air cargo. You should know the difference.

Years ago, it is said that if one travel along Keppel shipyard and estimate the number of containers uploaded and unloaded daily, one is able to estimate if the economy is doing better or worse. Not sure if it's still true nowadays though.

 

[jubilee1919]

go understand what SATs do

My mistake about CIAS when I meant Changi Airport Group. CIAS is the other major ground handling company.

 

[jubilee1919]

u r referring to land transport, air transport and sea transport.

there is still another cargo point u do not know...go figure out...come back when you have figured it out

Sorry but are you now saying if I do not know this I am wrong about points 4, 5 and 6?

 

[jubilee1919]

that shows how much you know abt MPA, NOL, etc

Neither do you if you use NOL's performance as an indicator that cargo shipments are down.

 

[jubilee1919]

go understand what SATs do

I know exactly what SATS do, but do you? Let me give the details then.

"SATS Ltd. SGX: S58, commonly abbreviated as SATS (Simplified Chinese:新翔集团有限公司) is the chief ground-handling and in-flight catering service provider at Singapore Changi Airport. SATS controls about 80% of Changi airport's ground handling and catering business.

SATS runs ground handling and airline catering operations at nearly 40 airports across Asia Pacific. Besides its operations in Singapore, SATS has also established a network in Asia through joint ventures in China (including Hong Kong & Macau), India, the Philippines, Indonesia, Taiwan, Vietnam and the Maldives.

SATS subsidiaries includes SATS Airport Services, SATS Catering, SATS Security Services, Aero Laundry & Linen Services, Aerolog Express, Country Foods Pte Ltd. and Singapore Food Industries."

They do not handle tourists arrivals and departures. The Singapore Customs handles this!

 

[jubilee1919]

that shows how much you know abt MPA, NOL, etc

Do I need to give you the details of what is NOL too?

 

[jubilee1919]

iunlike you, I dont make wild guesses..i have told you the methodology of my prediction

Let's be frank sister, you are making wild guesses and talking loads of rubbish.:oIo:

 

[TracyTan866]

I know exactly what SATS do, but do you? Let me give the details then.

"SATS Ltd. SGX: S58, commonly abbreviated as SATS (Simplified Chinese:新翔集团有限公司) is the chief ground-handling and in-flight catering service provider at Singapore Changi Airport. SATS controls about 80% of Changi airport's ground handling and catering business.

SATS runs ground handling and airline catering operations at nearly 40 airports across Asia Pacific. Besides its operations in Singapore, SATS has also established a network in Asia through joint ventures in China (including Hong Kong & Macau), India, the Philippines, Indonesia, Taiwan, Vietnam and the Maldives.

SATS subsidiaries includes SATS Airport Services, SATS Catering, SATS Security Services, Aero Laundry & Linen Services, Aerolog Express, Country Foods Pte Ltd. and Singapore Food Industries."

They do not handle tourists arrivals and departures. The Singapore Customs handles this!

hahahaha..you sound highly intelligent and well qualified. You are probably also quite young like me. You sound gullible and trusting , believing what the pap said and swallow line, hook and sinker!

But you dont even know the difference between CAAS, CAG, CIAS, SATS. That speaks a lot abt you

Read my post 1 carefully.

ICA can give the official tourist figures. But a discerning Singaporean who is inquisitive doesnt rely on ICA figures and PAP's data alone. There are various sources of information which are more current and useful. I was having dinner on saturday with a friend who works as a supervisor at SATS. He told me the following:

1. Recently, meal preparation for SIA flights show a dip in travel demand.
2. Business class and 1st class suffer most
3. PRC workers are suffering as they have reduced overtime which supplements their monthly pay
4. PRC workers feel cheated by the agent because they were painted a rosy picture when they were recruited in China but they are very disillusioned now. Thay are not saying the agent lied deliberately..it's just that the agent didnt tell them the whole truth.
5. Service providers replace each worker who doesnt turn up for work with two novices...but they are not effective and cant do their jobs because they are not familiar with the work. so on paper, it looks good..but for the workplace, it is a bogus solution ..
6. PRC workers, in order to save, are bringing in plain rice and one vegetable dish for their meals...so poor thing!
7. Is this a healthy situation that we want in SG's work relations? or is this a case of SMRT saga waiting to explode in SATS? Even if it doesnt explode, having unhappy workers who feel cheated, is not good for a company.

As for shipping in SG, besides waiting for official figures there are other sources we can glean to have a good idea:

1. Satellite pictures
2. A jog along east coast beach will tell you the shipping activities or lack of it.

so dont just think that the official figures are the only source you have.

be wise and look around.

SIA is trading at abt $10.70...SIA has reported a small profit for the first six months. SIA is looking at how to deploy its excess pilots. Do you want to wait until apr 2013 to know how sia performs?

i can tell you that sia is struggling and may make a loss for yr 2012 and SIA may go below $10 early next year.

back to my thread here...do you want to wait for ICA and PAP to tell you that SG is in recession?

that will be too late..you will miss the boat and be stuck.

Look beyond what the pap tells you. Check whether what the pap said is the whole truth. Be discerning and make an informed and calculated decision..trust your own judgement

 

[jubilee1919]

There are various sources of information which are more current and useful. I was having dinner on saturday with a friend who works as a supervisor at SATS. He told me the following:

1. Recently, meal preparation for SIA flights show a dip in travel demand.
2. Busines class and 1st class suffer most
3. PRC workers are suffering as they have reduced overtime which supplements their monthly pay
4. PRC workers feel cheated by the service provider because they were painted a rosy picture when they were recruited in China but thet are very disillusioned now.
5. Service providers replace each worker who doesnt turn up for work with two novices...but they are not effective and cant do their jobs because they are not familiar with the work. so on paper, it looks good..but for the workplace, it is a bogus solution ..
6. PRC workers, in order to save, are bringing in plain rice and one vegetable dish for their meals...so poor thing!
7. Is this a healthy situation that we want in SG's work relations? or is this a case of SMRT saga waiting to explode in SATS? Even if it doesnt explode, having unhappy workers who feel cheated, is not good for a company.

SATS is just one company in Singapore and because you had dinner and he tells you how bad it was in SATS, you concluded Singapore is going into recession in 2013.

As for shipping in SG, besides waiting for official figures there are other sources we can glean to have a good idea:

1. Satellite pictures
2. A jog along east coast beach will tell you the shipping activities or lack of it.

You talk about NOL and now no longer wants to use NOL to prop up your argument. Then you divert it to observations of shipping activities as an indicator that recession is coming. This is total crap and baseless. Please do better than that.

SIA is trading at abt $10.70...SIA has reported a small profit for the first six months. SIA is looking at how to deploy its excess pilots. Do you want to wait until apr 2013 to know how sia performs?

i can tell you that sia is struggling and may make a loss for yr 2012 and SIA may go below $10 early next year.

Shares of SIA and their losses is the reason for the coming recession? Don't make me laugh at your naivety. There are a few posts from members that did a better job than you in supporting their arguments as to whether they agree or do not agree that a recession is due.

You talked about NOL, SIA and SATS to arrive at your conclusion. What about all those air freighters bringing in air cargo(DHL or FEDEX) and all airlines operating in and out of Singapore? There are tons of shipping companies unloading and loading cargo here, and not only NOL. There are many other industries such as the F&B, Banking, Hospitality, shipbuilding etc. You need to cast a wider net to get a better perspective of what is actually happening before arriving at your conclusion.

If all businesses were to arrive at the same conclusion as yourself, there will be little reason for any of them to be optimistic enough to invest in Singapore. Your dig at me "but you dont even know the difference between CAAS, CAG, CIAS, SATS. That speaks a lot abt you" shows the level of debate you excel in, rather than refuting me and expanding on your points 4,5 and 6.

You still have not replied and I don't expect you to since we have gone so far and you are obviously side-tracking and putting more on the table. I asked 2 simple questions and I get so much crap from you in return.

 

[TracyTan866]

SATS is just one company in Singapore and because you had dinner and he tells you how bad it was in SATS, you concluded Singapore is going into recession in 2013.



You talk about NOL and now no longer wants to use NOL to prop up your argument. Then you divert it to observations of shipping activities as an indicator that recession is coming. This is total crap and baseless. Please do better than that.



Shares of SIA and their losses is the reason for the coming recession? Don't make me laugh at your naivety. There are a few posts from members that did a better job than you in supporting their arguments as to whether they agree or do not agree that a recession is due.

You talked about NOL, SIA and SATS to arrive at your conclusion. What about all those air freighters bringing in air cargo(DHL or FEDEX) and all airlines operating in and out of Singapore? There are tons of shipping companies unloading and loading cargo here, and not only NOL. There are many other industries such as the F&B, Banking, Hospitality, shipbuilding etc. You need to cast a wider net to get a better perspective of what is actually happening before arriving at your conclusion.

If all businesses were to arrive at the same conclusion as yourself, there will be little reason for any of them to be optimistic enough to invest in Singapore. Your dig at me "but you dont even know the difference between CAAS, CAG, CIAS, SATS. That speaks a lot abt you" shows the level of debate you excel in, rather than refuting me and expanding on your points 4,5 and 6.

You still have not replied and I don't expect you to since we have gone so far and you are obviously side-tracking and putting more on the table. I asked 2 simple questions and I get so much crap from you in return.

You are obviously ignorant, naive and gullible. so dont waste your breathe because you are not convincing..

Just get back to the core issue...you think SG is doing well and will continue to boom in 2013? Yes or No?

My assessment is SG is likely to go into a recession in 2013.

 

[jubilee1919]

Dont waste your breathe and nit pick..get back to the core issue...you think SG is doing well and will continue to boom in 2013? Yes or No?

My assessment is SG is likely to go into a recession in 2013.

Too bad for you then. I am not getting into the trap you are setting up. The conclusion you arrived at is full of holes and you talk about your "assessment." You might as well say "My gut feel is ......."

 

[TracyTan866]

Too bad for you then. I am not getting into the trap you are setting up. The conclusion you arrived at is full of holes and you talk about your "assessment." You might as well say "My gut feel is ......."

so, unlike me, you dare not hazard a guess on next year's economic outlook for SG?

 

[jubilee1919]

so, unlike me, you dare not hazard a guess on next year's economic outlook for SG?

I don't make wild guesses.