I wouldn't want to read too much in what GMS said since he is just engaging in campaigning talk at the wrong time and to the wrong audience. As we know bullshit and exaggeration are always part of any election.
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Is WP Stronger or more Vulnerable in future 3 corner fights?
- Thread starter Goh Meng Seng
- Start date
I wouldn't want to read too much in what GMS said since he is just engaging in campaigning talk at the wrong time and to the wrong audience. As we know bullshit and exaggeration are always part of any election.
I dunno which 2 individuals you are referring, for moi, the 2 individuals most responsible was GMS and NS... maybe Sebas should take some flak too because his leadership was non-existence during GE
Politics is a team sport, not a solo sport..... no matter what, Nicole Seah will need a party platform to contest, she cant handle logistic on her own and she have no policy views of her own.... she is just a spokeperson @ most...... she is stuck in NSP..... I dun think any new Party will resonate with voters after RP's failed experiment... it s detrimental to both NSP and NS for them if they continue to stick together... but yet they cant leave each other....
let notch forget huat happen in GE....how NIcole Seah derail NSP entire Campaign.... FOr GMS's GE minister-specific strategy to work, the focus is suppose to be on CCK and Tampines and how Gan and Mah fowl up....... however before nomination day it turn out that campaign has become a "lets follow NIcole's butt around". and media pounced on it....
it look like ingenious move at 1st to make NIcole Seah the spokeperson, but on hindsight, the media actually got what it wants. NS is a very slick spokeperson but her very presence overshadow the Party' message and very soon the Party itself....
this is to NSP's detriments most pple start to id NS with NSP, calling it "Nicole Seah Party" and she is clearly not credible enough to carry the whole Campaign on her own shoulders and the govt wanted the focus off CCK and Tampines and the media circus around Nicole mean that it gotch its wish and Gan and Mah was not seriously challenged @ all.
The PAP know that Marine Parade was not losable and rather it take the heat for Tampines, BSTPY, CCK and other danger ground, they would also rather TPL take the heat for Gan and Mah... because being under GCT protection mean that she will not lose...
GMS fall into the trap by focusing himself and smelling Nicole's ass all over Marine Parade instead of walking in Tampines...
so this is how the minister-specific strategy become a cat fights between 2 XMM, manipulated by the media, and encourage by Nicole's ego and GMS butt smelling act
Tampines was winnable and CCK could have gotten a much better result and in light of this 2 massive underachievements, GMS decide to console himself that he predict and know GCT's popularity is a myth.... and he have prove it
the truth is much simpler, NSP and media and social media have focus all their efforts on Marine Parade (which it initially must surely think was unwinnable) and gotch a very credible result there ... I assume that Nicole was also suppose to be the weakest member of the 2nd weakest NSP GRC team....
But strategically. GMS let go of the 2 piece of meats already in his mouth
on Hindsight, NIcole Seah should have let other Parties member take the limelight and not let herself become the Message, her exposure rise exponentially at the expense of the party...she is the main Beneficiary of GE2011 although she quickly squander this goodwill in PE2011 and through her tyrannical censorship on her FB wall...
She will continue to overshadow the Party until she leave and the Party will continue to shunt her growth because of the lack of clear leadership and credible mentors......
Of course it is easy to talk on Hindsight, GMS himself is very goot at this... but because they do not learn from it, they are doomed to repeat it
NSP under Hazel and Tony is totally directionless.... the PE fiasco is the best example of how the entire NSP's top leadership make a fool out of themselves and every1 went to support differnt candidates... bery bad impression....
despite their credentials, I am sad to say that Hazel and Tony has quite low Charisma, Tony is like an angry man, alsway shouting @ the govt in his speech and while Hazel is slightly better, her elitist background was too obvious from her accent...
her cambridge english accent and Peking chinese accent doesnt resonate with the heartlanders at all... Sylvia is also an elite but can tell her Singlish accent....
we also see Mr Low bery smartly make sure CSM tone down his powderful chinese during rally because the boh-ta-ceks will think he is ah tiong and not vote fot hime....I think Low is bery smart to make CSM speak Malay and Hokkien and ENglish and not his best language.... for this reason
Steve Chia, GMS, Jeannette and NS have much more charisma than Hazel and Tony....
Hazel and Tony are very outstanding individuals but very average politicians...
41.45% for WP's MK "3rd rate" team despite being snatched by WP at the last minute
vs
38.80% for NSP's CCK 'A' team which insist on being in CCK since they have walking the ground in CCK since their RP's days...
I believe the voters have spoken....
up moi pts if chiu rike ??? yesh nope??
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NSP is nothing more than a ragtag army, totally indiscipline, disunited and disoriented. That the impression they always give me. Even SDP presents a more unified image than NSP. The worse thing is people with problem following instruction from the top party leadership are now leading the party. Where is this party heading towards?
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If the winners of the 2011 election were from diverse parties, we could have that. Only one opposition party won so we may gravitate irreversibly to a two party system. Most will flock to one camp. If that happens the only thing that can affect WP is not SDP, NSP, RP etc. but WP themselves. And the only check on WP is again not NSP, RP, SDP but PAP. In addition, the non-WP opposition is splitting among themselves. TJS obviously knows that by wanting an alliance that doesn't include WP, but cannot do much.
The title doesn't make sense. Any party is of course not stronger in 3 corner fights. Three parties sharing one pie definitely get less pie than two. As I said, its whether it will always be PAP vs opp, In future, perhaps even PAP's votes might be split by a non-confrontational opposition party.
The chap talks about the PE. I would be happy that one opposition party will have such a narrow margin against PAP in all constituencies like what TT and TCB got, because it can flip anytime.
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I told u already.
He is upset that WP is at the forefront of all opposition parties (without him).
He is upset that WP (without him) will probably continue to have the greatest influence over 3 corner fights.
He is upset that WP (without him) now have the clout to even consider a coalition with pap and the guy who mentioned that was his replacement.
That's the connection between the 2 threads. His frustration and regret.
U know what? He's probably a little upset with u too.
When everyone else failed, forummer Golden Dragon managed to get him to reveal his point all long, that PS "lacked political wisdom".
It still too early to say. Whether we get a multi parties parliament will depend on how the rest of the non-WP parties fair in the centre and the western part at a time when WP is focusing on the eastern side. Their future certainly remains bleak unless they can build a strong support base in the west to deter WP expansion.
success begets success... the west is waiting for WP to come to the west only.....
NSP and SDP will only be seatwarmers or pegholders..
just look at the quality of NSP Jurong team.... who will vote them if notch for nicole seah??
SIngapore is too small to talk bout geographical politics.....
and SImgapore is too small to have 2 party around.... some say 1.....
e faster we accept Duverger's law and 2 party system.... the less time we spent discussing on irrelevant topics like coatlition govt
When LTK mooted the Moulmein-Kallang team, I gave me strongest support, volunteered for everything that I could do. The style and action was right. 当他们不到，不必放在眼里。That may sound arrogant but that's reality and politics, we have to fight it that way. No need negotiation, just do it. Lilian's case in Punggol East was the same. I told her to ignore Desmond, she's not likely to win but will score high and Desmond will lose his deposit, otherwise a big feast dinner on me. The result speaks for itself and I saved my expenses for a big feast dinner. 
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Couple of things;
NSP and Sebastian are there not for you and me. It has been that way from day 1. When GMS became SG and despite knowing how they are setup, I was wondering what was going on. I thought they cut Sebastian lose but it was not to be with the Moulmein move. The people behind this did not rate NS and having come from Reform Party and being buried by other characters, she did not have profile until GE. The train had already left the station. After the Moulmein NSP press conference, I knew that GMS was going to leave the position but not the party as it would look silly doing what Jufrie and James love to do and both are not longer credible.
It is a given that Jeanette, NS and others will love on.
Agree with your point about CCK. Disgraceful despite making all those claims and acting like a dog in the manager. And no one from the party has given an explanation. The PAP opponent was not much of a personality. So what were they doing on the ground as they confidently claimed?
Your comments about Hokkein, Malay, English and accents are good input and it does have an effect. Low does know his stuff.
Then there are idiots like Gilbert Goh. Gilbert knows that he will be toast if he ran as an independent and that he needs a platform. But having joined a party and paid for his deposit, he insists on running the show. You can see his comments about him joining Reform Party and the discussions that he had with KJ. He honestly thinks that he is an iconic figure and a catch for RP. Note his article on the well educated chap and this struggle with depression. When you read the poor chap's comments you know that he can't hold down a job because of his depression and not the other way around. Gilbert must assume that everyone is dumb.
NSP and Sebastian are there not for you and me. It has been that way from day 1. When GMS became SG and despite knowing how they are setup, I was wondering what was going on. I thought they cut Sebastian lose but it was not to be with the Moulmein move. The people behind this did not rate NS and having come from Reform Party and being buried by other characters, she did not have profile until GE. The train had already left the station. After the Moulmein NSP press conference, I knew that GMS was going to leave the position but not the party as it would look silly doing what Jufrie and James love to do and both are not longer credible.
It is a given that Jeanette, NS and others will love on.
Agree with your point about CCK. Disgraceful despite making all those claims and acting like a dog in the manager. And no one from the party has given an explanation. The PAP opponent was not much of a personality. So what were they doing on the ground as they confidently claimed?
Your comments about Hokkein, Malay, English and accents are good input and it does have an effect. Low does know his stuff.
Then there are idiots like Gilbert Goh. Gilbert knows that he will be toast if he ran as an independent and that he needs a platform. But having joined a party and paid for his deposit, he insists on running the show. You can see his comments about him joining Reform Party and the discussions that he had with KJ. He honestly thinks that he is an iconic figure and a catch for RP. Note his article on the well educated chap and this struggle with depression. When you read the poor chap's comments you know that he can't hold down a job because of his depression and not the other way around. Gilbert must assume that everyone is dumb.
Bro, time to move on. Half the people here are trying to pieces together what you are saying thinking that it is some acute political observations (what you are known for) but do not realise its a personal slugging match between you and GMS.
You use 3_M comments as the platform and he thinks that he is getting the message across and not realising what is going on.
Lets get back to politics.
You use 3_M comments as the platform and he thinks that he is getting the message across and not realising what is going on.
Lets get back to politics.
At presumably the half way mark of this thread, here are my observations;
You are digging a deeper hole. Your comments are clearly vindictive, and Low and WP are the obvious targets. For some reason you have assumed that Pritam is the weakest link or the least to cause you political capital. Its obvious that you will not got after Faisal as the backlash from the community and your Malay Bureau which you setup would look bad. Chen, Low and Sylvia are untouchable. Its poor form and reminiscent of old man going after Chiam's O level qualifications at Fullerton which he subsequently and openly regretted. Its dirty and unnecessary.
By now you do realise that this is no longer a discussion about coalition politics or 3 cornered fights. This is personal. You should realise that it is not your intention that counts but the perception that you create. Further compounded by the fact that coalition govt discussion is decades away to make any sense. It like 2 five years kids discussing how many kids they want to have when they get married.
You and Perspective either have to bury the hatchet or agree to disagree and let the threads progress meaningfully.
Your politics as I see is based on loyalty and not very practical. Why do you think that Tan Kin Lian is a dud? Imagine losing his deposit despite his grandstanding, the drama, the claims , the perceived control of the online world etc. I can understand why Ramseth kept supporting him and then conveniently took off. But you were holding the baby.
Singaporeans have very short memory and most have no clue about history including recent history. You can walk away and create fresh momentum or continue to build a negative image of yourself and cast it in stone eventually.
You are digging a deeper hole. Your comments are clearly vindictive, and Low and WP are the obvious targets. For some reason you have assumed that Pritam is the weakest link or the least to cause you political capital. Its obvious that you will not got after Faisal as the backlash from the community and your Malay Bureau which you setup would look bad. Chen, Low and Sylvia are untouchable. Its poor form and reminiscent of old man going after Chiam's O level qualifications at Fullerton which he subsequently and openly regretted. Its dirty and unnecessary.
By now you do realise that this is no longer a discussion about coalition politics or 3 cornered fights. This is personal. You should realise that it is not your intention that counts but the perception that you create. Further compounded by the fact that coalition govt discussion is decades away to make any sense. It like 2 five years kids discussing how many kids they want to have when they get married.
You and Perspective either have to bury the hatchet or agree to disagree and let the threads progress meaningfully.
Your politics as I see is based on loyalty and not very practical. Why do you think that Tan Kin Lian is a dud? Imagine losing his deposit despite his grandstanding, the drama, the claims , the perceived control of the online world etc. I can understand why Ramseth kept supporting him and then conveniently took off. But you were holding the baby.
Singaporeans have very short memory and most have no clue about history including recent history. You can walk away and create fresh momentum or continue to build a negative image of yourself and cast it in stone eventually.
Scroobal,
Haha, I won't be too sure about what will happen next. There are a lot of other things and factors in considerations but heck, I don't want to have anything to do with it.
To make comparison of Harban Singh with NSP is really out. NSP under Hazel and Tony is totally a different league. What you are seeing the past in the past is just indication of totally weak third choice. The PE has shown that the equation will change when the candidates are of equal quality. Besides, when WP goes into 3 corner fight, they will just send third rate team like those in Moulmein Kallang; definitely not calibre like JBJ or LTK.
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they cant build any support base in the west and it will not deter WP expansion because they have no support base in the West.
the only person with support base in the west is Dr Tan Cheng Bock and PAP
my cck NSP volunteer source told me that NSP has no plans for CCK at all and have not been spotted before or after except those 9 days in GE...
NSP simply dun have the logistic to handle such a large place like CCK .....
instead NSP has been spotted in Geylang Serai and East COast instead
Gilbert Goh is still making a fool of himself, thinking he is a gandhi or a sun yat sen ...
I start a thread on him
http://singsupplies.com/showthread.php?103497-Gilbert-Goh-what-is-his-agenda-is-he-foreign-funded
while I admire his spirit but he is one of the most naive politicians around .....no dat i dun think there are no naive peepur in WP but they arent allow to be loose cannons like gilbert...
hey screw, i repeat myself like a parrot again here... their marriage of convenience has become a catch 22 for NSP and ex-RP..
they cant move forward together but leaving hurt both sides...
Jeanette, NS and others will lost more political capital if they start another mass exodus... remember how much flak they gotten ... huat PAP moles and all that hurl around...only the heat of GE around them to bounce back
if they start a coup like Chee, they will also lost more political capital... only when deadweights like NSP old guards like sebas and all die off suddenly can they have freedom to move the party forward the way they wan...
will Sebas do it ???? this is quite obvious....
but they do have 5 yrs to reconcile all this contradictions....
Yesh it is a fact that Faisal is the weakest link and would be the reason, were Aljunied to fall again .....
Low should get find some even better qualified Malays and let Faisal go lead a GRC somewhere, maybe Marine Parade or something...if he feel that Aljunied may be lost
the fact the GMS do not dare to goes after Faisal is most telling
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The people that gathered around RP have that middle ground appeal would have done well except that KJ turned out to be very poor leader. That group needs to find a capable leader and when someone surfaces they will gravitate towards it. NSP is not the vehicle or the platform as the Sebastian and his lot have no common ground. One is Mandarin centric albeit with a bit of respite during GMS time. The Other is English central. So it's looks like Steve Chia and his fridge magnets is the end of all of their grand scheme for CCK. Talk about credibility.
Its time to stop giving RP, NSP and SDP the kind of slack given in the past. Now that a GRC has been won the game has shifted from 1st to 2nd gear. Saying that diversity is good or saying just vote any opposition to give PAP a black eye is going into reverse when mainstream opposition has already upped the playing field. RP does not deserve any chance as long as KJ is around. NSP needs to clear out the old trash and get their priorities and direction sorted out once and for all. And SDP needs to put on their jerseys and play the game to win a GRC outright, not just to get foreign funding. Frankly the time for all-encompassing tolerance is over. The message to GMS Seb KJ et al is that either you shape up or else
Let continue to support any opposition (including GMS) whenever possible. We need them to hold the ground till WP comes in.
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Its time to stop giving RP, NSP and SDP the kind of slack given in the past. Now that a GRC has been won the game has shifted from 1st to 2nd gear. Saying that diversity is good or saying just vote any opposition to give PAP a black eye is going into reverse when mainstream opposition has already upped the playing field. RP does not deserve any chance as long as KJ is around. NSP needs to clear out the old trash and get their priorities and direction sorted out once and for all. And SDP needs to put on their jerseys and play the game to win a GRC outright, not just to get foreign funding. Frankly the time for all-encompassing tolerance is over. The message to GMS Seb KJ et al is that either you shape up or else - quoted from Thick Face Black Heart
How very aptly put....
By the way, Brocoli..contrary to you saying that Faisal is the weakest link, is like slapping LTK on the face..IMHO, and as an Aljunied GRC constituent he is very hardworking and is slowly consolidating his power base in Kaki Bukit..Btw, WP are not like PAP who constantly shift their MPs to other places..FYI, Kaki Bukit residents were very pissed off by the gerrymandering of the PAP by shifting them first from Eunos GRC then to East Coast GRC then to Marine Parade GRC then to Aljunied GRC.. The PAP MP who was part of the Marine Parade Team, Faishal Ibrahim is a deadweight and most residents there did not like him..LTK is smart in placing Faisal WP there cos there are many disenfranchised Malays living there are likely to vote for Faisal over any PAP candidate any day..
U complained about Glenda not showing up for Kaki Bukit Hari Raya celebrations..here's the scoop...Glenda is very upset over the fact that Eric Tan has on his own volition left WP cos he feels that Gerald Giam has upstaged him..I do not blame Eric Tan for feeling that way..after all, it was Eric who persuaded CSM and even Glenda to join WP..btw, do not know if Ramseth will agree with me on this but Glenda and Eric are related..naturally she felt hurt that her kin was not even considered for a CEC post...anyway I really hope the WP can resolve their diff with Eric fast before the coming GE or else he might be another GMS or worse still SDA Desmond Lim and the PAP will use him to their advantage politically...
Dear Bros, the times they are a changing and changing fast in Sinkieland but anything can happen in the next 3 to 5yrs time..remember who would have expected Gecko to kick the bucket, most of them thought that the zillion tubes that were stuck in her will keep her alive but alas, life has no meaning anymore when you are a vegetable..even the most hardened of despots, cannot bear the sight of his other half rotting away in her vegetative state and decided to pull the plug.. who would have expected that the Arabs will not fear bullets and bombs and succeed in getting their tyrannical leaders out...likewise same here Bros, he Lee Kuan Yew is a mere mortal after all and no one not even you or me can escape DEATH and once he goes, it will all fall down just like a house of cards. i pray that i will be around to see that moment, bcos that is when Sinkies will see the true measure of the PAP and that is the PAP simply amounts to nothing.....
How very aptly put....
By the way, Brocoli..contrary to you saying that Faisal is the weakest link, is like slapping LTK on the face..IMHO, and as an Aljunied GRC constituent he is very hardworking and is slowly consolidating his power base in Kaki Bukit..Btw, WP are not like PAP who constantly shift their MPs to other places..FYI, Kaki Bukit residents were very pissed off by the gerrymandering of the PAP by shifting them first from Eunos GRC then to East Coast GRC then to Marine Parade GRC then to Aljunied GRC.. The PAP MP who was part of the Marine Parade Team, Faishal Ibrahim is a deadweight and most residents there did not like him..LTK is smart in placing Faisal WP there cos there are many disenfranchised Malays living there are likely to vote for Faisal over any PAP candidate any day..
U complained about Glenda not showing up for Kaki Bukit Hari Raya celebrations..here's the scoop...Glenda is very upset over the fact that Eric Tan has on his own volition left WP cos he feels that Gerald Giam has upstaged him..I do not blame Eric Tan for feeling that way..after all, it was Eric who persuaded CSM and even Glenda to join WP..btw, do not know if Ramseth will agree with me on this but Glenda and Eric are related..naturally she felt hurt that her kin was not even considered for a CEC post...anyway I really hope the WP can resolve their diff with Eric fast before the coming GE or else he might be another GMS or worse still SDA Desmond Lim and the PAP will use him to their advantage politically...
Dear Bros, the times they are a changing and changing fast in Sinkieland but anything can happen in the next 3 to 5yrs time..remember who would have expected Gecko to kick the bucket, most of them thought that the zillion tubes that were stuck in her will keep her alive but alas, life has no meaning anymore when you are a vegetable..even the most hardened of despots, cannot bear the sight of his other half rotting away in her vegetative state and decided to pull the plug.. who would have expected that the Arabs will not fear bullets and bombs and succeed in getting their tyrannical leaders out...likewise same here Bros, he Lee Kuan Yew is a mere mortal after all and no one not even you or me can escape DEATH and once he goes, it will all fall down just like a house of cards. i pray that i will be around to see that moment, bcos that is when Sinkies will see the true measure of the PAP and that is the PAP simply amounts to nothing.....
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