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Dr Allan Ooi's Obituary - Government's Policy

catersilly

New Member
Dear Toma
I'm interested in the inside story to this Allan Ooi case.
How was he pushed to awol in the first place?

To me it is easier to snake one's way around in the army than
to awol. So a lot must have been happening to trigger off the awol
and eventual suicide.
 

tomasloh

Alfrescian
Loyal
Dear Toma
I'm interested in the inside story to this Allan Ooi case.
How was he pushed to awol in the first place?

To me it is easier to snake one's way around in the army than
to awol. So a lot must have been happening to trigger off the awol
and eventual suicide.


Personally I am not aware of the circumstances why he went AWOL. I don't want to speculate on what the newspaper had to say about the deceased unless I have seen the hards facts put before me.
 

leetahbar

Alfrescian
Loyal
I beg to disagree that I did not digress from what I had set out to ask what was the public policy. What I had merely done was to give examples and illustration to drive home my point. It may have been viewed otherwise by you but differences in interpretation of what I had said between you and me is understandable as views between us may differ.

The simple point is that the deceased serviceman had committed 2 criminal offences, that is, AWOL and suicide. Mindef is sending a wrong message to the public. Is Mindef going to publish condolences if assuming another several servicemen follow the same footstep as the late Dr Ooi. If so, aren't they "decorating" such act and condone their action. Public policy may dictate otherwise.

you are very insightful to have drawn the line of law between the ordinary and the elite. in your wise opinion, what should the SAF have done so that it's more agreeable to all?

like someone has mentioned that "a precious life was lost". does a life lost through fighting a war and one that lost through suicide really make a great difference?

both are losses of life. does one loss deem to be greater than another? how much do we understand about the suffering that the deceased had to go through to finally and hopelessly take on this route?

on the formal military regimented law, the late dr ooi shouldn't be mentioned for his "not very honorable" and untimely death, but on the humane side, A PRECIOUS LIFE IS LOST.

many lives were lost during national service. never has once the army given a proper accountablity. sometimes the tagline from a certain forummer rings loudly in our ears:

NS IS REALLY KILLING SG!
 

leetahbar

Alfrescian
Loyal
There is a difference between being aware and chose to be ignorant when aware of it. Perhaps both eyes and ears are closed for that matter.

ok. i think i m beginning to get your point. the army is hidding something which the public ought to know. a certain guilt maybe that involved some big shot who could have neglected his duty? or maybe allan ooi was in a way forced to a stage of hopelessness and desperation which caused him to decide to end it all?

obituary from army is just a indirect guilt ridden conscience to say they are sorry, it happened...and yes, of coure - what else, let's move on.:(
 

Porfirio Rubirosa

Alfrescian
Loyal
Yes...this should always be the case, same goes for say the NTU stabbing suicide case.
Personally I am not aware of the circumstances why he went AWOL. I don't want to speculate on what the newspaper had to say about the deceased unless I have seen the hards facts put before me.[/COLOR][/SIZE]
 

tomasloh

Alfrescian
Loyal
you are very insightful to have drawn the line of law between the ordinary and the elite. in your wise opinion, what should the SAF have done so that it's more agreeable to all?

The SAF can do it privately by giving wreath in the soldiers' own personal name and NOT in the name of SAF. No one can fault the army if the SAF personnel do so in their own individual capacity. But if done in the name of the SAF, then it signals a public policy issue.

like someone has mentioned that "a precious life was lost". does a life lost through fighting a war and one that lost through suicide really make a great difference?

It does makes a difference between natural death where servicemen were killed in action and deliberately taking one's own life.

both are losses of life. does one loss deem to be greater than another? how much do we understand about the suffering that the deceased had to go through to finally and hopelessly take on this route?

Everyone is accountable to themselves for their own action unless where you are holding public office, in which case, you are accountable to the public for your action. It is just like if you commit a crime, your spouse is not answerable for it though not legally but morally you are answerable to your family. But if you commit a crime while holding post in a public office, that department will have to answer. This is accountability in a government and this is what election is all about. You choose your MP from the party to form the government and to represent the people. So this is accountability.

on the formal military regimented law, the late dr ooi shouldn't be mentioned for his "not very honorable" and untimely death, but on the humane side, A PRECIOUS LIFE IS LOST.

That is why I started off in this thread that what I am about to say is not in disrespect to the deceased family. I am merely asking what should be the public policy. Is it right or wrong for Mindef to put up an Obituary for a deceased who is the subject matter of a crime.

many lives were lost during national service. never has once the army given a proper accountablity. sometimes the tagline from a certain forummer rings loudly in our ears:

I have to stress the fact that not everything done by the government must be accountable to the public. Mindef is apparently one department which enjoys such a privilege but a balancing exercise must be carefully carried out. They cannot use that privilge as though it is a blanket ban to cover all incidents that took place in the army.

Remember, we are in peace time and not in any war. Mindef may have to state the policy of how they deal with bond breakers in this case. The breaking of bond is a different issue with "celebrating" someone who is an army deserter by putting up in the Obituary albeit we understand from the newspaper that the bond issue was one of the factors that led him to commit suicide. These are 2 separate issues.


NS IS REALLY KILLING SG!

The above is purely my opinion that the government has to come out and state their stand.
 

Einfield

Alfrescian
Loyal
The last few months have seen several articles published in local newspaper that the law are for the rich and powerful and this is another episode that criminals are also decorated if they come from the elite rank.

How can you compare a Chow Ah Beng Private with a Captain Doctor??

Singapore or elsewhere, there's always 2 set of laws.
 

leetahbar

Alfrescian
Loyal
The above is purely my opinion that the government has to come out and state their stand.

u write well. did u try to write to ST FORUM? it's a good point u got there but then i doubt they would be bold enough to publish it. again, maybe amid a lot of recent economic depressive news now, this would be a really interesting topic for the readers to ponder on.
 

tomasloh

Alfrescian
Loyal
u write well. did u try to write to ST FORUM? it's a good point u got there but then i doubt they would be bold enough to publish it. again, maybe amid a lot of recent economic depressive news now, this would be a really interesting topic for the readers to ponder on.

Over the years, I have given up writing to ST Forum as they chose to publish letters which they considered and deemed that are non-critical to what the ST or the government have put up.

I have written several letters pointing out facts put up by the government and/or big organisations, like the Law Society of Singapore, the Judiciary and others which were materially wrong in their statement to the public but they have not been published. They have given the public wrong information which stand un-corrected today.


If you are interested, read what I have to say in this thread "Abuse of Power by Singapore Civil Servants".

http://www.sammyboy.com/showthread.php?t=12490


Also you may read in PAP Forum, the same thread and also "Official Assignee Commits Contempt of Court".

http://www.youngpap.org.sg/phpbb/viewtopic.php?t=23305
http://www.youngpap.org.sg/phpbb/viewtopic.php?t=23783
 

leetahbar

Alfrescian
Loyal
if u really wanna hear your opinions/voices being heard, join the opp team and be prepared for the next GE.

nsp or wp could be a good choice for u. i think goh meng seng at nsp could help u further:smile:

you should avoid sdp - i hate to say that but for your well-being, it's best to stir clear from this group.

or just simply be an observer and share opinions in forums would be suffice to get many minds cranking furiously away:wink:
 

kchunjeng

Alfrescian
Loyal
It's strange !

99.9% of AWOL cases are lower ranking, drug cases, fighting, drunk, disobey order.

Why should a SAF scholar want to AWOL ? Totally no logic at all !!

High ranking, good pay, got status, some more MD !

I really don't understand ! something is wrong some where !
 

makapaaa

Alfrescian (Inf)
Asset
There is always a forum to challenge Mindef decision if they don't allow the bond to be broken. Government's decision can be challenged and they are not always right.

Kangaroo%20Court


Absolutely! *hee*hee*
 

DerekDear

Alfrescian
Loyal
Why should a SAF scholar want to AWOL ? Totally no logic at all !!

High ranking, good pay, got status, some more MD !

I really don't understand ! something is wrong some where !


Don't understand? Its because you're a farmer, not an ELITE... or you wouldn't be here asking these stupid questions. Now get out of ....

:oIo:
 

tomasloh

Alfrescian
Loyal
if u really wanna hear your opinions/voices being heard, join the opp team and be prepared for the next GE.

nsp or wp could be a good choice for u. i think goh meng seng at nsp could help u further:smile:

you should avoid sdp - i hate to say that but for your well-being, it's best to stir clear from this group.

or just simply be an observer and share opinions in forums would be suffice to get many minds cranking furiously away:wink:

Sorry, I am not interested in entering politics or to join any political parties.
 

leetahbar

Alfrescian
Loyal
u can see things clearly and are vocal about it. we have 82 mps - all like wearing a doggie muffles. when policies are good, everyone jumps in to add to the praise. but when it's bad, some would jump in to add to the con while most would keep themselves "muffled".
 

tomasloh

Alfrescian
Loyal
u can see things clearly and are vocal about it. we have 82 mps - all like wearing a doggie muffles. when policies are good, everyone jumps in to add to the praise. but when it's bad, some would jump in to add to the con while most would keep themselves "muffled".

You don't need to be in politics to engage the politicians or the government on issues whether political or not. The politicians can engage in healthy discussions even in this forum with any member of the public and they can get feedback on the pros and cons of the policies which they desire to implement.

Not everyone in this forum are talking nonsense and some do provide very good insight into the issues raised. I believe in healthy discussions and criticising policies constructively and where possible discuss alternative solutions instead of pure attack on a policy with no solution in sight.
 

leetahbar

Alfrescian
Loyal
good points u got.

i notice khaw boon wah now speaks more cautiously and mindfully over the issue of "sending age parents to foreign nursing homes" after there were much resentment created by his original speech.

it's good if the gov listen and act more considerately. in the past, the impression we had on our gov, they listen...and that is: listen only but unfair or imposing policies were still implemented anyway.

unless there are more sincere opp members in parleement, then some real voices of peasants could be truly represented.
 

tomasloh

Alfrescian
Loyal
There is always a forum to challenge Mindef decision if they don't allow the bond to be broken. Government's decision can be challenged and they are not always right.

Kangaroo%20Court


Absolutely! *hee*hee*

You are challenging the terms of the bond that allow extension of bond by the government on a unilateral basis or the consequence of breaking the bond. So far I have not come across cases where the government has taken a bond breaker to court. The court will have to decide and give reasonings on whether the terms are reasonable or not. We are talking of contractual law and not criminal law on whether it is right or not, or guilty or not guilty.

Contract law are commercial law that are well governed and established which cannot be simply overturned by the court purely for the sake of one case.
 

tomasloh

Alfrescian
Loyal
unless there are more sincere opp members in parleement, then some real voices of peasants could be truly represented.

To speak up for the public does not mean that you must be in the opposition to do it.

The problem with the ruling party is that people dare not speak up for fear of antagonising their superiors or that their chances of promotion within the party will be stifled if they "step" on someone above them who disliked what they say.

I have met several MPs who talk a lot but when you asked them to raise the issue with the ministers, they stopped short and say that they have to go through proper channel to do it. The MPs have direct access to the ministers but they feared raising issues of concern to them for whatever reasons.

There are some MPs who do raised it up to the top but if the top do not come back to them, then there is nothing much the MPs could do as they are restrained by their party own protocol of bringing up issues higher up the hierarchy.
 
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