Serious Burn opium China national hero Lin Zexu was Hokkien

[ginfreely]

Mee poh ta mai Chang.

Mudlander bastards like you don't know shame don't know respect. Even great hero Lin Zexu also can make use to bully me. 贱！

 

[flatearther]

You are frog in the well to insist good province govt is not good govt

Once again, you have confirmed my suspicion that you were using yet another "straw man" argument against me by claiming that I was talking about provincial governments, even though I was talking about national governments right from the start (i.e. my first reply in this thread to jw5's post about Zhang Wuji becoming the emperor).

and i already said if such person was high level enough or even emperor he would made it entire dynasty govt was good.

And I've already said:

And once again, just like Zhang Wuji, he:

would have been deposed soon after that, in my opinion, so he would have wasted his time and energy

and you are once again changing the subject to try to use your fantasy of a "good" government to convince everyone that there is such a thing as a truly good government, right?

 

[ginfreely]

No you are the one caught using straw man examples and exposed just a few posts earlier and now again repeating your false accusations of me using straw man when already proven it's not a few posts ago. I thought you offered to let audience be the judge?? Goes to show you have zero credibility once again, not me.

Again repeat my answer: anyone with Lin Zexu capability will make good govt - like tang emperor Li shimin - i didn't restrict to province, it's you who did that and frog in the well insisted province govt is not govt and - now said i change topic. Everything is you say one and then used it to accuse me change topic, not clear, tell lies etc, a low class tactic that you have been using nonstop to paint my character black creating trouble out of nothing.

Once again, you have confirmed my suspicion that you were using yet another "straw man" argument against me by claiming that I was talking about provincial governments, even though I was talking about national governments right from the start (i.e. my first reply in this thread to jw5's post about Zhang Wuji becoming the emperor).



And I've already said:

 

[flatearther]

Lin himself was sabotage by his enemies due to him doing his clear shit job and sentenced to exile in Xinjiang.

Doesn't this consequence prove that he was simply not good enough to govern?
Why blame others?
If even the seemingly "good" governments are not good enough, what more the obviously bad governments?

 

[flatearther]

It's under Tang that china power and influence travelled far and wide and that is why other countries like Japan are using Chinese words as their language isn't it?

Following your logic, the "great" British Empire was superior to the Tang dynasty, right?

 

[ginfreely]

Following your logic, the "great" British Empire was superior to the Tang dynasty, right?

Rubbish. One is power and influence without using firearm, one is not. Which is superior is obvious.

 

[flatearther]

According to the article link that I provided earlier, Li Shimin cared a great deal about his people inclusive of minorities and even appointed them to high rank officials.

He was obviously bribing them to maintain, or even increase, his power, right?

What ordered slaves to kill people you talking about? Why you didn't provide the link and the full story? Under what circumstances did the killing occur? If there's war or revolution or power struggle etc, how to have no killing?

Violently struggling for power is a sin.

 

[ginfreely]

Doesn't this consequence prove that he was simply not good enough to govern?
Why blame others?
If even the seemingly "good" governments are not good enough, what more the obviously bad governments?

Harm by evil people means it's his fault? Good mudlander logic no wonder everyday busy doing evil mudlander dogs have no shame in doing evil and forever boasting of doing evil.

 

[flatearther]

Rubbish. One is power and influence without using firearm, one is not. Which is superior is obvious.

Are you implying that Li Shimin and his father established the Tang dynasty without using violence? :*:

 

[ginfreely]

He was obviously bribing them to maintain, or even increase, his power, right?



Violently struggling for power is a sin.

Li shimin caring a great deal about his people and kind to minorities is called bribing only to everyday busy doing evil mudlander dogs.

And not only did you not pprovide the link to substantiate what you said of him using slaves to kill people, you are changing topic to say power struggle is a sin. Sin or not has nothing to do with him caring a great deal about his people i.e good govt.

 

[ginfreely]

Are you implying that Li Shimin and his father established the Tang dynasty without using violence? :*:

Again you are the one changing topic, you were asking about my point about tang having power and influence far and wide to other countries and i was obviously replying to that. And yet you can shamelessly put words into my mouth on something irrelevant.

 

[flatearther]

Harm by evil people means it's his fault?

If he was a truly good governor, not only would he be morally upright, he would even be able to overcome all his enemies, either by persuasion (i.e. without needing to use violence against them) or by divine intervention.

 

[ginfreely]

Harm by evil people means it's his fault? Good mudlander logic no wonder everyday busy doing evil mudlander dogs have no shame in doing evil and forever boasting of doing evil.

Is it Lin Zexu's fault to be doing clear shit job clearing opium incurring enemies and get sabotaged by evil people? Or is it the shameless Manchu and满清汉奸走狗 Han Chinese traitor dogs fault? "人，是可以无耻到这个地步的。". The answer is obvious.


http://lz.book.sohu.com/fullscreen-chapter-1236099.html

"英雄往往能赢得敌手的尊重，和林则徐软磨硬泡打了一年多的交道，许多英国人并不把这个固执、倔强的老头当成不共戴天的敌人。连英国人都认为：“林公自是中国好总督，有血性，有才气，……岂为仇林总督而来耶？”

　　但在北京，林则徐实在树敌太多太多。

　　那些曾经参与鸦片贸易大发国难财的朝廷大员，那些在英军进犯之初拥护还击，实际上却是墙头草的栋梁们，危急关头，勇敢地站了出来，有的说“英舰至大者，舱中分设三层，逐层有炮百余位”，“其每层前后，又各设有大炮，约重七八千斤”，有的害怕失事受斥，群起攻击林则徐的“肇衅”，高唱“议和”的论调，总之，在他们看来，英国人是很爱好和平的，压根儿不打算来进犯大清，是林则徐在广州推行禁烟运动，逼得英国人别无选择，只好不远万里来讨个公道。

　　人，是可以无耻到这个地步的。

　　忠臣，是很不容易找见的，但是奸臣、弄臣往往一抓一大把，在这些懦弱、无能大臣们的鼓动下，道光皇帝坐不住了，热情之火被一点点的浇灭，充斥内心的是对战局的担忧和对林则徐的怀疑、不满与愤怒"

 

[flatearther]

And not only did you not pprovide the link to substantiate what you said of him using slaves to kill people, you are changing topic to say power struggle is a sin.

You gave me the impression that you were already very knowledgeable about the Tang dynasty, so I thought you were already aware of:
wikipedia.org/wiki/Tang_dynasty#Soldiers_and_conscription

Sin or not has nothing to do with him caring a great deal about his people i.e good govt.

Truly good ends do not justify sinful means.

 

[flatearther]

Again you are the one changing topic, you were asking about my point about tang having power and influence far and wide to other countries and i was obviously replying to that.

Couple of points:

1.

Japan are using Chinese words as their language isn't it?

That was because the ancestors of the Japanese people, and I mean the:
wikipedia.org/wiki/Yamato_people
migrated from China, right?

2. Please don't forget the:
wikipedia.org/wiki/Three_Kingdoms
In other words, every single Chinese dynasty always had to use violence (not just the threat of violence, since "threats" are just words and even showing off weapons do not necessarily mean that they would be used successfully to defeat one's enemies) to establish their "right" to rule, right?

 

[ginfreely]

You gave me the impression that you were already very knowledgeable about the Tang dynasty, so I thought you were already aware of:
wikipedia.org/wiki/Tang_dynasty#Soldiers_and_conscription



Truly good ends do not justify sinful means.

So it's my fault again that you didn't provide links and refused to do so? Everything is my fault when i never claimed to be knowledgeable and i already asked you explicitly to provide the link means i am already telling the whole world i don't know about that. And again you are changing topic on sinful means that has nothing to do with he cares a great deal about his people and is good govt.

And please lah you are quoting Wikipedia then can you have the courtesy to quote the exact paragraph like what i did for Lin Zexu. You are making a big point that li shimin was using slaves to kill people, then jolly well quote the paragraph explicitly. Or at least gave a summary of what happened and the circumstances that led to him using slaves and people can then go to the Wikipedia link to verify if they want to. What's this just say li shimin used slaves to kill people no head no tail and after repeated asking just give a Wikipedia link?

 

[ginfreely]

Couple of points:

1.
That was because the ancestors of the Japanese people, and I mean the:
wikipedia.org/wiki/Yamato_people
migrated from China, right?

2. Please don't forget the:
wikipedia.org/wiki/Three_Kingdoms
In other words, every single Chinese dynasty always had to use violence (not just the threat of violence, since "threats" are just words and even showing off weapons do not necessarily mean that they would be used successfully to defeat one's enemies) to establish their "right" to rule, right?

You saying Japanese are Chinese people and that's why they are using Chinese language? Link please AND don't put the whole Wikipedia link without quoting the exact paragraph proving your point Japanese people migrated from China. If not it's your guess only.

Anyway from the little i know of Japanese language, my guess is Japanese is like a dialect that adopted the Chinese words as script only. That is, they are their own people and had their own language before adopting Chinese words as part of script. They just need a script to put it in words form and due to last time china must have been super impressive, they decided to adopt many Chinese words inside their language as written script. And you look at their sentence structure you would know they are no where like Chinese sentences although using Chinese words as part of it. That is, the way they talk is very distinct from Chinese way of talking and so it's very unlikely they are Chinese people who migrated from China.

And again you are changing topic to violence in setting up dynasty that has nothing to do with good govt that cares a great deal about people.

 

[ginfreely]

Is it Lin Zexu's fault to be doing clear shit job clearing opium incurring enemies and get sabotaged by evil people? Or is it the shameless Manchu and满清汉奸走狗 Han Chinese traitor dogs fault? "人，是可以无耻到这个地步的。". The answer is obvious.


http://lz.book.sohu.com/fullscreen-chapter-1236099.html

"英雄往往能赢得敌手的尊重，和林则徐软磨硬泡打了一年多的交道，许多英国人并不把这个固执、倔强的老头当成不共戴天的敌人。连英国人都认为：“林公自是中国好总督，有血性，有才气，……岂为仇林总督而来耶？”

　　但在北京，林则徐实在树敌太多太多。

　　那些曾经参与鸦片贸易大发国难财的朝廷大员，那些在英军进犯之初拥护还击，实际上却是墙头草的栋梁们，危急关头，勇敢地站了出来，有的说“英舰至大者，舱中分设三层，逐层有炮百余位”，“其每层前后，又各设有大炮，约重七八千斤”，有的害怕失事受斥，群起攻击林则徐的“肇衅”，高唱“议和”的论调，总之，在他们看来，英国人是很爱好和平的，压根儿不打算来进犯大清，是林则徐在广州推行禁烟运动，逼得英国人别无选择，只好不远万里来讨个公道。

　　人，是可以无耻到这个地步的。

　　忠臣，是很不容易找见的，但是奸臣、弄臣往往一抓一大把，在这些懦弱、无能大臣们的鼓动下，道光皇帝坐不住了，热情之火被一点点的浇灭，充斥内心的是对战局的担忧和对林则徐的怀疑、不满与愤怒"

Actually no need to be govt official to get sabotaged, many here already proved this point.

人，是可以无耻到这个地步的。

 

[ginfreely]

Actually no need to be govt official to get sabotaged, many here already proved this point.

人，是可以无耻到这个地步的。

Proven everyday busy doing evil dogs can attack me in anything and everything i share. Talk about learning Spanish? Want to act high class. French? Act high class. Chinese history? Act knowledgeable. Outward bound school? Act athletic. Many more accusations for doing nothing wrong.

人，是可以无耻到这个地步的。

 

[ginfreely]

Proven everyday busy doing evil dogs can attack me in anything and everything i share. Talk about learning Spanish? Want to act high class. French? Act high class. Chinese history? Act knowledgeable. Outward bound school? Act athletic. Many more accusations for doing nothing wrong.

人，是可以无耻到这个地步的。

Everyday busy doing evil dogs, ask yourself first what do i owe you? Nothing. But you dogs owe me for all the evil that you did to me and still doing to me. And instead of repenting, you have no shame of evil done and turn around to ask me to repent.

人，是可以无耻到这个地步的。