Rabid anti-SDP sentiment in SBF

[OverTheCounter]

It is not my business to care about whether people here are pro or anti SDP.

However, I must point out that anti SDP sentiment has risen to very high levels.

Some of you are expressing genuine feelings. I have no problem with that.

However, a lot of the anti SDP rhetoric seems to me to be orchestrated. A lot of new nicks have registered in recent weeks, and they are all unanimously against SDP for some reason or other.

I have tried my best to read them and see whether they are making valid points. Unfortunately much of it seems to be tired, old rhetoric that holds little water. I have felt like rebutting, but it would be a waste of time. They have an agenda.

I would not be so bothered to be honest if this negativity was confined to SDP. Why I am so bothered NOW is that the negativity is spreading to other Opposition Parties.

Forvendet for example is not just anti SDP, he has taken almost every other Oppo to task in an unfair manner. Just read his posting. All full of bullshit and crap.

I strongly suspect this is part of a campaign by the PAP IB to tarnish the opposition online ahead of the GE.

Why the strong focus on SDP? Well, SDP has grown from strength to strength, and people from both PAP and WP are very jealous. That is why PAP and WP are sending agents to knock down SDP in online forums.

The $20,000 SDP donation is the straw that broke the camels back. These losers cannot take it that SDP has garnered so much overwhelming support, they have to find ways and means to smearing SDP to vent their anger and jealousy.

Another SDP initiative is their alternative budget which they are going to announce. Perspective immediately attack it, saying why bother to come up with an alternative to a sweetener. This is a very unfair attack and reflects on the poster badly rather than on SDP.

Many of people here are now changing their stand from "vote any opposition" to "vote only specific opposition". I believe this entire thing is orchestrated by the PAP IB, because PAP knows its support is eroding, they are mobilizing their internet agents to start whacking the opposition.

 

[Maximilian Chua-Heng]

 

[QXD]

Noticed that too. The PAP IB is very active of recent.

A lot of people expressing opinions to spoil votes, rather than vote for opposition.

It is highly suspect that this "wave" of forummers are here to discredit alternative voices, to make them seem in utter disarray.

The advocating of "spoiling votes" is the perfect PAP ploy to make your vote not count, because for every vote spoiled, an alternative voice is silenced and the PAP dogs will make a bigger majority. PAP knows full well that spoiling votes will only work to bolster their votes towards a percentage win, and of course will play this card when undercover as "disgruntled opposition supporters".

Interestingly, spoiling votes was the rallying cry of QXP, aka Bin Hee Heng, or in his case, a clear boycott. Problem with that fuckwit, keyboard hero/anarchist's grand design was that it hinged on the fact that SG elections will raise the ire of the international community and some "white knight" country will rescue us Singaporeans from the clutches of the despotic status quo.

So, to the disgruntled, downtrodden Singaporeans who want change but do not "trust" the opposition, I hope they remember that every spoiled vote is a vote for PAP to suppress their hopes, dreams and wages for another 6 years.

Worse yet, in 6 years they might be even more marginalised than now due to PAP's FT policies, that they will not be significant enough for PAP to bother.

 

[drifter]

I never interested in politics but this thread is very interesting ... Like a soap opera ..if politics really as what the thread starter has wrote ...it's scary.

 

[QXD]

What lends credence to their attacks towards opposition is that idiots like UY (with his "China SG citizens will lead SG to democracy" slant) and fivestars (SG is better off as part of Mudland) have clearly gone rogue.

 

[OverTheCounter]

Noticed that too. The PAP IB is very active of recent.
.

QXD,

I agree with your overall assessment conccerning vote spoiling. Who does vote spoiling benefit? The PAP of course. PAP supporters will not spoil their vote. Only oppo supporters will. If u ask oppo supporters to void vote, that can only mean more votes for PAP.

I know u have criticized SDP in the past, but just to assure you, I count u as those genuine type who have no sinister agenda. Other nicks I'm really not sure at all. Some of the newbies just registered a few months or even a few weeks seem to be acting in concert. That's my gut feel and I hope I'm wrong.

 

[singveld]

they will be gone after election
ignore them

 

[silverfox@]

Why the strong focus on SDP? Well, SDP has grown from strength to strength, and people from both PAP and WP are very jealous. That is why PAP and WP are sending agents to knock down SDP in online forums.

You have a very wide imagination.

The $20,000 SDP donation is the straw that broke the camels back. These losers cannot take it that SDP has garnered so much overwhelming support, they have to find ways and means to smearing SDP to vent their anger and jealousy.

Chee's continuous brushes with the courts got him a $20K fine. So today anyone who helps this idiot to pay, so be it. They are just fattening the PAP's coffers with $20K.

Another SDP initiative is their alternative budget which they are going to announce. Perspective immediately attack it, saying why bother to come up with an alternative to a sweetener. This is a very unfair attack and reflects on the poster badly rather than on SDP.

If today SDP is ruling party and comes out with a budget, I can also come out with an alternative budget anytime because I just need to come out a better proposal, more tax cuts, more incentives, more cash payment, less bills to pay for the people from an improvement from the budget which is announced. So what's special about an alternative budget when even you can do it?

Many of people here are now changing their stand from "vote any opposition" to "vote only specific opposition". I believe this entire thing is orchestrated by the PAP IB, because PAP knows its support is eroding, they are mobilizing their internet agents to start whacking the opposition.

Your imagination is running wild again.

 

[QXD]

Thanks. I will indeed support any opposition that speaks the "people's language", because I know that it is the only way that Singaporeans can be treated as citizens instead of production statistics.

Putting an opposition into parliament is the only way to make those good-for-nothing PAP dogs and ministers eat their own shit rhetoric.

Just imagine if we could get lower-paid, but more enthusiastic elected opposition MPs, unencumbered by the oversight of the FamiLEE, fucking bastards like Comical Ah Lim, Marlboro Tan, Cunt Sing and the Clown Prince will have no choice but to work harder and faster for Singaporeans to justify their obscene salaries.

That to me, is closer to what PAP has always espoused from their ivory tower; That a free market would always benefit the overall economy of Singapore.

And if this means that I have to get a ticket to fly back to SG to vote for an opposition in my ward, I damn well will.

QXD,
I know u have criticized SDP in the past, but just to assure you, I count u as those genuine type who have no sinister agenda. Other nicks I'm really not sure at all. Some of the newbies just registered a few months or even a few weeks seem to be acting in concert. That's my gut feel and I hope I'm wrong.

 

[scroobal]

Welcome back. Nice opening. You remind me of Ramseth who used to qualify his comment about being neutral and launch into something that is not until someone pointed it out to him. We all have our hobby horses. You have always being an ardent fan of SDP, Ramseth of LTK, TKL etc.

Frankly nobody in SBF can influence or do anything detrimental to any political parties. The numbers are small and therefore insignificant. Furthermore they are unlikely to be concentrated in the constituency that SDP or any party is going to contest. Some are even based overseas.

How the SDP performs very much depends on the way that Chee and party do their strategy and tactics. Its up to voters.

Collecting $10k is small potatoes. People spend that in one night in a niteclub over diluted brandy, cheap PRC whores and a bill that can't even read.

The trouble with SDP supporters are that they blame everyone and everything for their defeat. In my mind Chee and his sister are the only two that have brains and the passion. Unfortunately Chee is neither a strategist or a tactician. The rest of those that he associates with can classified as imbeciles and posers. We got one clown who keeps claiming to be an OMS when he only attended a polytechnic paid by the Govt albeit it is now a University. During that era even nurses were sponsored by the Govt. Another got his tertiary education from distance learning but claim to fame is smart alec quibs to PAP politcians passing by. Lets not forget Uncle Yap. The damage that this guy did is immense and he was not a even member. Then we have hormonal charged skirt that chased one WP member fruitlessly and then switched to another. The we have the 2 rabbits that have jumped from party to party that no one knows which holes they came from. The decent thing to do is put all of them down on humanitarian grounds.

If I was Chee, I start from scratch including starting a new party. People rather follow him than SDP. Attract some decent individuals like Vincent W.

It is not my business to care about whether people here are pro or anti SDP.

 

[QXD]

You have a very wide imagination.

It is more likely that you lack the intelligence to contribute to a discussion.

Chee's continuous brushes with the courts got him a $20K fine. So today anyone who helps this idiot to pay, so be it. They are just fattening the PAP's coffers with $20K.

No difference in fattening of coffers compared to if Singtel were to be fined by IDA, the currency in use is still left pocket, right pocket. Only difference is the symbolic slap in PAP's face that the very people they lord over are stepping up and shaming their regime and kangaroo courts.

I can also come out with an alternative budget anytime because I just need to come out a better proposal, more tax cuts, more incentives, more cash payment, less bills to pay for the people from an improvement from the budget which is announced. So what's special about an alternative budget when even you can do it?

Be my guest and please do, and let us poke holes in it and expose you as the imbecile you so rightly deserve.

Your imagination is running wild again.

Little children by now have long gone to bed. You must be a very naughty.

 

[Ramseth]

Welcome back. Nice opening. You remind me of Ramseth who used to qualify his comment about being neutral and launch into something that is not until someone pointed it out to him. We all have our hobby horses. You have always being an ardent fan of SDP, Ramseth of LTK, TKL etc.

I'm having lunch with LTK on Sunday and dinner with TKL on Monday. I don't pretend to be neutral. However, neither do I pretend and insist that the people I support are perfect. There'd be times they'd make mistakes. Neither am I. There'd be time times I'd make mistakes. Point those mistakes out frankly and fairly and I'd accept them gladly and gratefully.

 

[OverTheCounter]

Being compared to two-faced double-headed snake Ramseth is one of the most vile insults I've been dealt with in recent years, but I'll let it pass.

You have a very nice imagination on my hobby horses. I support opposition and civil society actors who are working for change and democracy. As simple as that.

It is very unfair of you to smear those helping Chee & Sister. Have you met any of them personally? You spoken personally to Jarrod, Khalis, Kai Xiong, Seelan, Jaslyn, John Law, Jufrie Mahmood face to face before? Well, let me tell you I have.

These are not braggats or self-centered people looking for personal fame or to fill some gap in their life by latching on to CSJ and Sis. They are all great helpers, putting in time, energy, expertise to SDP, without the need to tell others what they're doing online. Your comments which smear this group of people in one brush stroke is very, very unfair and uncalled for.

Welcome back. Nice opening. You remind me of Ramseth who used to qualify his comment about being neutral and launch into something that is not until someone pointed it out to him. We all have our hobby horses. You have always being an ardent fan of SDP, Ramseth of LTK, TKL etc.

** ** SNIP ** **

The trouble with SDP supporters are that they blame everyone and everything for their defeat. In my mind Chee and his sister are the only two that have brains and the passion. Unfortunately Chee is neither a strategist or a tactician. The rest of those that he associates with can classified as imbeciles and posers.

 

[scroobal]

99.999% of voters have no time to meet any of the candidates let alone their helpers. This is not a Singapore phenomenon, it is universal. Their perceptions and their opinions are built around what they see and what they hear. The good part is that no fair minded or reasonably intelligent Singaporean is going to let the govt controlled media tell them what to do.

It therefore depends on the actions and images that this individuals create for themselves.

Very similar to your great opening line and then launching into Ramseth style narrative. People thus form opinions and your integrity goes down the drain. The least you should have done is create a new moniker.

You also need to separate passion and conviction from the capacity and capability. I know of total imbeciles that are absolutely passionate about freedom and the need for opposition parties to be in parliament. But they can't lead, can't think and worse still, can't explain themselves.

Lets face it - if Chee and his sister leave the party. no will bother with the rest. It is not the same with other opposition parties. They are more capable and respected people in other parties besides their respective leaders.

If Gandhi, John or any other stand in any constituency by themselves, they would not only lose their deposits, they will probably not register on any radar. That unfortunately is the reality.

Back to my original point - we can't do anything to influence Singapore. It up to SDP and Chee to convince Singapore.

Being compared to two-faced double-headed snake Ramseth is one of the most vile insults I've been dealt with in recent years, but I'll let it pass.

You have a very nice imagination on my hobby horses. I support opposition and civil society actors who are working for change and democracy. As simple as that.

It is very unfair of you to smear those helping Chee & Sister. Have you met any of them personally? You spoken personally to Jarrod, Khalis, Kai Xiong, Seelan, Jaslyn, John Law, Jufrie Mahmood face to face before? Well, let me tell you I have.

These are not braggats or self-centered people looking for personal fame or to fill some gap in their life by latching on to CSJ and Sis. They are all great helpers, putting in time, energy, expertise to SDP, without the need to tell others what they're doing online. Your comments which smear this group of people in one brush stroke is very, very unfair and uncalled for.

 

[scroobal]

Your integrity is as good as your next meal. TKL has been PAP cadre for over 30 years. He enjoyed the pleasure of enjoying PAP largesse including allowing NTUC Income monopoly to selling policies to Govt entities and access to army camp. The moment he retired, he found his balls and his consciousness. In case you are not aware, he was unceremoniously dumped and he did not get a directorship in any GLC and it must have hurt. If he was selected as a member of Marine Parade GRC where he was one of the shortlisted candidates, you won't be having dinner with him on Monday and we both won't be having this discussion.

99% of the time you are actually right and you probably one of the most rational person on this site and frankly you have been more fair than most. Unfortunately that 1% is a fatal mistake.

That is why when there is a conflict of interest as it is your bread and butter, best not to preach anything to anyone and just be quiet. We are all humans and we can't help ourselves when its our bread and butter. Only rare few can - and they become leaders.

While you are having dinner with TKL, ask him why he is not standing for president. And please don;t us that you advised against it. TKL knows very well that ex-cadre members would have their innards pulled out especially after enjoying the ride on the gravy train. Note what they did to Tang.

I'm having lunch with LTK on Sunday and dinner with TKL on Monday. I don't pretend to be neutral. However, neither do I pretend and insist that the people I support are perfect. There'd be times they'd make mistakes. Neither am I. There'd be time times I'd make mistakes. Point those mistakes out frankly and fairly and I'd accept them gladly and gratefully.

 

[Ramseth]

TKL has been PAP cadre for over 30 years. He enjoyed the pleasure of enjoying PAP largesse including allowing NTUC Income monopoly to selling policies to Govt entities and access to army camp. The moment he retired, he found his balls and his consciousness. In case you are not aware, he was unceremoniously dumped and he did not get a directorship in any GLC and it must have hurt. If he was selected as a member of Marine Parade GRC where he was one of the shortlisted candidates, you won't be having dinner with him on Monday and we both won't be having this discussion.

We have to put the insurance issue into perspective. TKL ran NTUC Income on the ideals founded by GKS, i.e. insurance for the lower income group who're not prospecting targets for commerical agents interested in bigger policies and bigger premiums. If you check out the premium rates and bonus returns from the 1997 to 2007, no other company can beat NTUC Income under TKL. It wasn't a monopoly to army camps or civil service departments, all other insurance companies can arrange talks there too, but they wouldn't, because no point wasting marketing resources fight such cheaper policies. They'd rather charge higher premiums and payout lower bonuses in order to pay agents much higher commissions in open market where policy buyers lack thorough figures to compare. It's allowed too, since the government must allow commercial insurance companies and agents to remain profitable, part and parcel of running an economy. NTUC Income role as a co-operative was to prevent higher commercial premiums from getting too high. TKL was unceremoniously booted out since the government apparently doesn't believe in that anymore. Free market, any price goes, You pay, your business. You overpay, business. You die, your business.

 

[Thick Face Black Heart]

We have to put the insurance issue into perspective.

Wow.

Ramseth really knows which side of his bread is buttered.

 

[Ramseth]

We have to put the insurance issue into perspective. TKL ran NTUC Income on the ideals founded by GKS, i.e. insurance for the lower income group who're not prospecting targets for commerical agents interested in bigger policies and bigger premiums. If you check out the premium rates and bonus returns from the 1997 to 2007, no other company can beat NTUC Income under TKL. It wasn't a monopoly to army camps or civil service departments, all other insurance companies can arrange talks there too, but they wouldn't, because no point wasting marketing resources fight such cheaper policies. They'd rather charge higher premiums and payout lower bonuses in order to pay agents much higher commissions in open market where policy buyers lack thorough figures to compare. It's allowed too, since the government must allow commercial insurance companies and agents to remain profitable, part and parcel of running an economy. NTUC Income role as a co-operative was to prevent higher commercial premiums from getting too high. TKL was unceremoniously booted out since the government apparently doesn't believe in that anymore. Free market, any price goes, You pay, your business. You overpay, business. You die, your business.

Wow.

Ramseth really knows which side of his bread is buttered.

Don't generalise and personalise attacks with one-liners like that to degrade your own integrity. Anonymous or not, you know who you are. Any point to disagree with, point it out, point and point. I'd be glad and grateful for any correction where I'm mistaken.

 

[Thick Face Black Heart]

Don't generalise and personalise attacks with one-liners like that to degrade your own integrity.

Sorry, my face is too thick and my heart is too black to worry about "integrity".

 

[Dreamer1]

It is not my business to care about whether people here are pro or anti SDP.

However, I must point out that anti SDP sentiment has risen to very high levels.

Some of you are expressing genuine feelings. I have no problem with that.

However, a lot of the anti SDP rhetoric seems to me to be orchestrated. A lot of new nicks have registered in recent weeks, and they are all unanimously against SDP for some reason or other.

I have tried my best to read them and see whether they are making valid points. Unfortunately much of it seems to be tired, old rhetoric that holds little water. I have felt like rebutting, but it would be a waste of time. They have an agenda.

I would not be so bothered to be honest if this negativity was confined to SDP. Why I am so bothered NOW is that the negativity is spreading to other Opposition Parties.

Forvendet for example is not just anti SDP, he has taken almost every other Oppo to task in an unfair manner. Just read his posting. All full of bullshit and crap.

I strongly suspect this is part of a campaign by the PAP IB to tarnish the opposition online ahead of the GE.

Why the strong focus on SDP? Well, SDP has grown from strength to strength, and people from both PAP and WP are very jealous. That is why PAP and WP are sending agents to knock down SDP in online forums.

The $20,000 SDP donation is the straw that broke the camels back. These losers cannot take it that SDP has garnered so much overwhelming support, they have to find ways and means to smearing SDP to vent their anger and jealousy.

Another SDP initiative is their alternative budget which they are going to announce. Perspective immediately attack it, saying why bother to come up with an alternative to a sweetener. This is a very unfair attack and reflects on the poster badly rather than on SDP.

Many of people here are now changing their stand from "vote any opposition" to "vote only specific opposition". I believe this entire thing is orchestrated by the PAP IB, because PAP knows its support is eroding, they are mobilizing their internet agents to start whacking the opposition.

Wow,my friend,u are not very clever,you start yr well intentioned msg by naming a new group which has not appeared so far

WP IB,

To me,U need to work hard to eatablish the existence of WP IB first!

Judge not people by their hidden motives,but by what they write here,if thier points are wrong,just point them out.