Why the new MDA rules won't hurt the PAP

[zhihau]

c if he dare 2 carry out his threats ...

bro,
the old man is... old

 

[escher]

“Without the elected president and if there is a freak result, within two or three years, the army would have to come in and stop it”
- Lee Kuan Yew, Straits Times, Sept 16 2006

*cough cough*

Why bother quoting that fuckhead LKY? LKY is such a fucking bag of fermented shit that he will put good to honest shit to fucking shame.
Half the things LKY quote came from other people that he plagiarised and the other half from his fucking shit head that is good only for fermenting more shit

 

[CPT (NS) BRANDON]

That's not 'realistic'; it's defeatist. LKY's statements were made without bases in fact. Who makes up the SAF? As for the Gurkhas, let's remember once again that they are seconded to the SPF from the British and have a British Commander. So long as the opposition does not say anything like 'We'll send the Gurkhas home', the British would be loathe to be seen supporting a failed dictatorship.

Finally, cast your mind back to the 1980s. Given what you saw at the start of the decade, would you have thought any of the scenarios possible?

• the breakup of the USSR
• the fall of the Berlin Wall
• Liverpool losing its domination of English football.

Well perhaps you are right, but I am not optimistic.

In the aftermath of 2011, I was hopeful that there would be change. But lately I have begun to realise that the PAP itself is not the only problem. The problem is from the culture that the PAP created decades ago, and that now permeates every single aspect of society.

I am talking about a culture where no one cares about anything beyond the issues which directly affect them. People who are more intent to cover their asses than to look at the big picture. I have interacted with police officers, army officers, educators, doctors, nurses and all seem to have totally no pride in their jobs, failing to appreciate how important their role is in society -- all are not comfortable making decisions based on conscience and common sense, instead choosing to just hide behind an invisible and faceless, yet also monolithic, bureaucracy.

I could give examples, but seriously, I am beginning to think that Singapore just needs to be this way because Singaporeans aren't really ready for anything different. You could vote the PAP out, yes, but would that change everything? Would Singapore become a happy place? Would people take pride in their jobs? Would you restore self-esteem and a sense of belonging? Seriously, I doubt it.

 

[steffychun]

Well perhaps you are right, but I am not optimistic.

In the aftermath of 2011, I was hopeful that there would be change. But lately I have begun to realise that the PAP itself is not the only problem. The problem is from the culture that the PAP created decades ago, and that now permeates every single aspect of society.

I am talking about a culture where no one cares about anything beyond the issues which directly affect them. People who are more intent to cover their asses than to look at the big picture. I have interacted with police officers, army officers, educators, doctors, nurses and all seem to have totally no pride in their jobs, failing to appreciate how important their role is in society -- all are not comfortable making decisions based on conscience and common sense, instead choosing to just hide behind an invisible and faceless, yet also monolithic, bureaucracy.

I could give examples, but seriously, I am beginning to think that Singapore just needs to be this way because Singaporeans aren't really ready for anything different. You could vote the PAP out, yes, but would that change everything? Would Singapore become a happy place? Would people take pride in their jobs? Would you restore self-esteem and a sense of belonging? Seriously, I doubt it.

Culture changes.

To HOTLAS, it would need lots of clever independent level minded soldiers to defy any order to clamp down on anti-establishment protesters.

 

[zhihau]

To HOTLAS, it would need lots of clever independent level minded soldiers to defy any order to clamp down on anti-establishment protesters.

with the number of foreigners here in Singapore, think many Singaporeans feel the crush... to bust a few caps? don't think the troops will have any qualms squeezing off a few rounds on the arses of the MIW.

 

[PrinceCharming]

I am talking about a culture where no one cares about anything beyond the issues which directly affect them. People who are more intent to cover their asses than to look at the big picture. I have interacted with police officers, army officers, educators, doctors, nurses and all seem to have totally no pride in their jobs, failing to appreciate how important their role is in society -- all are not comfortable making decisions based on conscience and common sense, instead choosing to just hide behind an invisible and faceless, yet also monolithic, bureaucracy.

Isn't that good for the opposition?

Like I said, for PAP to fall, the rot has to originate and spread from within.

 

[steffychun]

with the number of foreigners here in Singapore, think many Singaporeans feel the crush... to bust a few caps? don't think the troops will have any qualms squeezing off a few rounds on the arses of the MIW.

If they can find the keys to the arms

 

[zhihau]

If they can find the keys to the arms

was talking about the scenario where the SAF is called in during a "freak election result". do read in context.

 

[kukubird58]

“Without the elected president and if there is a freak result, within two or three years, the army would have to come in and stop it”
- Lee Kuan Yew, Straits Times, Sept 16 2006

*cough cough*

Finally, he also stated: "If there was a freak result and a rogue government came into power, we would have to call in the SAF."

hahaha...again it is quoted out of context......
cow sense is important and again it is missing.....
lky is not dumb enough to say that he (LKY) will call in the SAF when there is a feak result and a rouge government is in power...

 

[steffychun]

hahaha...again it is quoted out of context......
cow sense is important and again it is missing.....
lky is not dumb enough to say that he (LKY) will call in the SAF when there is a feak result and a rouge government is in power...

LKY no longer sits in front bench. Parliament-wise and government-wise, he cannot call in the SAF. It is up to his son to decide if he will follow dad's word. Then the CDF and the service chiefs will have to decide if they will agree--usually the scholar system makes sure they are beholden to the PAP. From then on, it's anyone's game. RSMs, CSMs, Armskotes men etc are not pure PAP holders. So they could follow or defy orders.

 

[steffychun]

was talking about the scenario where the SAF is called in during a "freak election result". do read in context.

I did read in context. The question I was asking if if it can really happen.

 

[kukubird58]

LKY no longer sits in front bench. Parliament-wise and government-wise, he cannot call in the SAF. It is up to his son to decide if he will follow dad's word. Then the CDF and the service chiefs will have to decide if they will agree--usually the scholar system makes sure they are beholden to the PAP. From then on, it's anyone's game. RSMs, CSMs, Armskotes men etc are not pure PAP holders. So they could follow or defy orders.

hahaha....u another kuku....
he is talking about 2-3 years time frame, when a rouge government is in power, papee is out of power so how is pinky going to call in the SAF???
What LKY is saying is scare tactics.....he is assuming the SAF is a professional army that will step in on their own when they see the country going down the drain...
this is typical LKY scare tactics....remember when he said your daughters will become maids....
but LKY is not dumb....that you can be sure.

 

[steffychun]

hahaha....u another kuku....
he is talking about 2-3 years time frame, when a rouge government is in power, papee is out of power so how is pinky going to call in the SAF???
What LKY is saying is scare tactics.....he is assuming the SAF is a professional army that will step in on their own when they see the country going down the drain...
this is typical LKY scare tactics....remember when he said your daughters will become maids....
but LKY is not dumb....that you can be sure.

You are the kuku. screw you.

 

[zhihau]

I did read in context. The question I was asking if if it can really happen.

thought you asked if they can find the keys :p:p:p

 

[zhihau]

lky is not dumb enough to say that he (LKY) will call in the SAF when there is a feak result and a rouge government is in power...

you could be right, he'd be dead by then

 

[steffychun]

you could be right, he'd be dead by then

You would have to wonder what his son would do then

 

[zhihau]

You would have to wonder what his son would do then

noticed how the parliament is lined with MG/BG and Admirals and sort? SMRT, A*Star top honcho, etc... now even PS to MOE also another army guy Neo... so, like what TCH asked: what do you think?

 

[steffychun]

noticed how the parliament is lined with MG/BG and Admirals and sort? SMRT, A*Star top honcho, etc... now even PS to MOE also another army guy Neo... so, like what TCH asked: what do you think?

Is that where Neo boy is now? At least old RSA Ng got into SID. and now brothers in charge of SAF.

 

[CPT (NS) BRANDON]

Seriously, LKY controls everything -- or at least most people assume so.

Do you honestly think that if the PAP loses an election, they would be willing to allow another party to run the country, take over all their ministries and agencies, and take over the assets of Temasek and GIC?

Honestly? Just like that? Give up and go into opposition quietly?

That is a rather naive view to say the least.

Remember when LKY appeared on some talk show to say that what Deng Xiaoping did (regarding Tiananmen Square) was right?

Do you really think he would not call in the SAF to depose a rogue government who (in his opinion) threatens Singapore's future?

 

[CPT (NS) BRANDON]

From then on, it's anyone's game. RSMs, CSMs, Armskotes men etc are not pure PAP holders. So they could follow or defy orders.

It's not about party politics. It's not about the PAP, or the WP, or the SDP.

It's about the entire country being run by a small coterie of interests. There is an inner circle, and I can tell you the inner circle is NOT limited to the PAP. There are PAP leaders, even cabinet ministers, who are not part of this inner circle. There are also people who are completely not associated with the PAP in any way, but are part of this inner circle. Do you think that the large family owned banks, conglomerates, real estate developers are not in this inner circle that is in control?? I shall not name names, but you will notice that LKY and LHL are always at their weddings, funerals and so on. Other peripheral PAP leaders, for instance people like Lui Tuck Yew or Chan Chun Sing, are not part of this elite inner circle.

In any case, to answer your question.

I am a reservist officer holding the appointment of S1 in a NS battalion.

I can openly tell everyone here with no fear whatsoever that if I received an order to open fire on fellow Singaporeans who were peacefully protesting, I would not do it. If I was ordered to use arms to overthrow a democratically elected government (whether I support them or not), I would also not obey the orders. If they want to charge me for insubordination, so be it. I would rather go to prison than have blood on my hands.

However, I can also openly tell everyone here that many of the colleagues who I know from my army days would not share my views. Mainly out of fear and ignorance. They would think that following orders of the "authorities" is right. They are not trained to question the orders. So if they receive orders to kill innocent people, they would assume that those innocent people must be guilty, otherwise the order would not have been given in the first place. Hence, they would just execute the order.