LKY replies to AWARE

[kingrant]

My dear Nicole,

Pls remind yr lady chauvinists that my late wife was a fine highly intelligent woman who had an IQ better than mine. She left her very successful job and business to be a stay-home Mum and singlehandedly brought up all 3 of our children. My elder son is your PM, another son heads an important national agency, and my daughter is the Director of NNI. Thus, that is how a succesful woman with a Degree should do - contribute to the nation's talent pool with 3 geniuses to keep our country going. Imagine what would have happened if Gek Choo had decided to work? Not only will she get in my way but we , and the country, would suffer with 3 less geniuses. So one woman's loss is a nation's gain - by threefold!

As AWARE president, you really ought to think first about this country of ours with its falling birthrate and lastly about your members selfish interests. In fact, I hope i dont have to tell you that what you are indulging in are acts of sedition and even treason; and I could put you all away with the ISA, just to make you all shut the fuck up . I want you to read about Hitler's "Fuhrer's brides" program. That fella might have been a idiot and a corporal in the Austrian army but he actually had some great ideas. Consider yourself lucky that my precocious son the PM actually stayed my hand, as he firmly believed in democracy and freedom of expression. If I was still in charge, you all will be deemed as dabbling in politics and I would make sure that AWARE is registered as a political party before the day is out.

Your former PM, SM, and MM.

Kuan Yew

 

[halsey02]

You left out the titles, Now Eminent Minister, soon to be Immortal Minister

 

[kingrant]

The Old Man asked me to pass this on:

"Will you guys shut the fuck up about my man-ish daughter, my woman-ish son, and my albino grandson?"

 

[scroobal]

What you wrote is not far from the truth. After his National Day rally speech where he first brought genetic engineering to the fore and began introducing policies to support, the ladies got together to resist. His minister threatened them. They relented. So now Aware spends its time playing at the fringe, fiddling and farting along the way.

 

[kingrant]

Was he GKS? Or he had already stepped down. My, I'm gg senile.

What you wrote is not far from the truth. After his National Day rally speech where he first brought genetic engineering to the fore and began introducing policies to support, the ladies got together to resist. His minister threatened them. They relented. So now Aware spends its time playing at the fringe, fiddling and farting along the way.

 

[Ash007]

Some how, I agree with what is written here. Even if it sounds a bit male chauvinistic. Most "dual" income family doesn't realised the impact to the family when the mum goes to work as well.

 

[Annoyed]

Then, the way forward should be to inculcate more pro-family policies as a whole, such as lengthening the duration of paternity leave and providing more affordable childcare services, among others. Raising children should be a dual responsibility, rather than rest squarely on the shoulders of the mother. May I also add that not every family has the luxury of relying on one breadwinner.

Some how, I agree with what is written here. Even if it sounds a bit male chauvinistic. Most "dual" income family doesn't realised the impact to the family when the mum goes to work as well.

 

[halsey02]

What you wrote is not far from the truth. After his National Day rally speech where he first brought genetic engineering to the fore and began introducing policies to support, the ladies got together to resist. His minister threatened them. They relented. So now Aware spends its time playing at the fringe, fiddling and farting along the way.

Can we accuse him of practicing EUGENICS? AWARE should have asked the many unborn children, that could have been born.

 

[red amoeba]

i remembered somewhere along the lines, he mentioned that if he could change, he would allow women to be so educated in Singapore...that comment drew alot of flak from my female classmates at that time..LOL

 

[neddy]

the ladies got together to resist. His minister threatened them. They relented. So now Aware spends its time playing at the fringe, fiddling and farting along the way.

1. Still at risk to be forced to register as a political party - a dirty way to silence AWARE. (Outcome: fiddling and farting)

2. Research papers have shown that a reason why Perth property prices shot up is that more and more families are having dual income, and they are competing with newly dual income homebuyers by upping the prices. Before that, the property prices were lower with single income families.

3. The trouble with Harry Lee is that he failed to think through or allow criticism with his ideas. Alternative views are called dissenting. I wonder if it is possible to have a proper discussion with him at all? I pity what he put his children through. And now, he is trying to run (ruin) single women's choice.

4. Research indicate social pressure for Singapore women to work! Tough when you consider the lack of flexible family friendly workplace.

5. Too much meddling by government and this near-senile politician will results in more confusion for today's Singapore women.

6. In general, a full-time job does not make a woman happy. Also, women love to talk about their day at the work, gossip about work and make decisions by talking. Who is listening?

This article highlight the difference between working women in Singapore and Australia.

* In short: Singapore women feel social pressure to work and society create an environment for working women. Aussie women feel the stress of work-family balance because work is a choice for them *

REFERENCES

"The Impact of Cultural Context on the Perception of Work/Family Balance by Professional Women in Singapore and Hong Kong", Htwe Htwe Thein, Siobhan Austen, Janice Currie and Erica Lewin, International Journal of Cross Cultural Management, Vol 10, No 3.

"Balancing Work and Childcare - The Legacy of a Gender Equality Experiment", Tone Schou Wetlesen, Community, Work & Family, Vol 13, No 4.

Women working less than 40hours a week are happiest.
http://asp-uk.secure-zone.net/v2/index.jsp?id=685/747/1478&lng=en

 

[Seee3]

Then, the way forward should be to inculcate more pro-family policies as a whole, such as lengthening the duration of paternity leave and providing more affordable childcare services, among others. Raising children should be a dual responsibility, rather than rest squarely on the shoulders of the mother. May I also add that not every family has the luxury of relying on one breadwinner.

Your suggestion will definitely provide parents with more free time. However,this may not lead to better care and upbringing of their children. How many parents really practise their preaching that raising children should be dual responsibility? In most instances, parents have sub-contracted raising children to maids, child-care centres, schools.... When things go wrong with their kids, it is the fault of all these agents. Maybe their definition of "responsibility" is different from mine.

 

[kingrant]

I dont think forummers here have really addressed the root of the problem, which is Why couples don't want to more than 2?All the suggestions are fine - lomger paternity leave, more and lower cost childcare services, even cheaper maids etc. If implemented, these will encourage some to begin to have one child or two. But they would stop at two. Why? Why do the Malays have more than 2?

 

[sleaguepunter]

My dear Nicole,

That fella might have been a idiot and a corporal in the Austrian army but he actually had some great ideas. Your former PM, SM, and MM.

Kuan Yew

Hitler who was an Austrian served as a corporal in the Kaiser's army.

 

[kingrant]

Tks for correction. But whatever, as a corporal, he already had his mind on big things and the big picture. unlike fallen angel Cpl Wong Kan Seng could think of nothing.

Hitler who was an Austrian served as a corporal in the Kaiser's army.

 

[Annoyed]

Hi,

Thought I should clarify that I wasn't purporting to recommend how to raise the birthrate, or provide better care and upbringing to children. I was merely responding to the suggestion that mothers had the sole responsibility of raising their kids, and that dual families didn't realize what they were sacrificing for that extra income. I come from only one angle: it isn't fair to say that women have no other role to play in society, but to procreate and bring up children. Rather than blame women for wanting to assert themselves in other ways, we should be looking at how to make the environment more conducive to raising families all around, such that the burden does not fall squarely on the shoulders of the mother. I am certainly aware that my suggestions are neither conclusive nor exhaustive.

Like Seee3, I disagree with "subcontracting" the care of children to maids, childcare centres, etc. IMHO, this isn't just about making sure your kids are fed and bathed, and prevented from fighting with each other, or falling down the staircase. There's that stuff about teaching them the "right values" - argh, how I hate that phrase - and I'll be the first to admit that you can't pay people to do these things. All I'm saying is that increasing such services will help to provide relief for parents - particularly mothers - who actually have to work for a living. Needless to say, it is still the parents' responsibilities to ensure that their kids are brought up "right" - however you want to define that. There's no substitute for spending quality time with your children. FYI, I come from a family of educators, and have no sympathy for complaining parents who never fail to blame the principal/teacher/education system/classmates/anyone but themselves when their kids get into trouble.

As for why people do not want to have more (than two) kids, I can't purport to speak for everybody. My personal observation is that it boils down primarily to three areas - costs, expectations and level of education - all of which are inter-related. Most of us are probably aware that there is a direct correlation between one's level of education and marriage age. [That extends to the number of spawn in a marriage as well - the later you marry, the less time your biological clock has to tick and the less kids you tend to have.] I would also venture to say that the higher your level of education, the higher your expectation - for both yourself and your children. That is, it isn't enough for your kids to enter "average" schools, mix with "average" kids, hopefully make it to a local university, and then get government jobs after they graduate. No, you want your kids to be the "best" and to be so, they must have the "best" - ballet/piano/art/abacus/mental calculation/foreign language lessons from the age of three. When they enter primary school, you'll start getting tuition teachers to supplement what they're taught in class, and more tuition teachers to supplement what they're taught in tuition classes. Continue with this all the way to secondary school and JC; let's also not forget about saving enough for "luxury items" like their overseas university education (just in case they don't qualify for scholarships). All of this costs money - does it not? - and the more children you have, the more you'll need to spend.

I've had colleagues tell me that they intend to stop at one because "I'd rather my only daughter have a 48-color crayon set than two kids, who each can only have 24-color crayon sets". And others who start sending their children for French - albeit kiddy - lessons when they're only two, in the hope that they'll grow up to be trilingual, instead of just bilingual (never mind that our system of bilingual education has flunked completely; that's another topic for another time). I'm not standing by the efficacy of these methods, but I do know a large number of people with such mentalities. And as society gets more competitive with upward mobility becoming increasingly important, I don't know if there's any turning back. For those I'm acquainted with, no number of incentives is going to make them spawn at the desirable level of three or more - simply because these are only a temporary, and not long-term, solution for the investment they plan to make in their kids. So, Kingrant, you're absolutely right to say that having cheaper maids and/or childcare services or longer paternity leave doesn't get to the root of the problem. Better to have less children to avoid spreading their time, money and effort too thin.

Of course, I can only cite my personal observations, and I'm not suggesting that every couple who intends to stop at two, if not one, or to remain childless thinks this way. Anyone who can throw up other suggestions, please do so. I really want to know your views on this.

Cheers!

Your suggestion will definitely provide parents with more free time. However,this may not lead to better care and upbringing of their children. How many parents really practise their preaching that raising children should be dual responsibility? In most instances, parents have sub-contracted raising children to maids, child-care centres, schools.... When things go wrong with their kids, it is the fault of all these agents. Maybe their definition of "responsibility" is different from mine.

I dont think forummers here have really addressed the root of the problem, which is Why couples don't want to more than 2?All the suggestions are fine - lomger paternity leave, more and lower cost childcare services, even cheaper maids etc. If implemented, these will encourage some to begin to have one child or two. But they would stop at two. Why? Why do the Malays have more than 2?

 

[scroobal]

Great Write-up Bro.

Many years ago, people began to realise that the environment was changing and wondered what to do. Thus some began to migrate. I know of a case where the working mum came home to find that the youngest kid was talking with a tagalog accent. The penny dropped. 6 months later the whole family migrated. The wife became a full time mum. They live in a wonderful home, the husband's take home pay after OZ tax is below many Singaporeans paycheck with a similar qualification.

They have 3 children. So how did the kids do?

All three kids chose IB rather than A Levels. The eldest boy sat in the same year as the PM's second son who was first in the Lee clan to do IB. This boy had a perfect score while the Lee boy missed it by 2 points. The 2 eldest are now doing Medicine and the last kid will do his IB final next year.

If the Mountain cannot come to Mohammed, then Mohammed must go to the Mountain. Don't wait for the PAP to tell you what to do. Don't find excuses. Get your butt moving. They are not the only family. There has been major outflow of educated Singaporeans since 1985. WHy you think the PAP is so dependent on FTs.

Hi,


Of course, I can only cite my personal observations, and I'm not suggesting that every couple who intends to stop at two, if not one, or to remain childless thinks this way. Anyone who can throw up other suggestions, please do so. I really want to know your views on this.

Cheers!

 

[Ramseth]

And others who start sending their children for French - albeit kiddy - lessons when they're only two, in the hope that they'll grow up to be trilingual, instead of just bilingual (never mind that our system of bilingual education has flunked completely; that's another topic for another time).

I don't understand why you say the bilingual education has "flunked completely." Bilingual education as foundation has enabled me (and many others I'm sure) to become multilingual. Even for those not so linguistically inclined, everyone P65 can read and write at least two languages. So, what failure is there? I'd say it's the greatest PAP policy of all time. Well of course I'd say that, since I consider myself a beneficiary thereof.

 

[scroobal]

Bro, unlike you, many suffered. Language does not come easy for these people. They paid inordinate amount of time on a subject at the expense of other subjects. There were years in the 80s, you could not enter Uni unless you had a pass in the 2nd language.

Kwa Soon Bee who is old man's brother in law and a Baba had his first son suffering doing the 2nd language. He approached his sister and said that he wanted to send his son overseas. The sister pleaded with him to avoid embarrassing the PM. He relented. When his second son began struggling with Mandarin, he told his sister FO and sent his boy overseas. The son now works in SIA. Not many people can send their kids overseas. Finally Ho Ching told the old man off and got the eldest grandson registered in American School - Breaking MOE regulation.

I don't understand why you say the bilingual education has "flunked completely." Bilingual education as foundation has enabled me (and many others I'm sure) to become multilingual. Even for those not so linguistically inclined, everyone P65 can read and write at least two languages. So, what failure is there? I'd say it's the greatest PAP policy of all time. Well of course I'd say that, since I consider myself a beneficiary thereof.

 

[Annoyed]

Thanks mate. Actually, I wasn't asking for suggestions on how to get out of the vicious cycle of the ratrace to the bottom, but for alternative theories (if any) as to why couples aren't spawning at more desirable levels.

You certainly hit the nail on the head though. This is hardly a conducive environment for raising families - unless you happen to have average (and below) demands, or are prepared to suck it up and continue running with the pack. I, too, have family and friends who migrated to Australia - they never looked back and have never been happier. But, I must add that pluck me downunder or in the US, and I wouldn't be contributing to birthrates there either. :p Sometimes, it's as much a lifestyle choice as anything else. Higher levels of education also lead to a higher rate of occurrence in bohemian types.

Great Write-up Bro.

Many years ago, people began to realise that the environment was changing and wondered what to do. Thus some began to migrate. I know of a case where the working mum came home to find that the youngest kid was talking with a tagalog accent. The penny dropped. 6 months later the whole family migrated. The wife became a full time mum. They live in a wonderful home, the husband's take home pay after OZ tax is below many Singaporeans paycheck with a similar qualification.

They have 3 children. So how did the kids do?

All three kids chose IB rather than A Levels. The eldest boy sat in the same year as the PM's second son who was first in the Lee clan to do IB. This boy had a perfect score while the Lee boy missed it by 2 points. The 2 eldest are now doing Medicine and the last kid will do his IB final next year.

If the Mountain cannot come to Mohammed, then Mohammed must go to the Mountain. Don't wait for the PAP to tell you what to do. Don't find excuses. Get your butt moving. They are not the only family. There has been major outflow of educated Singaporeans since 1985. WHy you think the PAP is so dependent on FTs.

 

[scroobal]

Knew where you were going. Agree on the Bohemian types.

I can tell you that this govt has tried everything in terms of tax relief, concessions, unpaid long leave for mums etc and nothing has worked. A whole string of cabinet ministers have also tried. They even have a Dept in PMO and no change in trend. Its obvious that we are facing a double whammy - move towards trends found in developed countries coupled with our own less than encouraging environment.

Thanks mate. Actually, I wasn't asking for suggestions on how to get out of the vicious cycle of the ratrace to the bottom, but for alternative theories (if any) as to why couples aren't spawning at more desirable levels.

You certainly hit the nail on the head though. This is hardly a conducive environment for raising families - unless you happen to have average (and below) demands, or are prepared to suck it up and continue running with the pack. I, too, have family and friends who migrated to Australia - they never looked back and have never been happier. But, I must add that pluck me downunder or in the US, and I wouldn't be contributing to birthrates there either. :p Sometimes, it's as much a lifestyle choice as anything else. Higher levels of education also lead to a higher rate of occurrence in bohemian types.