Serious Lawrence Wong: Leasehold HDB Good Store of Asset Value! Easy To Monetize When Old!

[JohnTan]

Re: Lawrence Wong: Leasehold HDB Good Store of Asset Value! Easy To Monetize When Old

For most people, the best way to monetize your HDB flat is to get a BTO in a central location, sell off in the 5th-10th year, and move to the outlying areas. You would probably be able to pocket about $350k or so at least.

 

[nayr69sg]

Re: Lawrence Wong: Leasehold HDB Good Store of Asset Value! Easy To Monetize When Old

Truly, you are a fucking idiot. "Your logic is like 2 grains of wheat hid in 2 bushels of chaff, you shall seek all day and 'ere you find them, and when you found them, they are not worth the search". U have no understanding of it, but act like you know. So, you post this kind of shit and confuse and muddy the water further. Really moronic.

You only know how to use vulgar language curse and swear insult others and belittle other people.

There is no need to resort to that lah. I am a medical doctor mah. I am not some financial adviser or financial guru or banker or real estate expert. Of course I don't know the nitty gritty details.

So thank you for sharing about the residents owning the physician structure of the building on a 99 year leasehold land.

But my argument still stands that what happens in the even there are no takers for an en block of a 99 year old leasehold condo? No private developers coming in for an offer simply cos SLA will not approve a higher plot ratio? What happens?

There may not be a legal precedence yet in Singapore but what happens in the even the residents own the building sitting on a land that runs out its 99 year leasehold? Again I am no lawyer. And I acknowledge that.

This is a forum for discussion right?

Papsmearer you are too full of yourself. Every discussion and disagreement you take it so personally and curse and swear vulgarities at people shows your character.

 

[zhihau]

Re: Lawrence Wong: Leasehold HDB Good Store of Asset Value! Easy To Monetize When Old

You would probably be able to pocket about $350k or so at least.

Nice logic there... then let our offspring pick the tab 30-40 years down the road

 

[HTOLAS]

Re: Lawrence Wong: Leasehold HDB Good Store of Asset Value! Easy To Monetize When Old

Hark! You make the HDB look like a pyramid scheme!

For most people, the best way to monetize your HDB flat is to get a BTO in a central location, sell off in the 5th-10th year, and move to the outlying areas. You would probably be able to pocket about $350k or so at least.

 

[frenchbriefs]

Re: Lawrence Wong: Leasehold HDB Good Store of Asset Value! Easy To Monetize When Old

singapore has gone too far down the rabbit hole.....PAP for whom i do not apologize is the government and the government is PAP has no choice but to continue letting HDB appreciate otherwise those who paid 999k for their pigeon holes will scream bloody murder why their pigeon holes are not appreciating as fast as they like to,as once the secret is out that hdbs are no longer the magic silver bullet investment that all daft sinkies expect and its merely a ponzi bubble fueled by sinkies stupidity and greed which is unsustainable.....it will have a permanent lasting impact on the future rate of return.

 

[Seee3]

Re: Lawrence Wong: Leasehold HDB Good Store of Asset Value! Easy To Monetize When Old

In a private condo case, a 99 year lease is actually a leasehold. What they are leasing is the land for 99 years, but they hold (own) the building that sits on this land. So, all the owners that live in the building actually own their own units and a share in the common areas etc. because they own the building, they can do what they want with it. If all the owners decide to tear the building down after 50 years and build a new one, they can do so, and maybe without even any need to inform the landlord dependent on the terms of their lease. This is not possible at all with the HDB 99 year lease, as they are not the owners of the building.

Just curious, if a private 99 yr leasehold runs out and govt refuse to extend lease, can the govt requires the owners to tear down the structure and return the land without any structure? If yes then owner not only has no house but also need to pay to demolish the buildings and structures.

 

[AhNehs]

Re: Lawrence Wong: Leasehold HDB Good Store of Asset Value! Easy To Monetize When Old

Just curious, if a private 99 yr leasehold runs out and govt refuse to extend lease, can the govt requires the owners to tear down the structure and return the land without any structure? If yes then owner not only has no house but also need to pay to demolish the buildings and structures.

It's simple. No need to tear down. Land will be up for tender "as is". The new bidder take the cost of demolition and build into price.

 

[nayr69sg]

Re: Lawrence Wong: Leasehold HDB Good Store of Asset Value! Easy To Monetize When Old

It's simple. No need to tear down. Land will be up for tender "as is". The new bidder take the cost of demolition and build into price.

Will the owners of the units get anything back in that situation?

 

[frenchbriefs]

Re: Lawrence Wong: Leasehold HDB Good Store of Asset Value! Easy To Monetize When Old

Nice logic there... then let our offspring pick the tab 30-40 years down the road

they can simply boycott hdb and sleep at east coast park,but knowing sinkie chinks kiasu kiasee kiaboh mentality,they will probably participate in the ponzi rat race instead.

my offspring will thank me instead when im a multi millionaire.

 

[Seee3]

Re: Lawrence Wong: Leasehold HDB Good Store of Asset Value! Easy To Monetize When Old

It's simple. No need to tear down. Land will be up for tender "as is". The new bidder take the cost of demolition and build into price.

Yes I think that is usually the practice. However, if it is a legal requirement to return the land without structures, that means the govt is doing it out of goodwill. (When lessee return hdb shop spaces it is a must to demolish and remove everything and build back original partition walls that had been removed and return the shop in its original condition. )

 

[nayr69sg]

Re: Lawrence Wong: Leasehold HDB Good Store of Asset Value! Easy To Monetize When Old

Yes I think that is usually the practice. However, if it is a legal requirement to return the land without structures, that means the govt is doing it out of goodwill. (When lessee return hdb shop spaces it is a must to demolish and remove everything and build back original partition walls that had been removed and return the shop in its original condition. )

So far there has been no precedent case? All have gone en bloc private developer took over and extended lease?

I think this is the assumption private 99 year leasehold condo owners have. That there will always be a en bloc sale to the private developer and a profitable sale to boot when it nears the end of the 99 year leasehold.

Do other forumera agree?

 

[AhNehs]

Re: Lawrence Wong: Leasehold HDB Good Store of Asset Value! Easy To Monetize When Old

Yes I think that is usually the practice. However, if it is a legal requirement to return the land without structures, that means the govt is doing it out of goodwill. (When lessee return hdb shop spaces it is a must to demolish and remove everything and build back original partition walls that had been removed and return the shop in its original condition. )

The details are probably in the lease agreement.

 

[halsey02]

Re: Lawrence Wong: Leasehold HDB Good Store of Asset Value! Easy To Monetize When Old

I believe that many Generation Y folks do not have a $20,000 cash saving in hand now.

Middle class Baby Boomers retired with about $100,000 while low income Boomers retired with $50,000 cash saving.

Yes most sinkies are really poor :(

Yes, every year, at the beginning, you get a statement with the colourful pie graph & a HUGE LETTERING reminding you, how "rich" you are in your CPF ACCOUNT. Try to remember, those are ONCE YOUR MONEY, now it is yOUR MONEY. Even when you retire, 65, 67, 69 or 99...it is no longer yours but yOUR CPF...

On paper, you are RICH...you bank account?.. - $23 bank deduct fees for that PLUS! card, they lovingly give you...ha ha ha...

 

[eatshitndie]

Re: Lawrence Wong: Leasehold HDB Good Store of Asset Value! Easy To Monetize When Old

Basically the difference is private 99 year lease got chance to sell enbloc to private developer. Also got chance to extend lease. But all must meet SLA approval anyway which is the govt.

Private 99 year lease properties not yet hit this 55 year left on leasehold yet.

For those already en bloc once 99 year leasehold the chance of going en bloc again and make money is low. How high can SLA approve to build again?

End of the day it is called a leasehold for a reason. Only fools think they actually own the property when they are granted a 99 year lease.

for hdb flat, it's a 99-year prepaid tenancy. the hdb (also gov linked) leases the land from gov. the hdb "owner" does not sign a leasehold agreement directly with gov entity which acquires the land. this is unique to sg. only sinkies can believe in and commit to this surreal sense of "ownership" with their money. the rest of the world except nk will find it quite impossible to sell tenancy as ownership. most important is sinkies' acceptance and gullibility. if sinkies accept and believe, mountains can be moved and seas reclaimed.

 

[frenchbriefs]

Re: Lawrence Wong: Leasehold HDB Good Store of Asset Value! Easy To Monetize When Old

for hdb flat, it's a 99-year prepaid tenancy. the hdb (also gov linked) leases the land from gov. the hdb "owner" does not sign a leasehold agreement directly with gov entity which acquires the land. this is unique to sg. only sinkies can believe in and commit to this surreal sense of "ownership" with their money. the rest of the world except nk will find it quite impossible to sell tenancy as ownership. most important is sinkies' acceptance and gullibility. if sinkies accept and believe, mountains can be moved and seas reclaimed.

people think theres "value" in these hdb when in truth its all driven by market forces and inflationary forces,they assume its a investment that will continue bearing fruit in the decades to come like a business that generates profits(from labour and inputs to create value and profit) but what does a hdb flat do?nothing....,when in truth the value of a hdb is a bubble,driven only by the amount of capital there is to sustain it.a economic crisis or recession could easily end the speculatory madness and burst the bubble sending prices crashing.

 

[Papsmearer]

Re: Lawrence Wong: Leasehold HDB Good Store of Asset Value! Easy To Monetize When Old

For most people, the best way to monetize your HDB flat is to get a BTO in a central location, sell off in the 5th-10th year, and move to the outlying areas. You would probably be able to pocket about $350k or so at least.

Yes, absolutely right. And this is what I have said for many years. The time window to make money on your HDB flat is very short and the 5th -10th year rule is really dependent on the neighbourhood and what you paid for it. For example in some mature estates, people have made $300K in 3 years because of demand on the resale flat they "bought". SO, it does not have to be a BTO per se.

What the clueless and Lawless Wrong has said is wrong. if you wait until you are 65 years old to monetize your flat, you have already missed the peaked appreciation in your flat. Your flat is worth less because no bank is allowed to finance any flats with less then 65 years left on the lease and even many will not do so after the flat is 25 years of age. For example, if you "bought" your flat for $300K, it might be worth $600K in 10 years time. If you cash out (monetize according to PAP jargon), you pocket the $300K. But if you stay there for 40 years or more until you are 65 years or older, no one will pay you $600K for you flat. That is because they have to pay cash for it as no bank will give you a loan. hence, at the time when you need the money from the flat the most, i.e. to fund your retirement, you find that you will be lucky to get $150K for it. Stupid sinkies better wake up to this idea.

 

[frenchbriefs]

Re: Lawrence Wong: Leasehold HDB Good Store of Asset Value! Easy To Monetize When Old

Yes, absolutely right. And this is what I have said for many years. The time window to make money on your HDB flat is very short and the 5th -10th year rule is really dependent on the neighbourhood and what you paid for it. For example in some mature estates, people have made $300K in 3 years because of demand on the resale flat they "bought". SO, it does not have to be a BTO per se.

What the clueless and Lawless Wrong has said is wrong. if you wait until you are 65 years old to monetize your flat, you have already missed the peaked appreciation in your flat. Your flat is worth less because no bank is allowed to finance any flats with less then 65 years left on the lease and even many will not do so after the flat is 25 years of age. For example, if you "bought" your flat for $300K, it might be worth $600K in 10 years time. If you cash out (monetize according to PAP jargon), you pocket the $300K. But if you stay there for 40 years or more until you are 65 years or older, no one will pay you $600K for you flat. That is because they have to pay cash for it as no bank will give you a loan. hence, at the time when you need the money from the flat the most, i.e. to fund your retirement, you find that you will be lucky to get $150K for it. Stupid sinkies better wake up to this idea.

thats what u call a bubble,fools buying from fools because the price of a commodity is going up rapidly without any support or justification for it,they are hoping for a bigger fool to take it off their hands and profit before the music stops and last one's holding a big pile of odourous excrement shit otherwise known as hdb.bubbles like these are so common around asia,the funny thing is they are still thriving and have yet to pop.

just wait one day when singapore real estate rise to ever great heights like Japan real estate bubble before it burst and resulted in the lost decade for Japan's economy.

 

[Papsmearer]

Re: Lawrence Wong: Leasehold HDB Good Store of Asset Value! Easy To Monetize When Old

Just curious, if a private 99 yr leasehold runs out and govt refuse to extend lease, can the govt requires the owners to tear down the structure and return the land without any structure? If yes then owner not only has no house but also need to pay to demolish the buildings and structures.

Ok, lets get one thing straight. Not all leasehold land is owned by the govt. In the past, some developers would buy freehold land and then build a high rise on it. But instead of selling freehold condos, they create a 999 or 99 year lease with themselves as the landlord, and sell it as leasehold. So, they always hold on to the land. What happens when the lease runs out is entirely dependent on what is written into the lease. Some leases require the that the land be returned to the owner in its original shape. So, if it was vacant land before, then the building must be torn town and the land returned as vacant. Some leases allow an extension of the lease for a set amount of compensation to the landowner. Other leases require the leaseholders to walk away from the building and revert it to the landlord. i.e. the land owners owns the improvements after the lease is over.

 

[ginfreely]

Re: Lawrence Wong: Leasehold HDB Good Store of Asset Value! Easy To Monetize When Old

u are absolutely 100% right. And so far from what i can see, you are one of the few here who understands the concept. Versus the moron Nayr69sg who claims to be a medical doctor, but can't understand this concept.

In the HDB 99 year lease, its just a straight rental. You have prepaid 99 years worth of rent up front to the landlord (HDB). You own nothing and you get nothing when the lease expires. That is why its called a lease.

In a private condo case, a 99 year lease is actually a leasehold. What they are leasing is the land for 99 years, but they hold (own) the building that sits on this land. So, all the owners that live in the building actually own their own units and a share in the common areas etc. because they own the building, they can do what they want with it. If all the owners decide to tear the building down after 50 years and build a new one, they can do so, and maybe without even any need to inform the landlord dependent on the terms of their lease. This is not possible at all with the HDB 99 year lease, as they are not the owners of the building.

Yeah and the way i see how tall and dense HK apartments are, i don't see why any of the old 99 year old Spore condo cannot qualify for "urban renewal" to make it more dense. As it is now, the same size land in the past can already yield like 1.5 times the number of units in the same area. So give another two decades, surely can become 2 or more times and can enbloc for sure. Huat ah!

 

[Papsmearer]

Re: Lawrence Wong: Leasehold HDB Good Store of Asset Value! Easy To Monetize When Old

people think theres "value" in these hdb when in truth its all driven by market forces and inflationary forces,they assume its a investment that will continue bearing fruit in the decades to come like a business that generates profits(from labour and inputs to create value and profit) but what does a hdb flat do?nothing....,when in truth the value of a hdb is a bubble,driven only by the amount of capital there is to sustain it.a economic crisis or recession could easily end the speculatory madness and burst the bubble sending prices crashing.

If you think there is market forces in singapore, then I have some land in Tekong I want to sell you. There is zero, nada, zilch market forces in singapore. Think about it. If one entity owns 80% of the housing in singapore and 90% of the land, how can there be a market?. There is a monopoly, but no market. The entity sets and manipulates the price of the land, and as a monopoly, we have no choice but to pay for it. So far, the entity has decided that they want to pocket lots of money from property manipulation. The only way they can do that is to manipulate the price constantly upwards. The side benefit is that some existing flat owners will also make some money. A rising tide floats all boats as they say. Other shitizens will be priced out of the market or end up heavily in debt. This is also happening now.