If LKY had retired earlier, will he be much revered?

[ah_phah]

to come up with the internal security act, to imprison ppl he didnt like without a trial..... speaks a lot about how much respect he deserves. step down early or not, i can't imagine wat his grave would look like after he's gone.

 

[ah_phah]

I respect LKY for being part of the team who make Singapore so steady. But now, I worry that he is mortal and can die. Because I have little faith in his junior.

y worry? the end of the famiLee & their Leegime, is not the end of the world. in history, we read of many changes of dynasty, and each time the dynasties changed hands, the peasants had more reason to rejoice from the reforms that take place.

we frown upon communism today, but somehow the ppl back in those times embraced it with open arms, to remove the monarchy.

 

[SIFU]

at the very least he wouldn't be so much hated.

 

[po2wq]

If Old Fart had left the political scene in 1990 (when he handed power to Goh) or 2004 (when Goh handed power to his son), will he have the same hero worship as Che Guevara or Mao? Even better, hero-worshiped like Sun Yat Sen?

he shud have ... but he can, meh? ... :o

 

[Watchman]

He will be served this soon enough

Tong Aik Wanton Noodle

Tong Aik Wanton Noodle
Bedok North Street 3
Block 511 Market 01-09
Tel: 90694141

 

[Wang Ye]

Che Guevara dying fighting for his ideals and is thus revered. Sun Yat Sen is revered because he is credited with toppling the Qing dynasty and transforming China into a republic. Mao is revered because he liberated China (remembered more for his early years than his later ones when he was acting nuts) and the massive propaganda on Mao worship (please stand do do the Mao loyalty dance and sing the Loyalty to Chairman Mao Song).

Chances the answer to your question would be yes. However, it also strongly depends on how he behaves.

 

[halsey02]

I would still revere LKY...but liking him, that is another story.....we hate to love him, but we love to hate him...

He has many qualities that most of us doesn't have & many qualities most of us doesn't like either.

To revere him as a statemen, Yes!...but to like him, NO!

 

[halsey02]

He will be served this soon enough
Tong Aik

Naughty, naugthy...wouldn't ANG YEW SENG be better?

http://www.streetdirectory.com/businessfinder/company_profile/403/246087/

 

[ah_phah]

based on the oldman's recent speech about no retirement age.... its quite clear that retirement never cross his mind

 

[ChaoPappyPoodle]

I would still revere LKY...but liking him, that is another story.....we hate to love him, but we love to hate him...

He has many qualities that most of us doesn't have & many qualities most of us doesn't like either.

To revere him as a statemen, Yes!...but to like him, NO!

How can you revere someone who worked for the enemy? LKY worked for the kempetei. The kempetei were vile murderers how used local traitors to cull out brave or prominent Singaporeans. And look at prataman, he says he worked for the Japanese civil police and not the kempetei. What a piece of crap is that! The japanese never had a civil police force in lands that they conquered in WW2!

The police was the kempetei. :oIo:

LKY was and still is a despot, a dictator, a leader of a fascist political party, the PAP. They cannot leave their seat of power because it is not in their character. The longer they stay the more difficult it is to leave. This is history on a worldwide scale. No dictator leaves their power behind unless they are removed from power or die.

History will show the true worth of LKY. He was never a good man. He was an opportunist and a greedy man. As Britain's secret books of history are showing, LKY was a very vile man who would sleep with his enemies with the intention of killing them the next morning.

From our inception as a nation, he had started his way towards building a huge cache of cash for himself and his wife through the HDB's legal requirements. At that time, all HDB stamp duties had to be done only through his wife's legal company.

As time progressed, he would look at other ways to enrich himself and other members of his family.

Like Stalin and other dictators, LKY's 'statue' will fall. And LKY knows it as well. Does he care? All dictators are atheist. They do not care for the afterlife and that is why they are scums to other good human beings who may pose a threat to them.

 

[Sideswipe]

Che Guevara dying fighting for his ideals and is thus revered. Sun Yat Sen is revered because he is credited with toppling the Qing dynasty and transforming China into a republic. Mao is revered because he liberated China (remembered more for his early years than his later ones when he was acting nuts) and the massive propaganda on Mao worship (please stand do do the Mao loyalty dance and sing the Loyalty to Chairman Mao Song).

Mao liberate China from who? Japan, KMT or western imperialists.
CCP did little fighting in ww2. CKS ended all China unequal treaties expect hong kong and macau during ww2. KMT efficiently control whole of china proper so Mao didn't unified country as claimed. Did Mao liberate China from KMT. China was facing post war problems like all countries. Mao exaggerated the situation, portrayed KMT as useless and corrupt and resumed the civil war.

LKY still did some good for Singapore but Mao success were all fabricated lies to justify his and CCP mandate to rule China.

 

[Ramseth]

Mao liberate China from who? Japan, KMT or western imperialists.
CCP did little fighting in ww2. CKS ended all China unequal treaties expect hong kong and macau during ww2. KMT efficiently control whole of china proper so Mao didn't unified country as claimed. Did Mao liberate China from KMT. China was facing post war problems like all countries. Mao exaggerated the situation, portrayed KMT as useless and corrupt and resumed the civil war.

LKY still did some good for Singapore but Mao success were all fabricated lies to justify his and CCP mandate to rule China.

It might be propaganda but auto-fulfilling and self-proving propaganda.

If KMT wasn't that useless and corrupt, how could they lose to CCP?

 

[kingrant]

Acc to the book "Lee Kuan Yew's Singapore" by TJS George, there are some very telling characteristics of the man. I quote passages:

"The idea of rumbling down the tube from Swiss Cottage to Holborn, and dashing around from Holborn to Aldwych, and popping up at Aldwych and running across to go down to the London school of Economics and getting out to catch I don't know what number of bus to University Colllege up King St and then back again to King's College frightened me. This wasnt my idea of University life"

That from a man who now tells us there weren't enough spurs stuck into our hides to compete with FTs! And he was only barely 25!

From another account, after getting a place onboard the troopship Britannia on way to England for his studies, this time from one of his shipmates, a Chinese from HK, who remembered the voyage well and recalled how LKY made a distinct impression on others as a brash young man who knew exactly what he wanted and cared less what others thought:

"Fresh water was strictly rationed. We were six to a cabin and the steward would bring in three buckets of water early every morning, half a bucket for each person. But Harry would rise as early as five or six o'clock and use up all three buckets in his cabin for himself and then go over to the other cabins for more. This of course made him quite unpopular, but he didnt seem to care. We all thought he was a spoiled boy and quite selfish".

Elsewhere, the author also cited sources that Harry was even born in Indonesia, a place called "Kudus" in Java. His mother had malay blood and his father Indonesian, which made the young Lee somewhat of a misfit, which probably made him want to acquire Chinese characteristics in a hurry. He was like a bat - belonging to and receiving recognition from neither the 2 legged or the 4 legged family.

It was also mentioned that despite the shortage of space onboard the troopership, he managed to wrangle his way on to it. So there was speculation that he must have had British special help from high up due to what he did as an interpreter for the kempetai and that he was also working for the British at the same time.

A very cheem man indeed!

 

[Sideswipe]

It might be propaganda but auto-fulfilling and self-proving propaganda.

If KMT wasn't that useless and corrupt, how could they lose to CCP?

three major factors that resulted in communists victory
1)ww2 destroyed KMT militarily, financially and spiritually.
2)George Marshall, "soviet number 1 wu jian dao" plotted against KMT?
Marshall military demilitarization of China - Mao didn't, Chiang did. the ceasefire gave CCP time to move into Manchuria and regroup
he cut off all US financial aids and arms embargo to KMT after ww2 to 1948. that destroyed KMT morale.
3)Soviet aid to CCP
700K soviet guns and heavy tanks compared to no US weaponry for KMT at all.
250K North Korean soldiers and unknown number of Mongolian soldiers that fought for CCP in "winner take all" Huaihai Campaign. Mao use foreign trash to fight civil war.

I admit KMT was also useless and corrupt, CKS made fatal military decisions but they lost due to a combination of many factors - internal rivals and foreign powers wanting China to turn communist.

 

[Sideswipe]

It was also mentioned that despite the shortage of space onboard the troopership, he managed to wrangle his way on to it. So there was speculation that he must have had British special help from high up due to what he did as an interpreter for the kempetai and that he was also working for the British at the same time.

A very cheem man indeed!

I read one of LKY books. He wrote a page about Japanese occupation, regarding the translator job, he said it was the best option at that time and end.

 

[kingrant]

The book I read also said that while working for the Kempetai, he was able to tune in to reports that the Allies were winning the war but the Japs of cos were hiding this from the Singaporeans. When the game was almost up for the Japs, our fren managed to slip off from the agency and fled to Cameron Highlands where he hid under the bed until the Occupation was over. talk about Singapore heros and icons of founding fathers while people like Lim Bo seng died under torture.

I read one of LKY books. He wrote a page about Japanese occupation, regarding the translator job, he said it was the best option at that time and end.

 

[Ramseth]

three major factors that resulted in communists victory
1)ww2 destroyed KMT militarily, financially and spiritually.
2)George Marshall, "soviet number 1 wu jian dao" plotted against KMT?
Marshall military demilitarization of China - Mao didn't, Chiang did. the ceasefire gave CCP time to move into Manchuria and regroup
he cut off all US financial aids and arms embargo to KMT after ww2 to 1948. that destroyed KMT morale.
3)Soviet aid to CCP
700K soviet guns and heavy tanks compared to no US weaponry for KMT at all.
250K North Korean soldiers and unknown number of Mongolian soldiers that fought for CCP in "winner take all" Huaihai Campaign. Mao use foreign trash to fight civil war.

I admit KMT was also useless and corrupt, CKS made fatal military decisions but they lost due to a combination of many factors - internal rivals and foreign powers wanting China to turn communist.

Marshall's priority was to rebuild European economies. That's the first front of the post WW2 cold war face-off. Anyway, I think US miscalculated and didn't expect such a swift recovery of USSR and capitatulation of KMT.

CCP returned the NK favor with more than 1 m. troops in the Korean War. They were allies, not foreign trash. Just like Britain, Holland, Belgium etc. were allies in both the Dunkirk retreat and the Normandy landing.

The Mongolian troops fighting on the CCP side were not only allies, they were secessionists who believed Mongolia should be part of China under CCP. That's their belief, what to say? That's Inner Mongolia today.

 

[sherrry]

if harry stepped down earlier, he will not be revered, nor will the ppl loath him as much.
if harry stepped down earlier, they may not be the ruling party today.
if harry stepped down earlier, their salary (our burden) may not even exist today.

i still don't understand what is the purpose of having 2 SM & 1 MM to oversee matters? i also don't understand why should they even be on the nation's payroll?

 

[halsey02]

How can you revere someone who worked for the enemy? LKY worked for the kempetei. The kempetei were vile murderers how used local traitors to cull out brave or prominent Singaporeans. And look at prataman, he says he worked for the Japanese civil police and not the kempetei. What a piece of crap is that! The japanese never had a civil police force in lands that they conquered in WW2!

The police was the kempetei. :oIo:

Just give the man, a place in HIS STORY...and we can go kick, spit or leer at his statue if there is ever one...definitely he has his place in History...:p

 

[kingrant]

It's not a question of early or not. It's whether he has done enough damage to Singapore.

Clearly there is no such thing as too early for him. Only he himself thinks so. For if he steps down, we'll fix him.

If Old Fart had left the political scene in 1990 (when he handed power to Goh) or 2004 (when Goh handed power to his son), will he have the same hero worship as Che Guevara or Mao? Even better, hero-worshiped like Sun Yat Sen?