Hiroshima after the Atomic Bomb

[Sideswipe]

Fair view. Pearl Harbor was a naval base and US should know better to be on guard since they blockaded Japanese shipping lines. As for Hiroshima and Nagasaki, I think that US should be accorded some credit for humane benevolence and strategic prudence. It could easily have been Tokyo and Osaka. US objective wasn't to destroy or conquer Japan, just to subdue it completely. At war, calculated sacrifices have to be made. Enough to make Japan surrender unconditionally, but not too much as to create another mass of chaos that couldn't be cleaned up.

Pearl Harbor was the mother of all conspiracies. I wouldn't disagree with that viewpoint. George Marshall role in it was just unfathomable as claimed by Joseph McCarthy.

It was US diplomatic failure to successfully negotiate with Japan a conditional or unconditional surrender. Japan knew the war was lost, they were going to surrender as shown by the appointment of pro US Kantaro Suzuki as Japan Premier in April 1945. What US needed back then were more skilled diplomats and negotiators to solve the surrender deadlock instead of using the A Bombs. as to why US diplomacy efforts failed, that's another story involving the Russians, Chinese and the big prize Manchuria.

 

[Ramseth]

anglo saxons are the most power hungry land grabbing and war mongering people on earth. it has to do with aryan genes. too bad sam the admin and aryan descendant worships them.

The British relatively easy conquest of India was also because North Indian Aryans opened the gates. Much like Wu Sangui opened the Great Wall gate of China to the Manchurian hoardes. The Ghandhi family themselves were also Aryans. But due to acquired color through the generations, become considered as colored. Fedup with the color distinction of Aryans, they revolted taking advantage of the circumstances of the times and succeeded. Sacrifice of other people's lives was nothing to them, including Mohandas Ghandi himself. He was just another political conman as far as I'm concerned.

 

[da dick]

the yanks themselves helped to gave birth to People Republic of China, all thanks to George Marshall. without Red China, there will be no Communists movement throughout South East Asia.

errr. also wrong. no matter how much political backstabbing happened, it's still a fact that the jap imperial army destroyed all the of the chinese republicans' weapons, so they couldn't hold back the reds when WWII finally ended. according to some historians, the cowardly commies mostly went into hiding instead of helping to fight off the japs. bastards rather spend more time fighting their own countrymen than foreigners.

and you must remember the soviets gave the commies a lot more support than the americans did.

 

[Sideswipe]

errr. also wrong. no matter how much political backstabbing happened, it's still a fact that the jap imperial army destroyed all the of the chinese republicans' weapons, so they couldn't hold back the reds when WWII finally ended. according to some historians, the cowardly commies mostly went into hiding instead of helping to fight off the japs. bastards rather spend more time fighting their own countrymen than foreigners.
and you must remember the soviets gave the commies a lot more support than the americans did.

yes, the soviets gave the communists massive aids. the americans by dropping aids to the nationalists also helped the communists.

 

[Forvendet]

It was US diplomatic failure to successfully negotiate with Japan a conditional or unconditional surrender. Japan knew the war was lost, they were going to surrender as shown by the appointment of pro US Kantaro Suzuki as Japan Premier in April 1945. What US needed back then were more skilled diplomats and negotiators to solve the surrender deadlock instead of using the A Bombs. as to why US diplomacy efforts failed, that's another story involving the Russians, Chinese and the big prize Manchuria.

I don't share that view. It was Japan whom attacked others first, then when the tides turned and they were on the losing side, blaming their victims turned victors for failure in diplomacy? US owed Japan no duty of diplomacy whatsoever. It was Japanese stubborness in holding back the inadvertable surrender that cost more Japanese lives. Why should more US lives be sacrificed to satisfy the misplaced pride of the Japanese? Why didn't the Japanese be more diplomatic and realistic then? That, they owed it to themselves.

 

[Sideswipe]

I don't share that view. It was Japan whom attacked others first, then when the tides turned and they were on the losing side, blaming their victims turned victors for failure in diplomacy? US owed Japan no duty of diplomacy whatsoever. It was Japanese stubborness in holding back the inadvertable surrender that cost more Japanese lives. Why should more US lives be sacrificed to satisfy the misplaced pride of the Japanese? Why didn't the Japanese be more diplomatic and realistic then? That, they owed it to themselves.

The A bombs were wrong on strategic grounds for US. it gave the go-ahead to Soviet Russia to swarm over East Asia, the seizure of Manchuria which sealed the doom of Nationalist China and sow the seeds for the later Chinese and Korean war.
a negotiated peace might have changed everything and relieved the American troops from facing Communist troops later in Manchuria and Korea.

US diplomacy failure resulted in the strategic mistake of the A bombs that changed the order of East Asia which we are still paying the price today.

 

[halsey02]

You should thank the yanks for saving your ass from the commies up North.

This I got to agree with you, what if the 'dominoes' had fallen, will there be a Sout East Asia?:p

 

[Leongsam]

This I got to agree with you, what if the 'dominoes' had fallen, will there be a Sout East Asia?:p

I'm often puzzled why there are so many Anti Americans in Singapore.

The US has saved Singapore's skin three times over in recent times.

1) Had Japan not been defeated by the USA in WW2, Singaporeans might all be speaking Japanese and LKY would have lost his "interpreter" role.

2) In the 60s, only the USA stood in the way of the communist takeover of South East Asia. It put its money where its mouth was. No other country stepped forward.

3) Singapore moved from 3rd world to 1st thanks to the yanks. Had it not been for TI, Fairchild, National Semiconductor, Seagate, Maxtor, Conner, Western Digital, Apple, Motorola etc pouring billions into the country and being very, very generous and selfless when it came to the transfer of skills and technology, Singapore would not be where it is today. The multiplier effect was tremendous. Many Singaporeans grew very wealthy via the support industries that flourished. Multinationals from other countries set up shop during that period too but none of them were as generous as the yanks when it came to sharing the pie. The US multinationals had no problems placing Singaporeans in the the top management echelons. The same cannot be said of the Europeans, the Japs and the Koreans where management roles were the preserve of their own kind.

While we may cringe at the personalities of some of their presidents, the fact remains that many Americans actually embrace to concept of democracy and freedom and honestly believe that they are doing good, often rather naively, by spreading the principle throughout the world.

 

[Windsor]

I'm often puzzled why there are so many Anti Americans in Singapore.

In this I agree with you, but the US of yesteryears have changed to one that is more self-serving.

 

[Leongsam]

In this I agree with you, but the US of yesteryears have changed to one that is more self-serving.

Not more self serving... simply less confident.

 

[Agoraphobic]

I'm often puzzled why there are so many Anti Americans in Singapore.

The US has saved Singapore's skin three times over in recent times.

1) Had Japan not been defeated by the USA in WW2, Singaporeans might all be speaking Japanese and LKY would have lost his "interpreter" role.

2) In the 60s, only the USA stood in the way of the communist takeover of South East Asia. It put its money where its mouth was. No other country stepped forward.
i during that period too but none of them were as generous as the yanks when it came to sharing the pie. The US multinationals had nor problems placing Singaporeans in the the top management echelons. The same cannot be said of the Europeans, the Japs liand the Koreans where management roles were the preserve of their own kindce
While we may cringe at the peronalities of some of their presidents, the fact remains that many Americans actually embrace to concept of democracy and freedaom and honestly believe that they are doing good, often rather naively, by spreading the principle throughout the world.

I don't think many Sgns (or citizens of other countries) are anti-American. Most ppl admire the US. If there is any resentment, it id s against some of the foreign policies and the way the biggest military power in the world handles lesser regimes.

1) Japan would not have been able to hold on to the nations she conquered. Them Nips would've to fight guerillas all over Asia.

2) The commies in the 60s were starving and till today, have unmentionable internal social problems.

3) This I agree. But they treat everyone, including homegrown CEOs the same - they axe ya on short notice.

And one more note - The Business of America is Business. Not democracy.

Cheers!

 

[Cestbon]

Not more self serving... simply less confident.

I always disgree for US to stay in IRAQ/Afgan for too long. In beginning mission is to bring down Saddam and Osama. Now both dead, they should retreat and go back.
For second time US attack Iraq is totally wrong. Iraq do nothing didn't attack Kuwait as in the 1st war. US is taking advantage of the situation.
As in the middle East>> Israel everyone agree but US keep on protecting Israel by using it VETO power. So many start losing faith about the US standing no neutral very bias.

 

[Zombie]

1) Had Japan not been defeated by the USA in WW2, Singaporeans might all be speaking Japanese ...

so what.... we are still speaking/writing another foreign language.. if you can read the words...


2) In the 60s, only the USA stood in the way of the communist ....

so what... the communist prcs are still coming in droves...


3) Singapore moved from 3rd world to 1st thanks to the yanks....

so what... our pays are going back to the 3rd world (due to 2 above) ...

 

[Cestbon]

1) Had Japan not been defeated by the USA in WW2, Singaporeans might all be speaking Japanese ...

so what.... we are still speaking/writing another foreign language.. if you can read the words...


2) In the 60s, only the USA stood in the way of the communist ....

so what... the communist prcs are still coming in droves...


3) Singapore moved from 3rd world to 1st thanks to the yanks....

so what... our pays are going back to the 3rd world (due to 2 above) ...

Ha ha...........

China now in control of US economy. If China dump US$ that will be history of US from now AA+ rating maybe par with Greece.

 

[Leongsam]

2) The commies in the 60s were starving and till today, have unmentionable internal social problems.

3) This I agree. But they treat everyone, including homegrown CEOs the same - they axe ya on short notice.

And one more note - The Business of America is Business. Not democracy.

Cheers!

"Axing at short notice" kept everyone on their toes. While life could be stressful, it honed a survival instinct in many who worked for the yanks myself included. We always kept our resumes up to date and always had a resignation letter standing by. We pretty much knew when it needed to be handed in. The rules were the same for everyone regardless of skin colour. If anything, they were harsher towards their own kind. It was what set the yanks apart from the rest.

In stark contrast, the Europeans and Japs operated like the PAP. One company... two systems. One for the locals and one for the expat management.

I like the yanks in general. They're a bit superficial but they tell it like it is and would seldom allow a work related dispute to spoil a friendship.

 

[Windsor]

"Axing at short notice" kept everyone on their toes. anything, they were harsher towards their own kind. It was what set the yanks apart from the rest.

In stark contrast, the Europeans and Japs operated like the PAP. One company... two systems. One for the locals and one for the expat management.

I like the yanks in general. They're a bit superficial but they tell it like it is and would seldom allow a work related dispute to spoil a friendship.

I have worked with different nationalities and I agree that the yanks believe in paying what you are worth. Once you fall short of expectations, out you go. They also do not minced their words and are very frank. If they see anything wrong they will approach the person and tell them off. I have witnessed this many times, like telling someone not to knock on the glass in the zoo where it says "Do Not Knocked On Glass." If they see someone smoking in areas they are not suppose to they will also tell the person.

In this forum there are also members who are afraid to say how they feel if they do not agree. We should learn from the yanks.

 

[Agoraphobic]

"Axing at short notice" kept everyone on their toes. While life could be stressful, it honed a survival instinct in many who worked for the yanks myself included. We always kept our resumes up to date and always had a resignation letter standing by. We pretty much knew when it needed to be handed in. The rules were the same for everyone regardless of skin colour. If anything, they were harsher towards their own kind. It was what set the yanks apart from the rest.

In stark contrast, the Europeans and Japs operated like the PAP. One company... two systems. One for the locals and one for the expat management.

I like the yanks in general. They're a bit superficial but they tell it like it is and would seldom allow a work related dispute to spoil a friendship.

Worked once for an American company in Sg that was headed by an Ozzie. Hardest working man I've come across, removed any notion I had that Aussies were lazy. He played hard too. Was so ambitious, he quit after the company was sold and started his own and we became competitors.

Worked a short while at a Jap company and have this to say - Can buy their products but don't work there.

Yeah, I like the Yanks too. They have a great sense of humour.

Cheers!

 

[Forvendet]

I agree with Leongsam and Windsor. I've studied and worked in US before. They're generally nice people, and generally much nicer, fairer and more considerate than those Sinkies under Tonychat's classification. Although US investments in Singapore is more out of self-interests than any love for Singapore, they did us quite some favors along the way. Except for the Muslims understandly, I see no reason why many Singaporeans are harboring political dissent and some even hatred against US.

 

[Cestbon]

I agree with Leongsam and Windsor. I've studied and worked in US before. They're generally nice people, and generally much nicer, fairer and more considerate than those Sinkies under Tonychat's classification. Although US investments in Singapore is more out of self-interests than any love for Singapore, they did us quite some favors along the way. Except for the Muslims understandly, I see no reason why many Singaporeans are harboring political dissent and some even hatred against US.

Not hate US citizen. Hate their Politic and policy maker like to be busy body declare war against other.

 

[Leongsam]

Not hate US citizen. Hate their Politic and policy maker like to be busy body declare war against other.

Someone has to do the dirty work. While other countries arrange talk fests to condemn terrorism, the USA actually takes concrete steps to blow up their sorry asses.

George W Bush and his father exterminated more muslim terrorists in the last 20 years than all the other presidents combined over the last couple of centuries. For that, I am forever grateful