NSP Bitch Jeannette spotted @ East Coast GRC since worker "PARTY GAL" cant be bother!

[Perspective]

Re: NSP Bitch Jeannette spotted @ East Coast GRC since worker "PARTY GAL" cant be bot

2 party system can only be established either by opposition party merging or rise of a dominant opposition party.

Probability of our opposition uniting is close to zero.

Unfortunately rise of dominant opposition party can only be realised through 3 or more corner fight.

For that I tend to agree. The founders of all these parties would not have done what they did if they felt they could have fit into an already-existing party, so why would they merge? And even if the 5 existing ones can merge for some miraculous reasons, there is no stopping more people coming out from woodwork, or those in this merged entity who were not selected as candidates, to come out again to form new parties - end up still coming back to 3 corner fights.

With no hope that only one opposition party will contest the election (heck that doesn't happen anywhere in the world), it is better that we go on the road towards having one opposition party contest all the 87 seats not bearing whichever else party or candidate wants to join in.

WP looks more likely to be the one and it's not that they deserve it, not that the people in there are more or less comparatively altrusic or high integrity. It's about going for the only better options available.

 

[yellowarse]

Re: NSP Bitch Jeannette spotted @ East Coast GRC since worker "PARTY GAL" cant be bot

Strange that you didn't mention NSP! NSP has given way to SDP in YuHua and MK to WP!

Okay, should have added NSP.

My fear is that once WP starts muscling into other territories come GE2016, the solidarity that has informed the opposition in past elections will be gone.

 

[Goh Meng Seng]

Re: NSP Bitch Jeannette spotted @ East Coast GRC since worker "PARTY GAL" cant be bot

Well, just look at the EAGLE TALK that some WP members here is giving! Some people have come to me and say we should combined all non-WP opposition parties and work together. Some have even made bold suggestions on how deal with situation like 3 corner fights. But I just hope that we would not go to that extremes.

Goh Meng Seng

Okay, should have added NSP.

My fear is that once WP starts muscling into other territories come GE2016, the solidarity that has informed the opposition in past elections will be gone.

 

[3_M]

Re: NSP Bitch Jeannette spotted @ East Coast GRC since worker "PARTY GAL" cant be bot

Well, just look at the EAGLE TALK that some WP members here is giving! Some people have come to me and say we should combined all non-WP opposition parties and work together. Some have even made bold suggestions on how deal with situation like 3 corner fights. But I just hope that we would not go to that extremes.

Goh Meng Seng

U only merge when you are sure that other parties are an asset and have something to contribute towards the coalition. Do you want to merge with chaps from PKMS or the DPP (aka slipperman party)?

It will only turn out to be 1+1 < 2.

 

[Perspective]

Re: NSP Bitch Jeannette spotted @ East Coast GRC since worker "PARTY GAL" cant be bot

Okay, should have added NSP.

My fear is that once WP starts muscling into other territories come GE2016, the solidarity that has informed the opposition in past elections will be gone.

How would you wish to avoid multi-corner fights?

1) Every party stays in two corner fights forever. None can expand, so in voters' perception there is none as strong as the PAP and they are not confident enough to vote for the opposition in big numbers. It's always perceived as fragments vs one solid. Furthermore, some funny opposition party the rest were obliged to give way to spoils their name and gets the publicity doing so because the rest who are better fielded a bit more candidates only and not given enough publicity to stand up better or engulf the funny ones. In the end no one wins except PAP.

2) All parties merge and only one party contest the election. All two corners. This happened in the dreams of opposition supporters for 50 years - long enough for a baby to grow into an old man.

I remember I am one of the few (or the only one) who did not blame TJS or TKL for TCB's loss despite being far from a supporter of either TJS or TKL so I am consistent on that.

I wish for a more fairer system that is why I suggested loss of deposit to be below 5% and the cost no more than $2,000 so that at least it is not too damaging or discouraging to aspirants who want to contribute despite their own shortcomings.

Lastly, gauging the intentions of the party by means of giving way isn't realistic and accurate. Did WP not give the most way? Did RP not give the most way because they had declared too many seats without the candidates? Did SDP and NSP not take up the most 3 corner fights before giving way? Did none of your more favourite parties not give way to Socialist Front in Mountbatten and Radin Mas? What is the standard of measure?

 

[3_M]

Re: NSP Bitch Jeannette spotted @ East Coast GRC since worker "PARTY GAL" cant be bot

How would you wish to avoid multi-corner fights?

Lastly, gauging the intentions of the party by means of giving way isn't realistic and accurate. Did WP not give the most way? Did RP not give the most way because they had declared too many seats without the candidates? Did SDP and NSP not take up the most 3 corner fights before giving way? Did none of your more favourite parties not give way to Socialist Front in Mountbatten and Radin Mas? What is the standard of measure?

If NSP is so confident about their chance in MK GRC, then they should go head on with WP. There is no right or wrong here, ultimately it still boil down to the fact on who got bigger muscles. Of course the one who back off will want to portray that they are giving way for the sake of "opposition unity" and ride on the high moral ground.

Now we have already reach a point of saturation. Growth of various opposition parties is just going to be a zero sum game. We have to realise that opposition movement on the whole is greater than any opposition party. I reckon the best way forward is to have a dominant opposition party and stop fantasizing about opposition unity (that not going to happen). Which is why I support 3 corner fight to get rid of the weaker ones though it will mean victory for PAP in 2016.

May the best party carry the torch of the opposition cause.

 

[sleaguepunter]

Re: NSP Bitch Jeannette spotted @ East Coast GRC since worker "PARTY GAL" cant be bot

Please remember what you wrote here and be ready to be proven wrong in a few years' time.

Goh Meng Seng

if WP prove me wrong by expanding into TP or MP, then WP must be able to attract many more credible candidates. That for once i dont mind being proven wrong.

or u telling me NSP can wrestle TP from pap in the next ge? that i dont mind being proven wrong too.

 

[Goh Meng Seng]

Re: NSP Bitch Jeannette spotted @ East Coast GRC since worker "PARTY GAL" cant be bot

Let's put it into good perspective. I don't think any WP "credible candidates" would want to risk themselves in a 3 corner fight, especially in GRC against a good team from other opposition party. Most likely, third rate team will be sent to TP, just like MK.

Goh Meng Seng

if WP prove me wrong by expanding into TP or MP, then WP must be able to attract many more credible candidates. That for once i dont mind being proven wrong.

or u telling me NSP can wrestle TP from pap in the next ge? that i dont mind being proven wrong too.

 

[Perspective]

Re: NSP Bitch Jeannette spotted @ East Coast GRC since worker "PARTY GAL" cant be bot

If NSP is so confident about their chance in MK GRC, then they should go head on with WP. There is no right or wrong here, ultimately it still boil down to the fact on who got bigger muscles. Of course the one who back off will want to portray that they are giving way for the sake of "opposition unity" and ride on the high moral ground.

Now we have already reach a point of saturation. Growth of various opposition parties is just going to be a zero sum game. We have to realise that opposition movement on the whole is greater than any opposition party. I reckon the best way forward is to have a dominant opposition party and stop fantasizing about opposition unity (that not going to happen). Which is why I support 3 corner fight to get rid of the weaker ones though it will mean victory for PAP in 2016.

May the best party carry the torch of the opposition cause.

I beg to differ slightly. I think "getting rid of small opposition" is not the main course. Unprepared candidates from small parties losing their deposits comes along naturally with three corner fights, but getting rid of them is not the primary objective. For that matter you might not be able to get rid of them as they will have the means to come back. The issue is as long as no party or parties stunt themselves or keep themselves to limits at the cost of not unseating the PAP sooner, I am fine. As we know the incumbent is bad and unless the only forerunning opposition party is extremely evil and kept this hidden and the third, fourth parties are faithfully altrustic (which I do not think so in this case) I don't see why we need to overturn the entire plate so harshly.

 

[methink]

Re: NSP Bitch Jeannette spotted @ East Coast GRC since worker "PARTY GAL" cant be bot

I beg to differ slightly. I think "getting rid of small opposition" is not the main course. Unprepared candidates from small parties losing their deposits comes along naturally with three corner fights, but getting rid of them is not the primary objective. For that matter you might not be able to get rid of them as they will have the means to come back. The issue is as long as no party or parties stunt themselves or keep themselves to limits at the cost of not unseating the PAP sooner, I am fine. As we know the incumbent is bad and unless the only forerunning opposition party is extremely evil and kept this hidden and the third, fourth parties are faithfully altrustic (which I do not think so in this case) I don't see why we need to overturn the entire plate so harshly.

Yes getting rid of small opposition is not an issue. We should have different views.

Imagine we have only one major party(say the WP) opposing the PAP. And their politics is not that palatable. Their silence on many important issues is a real put off. Since I do not agree with them, I would have to look to some other parties to articulate my views.

 

[Perspective]

Re: NSP Bitch Jeannette spotted @ East Coast GRC since worker "PARTY GAL" cant be bot

Yes getting rid of small opposition is not an issue. We should have different views.

Imagine we have only one major party(say the WP) opposing the PAP. And their politics is not that palatable. Their silence on many important issues is a real put off. Since I do not agree with them, I would have to look to some other parties to articulate my views.

Of course. But it should be that WP's politics is not savoury or palatable and not because WP by the act of fielding more candidates by itself is not savoury or palatable.

In fact, parties who want to be more palatable should field more candidates to give their voters a choice to choose them. I would encourage that if SDP or NSP has 87 candidates, please show and field them all.