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How USA won WW2

LaoTze

Alfrescian
Loyal
USA would not even have won in WW2 in the Pacific but for China taking on 80% of the Japan military might in China and killing over 1.5 million Japanese soldiers even though Chinese had very little arms to fight the Japanese.
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This was how Chinese went into battle in 1941
Those Chinese lucky enough to have rifles would have five rounds for each rifle. The rest using swords and spears against Japanese machine guns, tanks and artillery. And explosives strapped on to their bodies to take out Japanese tanks.
Yet they fought and killed Japanese invaders.
Chinese paid with 14 odd million of their Chinese soldiers dying . And another 14++ million Chinese civilians slaughtered and murdered by the Japanese soldiers in attempts to terrorised and intimidate China into surrendering.
USA had battleships with 16″ guns and planes and bombs and Ma Deuces and artillery , tanks flame throwers and unlimited ammo and kitchen sink to help them take on the remaining 20% of the Japanese on islands like Iwo Jima, Guadalcanal, Guam, Okinawa maybe taking out 200,000 Japanese troops in the entire Pacific islands campaigns.
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Stalin took on 80% of the Wehrmacht and the cream of Wehrmacht and much of the German tanks and planes and military equipment with USA and UK taking on the remaining 20% unfit to fit on the Eastern front or USA would have lost WW2 in Europe.
 

syed putra

Alfrescian
Loyal
But hollywood more powderful. Everybody believes in hollywood.
But to capture the essence of the war on eastern front, i recommend, "enemies at the gates". Its about the war in stalingrad.
 

glockman

Old Fart
Asset
I respect those who fought to defend their land and liberators of the oppressed during WW2. The greatest generation the world has ever seen. Our great-grandparents and grandparents generation.
 

JohnTan

Alfrescian (InfP)
Generous Asset
Chinese paid with 14 odd million of their Chinese soldiers dying . And another 14++ million Chinese civilians slaughtered and murdered by the Japanese soldiers in attempts to terrorised and intimidate China into surrendering.

By what you said, 1.5 million Japanese warriors dead vs around 29 million dead chinks.

So it takes 29 chinks to fight 1 jap.

You should be on your knees, sucking yankee cock. Given the high chink casualty rate, if not for the yankees, the chinks today would be speaking jap. I picked the right side to support during the Sino-Jap war.

 

tanwahtiu

Alfrescian
Loyal
How China won the opium trade war?

Any takers?

How Singapore won the bastard BE opium trade monopoly?

Any takers?
 

LaoTze

Alfrescian
Loyal
By what you said, 1.5 million Japanese warriors dead vs around 29 million dead chinks.

So it takes 29 chinks to fight 1 jap.

You should be on your knees, sucking yankee cock. Given the high chink casualty rate, if not for the yankees, the chinks today would be speaking jap. I picked the right side to support during the Sino-Jap war.

From Wuming Chan's answer to Why was China given the Veto power when it was a third world nation in 1945 and was backwards scientifically, militarily, and economically?
Extracted below as this will give the true picture. As to the fighting qualities of UK and USA against the Japs. Where 130 k UK soldiers surrended to 36 k Japs despite have tanks and arty and mortars against Japs riding down on bicycles to fight them. And the Japs down to their last bullets too at that point.
USA and UK would not even have won in Europe if Stalin had not taken on 80% of the Wehrmacht and the military machineries of Hitler.
Go check out Operation Kursk and Operation Bagration and compare that to what USA contributed to the win in Europe.
And as for the WW2, if China and Russia had not taken the vast bulk of the war, USA would not even have won WW2.
China had little industry in China being raped and pillaged by Western powers all set to divide and dismembered her and selling opium to China prior to the Sino Japanese war from July 7, 1937, to September 2, 1945
And for that purpose, the Western Powers were not going to let China have the means to produce armaments which could be used to stop the West from enjoying what they could from China.
Second Sino-Japanese War - Wikipedia
Japanese had a very strong military and armaments , from the steel USA happily sold to her for that purpose, together with the oil . Going on until almost before Japan decided to attack Pearl harbour because the Japanese were very unhappy USA not selling to Japan as much steel and oil as they want to beat and loot China in the way the Japanese want to.
China ports were all taken by Japanese so nothing could get through and for that matter, USA was not going to do that as USA had this great friendship going on with Japan.
Until Japan attacked Pearl Harbour that USA decided perhaps USA needed to supply arms to China except USA main focus was to supply arms to Europe as China was a bastard child. China did not even get 1% of the armaments supplied to UK, Russia and other Allied forces in other theatres of war.
The much ballyhooed military lift over the Hump was a fucking joke as that primarily was to try to get fuel and bombs over to bases for USA planes to bomb Japan and not arms for China. And at that, the fuel required to fly over the hump, and to fly back meant only a pittance could be brought over.
If the Chinese were not fighting and holding 80% and the cream of the Japanese Army in China, despite the Chinese having very little arms. Chinese even had to resort to using kungfu swords and spears against machine guns and tanks as the Chinese was desperate enough. Chinese strapped explosives on themselves and rushed in suicide charges on tanks to take out Japanese tanks.
And even Chinese women joined in the fight.
Here was one of them.
Please remember this girl, Cheng Benhua .
She was a soldier and will remain forever young.
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Wuming Chan's answer to Did China utilize female soldiers during the 2nd Sino-Japanese war?
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14 million Chinese fought and paid with their lives against the Japanese .
Another 16 million Chinese civilians were massacred and butchered by the Japanese in that war in attempts to terrorised and intimidate the Chinese.
How many casualties did the Imperial Japanese Army have in China from 1937 to 1945?
According to claims made by the Republic of China (ROC), Japan suffered quite a few more casualties with:
1.77 million Japanese killed and 1.9 million Japanese wounded.
This gives us a total of 3,670,000 casualties.
Leaving USA Army and Marines to fight the remaining 20% of the Japanese Arm forces in Pacific.
Of course, USA army and Marines had planes and battleships with 16 inch guns, and carriers and submarines and tanks and artilleries and Ma Deuces and everything including kitchen sink in their fight against the 20% Japanese in Pacific.
And even so, it was not easy at all for USA.
Unless their stories of Pacific war of courage against the Japs were faked.
How many Japanese did USA Army and Marines killed in the Pacific?
In Guadacanal , Tarawa, Iwo Jima , Guam, Okinawa and all Pacific fighting theatre of war?
(firebombing Jap cities and nuking Jap excluded)
100,000? 200,000? 300,000?
A fraction of what the Chinese did with swords and spears and primitive explosives strapped to their bodies.​
From Jamie Wong answer to How powerful is the Chinese military?
As a matter of fact, a lot of PLA soldiers didn’t even have a rifle. For major battles, each soldier got 1 rifle, 100~200 bullets, and 2~3 grenades. As for the guerrillas who was fighting in the Japanese occupied ares, half of them didn’t even have a rifle or pistol. Each battle, 5 rounds were the standard equipment.
Others had to use blades and spears.
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↑ This picture shows the common situation of PLA guerrillas.
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↑ And this was already a major division, but in the tough area.
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↑ This is how the 8th route army looked like. It was the major division of PLA. Still no armored vehicle.


I still cannot help but wonder what if 80% of the Japanese military might were not stuck in China fighting against the Chinese in China and were all in the Pacific as well., USA might well lose the Pacific War in WW2.
Second Sino-Japanese War - Wikipedia
That the turning point in Pacific war was Doolittle raid on Tokyo which forced the Japanese to attack Midway. That was the beginning of the end for them.
Few folks realised the cost to Chinese for Doolittle raid as USA planes landed in China. Turning Japanese into orgy of revenge as Chinese rescued the pilots. And at horrendous cost of 250,000 chinese lives, kept their mouths shut and not turned a single aircrew to Japanese.
https://www.realcleardefense.com...
The Untold Story of the Vengeful Japanese Attack After the Doolittle Raid
Now we look at how the Chinese fought when they had adequate arms.
Battle of Yenangyaung - Wikipedia
And in Burma, at the battle of Yenangyaung, almost 7,000 British soldiers, and 500 prisoners and civilians were encircled by an equal number of Japanese soldiers from the IJA 33rd Division at Yenangyaung and its oil field. The 33rd Division had cut the Magwe road between Slim's two divisions, who were now about 50 miles (80 km) apart.
General Sun instead led his 113th Regiment with only 1,121 men, of which only 800 were combat personnel, in the rescue mission.
British veteran expresses thanks to descendants of China Expeditionary Force
And those 800 chinese saved the Brits. And those 800 Chinks pulled the chestnuts of the 7,000 valiant brits out of the fucking fire and slaughtered the IJA 33rd Division.
As to how Japs could fight, do recall 36,000 Japanese invaded Malaya , forced and fought their way down and utterly defeated 86,000++ British troops capturing Singapore. So do not think Japs could not fight.
About 130,000 Indian, Australian and British troops became prisoners of war when Singapore was surrended to General Yamashita. The 130,000 Brits and Allied forces with artillery and tanks and planes and guns and lots of ammo surrended to 36,000 Japs who rode down on fucking bicycles fighting with guns and hardly any arty .
And that Gen McArthur ran away from his troops in Corregidor for which he was awarded MOH for his glorious act of running away.
The defensive arsenal on Corregidor was formidable with 45 coastal guns and mortars organized into 23 batteries, some seventy-two anti-aircraft weapons assigned to thirteen batteries and a minefield of approximately 35 groups of controlled mines.
The two 12-inch (305 mm) guns of Batteries Smith and Hearn, with a horizontal range of 29,000 yd (27,000 m) and all-around traverse were the longest range of all the island's artillery.
Caballo Island, with Fort Hughes—just south of Corregidor—was the next largest in area. At about 160 acres (65 ha), the island rose abruptly from the bay to a height of 380 ft (120 m) on its western side. Commander Francis J. Bridget was in charge of its beach defenses with a total of 800 men, of whom 93 were Marines and 443 belonged to the Navy, by the end of April 1942. Coastal artillery numbered some 13 assorted pieces, with its anti-aircraft defenses tied in with those of Corregidor.
Fort Drum—which lay about 4 mi (6.4 km) south of Fort Hughes—was the most unusual of the harbor defenses. Military engineers had cut away the entire top of El Fraile Island down to the water-line and used the island as a foundation to build a reinforced concrete "battleship", 350 ft (110 m) long and 144 ft (44 m) wide, with exterior walls of concrete and steel 25–36 ft (7.6–11.0 m) thick. The top deck of this concrete battleship was 40 ft (12 m) above the low-water mark and had 20 ft (6.1 m) thick walls. Equipped with four 14-inch (356 mm) guns in armored turrets facing seaward, a secondary battery of four casemated 6-inch (152 mm) gunsguns, and two antiaircraft guns, the fort with its 200-man garrison was considered impregnable to attack.
And the 13,000++ USA and Filipino soldiers left on Corregidor with all those hardware and lots of military goodies were ran over and surrendered to 2,400++ Japs in three landings made by the Japs on the island.
In China, Chinese with kungfu and spears and swords and hardly any guns hold the Japs and fought the Japs killing 1.77 million of the Japs and wounding 1.9 million Japs
But Chinese when given adequate arms could fight far better than the Japs.
Imagine now if Chinese had been given sufficient arms in China to fight the fucking Japanese there in China!
There might not even be a fucking TORA TORA TORA at Pearl Harbour. And no Japanese in Pacific at all for USA Army and Marines to fight as Japs will all be in China and being fucked and killed by Chinese in China.​
 

Hypocrite-The

Alfrescian
Loyal
If the nips could not even conquer ah tiong land..why did they open another front in SEA? The historical reasoning is their oil supplies were shut down. But they had Manchuria n never did much to secure their merchant fleet. So even if they had the oil etc they could not get the oil to nipland anyway. It was invading SEA tat drained their resources. If they focused 100% on ah tiong land. It would be a different story. N it was the Japanese navy tat was fighting the yanks. The nip army had minimal central control. Army do 1 thing n navy did another. Not as simple as ah tiong land tie down the Japs etc.
 

hofmann

Alfrescian
Loyal
If the nips could not even conquer ah tiong land..why did they open another front in SEA? The historical reasoning is their oil supplies were shut down. But they had Manchuria n never did much to secure their merchant fleet. So even if they had the oil etc they could not get the oil to nipland anyway. It was invading SEA tat drained their resources. If they focused 100% on ah tiong land. It would be a different story. N it was the Japanese navy tat was fighting the yanks. The nip army had minimal central control. Army do 1 thing n navy did another. Not as simple as ah tiong land tie down the Japs etc.

They needed the tin and rubber from Malaya as I recall? Probably an opportunistic land grab too since the Brits were too busy dealing with Hitler to defend the far East.
 

Sideswipe

Alfrescian (Inf)
Asset
USA played the biggest role in winning the Asia Pacific war but China still played an important significant role there. China received meager aid from the USA ww2 lend-lease program, just 0.6% of the world total from 1942-1944. In total. 60% went to Great Britain, 20% to Soviet Union, Others 17% and just 3% to China. the Chinese Nationalist army bogged down 1.2 million Japanese army in China which would be used against the USA in the Pacific. the crack troops of the Japanese 1st-20th Divisions had already perished in the war against China by 1941 before the Japanese sent those rebuilt/refurbished Divisions to the Pacific war.
 

Hypocrite-The

Alfrescian
Loyal
They needed the tin and rubber from Malaya as I recall? Probably an opportunistic land grab too since the Brits were too busy dealing with Hitler to defend the far East.
But the nips did not improve their merchant fleet to ship the stuff to nip land. So wat the point?
 

Hypocrite-The

Alfrescian
Loyal
USA played the biggest role in winning the Asia Pacific war but China still played an important significant role there. China received meager aid from the USA ww2 lend-lease program, just 0.6% of the world total from 1942-1944. In total. 60% went to Great Britain, 20% to Soviet Union, Others 17% and just 3% to China. the Chinese Nationalist army bogged down 1.2 million Japanese army in China which would be used against the USA in the Pacific. the crack troops of the Japanese 1st-20th Divisions had already perished in the war against China by 1941 before the Japanese sent those rebuilt/refurbished Divisions to the Pacific war.
Chiang was unwilling to fight the nips bcos he wanted to conserve strength to fight the commies. Tat was wat pissed off some of the yanks. When Burma was conquered. The yanks had to fly supplies in to Chiang. An expensive n dangerous endeavour. I would not give Chiang too much credit. He could have done better in WW2 n inturn prevented the commie take over in the end.
 

Sideswipe

Alfrescian (Inf)
Asset
Chiang was unwilling to fight the nips bcos he wanted to conserve strength to fight the commies. Tat was wat pissed off some of the yanks. When Burma was conquered. The yanks had to fly supplies in to Chiang. An expensive n dangerous endeavour. I would not give Chiang too much credit. He could have done better in WW2 n inturn prevented the commie take over in the end.

Chiang of course had to conserve some military strength at times for the long war against the Japanese army, and also guarding many key positions in the vast lands of China required large number of troops just to block off the Japanese army. the Communists interpreted this necessary military actions as Nationalist armies being inactive, and Chiang conserved strength to fight the Communists. it became an effective Communist propaganda and damaged the KMT government’s reputation. Chiang did the best he could under exceptionally difficult circumstances. China’s successful resistance was a great admirable effort undertaken by the KMT government, with only meager aid from its allies. the CCP’s military and political sabotages did lots of damages and caused many problems to the KMT’s war cause. Chiang would not have lost China to the Communists if not for the 1945 Yalta conference USA betrayal which gave the Soviet Union a special position in Manchuria at the war end.
 

Hypocrite-The

Alfrescian
Loyal
Chiang of course had to conserve some military strength at times for the long war against the Japanese army, and also guarding many key positions in the vast lands of China required large number of troops just to block off the Japanese army. the Communists interpreted this necessary military actions as Nationalist armies being inactive, and Chiang conserved strength to fight the Communists. it became an effective Communist propaganda and damaged the KMT government’s reputation. Chiang did the best he could under exceptionally difficult circumstances. China’s successful resistance was a great admirable effort undertaken by the KMT government, with only meager aid from its allies. the CCP’s military and political sabotages did lots of damages and caused many problems to the KMT’s war cause. Chiang would not have lost China to the Communists if not for the 1945 Yalta conference USA betrayal which gave the Soviet Union a special position in Manchuria at the war end.
The Soviets in Manchuria gave support to Chiang. It's was Chiang's incompetence tat lost him the civil war
 

Hypocrite-The

Alfrescian
Loyal
Chiang's role in ww2 is over rated.

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Vinegar Joe Stilwell – a tough, brilliant, but difficult commander in World War Two
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Aug 12, 2017 Andrew Knighton

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Stilwell eating C-rations on Christmas Morning, 1943.

General Joseph Stilwell, widely known as Vinegar Joe, had one of the strongest personalities of WWII. As American commander in Burma, he showed incredible insight into the challenges of war in that region. His stern attitude was at times his greatest asset; at others, it was his biggest flaw.

The Tough Guy
Stilwell earned his nickname and his tough guy reputation long before WWII.
From early in his career, Stilwell’s short temper and colorful language made him stand out. He had no patience for inefficiency or stuffiness. It led him to have a deep disdain for the British he worked with in Burma, an attitude that caused problems.
He was also a smart, capable leader. That was why he was in a position of great responsibility.
Early Years
A West Point graduate, Stilwell was commissioned in 1904. Aggressive, highly professional, and gifted with languages, he served in the Philippines and China. There he earned a reputation as someone willing to speak his mind about inefficiency. Returning to America, he became an instructor at West Point before serving in WWI, where he saw the fierce fighting of the last great German push.
The Chinese Expert
After the war, Stilwell applied for a post in China. He arrived there in 1920. Although he returned to the US for officer training and other assignments, he spent much of the interwar years in positions in China.
There, he scorned the life of leisure and cocktail parties that many expatriates enjoyed. Instead, he acted as a supervisor on public works before traveling the country.
stilwell001-634x640.jpg

He saw first-hand the suffering of the Chinese people. He watched as first civil war and then Japanese invasion tore the country apart. All sides showed a disdain for human life. He witnessed the Rape of Nanking in 1937 when the Japanese massacred 40,000 civilians.
Through his brave and diligent information gathering, Stilwell became one of America’s top experts on China. He also developed a dislike of many of those involved, especially the Japanese.
Settling in Amid Setbacks
Following the attack on Pearl Harbour, America and Britain joined in the fight against Japan. In early 1942, Stilwell was appointed to take charge of American forces in Burma.
A British possession, Burma was invaded by the Japanese in January 1942. The British were rapidly pushed back and Chinese attempts to intervene crumbled before Japanese advances. For months, the British fought a desperate retreat through the jungle.
Stilwell commanded the US and Chinese forces in Burma. Chiang Kai-Shek, the Chinese Nationalist commander, gave the Americans ostensible command of some of his troops.
Although focused on supporting the British and Chinese withdrawal, Stilwell led Chinese forces in a counter-attack that beat the Japanese at Tounggyi. It showed that, with good command, they could achieve a great deal.
Handling the Chiang Kai-Shek Problem
Stilwell found many problems with his Chinese troops. They were poorly equipped. Their commanders lacked boldness and courage. Supplies were not properly organized. The main recurring problem, however, was Chiang Kai-Shek.
He frequently failed to live up to his promises and countermanded orders from Stilwell. He played politics, threatening to withdraw from the campaign if America did not give him more supplies.
Stilwell put a tremendous effort into negotiating with and managing Chiang. It was an experience that embittered both men. With his strong character and local knowledge, though, Stilwell showed he was the right man for the job.
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Lieutenant General Stilwell with Chiang Kai Shek.
Strategic Brilliance and Playing Politics
Stilwell was a sound military planner. He produced a strategy to tackle the Japanese through a simultaneous attack by all Chinese forces. It would give their allies a chance to advance, but with Chiang involved, there was no chance of it happening.
Stilwell was part of meetings between Roosevelt, Churchill, senior Allied commanders, and Chiang. The Chinese demands and duplicity were apparent, but the Allies had to work with him. Stilwell was offered another posting to defuse his frustration, but he stuck with the job.
Advances
Despite constant bickering at the top, the Allies made progress in Burma. A Japanese counter-attack in early 1944 was a setback, but Stilwell was determined to push back.
He planned to advance south on the airfield at Myitkyina before linking up with the Burma Road. Substantial advances were made, including the capture of supplies at Tanaka by General Sun, a Chinese general acting decisively despite Chiang’s orders.
chiang_kai_shek_and_wife_with_lieutenant_general_stilwell-1.jpg

Chiang Kai Shek and his wife with Lieutenant General Stilwell.
Myitkyina and Mogaung
The towns of Myitkyina and Mogaung were crucial to Stilwell’s strategy. His frustration and the yes-men surrounding him blinded Stilwell to the nuances of his situation.
Given command of Merrill’s Marauders, an elite irregular force, he flung them into an ill-supported frontal assault on Myitkyina. It wasted their talents and caused enormous losses. The Chindits, British irregulars put under Stilwell’s command, suffered from similar misuse. In his hurry to out-do the British, Stilwell made tactical errors and failed to credit the Chindits when they captured Mogaung.
His bull-headed determination was turning into a flaw. When one of the Chindit commanders, Michael Calvert, challenged him, Stilwell showed another side to his personality. At first arguing with Calvert, he changed his mind deciding he liked Calvert’s willingness to challenge him. He had found a like-minded Brit at last.
A Bitter End
As the Allies advanced through Burma, problems with Chiang continued. In response to the Chinese commander’s obstructions, Stilwell delivered a blunt message from Roosevelt. In response, the Chinese demanded Stilwell’s removal; a demand the Americans could not afford to ignore.
Despite being honored for his service, Stilwell was left bitter. He had been unceremoniously dismissed and was told not to discuss the China problem with anyone, particularly the media.
Stilwell served until the end of the war and was present at the Japanese surrender. He died on October 12, 1946, from stomach cancer.
Stilwell was a brilliant but difficult commander caught in one of the most challenging posts of WWII. It was a shame that, in the end, politics prevented him from achieving all he could have done.
Source:
David Rooney (1999), Military Mavericks: Extraordinary Men of Battle.





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