CPF vs CPP

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http://retirehappy.ca/is-cpp-a-good-deal/

Canada Pension Plan is one of the cornerstones of the Canadian retirement benefits. Everyone that works must contribute to CPP and as a result everyone is eligible to receive a retirement benefit from CPP.

How much you get in benefit depends on how much you put into CPP. For more details on how much you will get from CPP, check out one of my previous articles HOW MUCH WILL YOU GET FROM CANADA PENSION PLAN?

Lately there is lots of talk about enhancing CPP because of the serious retirement gap. Is this really a good deal? Let’s take a look at the current CPP system and see if Canadians are getting value for their contributions.

Going back 40 years

Let’s say Bill started working 40 years ago. Back then he only contributed 1.8% of your pay to a maximum of $135.00. From this point, every year his contribution amount would have gone up because of inflation adjustments and increases to the contribution rate. Over the course of 40 years, he would have contributed $44,692.80. Bill’s employer would have also matched his contributions. Today, 40 years later, Bill would be eligible for a CPP retirement benefit of $1092.50 per month or $13,110 per year. Is that good or bad?

If we look at it from the perspective of how much money would we need today as a lump sum to generate an annual income of $13,110 per year, we can estimate that we would need somewhere between $230,000 and $330,000. Let’s say Bill could have taken his CPP contributions along with the employer contributions and invested it himself he would need to earn somewhere between 6.5% and 8.8% to achieve the $230,000 to $330,000. If Bill did not have the employer contributions, it would be very difficult to replicate a pension of $1092.50 per month.

Based on this math, CPP is a pretty good deal for employees. Especially if you add in the fact that the pension is indexed and that CPP is not only a retirement pension but a disability plan as well as a life insurance benefit.

What about the next 39 years?

Today, employees contribute 4.95% of their income up to a maximum of $2,544.30 per year (2016). This is figure is based on the yearly YMPE which is $54,900 for 2016. The YMPE goes up a little each year as a result of being adjusted for inflation.

In addition to the employee contribution, the employer also contributes $2544.30 per year making the total annual contribution $5088.60.

Let’s say inflation runs at 1% per year for the next 39 years. That means your contributions to CPP will increase every but so will the monthly CPP retirement benefit. Based on these assumptions, your total contributions over the next 39 years would total $120,631. Your monthly CPP retirement benefit will be projected to be $1599 per month or $19,188 per year.

If we use the same math as we did in Bill’s example, we would need somewhere between $320,000 and $480,000 to generate that income. If we were able to take our CPP contributions along with the matching employer contributions and invest that money ourselves, we would only need 2% to 3.5% to grow it to the $320,000 to $480,000. I know a lot of people would look at this and suggest they had a good shot at making more than 2% to 3.5%.

Because of higher contribution rate, the math of CPP is not as attractive as it was for the past 40 years. Regardless of the math, we can’t opt out of CPP anyway as it is a mandatory plan. The math does suggest that moving forward CPP an OK deal. You can argue the pros and cons either way.

More than just math

The best part of CPP is your employer is required to match your contribution. If you were to invest only your portion, it would be very difficult to match the CPP retirement pension. For self-employed people like me, we pay both the employer and the employee contributions and if I I were to invest that money I would not need a very high return to equal what I will get from CPP 40 years later. One can argue that the CPP program is not great for self-employed people that pay both the employee and employer contributions.

Remember that CPP is a guaranteed lifetime pension. You get a cheque for as long as you live. And if you have a spouse, your spouse may get part or all of your CPP in the future.

Lastly, CPP is an indexed pension which is very hard for any of us to replicate on our own. The math I have given here largely ignores that which means the numbers argue more in favour of the CPP program.

The bottom line

Like any workplace savings program, if the employer is going to make contributions on your behalf, then you can’t go wrong.

With regards to CPP, the employer‘s matching contribution make CPP a wonderful program and every employee should vote to enhance CPP.
 
Why Canada can have a pension plan that is sustainable and sinkapore cannot? Sinkees pay so much more in CPF, yet the PAP government, the costliest in the world, cannot give us a lifetime pension? The PAP is pretty useless.
 
Only contribute 4.95% can get $1095 per month pension indexed to inflation? So good.
 
Canadians are also encouraged to invest for their retirement with RRSPs
This is a voluntarily, where you use a portion of your wages to invest in a RRSP(registered retirement plan).
I say voluntary, because you decide if you want to invest in a RRSP or not.

The advantage of an RRSP is that the amount invested is not taxed. This amount may be taxed when you take it out.
There are many differet RRSPs available via the banks, redit unions, insurance companies,.....
 
according to my calculations.....if a sinkie young adult at the age of 25 earning a average median income of $3000 starts contributing 3% of his income monthly($90 a month) into the S&P 500 for a period of 30 years,at the end of 30 years at age 55,he would a princely sum of $159k in his retirement account.

how can a 3% monthly investment in the SNP500 manage to accomplish what a 36% contribution rate into the CPF cannot?

fine lets say nothing in future is for certain and we should always plan with a margin of error.....lets boost the retirement plan investment rate of the 25 year old to 10 percent instead,30 years later he would end up with a whopping sum of $627k.....from a measly 10 percent investment rate from his monthly income???

the CPF is the ultimate ponzi SCAM and is cheating every SIngaporean from becoming a potential millionaire....even the poorest of the poor sinkie earning $1200 a month could be a millionaire if he invested 36% of his income into the snp 500 for 33 years.
 
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according to my calculations.....if a sinkie young adult at the age of 25 earning a average median income of $3000 starts contributing 3% of his income monthly($90 a month) into the S&P 500 for a period of 30 years,at the end of 30 years at age 55,he would a princely sum of $159k in his retirement account.

how can a 3% monthly investment in the SNP500 manage to accomplish what a 36% contribution rate into the CPF cannot?

fine lets say nothing in future is for certain and we should always plan with a margin of error.....lets boost the retirement plan investment rate of the 25 year old to 10 percent instead,30 years later he would end up with a whopping sum of $627k.....from a measly 10 percent investment rate from his monthly income???

the CPF is the ultimate ponzi SCAM and is cheating every SIngaporean from becoming a potential millionaire....even the poorest of the poor sinkie earning $1200 a month could be a millionaire if he invested 36% of his income into the snp 500 for 33 years.

I did a calculation previously ...$10k a year for 30 years will result in $1.3 million when invested in S&P. If in CPF, the final amount is $450k. Return is $1 million from S&P versus $150k in CPF. We have been rip-off big time.
 
Canadians are also encouraged to invest for their retirement with RRSPs
This is a voluntarily, where you use a portion of your wages to invest in a RRSP(registered retirement plan).
I say voluntary, because you decide if you want to invest in a RRSP or not.

The advantage of an RRSP is that the amount invested is not taxed. This amount may be taxed when you take it out.
There are many differet RRSPs available via the banks, redit unions, insurance companies,.....

I can never understand till this day, why people here, for 5 decades allowed a government to take yOUR CPF monies & treat it like it is theirs. Give them unlimited permission to change regulations, laws to hold yOUR CPF ( theirs), which is our hard earned, blood, sweat & tears retirement money, & distancing it out of our reach, our descendants reach for as long as possible!.

Why do we allow that to happen?....they still this day...make CPF as yOUR MONEY ( theirs) to KEEP. It was simple back when up to around 1983, I had a colleague who retired then after 30+ years of work, at 55 years of age, took the BULK OF HIS MONEY & had been living off it comfortably till now, that person is in the 80's already.

The point is, that was the idea of CPF when it was started 50 years ago.....one work, contribute to a 'pension fund' retire at 55, cash out the money....have a choice to continue working or live off, spend all the retirement money....right!

It is OUR MONEY....no government in power, should have their 'greedy hands' on them & dictate, "WHEN"! we can have them....only the dense Singaporean who vote for such a government...allow this....I JUST CANNOT UNDERSTAND....it is YOUR MONEY, & YOU ARE SO TRUSTING..amazing!:mad:
 
I can never understand till this day, why people here, for 5 decades allowed a government to take yOUR CPF monies & treat it like it is theirs. Give them unlimited permission to change regulations, laws to hold yOUR CPF ( theirs), which is our hard earned, blood, sweat & tears retirement money, & distancing it out of our reach, our descendants reach for as long as possible!.

Why do we allow that to happen?....they still this day...make CPF as yOUR MONEY ( theirs) to KEEP. It was simple back when up to around 1983, I had a colleague who retired then after 30+ years of work, at 55 years of age, took the BULK OF HIS MONEY & had been living off it comfortably till now, that person is in the 80's already. .....

Amazing isn't it:eek:
May explain why so many Sporeans are voting with their feet & leaving to become ex-Sporeans.

For the rest, they still prefer to live in ignorance e.g. I think most are females?
Eventually some of them to wake up & find that the kitty is empty, but by that time LHL & wifey will either be dead or retired overseas.
 
Amazing isn't it:eek:
May explain why so many Sporeans are voting with their feet & leaving to become ex-Sporeans.

For the rest, they still prefer to live in ignorance e.g. I think most are females?
Eventually some of them to wake up & find that the kitty is empty, but by that time LHL & wifey will either be dead or retired overseas.

I have been telling people since the 1980's, when you know who! was the finance minster & we ENTERED into a recession due to extremely high CPF rates.....until I am tired & stopped saying..." one day, we will wake up, open the newspapers & know that, our CPF monies were all 'burnt'...

Quite a lot, I grew up with or went to school with from primary to secondary....have left Singapore....if it weren't for my late mother...I almost left.....:p

I am never comfortable in placing my hard earn money with any government.....in which ever party that maybe....we have became too trusting....not me of course!.....those clueless, dense voters!
 
Why Canada can have a pension plan that is sustainable and sinkapore cannot? Sinkees pay so much more in CPF, yet the PAP government, the costliest in the world, cannot give us a lifetime pension? The PAP is pretty useless.


...and being in the top 5 highest in the world... the reserve we have...that says a lot about this gahment.
 
I have been telling people since the 1980's, when you know who! was the finance minster & we ENTERED into a recession due to extremely high CPF rates.....until I am tired & stopped saying..." one day, we will wake up, open the newspapers & know that, our CPF monies were all 'burnt'...

Quite a lot, I grew up with or went to school with from primary to secondary....have left Singapore....if it weren't for my late mother...I almost left.....:p

I am never comfortable in placing my hard earn money with any government.....in which ever party that maybe....we have became too trusting....not me of course!.....those clueless, dense voters!


Unfortunately it is the males of Spore that stand to lose much more than the females & that is why your friends & mine have all left. We are the ones that have to do NS, reservist, are the bread wiiners,... The females had little to lose & even enjoyed the perks of the womens charter.


While I was in Canada I learn't that Canadians never took their freedom for granted. Many of them have come countries with dictatorships, including ex-Sporeans:D

Over there they have elections at the provincial & federal elections & many Canadian made sure to vote to ensure that none of the parties ever held both levels of power.

Unfortunately the pioneer generation didn't know anything about democracy & let the bully with the brass knuckles set up a dynasty.
 
Unfortunately it is the males of Spore that stand to lose much more than the females & that is why your friends & mine have all left. We are the ones that have to do NS, reservist, are the bread wiiners,... The females had little to lose & even enjoyed the perks of the womens charter.

All Sinkie Females should be made to do NS, including running SOC in FBO. ;)
 
Only contribute 4.95% can get $1095 per month pension indexed to inflation? So good.

Like that Singaporeans contributing 20% should get $4000 pension indexed to inflation. No $4k also should at least get $3k. Another sign that we are shortchanged or CPF has poor performance.
 
Unfortunately it is the males of Spore that stand to lose much more than the females & that is why your friends & mine have all left. We are the ones that have to do NS, reservist, are the bread wiiners,... The females had little to lose & even enjoyed the perks of the womens charter.


While I was in Canada I learn't that Canadians never took their freedom for granted. Many of them have come countries with dictatorships, including ex-Sporeans:D

Over there they have elections at the provincial & federal elections & many Canadian made sure to vote to ensure that none of the parties ever held both levels of power.

Unfortunately the pioneer generation didn't know anything about democracy & let the bully with the brass knuckles set up a dynasty.

O Canada!...that was where I was heading, until my late mother, " cry me a river"...:p some of my best buddies, through thick & thin, through schools, through National Slavery are settled there....some or many are down under & some spread across the globe...the sum of which, could have, would have, should have contributed much here & reduced the dependance on Foreigners....for the architect of all these is dead & they are still honouring him with the discharge shells from the cursory canons...never mind, the money, we shall not see until......don't know when or will get it , in drips....in later years, before we starved or whatever come earlier...

:mad:
 
O Canada!...that was where I was heading, until my late mother, " cry me a river"...:p some of my best buddies, through thick & thin, through schools, through National Slavery are settled there....some or many are down under & some spread across the globe...the sum of which, could have, would have, should have contributed much here & reduced the dependance on Foreigners....for the architect of all these is dead & they are still honouring him with the discharge shells from the cursory canons...never mind, the money, we shall not see until......don't know when or will get it , in drips....in later years, before we starved or whatever come earlier...

:mad:

Now that your late mother is no longer around, what's keeping you from going? ;)
 
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