Your CPF is F*cked
- Thread starter Loofydralb
- Start date
https://www.scmp.com/economy/china-...&utm_medium=share_widget&utm_campaign=3084979
An Institute of International Finance report published in May 2020 suggested that China is now the world’s largest creditor to low income countries, with China’s outstanding debt claims on the rest of the world having risen from US$875 billion in 2004 to over US$5.5 trillion in 2019 – more than 6 per cent of global gross domestic product (GDP)
- The Institute of International Finance (IFF) estimated that China’s total debt hit 317 per cent of gross domestic product (GDP) in the first quarter of 2020
- In May 2020, the IFF also said the debt owed to China by the rest of the world had risen to more than 6 per cent of global GDP
An Institute of International Finance report published in May 2020 suggested that China is now the world’s largest creditor to low income countries, with China’s outstanding debt claims on the rest of the world having risen from US$875 billion in 2004 to over US$5.5 trillion in 2019 – more than 6 per cent of global gross domestic product (GDP)
https://www.thebalance.com/national-debt-by-year-compared-to-gdp-and-major-events-3306287
https://www.bloomberg.com/graphics/2020-debt-and-deficit-projections-hit-records/
Still, the U.S. is destined for much higher levels of debt when the contagion passes. In a worst-case scenario, the CRFB predicts debt could reach 117% of GDP by 2025, easily exceeding the record of 106% set in 1946.
https://www.bloomberg.com/graphics/2020-debt-and-deficit-projections-hit-records/
Still, the U.S. is destined for much higher levels of debt when the contagion passes. In a worst-case scenario, the CRFB predicts debt could reach 117% of GDP by 2025, easily exceeding the record of 106% set in 1946.
I think cant just look at debt. Must look at how the loans are structured and who actually owns it.
https://www.thebalance.com/who-owns-the-u-s-national-debt-3306124
https://www.thebalance.com/who-owns-the-u-s-national-debt-3306124
- Joined
- Oct 22, 2008
- Messages
- 4,050
- Points
- 113
this bond thingy is basically a. promise to pay ,an IOU by a soverign state ...it's like an IOU signed by a poor towkay living in a large mansion ..should he die ,the creditors can seize his estate in lieu of the IOU ..but what if US refuses to honour the treasury bills ?
the only presumption is that US cannot go back on its promises since a question of credibility arises as a soverign state to borrow further in future arises
but what if there is a legal loop hole ,that can set aside US legal obligation ?
the only presumption is that US cannot go back on its promises since a question of credibility arises as a soverign state to borrow further in future arises
but what if there is a legal loop hole ,that can set aside US legal obligation ?
- Joined
- Jan 27, 2009
- Messages
- 1,745
- Points
- 113
look, if you are anti-American, that is your business. I have been very lucky and fortunate in my life and I owe it to my country and America. I am happy with my situation. I think that is the major difference between you and I.
In my experience I have noticed some people whom are vehemently opposed to America - for whatever reason and in the end, after all is said and done - the root cause is always the same. People are jealous of America and everything they have achieved. So attack the king if you will because it wont change anything. They will still be there long after you and I are gone.
China is not your friend
- Joined
- Oct 22, 2008
- Messages
- 4,050
- Points
- 113
it's actually a clash of civilization here
east vs west ...as far as China vs US is concerned ...just as Islamic civilization vs Christian civilization ..though most of middle eastern civilization now falls under the armpit of Islamic
US is actually an extension of western civilization, the origin being the Greeks than Romans, than Europe colonists to Uncle Sam
whreas ,chinese civilization had more or less remain in the same domain ...glorious some thousands years back and went down the hill in the past 1000 years
its this clash we are actually witnessing now
what made you think US cannot go back on its promises ?
the nation will have to start a war with US if they go back on its promises and which nation dare or have such capability ?
- Joined
- Oct 22, 2008
- Messages
- 4,050
- Points
- 113
helooop,that's exactly what I am saying ...read my post again please
- Joined
- Jul 25, 2013
- Messages
- 17,813
- Points
- 113
Even if there's a legal loophole,defaulting on ur bonds is destroying people's trust in u,and that beyond anything is the most important.
Once u lose that,u lose the ability to borrow,and our economies today are construed upon debt,mountains of it......without the ability to borrow,any civilisation is finished.even a high percent of interest is enough to destroy u.....in the history of borrowing any companies issuing bonds with high interests are often on its last legs.
- Joined
- Oct 22, 2008
- Messages
- 4,050
- Points
- 113
well said and well argued but whatever you thus says applies under normal circumstances ...meaning even in a normal contractual obligation the force major is a clause that nulls and void it legally ,or without losing further credibility so as to speak
even where say a country falls short of its payment and the loaning country knows very well that the borrowing country is quite unable to pay ..usually the loan is written off and not pushed to pay where the question of crediblity to borrow further will arise as you argued ...simply put reset all over again
the question here whether US is unable to pay arises out of liquidity problem since a soverign guranteed is backed by the asset of the entire country....in short, should US sell say the city of New York to a willing buyer than the entire loan would be paid ...as an individual that would be the recourse but not as a soverignity
so ,it's a very touchy subject we are talking about .
- Joined
- Jul 25, 2013
- Messages
- 17,813
- Points
- 113
is there such a guarantee?that a country's bonds is backed by the assets of the country?i think theres nothing backing it and they are free to default whenever they like no?just that in future if they wish to issue any bonds,it would be much harder to find buyers and the interest rates would be much higher.....like different sources of credit,borrowing from bank vs borrowing from loan shark....if ur credit is so bad banks refuse to deal with u.......
unless we are thinking of china's debt traps......i think those are loans made to poor countries that we know are extremely likely to default on their obligations,but there are specific clauses and obligations included that demand they hand over certain assets or lands should they default.......
- Joined
- Oct 22, 2008
- Messages
- 4,050
- Points
- 113
- Joined
- Jan 2, 2013
- Messages
- 7,068
- Points
- 113
One thing people don’t realise is there are 4 types of debts: Government Debt, Household Debt, Financial Sector Debt and Non Financial Sector Debt. The 310% of China is Total Debt which is the sum of all 4. The 117% of US is the Government Debt, the China equivalent is 55%. Now, Singapore Government Debt is higher than US.
- Joined
- Jan 2, 2013
- Messages
- 7,068
- Points
- 113
- Joined
- Jan 27, 2009
- Messages
- 1,745
- Points
- 113
The point is not who has what debt. All nations in the world has debt. Singapore actually has quite a bit.
Recently some lawmakers in the USA have proposed to take China held US debt of 1 Trillion and cancel it due to the Wuhan Virus as a means to make China pay.
The point I was making is this will be a deliberate act. That pro-China chappie went into a fit and said its a default and I said no, its not an inability to pay the obligation, its a choice to take it in lieu of Virus related damages.
There is a difference. You cannot talk to some people if they are in favor of the Chinese Communist Party, as is that person. Someone private messaged me and told me he is in fact another nickname of "tanwahtiu" so I am adding him to my China troll list in my signature.
China is not your friend
- Joined
- Jul 14, 2008
- Messages
- 90,928
- Points
- 113
Remember who said this?
"Blah blah blah blah blah................. you will be Finished!"
"Blah blah blah blah blah................. you will be Finished!"
