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Vivian taking the war to his facebook

winnipegjets

Alfrescian (Inf)
Asset
The core issue is integrity - Hawkers vs AHPETC

Many well-intended people advised me not to pursue this saga. It was too mundane, and people wanted to move on.

But I felt duty bound to resolve this matter, because it goes far beyond clean ceilings.

The core issue is integrity.

The Property Manager of AHPETC, Mr Tai Vie Shun, demanded extra money from hawkers for cleaning the high areas of hawker centres. He did so on three occasions – 8 March 2013, 26 April 2013 and 28 April 2013. The hawkers have confirmed this consistently, and their account is backed up by notes of meetings.

When this scandal came to light, instead of putting things right, the Town Council Chairman, Ms Sylvia Lim, and the Vice-Chairman, Mr Pritam Singh, publicly denied that the Town Council had ever asked hawkers for more money.

That was why I said in Parliament that these denials by Ms Lim and Mr Singh were false and untruthful. And I say it again here.

Ms Sylvia Lim acknowledged that this was a very grave charge, but then she beat around the bush, and claimed confusion between spring and annual cleaning. But how can she, on the one hand, claim that the Town Council never asked for more money; and then, on the other hand, maintain that this was spring and not annual cleaning, i.e. the Town Council was justified to ask for more money?

Mr Pritam Singh sat conspicuously silent throughout the proceedings.

Mr Low Thia Kiang argued that it was all ‘a misunderstanding’. But interestingly he did not strongly defend the Town Council’s actions, or Ms Lim and Mr Singh’s public denials.

Politics is a contest for power, but people with power must never take advantage of those in their charge. Equally important, we must always be honest with everyone, including ourselves, especially if a mistake has been made. I therefore urged Mr Low to conduct a full investigation and clean up his Town Council.

To my surprise, at this point Mr Low, Ms Lim and Mr Singh all chose to remain silent, and raised no further questions or objections, and so the debate in Parliament ended.

Vivian still doesn't know the difference between Spring cleaning and Annual Cleaning. When the discussions were all on spring cleaning, Tai was correct to state that any additional requirement to clean the ceiling during a spring cleaning should be a matter that the hawkers sort out with NEA as that is a NEW requirement. Tai was also correct to state that if ceiling cleaning was required during a spring cleaning, then there would be additional charges.


Vivian did not address why NEA was involved in arranging the scaffolding. If the scaffolding was to cover the stalls as claimed by Vivian, this is a most unusual contract. The hawkers hire the contractor to cover their stalls ...not to put up scaffolding to cover the stalls. The contractor could just use ladders for the task. Why is there a need for scaffolding? Are the hawkers that stupid to dictate to the contractor that the covering has to be done using scaffolding?

The quotation from ATL was for the PAP lackey. Has the PAP lackey deny asking for the quotation? Vivian has spoken on his behalf in the dossier. This will be interesting if a lawsuit takes place. Will the PAP lackey lie in court?

From the dossiers, one can conclude that the NEA screwed up and tries to pin the blame on the WP TC. NEA assumed that the spring cleaning would be annual cleaning when there was NO discussion prior. And the NEA communicated to the hawkers that it was an annual cleaning. When it turned out otherwise, the hawkers wanted blood and the NEA taichi the blame to WP TC.

SL and PS should sue Vivian.
 

kingrant

Alfrescian
Loyal
This is called 罪人先告状。


Vivian still doesn't know the difference between Spring cleaning and Annual Cleaning. When the discussions were all on spring cleaning, Tai was correct to state that any additional requirement to clean the ceiling during a spring cleaning should be a matter that the hawkers sort out with NEA as that is a NEW requirement. Tai was also correct to state that if ceiling cleaning was required during a spring cleaning, then there would be additional charges.


Vivian did not address why NEA was involved in arranging the scaffolding. If the scaffolding was to cover the stalls as claimed by Vivian, this is a most unusual contract. The hawkers hire the contractor to cover their stalls ...not to put up scaffolding to cover the stalls. The contractor could just use ladders for the task. Why is there a need for scaffolding? Are the hawkers that stupid to dictate to the contractor that the covering has to be done using scaffolding?

The quotation from ATL was for the PAP lackey. Has the PAP lackey deny asking for the quotation? Vivian has spoken on his behalf in the dossier. This will be interesting if a lawsuit takes place. Will the PAP lackey lie in court?

From the dossiers, one can conclude that the NEA screwed up and tries to pin the blame on the WP TC. NEA assumed that the spring cleaning would be annual cleaning when there was NO discussion prior. And the NEA communicated to the hawkers that it was an annual cleaning. When it turned out otherwise, the hawkers wanted blood and the NEA taichi the blame to WP TC.

SL and PS should sue Vivian.
 

kingrant

Alfrescian
Loyal
The s.o.b is bitching like a bitch on heat for a good fight, but Ah Low frustrated him. So the bitch ended up wanking in his FB.

Noticed his choice of words - demanded... All that WP said was to advise the hawkers that there will be charges..LOL!

Demand is a typical PAP word.
 
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I_hv_adream

Alfrescian
Loyal
Whatever dam cock things about Vivian, this time round he is dam good lor.

Even yahoo news (well know for attacking PAP) wrotes good thing about PAP.

http://sg.news.yahoo.com/blogs/singaporescene/commentary-happened-workers-party-fire-025829579.html

COMMENT: PAP deals body blow to Workers' Party

Satish Cheney is a freelance news correspondent and TV producer for overseas and local news agencies.

The views expressed below are his own.

The Workers’ Party (WP) may have delivered a ‘Punggol punch’ to the ruling People’s Action Party (PAP) earlier this year at the Punggol East by-election, but in Parliament on Tuesday, Singapore’s most successful opposition party received a hammering from the PAP’s Vivian Balakrishnan.

Like a children's tiff in the playground, this has been going on for so long that people have become tired of the banality of it all. The issue at hand: the cleaning or rather the lack of cleaning of certain hawker centres in Aljunied-Hougang-Punggol East Town Council (AHPETC) which is overseen by the Workers’ Party.

But the issue sparked one highly interesting episode of Parliament highlights on TV last night. For the full video of the debate, watch the video (the fun starts around the 24 minute mark). Parliament hadn’t been this exciting since Balakrishnan’s exchange with fellow PAP lawmaker Lily Neo over welfare benefits many years ago.

Some government critics have been pointing out that the PAP itself has not been perfect and have been referring to this latest salvo by the PAP as a case of the pot calling the kettle black.

But that is neither the point nor the topic of this commentary. Neither is the point to show who is lying or saying the truth.

The point is how ill-prepared the WP seemed to be on the topic of Tai Vie Shun, property manager of AHPETC, who allegedly asked hawkers for extra money for cleaning the high areas of the hawker centres.

Balakrishnan’s salvo against the WP could have backfired like an embarrassing own-goal, but the gamble paid off. The WP seemed totally taken by surprise by that ‘Matlock’ moment when the minister distributed a dossier containing evidence contradicting Lim, who had said the manager of AHPETC had not asked hawkers for extra money to be paid to the town council for cleaning of the high-areas.

Referring to his evidence, the minister pointed out a quotation from the AHPETC’s contractor, ATL Maintenance Pte Ltd.

“The first irregular event is ATL’s quotation delivered by hand on the 19th of February 2013… the hawkers have never asked for a quotation. Mr Low (WP’s chief, Low Thia Kiang) has met with the hawkers. They have told him the same thing. Secondly ATL is your own private contractor. When your own contractor issues a quotation for $7,200 to the hawkers asking for payment for work which you say is already covered by your contract – that amounts to a demand for double payment for the same quantity of work.,” Balakrishnan said, adding that he also had witnesses from meetings who could verify events.

Lim brought up the difference between annual cleaning of the high areas and quarterly spring cleaning and said that the quotation from ATL was addressed to the market association.

“This quotation was requested by the market association and does not coincide with their annual obligation to clean the high areas under the town council contract. Does the minister not agree that in this quotation, nowhere is the town council implicated?” she asked.

Balakrisnan replied: “This is really painful. Let’s not beat around the bush arguing about annual and quarterly spring cleaning.”

Making very serious claims, Balakrishnan pretty much referred to WP’s Sylvia Lim and Pritam Singh as liars.

Surely that should have vexed Pritam Singh, a lawyer by profession, to get up and defend himself and the party, but he didn’t. Perhaps, there was no opportunity to do so. But still, you can imagine questions may arise on his silence.

Lim, on the other hand, maintained that the evidence did not show that the town council had asked the hawkers to pay extra to clean the high areas.

Low might have done himself disservice by saying he had not yet spoken to Tai Vie Shun, the property manager of AHPETC.

Referring to the whole saga as a misunderstanding, Low said the ATL quotation “is a puzzle…I’m trying to find out who actually asked them to quote." But he reiterated that the town council did not ask for the quotation.

Perhaps what was not said screamed louder in Parliament – body language. While this is highly subjective, Balakrishnan seemed much more confident in his tone and the way he carried himself. Low and Lim failed to showcase their usual punchy rhetoric in their replies. Cameras showed Low looking not so comfortable at certain points when Balakrishnan was speaking. Neither were his arguments very strong in defending his party.

Perhaps the party has a different strategy. Low is well-known for being an astute and savvy politician and is highly regarded in Singapore. But right now, this doesn’t bode well for his party. Having made major strides in the political arena in recent times, the WP possibly has the best potential of being an opposition check on the ruling party in Parliament. But the recent incident in parliament may affect moderate voters who might be sitting on the fence when 2016 comes.

Low has to ensure his party addresses this problem quickly and in a strong manner or the party risks being stamped with a dirty stain which no doubt political challengers will try to use against it.

Politics is never a clean game, but it is how one handles the dirt that is important in this age.
 

Sideswipe

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Asset
But the recent incident in parliament may affect moderate voters who might be sitting on the fence when 2016 comes.


do people really care about this hawker centers cleaning issue which affect who, the hawkers only ? i don't even bother to read let alone understand it. little votes to be won or lost here.
 

laksaboy

Alfrescian (Inf)
Asset
But the recent incident in parliament may affect moderate voters who might be sitting on the fence when 2016 comes.


do people really care about this hawker centers cleaning issue which affect who, the hawkers only ? i don't even bother to read let alone understand it. little votes to be won or lost here.

You may not care about the hawker centre, but you should care about Vivian's thuggery.

If the moderate voters gave him the benefit of the doubt despite his YOG cockup, they may not do it this time.
 

bryanlim1972

Alfrescian
Loyal
The s.o.b is bitching like a bitch on heat for a good fight, but Ah Low frustrated him. So the bitch ended up wanking in his FB.

Noticed his choice of words - demanded... All that WP said was to advise the hawkers that there will be charges..LOL!

Demand is a typical PAP word.

vivian accusing LTK of lack of control in the party... well its more like LHL lack of control over his minions. vivian couldnt shut up at the loss of face and blew the matter up out of proportion.

interesting that vivian and yacoob, the 2 oft ministers cited online for incompetency, are making the most noise of late. khaw seems more steady in taking the barrage of online abuse.
 

I_hv_adream

Alfrescian
Loyal
But the recent incident in parliament may affect moderate voters who might be sitting on the fence when 2016 comes.


do people really care about this hawker centers cleaning issue which affect who, the hawkers only ? i don't even bother to read let alone understand it. little votes to be won or lost here.

...but Aljunied is new to WP so people there might vote against them on the next GE.
 

hurley

Alfrescian
Loyal
it is politics 101. vivian kena for dengue, haze and flood. now hawker center also kena.

yaccob is damned lucky
 

presssomemore

Alfrescian
Loyal
I don't understand....

If Mr Tai Vie Shun had demand extra money from hawkers for cleaning the high areas of hawker centres on three occasions, in meetings where NEA representatives were also present, why didn't NEA tell him there and then that it's an annual cleaning and the TC is responsible for the cost?

3 meetings held and they still have to email here & there after the meetings to find out when are the dates and who is responsible for what.
 
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Satyr

Alfrescian
Loyal

Sorry VB. Your issue is integrity. The real issue for everyone is credibility. Taking the side of hardworking hawkers won't score brownie points with anyone else. Everybody pretty much has to work hard here. For leaders, the people want to know who has our interests at heart. Correctly or not, for the moment, the WP is given the benefit of the doubt.
 

Dark Knight

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Asset
VB think he is GOD send to press for a Yes/No answer. He point his finger to the sky while talking about clean politics.
He is now above everyone and everything else.
 

jw5

Moderator
Moderator
Loyal
VB think he is GOD send to press for a Yes/No answer. He point his finger to the sky while talking about clean politics.
He is now above everyone and everything else.

He was not pointing to the sky, he was pointing to the ceiling in order to make the silly point that "it is not about cleanliness of the ceiling". :rolleyes::biggrin:
 

Dark Knight

Alfrescian (Inf)
Asset
He was not pointing to the sky, he was pointing to the ceiling in order to make the silly point that "it is not about cleanliness of the ceiling". :rolleyes::biggrin:

He doesn't see the ceiling but the sky over his head. That's why he keep asking the same question 3 times and don't take "No" for an answer. :biggrin:
 

Confuseous

Alfrescian (Inf)
Asset
vivian accusing LTK of lack of control in the party... well its more like LHL lack of control over his minions. vivian couldnt shut up at the loss of face and blew the matter up out of proportion.

interesting that vivian and yacoob, the 2 oft ministers cited online for incompetency, are making the most noise of late. khaw seems more steady in taking the barrage of online abuse.

$8 Cow has learnt his lessons a little bit. But his day will come.

Not sure if the word "abuse" here is appropriate - if it is, then, it is in retaliation to the abuse we have been subjected to, by these clown ministers all these years.
 

Dark Knight

Alfrescian (Inf)
Asset
$8 Cow has learnt his lessons a little bit. But his day will come.

Not sure if the word "abuse" here is appropriate - if it is, then, it is in retaliation to the abuse we have been subjected to, by these clown ministers all these years.

That "$8 cow be cow bu" fellow may have learnt his lesson and play dumb.
But that "cleaner politics" fellow will not be numb about this minor issue yet.
 
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