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Vincent Cheng: ISA victims must speak out

Actually it was the PAP that conditioned them to think that without the PAP the country and Singaporeans would fail. Where do you think the term the "Nanny State" came from. Just take one example - a Singaporean who had money could not send his child to an International school. You are ever wondered why.

85% of housing is public. Its became a political strategy that worked for the PAP. Now that the PAP is struggling to make ends meet, they now blame Singaporeans for not looking after themselves.

Take the YOG. So many mistakes and many are simple matters. Don't you think that standards have dropped. Maybe we should accelerate the recruitment of foreigners to run the country. There are already a few and they tend to be cheaper as well.

ps. could you lose the "bold" in your post. It does not make it any more important or raise the substance level. You highlight certain things and not the whole text.

If i were to un-bold certain words, would they stand out from all the bolded words? Some forummers like to use larger red fonts and i get harassed for bolded fonts.

Your actions are in itself an example of conditioning. By constantly choosing to highlight how using bold does not make my points more important or raise its substance level, you are alluding (very transparently) that they are of little substance and importance.

As for your retorts, they are seem like a mishmash of random ideas. And factually inaccurate.
 
Are you aware that some of those detained were elections agents for the Workers Party during the 1984 elections. I am sure that if there no link to WP, Operations Spectrum would not have happened. After the Anson By Election defeat, the PAP thought they could fix it but were surprised that WP/JBJ retained the seat. Old man started imagining things.

What is also interesting is that JBJ pretty much kept quiet over the detention and I won't be surprised if he thought that they were indeed communist and attempted to control the party like they did during Marshall's second attempt.

Here is the funny bit.

The 22 persons arrested under Operations Spectrum are not even considered political activist. After their release, they attempted to join the Ex-Political Detainees Association which used to be housed in a bungalow at the start of Mountbatten road. They were rejected. This is the same association that catered for the Ops Coldstore and subsequent detainees.

The person whose blood they were after was not Vincent Cheng but Teo Soh Lung. Teo was part of the infamous Law society committee led by Francis that took on the old man over the nationalisation of the press which became the Toa Payoh Brothel. They built their case around Vincent.



I knew bits and pieces but thanks for the whole picture put together.

Things have changed since. In the 90s, I would never have expected that a former 1987 detainee would speak out in public donning the t-shirt of Singapore's most confrontational opposition party, or a group of them releasing a book that sells in Singapore. Old man is caught in this internet world.
 
In short, they were arrested because they said this to the old man?

r
 
Are you aware that some of those detained were elections agents for the Workers Party during the 1984 elections. I am sure that if there no link to WP, Operations Spectrum would not have happened. After the Anson By Election defeat, the PAP thought they could fix it but were surprised that WP/JBJ retained the seat. Old man started imagining things.

What is also interesting is that JBJ pretty much kept quiet over the detention and I won't be surprised if he thought that they were indeed communist and attempted to control the party like they did during Marshall's second attempt.

Here is the funny bit.

The 22 persons arrested under Operations Spectrum are not even considered political activist. After their release, they attempted to join the Ex-Political Detainees Association which used to be housed in a bungalow at the start of Mountbatten road. They were rejected. This is the same association that catered for the Ops Coldstore and subsequent detainees.

The person whose blood they were after was not Vincent Cheng but Teo Soh Lung. Teo was part of the infamous Law society committee led by Francis that took on the old man over the nationalisation of the press which became the Toa Payoh Brothel. They built their case around Vincent.

And Chee Soon Juan is dying to become an ISA martyr. But the PAP will not give him that pleasure. :)
 
I suppose they too have a complex. Well I suppose you can't make an ass drink from a water trough. Though I will give it a go.

If i were to un-bold certain words, would they stand out from all the bolded words? Some forummers like to use larger red fonts and i get harassed for bolded fonts.

Your actions are in itself an example of conditioning. By constantly choosing to highlight how using bold does not make my points more important or raise its substance level, you are alluding (very transparently) that they are of little substance and importance.

As for your retorts, they are seem like a mishmash of random ideas. And factually inaccurate.
 
The person whose blood they were after was not Vincent Cheng but Teo Soh Lung. Teo was part of the infamous Law society committee led by Francis that took on the old man over the nationalisation of the press which became the Toa Payoh Brothel. They built their case around Vincent.

The three lawyers, Francis Seow, Teo Soh Lung and Tang Fong Har were whacked worst. Of course LKY wouldn't allow male officers to whack women detainees, but there's always martially trained women police. :eek:
 
The authorities will release statements to justify their actions, likewise Vincent will release his version to justify what the authorities did was wrong.

Thats why I said we must be objective.

Do you seriously think educating workers on their rights (just this alone) will carry a serious crime of marxist conspiracy?

educating workers on their rights is just a small part of the equation. The truth is that PAP saw it as anti-PAP and had to nip the problem at the bud. There were many other anti-PAP policies espoused by Vincent and company. LKY was paranoid then that a church-based coup was in the making (like what happend in Phillipines). That was paranoia was totally unfounded as (1) Vincent & co. was more interested in fighting for the rights/injustices of certain groups rather than fighting the govt as a whole (2) Sg is by no means a catholic country as compared with Phillipines.
 
educating workers on their rights is just a small part of the equation. The truth is that PAP saw it as anti-PAP and had to nip the problem at the bud. There were many other anti-PAP policies espoused by Vincent and company. LKY was paranoid then that a church-based coup was in the making (like what happend in Phillipines). That was paranoia was totally unfounded as (1) Vincent & co. was more interested in fighting for the rights/injustices of certain groups rather than fighting the govt as a whole (2) Sg is by no means a catholic country as compared with Phillipines.

LKY might have the mentality then, 宁可杀错,也不可放过. (To english bros,sis, it means he rather kill wrongly than to let them off)

Like you said, educating workers on their rights is just a small part. This is not a threat to them, its doing beyond that makes the PAP paranoid. It's what makes PAP famous. ACTION.

They forsee/presume the situation, take action and not wait for it to happen if it ever happens. Others would wait for things to happen and then take action.
 
LKY might have the mentality then, 宁可杀错,也不可放过. (To english bros,sis, it means he rather kill wrongly than to let them off).

I think more accurately is the 曹操 quote,宁可我负天下人,不可天下人负我。
 
Instead, many Singaporeans are becoming victims of their own shortcomings. The inability to succeed in this society then leads them to believe that every woe and misfortune in their lives originates from the PAP.

In the above scenario, we start to romanticize any opponents of the PAP. Francis Seow, Vincent Cheng, MSK, Chee Soon Juan...etc suddenly become heroes of epic proportions who are disproportionately grade in simple small minds.

Instead, many Singaporeans are becoming victims of their own shortcomings. The inability to succeed in this society then leads them to believe that every woe and misfortune in their lives originates from the PAP.

In the above scenario, we start to romanticize any opponents of the PAP. Francis Seow, Vincent Cheng, MSK, Chee Soon Juan...etc suddenly become heroes of epic proportions who are disproportionately grade in simple small minds.

Typical belief and attitude of an arrogant elitist bully, always degrading fellow citizens who has a mind of their own and who do not subscribe to your perspective. By surpressing differing opinions and ideas, how will a country grow and mature?

I do not support any alternative parties in particular. But I know we need a balance of power in the poilitical arena, as well as improve the independence of the civil services whose duty is to serve the people and not political parties.

And each and every singaporean owe it to themselves to help manage such a political balance through the power of the voting slip in their hands.

When I cast my vote, I know I am not voting for heroes, but for improved and effective system of checks and balances, as well as accountablility in the system which can only happen when there is a balance of political forces.

Yeah, and dont tell me it slows decision making with too many political parties involved in the process, nor the quality of candidates in alternative parties.

Currently, I will vote for any fathers' or mothers' son or daughters that has the gumption and dare to ask questions. And I do not care for their personal agenda, so long they did their best to get their job done for the people as promised.

Given the current circumstances they may not succeed initially, but along they put in their heart and soul into their task.

When I was a very young child, i watched parliment in session for amusement, I saw JBJ and Chiam getting ridiculed by majority of MPs smirking at them...... I felt a sense of distaste for such bully behaviour, eventhough I dont care for politics. But even as a child then, I know one should show respect for each other in public office, respect the person for his or her efforts in service of the people, however right or wrong their opinion presented. Their uncouth behaviour left a deep impression on me and i asked myself what cause the majority of members to be so arrogant?

As I entered the workforce and travelled, I learned more. How do singaporeans expect these two men from alternative parties to perform without flaw, relative to the majority of MPs who has a big machinery behind them and at their becking and calling? In rectrospect, these two MPs from the alternative parties did well given their resource limitations.

Lunch time...:)
 
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Instead, many Singaporeans are becoming victims of their own shortcomings. The inability to succeed in this society then leads them to believe that every woe and misfortune in their lives originates from the PAP.

In the above scenario, we start to romanticize any opponents of the PAP. Francis Seow, Vincent Cheng, MSK, Chee Soon Juan...etc suddenly become heroes of epic proportions who are disproportionately grade in simple small minds.

Every society, economy, village, kampung needs people with different skills. It is part of society since the beginning of mankind. For you to insinuate that all within a society must be successful and those who are not are to blame themselves goes to show your lack of understanding of societies and their underpinnings.

You pathetic fascist fool!
 
You communist imbecile.

Haha! You traitorous fool! Your masters are the ones in love with communists. Can't you tell by the huundreds of thousands that they have let in? Can't you tell by the hundreds of millions spent on scholarships for 2nd and 3rd rate PRC students to study here? I'm sure your children would have lost the opportunity to get into med school here if not for these PRCs. But then again, you're a pathetic loser in life and I am certain that your children have lost nothing even if those lost places at the local med school didn't pay such huge sums to the PRC students.

Remember, 2-3 years from now and you will lose almost everything you now have.
 
I do not support any alternative parties in particular. But I know we need a balance of power in the poilitical arena, as well as improve the independence of the civil services whose duty is to serve the people and not political parties.

And each and every singaporean owe it to themselves to help manage such a political balance through the power of the voting slip in their hands.

When I cast my vote, I know I am not voting for heroes, but for improved and effective system of checks and balances, as well as accountablility in the system which can only happen when there is a balance of political forces.

Yeah, and dont tell me it slows decision making with too many political parties involved in the process, nor the quality of candidates in alternative parties.
Very sensible comments. Just upped your points.
A good reaction and summary following the useful information provided by metaslug and scroobal and the discussion among others.
This is exactly what we need to do to make Singapore a better place for everyone.
 
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