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Speak Dialects, you feel tribal ! Speak mandarin, it will break unity!

OldPlaza

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PS In Singapore you can converse in Mandarin and various Chinese dialects openly, but in Hong Kong you hardly hear anyone uttering Hokkien or Teochew, possibly for fear of brutal discrimination and being cast out from the mould. This is how blatantly racist you Cantonese people are. Thank God LKY is not Cantonese that would have probably interfered with his objectivity, flexibility and foresight.

In Hong Kong, non-cantonese chineses are publicly and openly discriminated.

If anyone is so proud of their dialects, they should do more for their dialect pride.

Why stop at clinging to dialect, why not include dress, food, movies, books and etc. so that they can be distinctively seen to belong to certain dialect group.

Best if they can AVOID hanging out with people who do not speak their dialect too. That way, they will not be polluted by other language... especially English. it is NOT even an Asian language to start with.
 
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lancheowman

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HAHA!!! GO SCROLL UP. THE VERY FIRsT POST IS BASHING MANDARIN. GET THAT RIGHT BEFORE WE TALK.

hahahaha this is what the first post says:

<Speak Dialects, you feel tribal ! Speak mandarin, it will break unity!

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Speaking dialects in Singapore will bond local people together, in addition, you feel tribal among the local tribe.

Keep your dialects, teach your children and learn mandarin only when necessary.
Dont be conned to speaking Mandarin, it will break up local unity.

Please speak dialects at home, you child will learn more about his or her roots as local singaporeans.>.


how can 0ne bash mandarin by telling people to learn it. you want to enlighten us?
 

char_jig_kar

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ok uncle give you permission to escape or run away but make sure your tail is between your legs when you go ....since you cannot justify why i am a cantonese supremacist but not a hokkien-cum-cantonese-cum-shanghainese dialect supremacist

LOL... YoU WANNA GO, JUST GO.

U CANT EVEN MAKE OUT THE FIRST MESSAGE AND U PRETEND TO KNOW IT ALL. GO. GO LIM YOUR BEER OR KOPI OR SOMETHING.
 

char_jig_kar

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Loyal
hahahaha this is what the first post says:

<speak dialects,="" you="" feel="" tribal="" !="" speak="" mandarin,="" it="" will="" break="" unity!="">

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Speaking dialects in Singapore will bond local people together, in addition, you feel tribal among the local tribe.

Keep your dialects, teach your children and learn mandarin only when necessary.
Dont be conned to speaking Mandarin, it will break up local unity.

Please speak dialects at home, you child will learn more about his or her roots as local singaporeans.>.


how can 0ne bash mandarin by telling people to learn it. you want to enlighten us?

Harlo??? u need me to highlight it for u? okay.

third line, '</speak>Dont be conned to speaking Mandarin, it will break up local unity.'
 

lancheowman

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Harlo??? u need me to highlight it for u? okay.

third line, '</speak>Dont be conned to speaking Mandarin, it will break up local unity.'

dun need to magnify we can all read but dun cut and paste and remove the words immediately preceding this. that is what demagogues do, they take a small part of a speech and twist it for their purposes. they will never dare to read something as a whole:

<<
Keep your dialects, teach your children and learn mandarin only when necessary.

Dont be conned to speaking Mandarin, it will break up local unity. >>

when you read these sentences as a whole, any reasonable person will not be able to conclude that the writer is bashing mandarin despite of what he said in the second sentence because this inegated by the first sentence where he says "learn mandarin only when necessary".the most you can sya is that the writer thinks it is a necessary evil but no bashing...

if you try to smart and hope to stir up hatred and shit , you will pretend that the first part does not exist and read only the second.....tio bo?
 

char_jig_kar

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Loyal
dun need to magnify we can all read but dun cut and paste and remove the words immediately preceding this. that is what demagogues do, they take a small part of a speech and twist it for their purposes. they will never dare to read something as a whole:

<<keep dialects,="" teach="" your="" children="" and="" learn="" mandarin="" only="" when="" necessary.="">

Dont be conned to speaking Mandarin, it will break up local unity. >>

when you read these sentences as a whole, any reasonable person will not be able to conclude that the writer is bashing mandarin despite of what he said in the second sentence because this inegated by the first sentence where he says "learn mandarin only when necessary".the most you can sya is that the writer thinks it is a necessary evil but no bashing...

if you try to smart and hope to stir up hatred and shit , you will pretend that the first part does not exist and read only the second.....tio bo?

hey asshole. u go reread the whole message. if u still don't get it, that there's mandarin bashing in it, u need to take comprehension lesson.

</keep>
 

OldPlaza

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He had escaped China during the Cultural Revolution and had had very little formal education. I was asked along because I spoke Cantonese quite well and was expected to interpret.

Business discussions spilled over into dinner and my wife (also Cantonese) joined us.

What kind of business that you could bring your wife along??

Though lighter, the talks were still serious and I was still their interpreter. Later in the hotel room, my wife was close to tears. She said although she knew Cantonese was as important a language as any, that was the first time she heard it used to signify such deep business discussions.

If you go to China, Taiwan, Indonesia, Malaysia.. you will probably end up speaking Mandarin if you do not speak the host's dialects. even In HK, I was pleasantly surprised that some are not shy to speak to me in Mandarin.

Another time, my uncle (a Malaysian) had stayed over at my place and he and I chatted after dinner. Though not highly educated, he was quite politicised and had definite views about Malaysian politics. We also chatted about his experiences during the war and then the emergency and race riots. Again my wife was jolted by hearing Cantonese used to discuss politics, history and society.

I am 100% sure that you can use malay, mandarin, teochew, hokkian, hainan, tamil (and almost any languages)to discuss politics, history and society.


Incidentally, my uncle's one wish was to see BN get kicked out of Penang before he died. He got his wish but died a few months later, aged 93.

In Penang, most local chineses speak hokkian. (even for those non-hokkian chinese)

What LKY has done was to strip away our respect for our roots and to accept his version of reality. This must have been his intent because he could just as easily have pushed for Mandarin without denigrating the other languages. But there are more things in heaven and earth than is dreamt of in his tiny bigoted mind.[/QUOTE]

This is the problem for malaysian chineses, every states, districts, kampungs speak different dialects. Ultimately, only mandarin can help facilitate the communications among them, if english is not the viable choice.
 

lancheowman

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hey asshole. u go reread the whole message. if u still don't get it, that there's mandarin bashing in it, u need to take comprehension lesson.

</keep>

u are truly a dishonest and shameless twat , you even remove the first sentence from my post in your quote

here is what the thread starter said in totality .... nobody will consdier this mandarin bashing .... those who try to be funny will delete the 1st sentence and read only the second.... haizzzzzz

<<
Keep your dialects, teach your children and learn mandarin only when necessary.

Dont be conned to speaking Mandarin, it will break up local unity. >>
 

char_jig_kar

Alfrescian
Loyal
u are truly a dishonest and shameless twat , you even remove the first sentence from my post in your quote

here is what the thread starter said in totality .... nobody will consdier this mandarin bashing .... those who try to be funny will delete the 1st sentence and read only the second.... haizzzzzz

<<
Keep your dialects, teach your children and learn mandarin only when necessary.

Dont be conned to speaking Mandarin, it will break up local unity. >>

u stupid or what? the first post is still here. i cant delete that away. could just go to the first post and refer to it.
 

lancheowman

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Loyal
u stupid or what? the first post is still here. i cant delete that away. u could go check it.

dun act blur la loser....not everyone will bother to scroll down to the first post la..we all know that ....so you think you jsut delete the first part , nobody will see. issit....pathetic scum.

i am still waiting for your explanation as to why i am not called a cantonese-hokkien-shanghainese supremacist but only a cantonese supremacists, Mr
Dishonesty?
 

char_jig_kar

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Loyal
dun act blur la loser....not everyone will bother to scroll down to the first post la..we all know that ....so you think you jsut delete the first part , nobody will see. issit....pathetic scum.

i am still waiting for your explanation as to why i am not called a cantonese-hokkien-shanghainese supremacist but only a cantonese supremacists, Mr
Dishonesty?

you had quote it. i might accidentally deleted it. u think i scared? siao. u want it to be shown again in my post? fucking moronic really. nah. here.

"Speaking dialects in Singapore will bond local people together, in addition, you feel tribal among the local tribe.

Keep your dialects, teach your children and learn mandarin only when necessary.

Dont be conned to speaking Mandarin, it will break up local unity.

Please speak dialects at home, you child will learn more about his or her roots as local singaporeans.
"

like i said, if u cant understand the first message, u need to take comprehension class. or u are one fucking dishonest piece of shit. if u dont understand the message, i don't see why i should deal with u further.
 

lancheowman

Alfrescian
Loyal
you had quote it. i might accidentally deleted it. u think i scared? siao. u want it to be shown again in my post? fucking moronic really. nah. here.

"Speaking dialects in Singapore will bond local people together, in addition, you feel tribal among the local tribe.

Keep your dialects, teach your children and learn mandarin only when necessary.
Dont be conned to speaking Mandarin, it will break up local unity.

Please speak dialects at home, you child will learn more about his or her roots as local singaporeans.
"

like i said, if u cant understand the first message, u need to take comprehension class. or u are one fucking dishonest piece of shit. if u cant make out the first message, what it means, i don't see i should entertain u further.

comprehension is my forte ...thats why you are getting the bashing here and not mandarin.... you want to act blur act seow ...what can i do? everything you oso cannot answer ....the cantonese supremacist oso accidentally say one...it is an honest mistake hor..... how to teach you leh
 

char_jig_kar

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Loyal
comprehension is my forte ...thats why you are getting the bashing here and not mandarin.... you want to act blur act seow ...what can i do? everything you oso cannot answer ....the cantonese supremacist oso accidentally say one...it is an honest mistake hor..... how to teach you leh

please. first u need to learn to be honest. before u go teach others.
 

lancheowman

Alfrescian
Loyal
please. first u need to learn to be honest. before u go teach others.

you can start by telling me:

why i am a cantonese supremacists and not a hokkien-cantonese-shanghainese supremacist?

and why when i ask you to learn a language it is considered bashing?

dun try to hide behind insults and f words ...u not sian meh
 

char_jig_kar

Alfrescian
Loyal
you can start by telling me:

why i am a cantonese supremacists and not a hokkien-cantonese-shanghainese supremacist?

and why when i ask you to learn a language it is considered bashing?

dun try to hide behind insults and f words ...u not sian meh

please refer to my previous message. i had stated, if u cant understand the very first message of this thread, i don't see any point in this conversation.

until u admit, that u are being dishonest, or having difficulty in comprehension, then i go think about whether to carry on talking to a piece of shit like u.
 

lancheowman

Alfrescian
Loyal
please refer to my previous message. i had stated, if u cant understand the very first message of this thread, i don't see any point in this conversation.

until u admit, that u are being dishonest, or having difficulty in comprehension, then i go think about whether to talk to piece of shit like u.

errr.....that has nothing to do with what i am asking you ... now we have reached the self-denial phase....poor noob
 

Jah_rastafar_I

Alfrescian (Inf)
Asset
PS In Singapore you can converse in Mandarin and various Chinese dialects openly, but in Hong Kong you hardly hear anyone uttering Hokkien or Teochew, possibly for fear of brutal discrimination and being cast out from the mould. This is how blatantly racist you Cantonese people are. Thank God LKY is not Cantonese that would have probably interfered with his objectivity, flexibility and foresight.

In Hong Kong, non-cantonese chineses are publicly and openly discriminated.

If anyone is so proud of their dialects, they should do more for their dialect pride.

Why stop at clinging to dialect, why not include dress, food, movies, books and etc. so that they can be distinctively seen to belong to certain dialect group.

Best if they can AVOID hanging out with people who do not speak their dialect too. That way, they will not be polluted by other language... especially English. it is NOT even an Asian language to start with.



Fucking hell this reminds me of an incident in zouk. When some hongkies spoke to me in canto. Of course i could not understand that shit. PLus this is sinkeeland not HK or guangzhou, plus usually when ang mohs want to make fun of chinese in the USA they always imitate the catonese way of speaking cos canto is the de facto dialect spoken there or whatever da fuck. :mad:

Of course they were pissed or the one speaking to me was pissed. He said tiu to me, but anyway the other hk guys told me in sinkeeland he would speak mandarin to anyone even if they spoke english to him. I was racially aware and i know in sinkeeland some ppl have that sort of mentality to bash chinese despite it being the majority race or to make fun of that shit. It's a double edged sword kind of thing cos i know there are Asshole chinamen and sinkees too.



ANyway i was glad i made fun of that canto hk guy. Hey cantonese is not the only language chinese speak. Imagine a european guy walking around speaking french for eg to every ang moh he sees. Or spanish for that matter. Other than english which is an international language and spanish to a lesser extent, ang mohs speak bulgarian, russian, portugese etc etc. Imagine telling a russian guy his russian language means nothing and try speaking to him in french for eg.
 

denzuko1

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I heard from someone that Hokkien has 8 tones and Cantonese has 9 tones (compared to Mandarin having 4 tones). I speak both Hokkien and Cantonese and I think it's probably true, though I cant explain the tones systematically as like codified in Hanyu Pinyin Mandarin. Hokkien and Cantonese speakers, if they think about it, will surely find some tones that are neither here nor there in the Hanyu Pinyu 4-tone system. However, it comes naturally to the natural speaker of the respective dialects. Just like Thai with 5 tones, no textbook can teach the tones accurately. Listening and speaking is the key. Audio CD can help but to a limit; listening and speaking is still the key. However, listening and speaking also involve imitating and adopting the accent of your learning environment. That's how accents and dialects evolve.


My mistake, I learned my cantonese from my parents and grand parents, they have never taught me the rules. I have just checked on http://www.Wikipedia.org and it stated that Cantonese has 8 tones.

Officially Standard Mandarin (Putonghua 普通话 or guoyu 国语) is the standard language of mainland China and Taiwan and is taught nearly universally as a supplement to local languages such as Cantonese in Guangdong. Cantonese and Standard Mandarin are the de facto official languages of Hong Kong and Macau, though legally the official language is "Chinese". Cantonese is also one of the main languages in many overseas Chinese communities including Australia, Southeast Asia, North America, and Europe. Many of these emigrants and/or their ancestors originated from Guangdong. In addition, these immigrant communities formed before the widespread use of Mandarin, or they are from Hong Kong where Mandarin is not commonly used. The prestige dialect of Cantonese is the Guangzhou dialect. In Hong Kong, colloquial Cantonese often incorporates English words due to historical British influences.

In some ways, Cantonese is a more conservative language than Mandarin, and in other ways it is not. For example, Cantonese has retained consonant endings from older varieties of Chinese that have been lost in Mandarin, but it has merged some vowels from older varieties of Chinese.

The Taishan dialect, which in the U.S. nowadays is heard mostly spoken by Chinese actors in old American TV shows and movies (e.g. Hop Sing on Bonanza), is more conservative than Cantonese. It has preserved the initial /n/ sound of words, whereas many post-World War II-born Hong Kong Cantonese speakers have changed this to an /l/ sound ("ngàuh lām" instead of "ngàuh nām" for "beef brisket" 牛腩) and more recently drop the "ng-" initial (so that it changes further to "àuh lām"); this seems to have arisen from some kind of street affectation as opposed to systematic phonological change. The common word for "who" in Taishan is "sŭe" (誰), which is the same character used in classical Chinese, whereas Cantonese has changed it to "bīngo" (邊個).

Cantonese sounds quite different from Mandarin, mainly because it has a different set of syllables. The rules for syllable formation are different; for example, there are syllables ending in non-nasal consonants (e.g. "lak"). It also has different tones and more of them than Mandarin. Cantonese is generally considered to have 8 tones, the choice depending on whether a traditional distinction between a high-level and a high-falling tone is observed; the two tones in question have largely merged into a single, high-level tone, especially in Hong Kong Cantonese, which has tended to simplify traditional Chinese tones.[citation needed] Many (especially older) descriptions of the Cantonese sound system record a higher number of tones, 9. However, the extra tones differ only in that they end in p, t, or k; otherwise they can be modeled identically.[10]

Cantonese preserves many syllable-final sounds that Mandarin has lost or merged. For example, the characters 裔, 屹, 藝, 憶, 譯, 懿, 誼, 肄, 翳, 邑, and 佚 are all pronounced "yì" in Mandarin, but they are all different in Cantonese (Cantonese jeoih, ngaht, ngaih, ngaaih, yìk, yihk, yi, yìh, yih, ai, yap, and yaht, respectively). It should be noted that 艾 in Mandarin is commonly pronounced as ài, and is almost always used in transliteration, family names, and nicknames, as it carries no meaning by itself. Like Hakka and Min Nan, Cantonese has preserved the final consonants [-m, -n, -ŋ -p, -t, -k] from Middle Chinese, while the Mandarin final consonants have been reduced to [-n, -ŋ]. But unlike any other modern Chinese dialects, the final consonants of Cantonese match those of Middle Chinese with very few exceptions. For example, lacking the syllable-final sound "m"; the final "m" and final "n" from older varieties of Chinese have merged into "n" in Mandarin, e.g. Cantonese "taahm" (譚) and "tàahn" (壇) versus Mandarin tán; "yìhm" (鹽) and "yìhn" (言) versus Mandarin yán; "tìm" (添) and "tìn" (天) versus Mandarin tiān; "hùhm" (含) and "hòhn" (寒) versus Mandarin hán. The examples are too numerous to list. Furthermore, nasals can be independent syllables in Cantonese words, e.g. Cantonese "ńgh" (五) "five," and "m̀h" (唔) "not".

Differences also arise from Mandarin's relatively recent sound changes. One change, for example, palatalized [kʲ] with [tsʲ] to [tɕ], and is reflected in historical Mandarin romanizations, such as Peking (Beijing), Kiangsi (Jiangxi), and Fukien (Fujian). This distinction is still preserved in Cantonese. For example, 晶, 精, 經 and 京 are all pronounced as "jīng" in Mandarin, but in Cantonese, the first pair is pronounced "jīng", and the second pair "gīng".

A more drastic example, displaying both the loss of coda plosives and the palatization of onset consonants, is the character (學), pronounced *ɣæwk in Middle Chinese. Its modern pronunciations in Cantonese, Hakka, Hokkien, Vietnamese, Korean, and Japanese are "hohk", "hók" (pinjim), "ha̍k" (Pe̍h-ōe-jī), học (although a Sino-Vietnamese word, it is used in daily vocabulary), "학" (hak) (Sino-Korean), and "gaku" (Sino-Japanese), respectively, while the pronunciation in Mandarin is xué [ɕyɛ].

However, the Mandarin vowel system is somewhat more conservative than that of Cantonese, in that many diphthongs preserved in Mandarin have merged or been lost in Cantonese. Also, Mandarin makes a three-way distinction among alveolar, alveopalatal, and retroflex fricatives, distinctions that are not made by modern Cantonese. For example, jiang (將) and zhang (張) are two distinct syllables in Mandarin or old Cantonese, but in modern Cantonese they have the same sound, "jeung1". The loss of distinction between the alveolar and the alveolopalatal sibilants in Cantonese occurred in the mid-19th centuries and was documented in many Cantonese dictionaries and pronunciation guides published prior to the 1950s. A Tonic Dictionary of the Chinese Language in the Canton Dialect by Williams (1856), writes: The initials "ch" and "ts" are constantly confounded, and some persons are absolutely unable to detect the difference, more frequently calling the words under "ts" as "ch", than contrariwise. A Pocket Dictionary of Cantonese by Cowles (1914) adds: "s" initial may be heard for "sh" initial and vice versa.

There are clear sound correspondences in the tones. For example, a fourth-tone (low falling tone) word in Cantonese is usually second tone (rising tone) in Mandarin.

This can be partly explained by their common descent from Middle Chinese (spoken), still with its different dialects. One way of counting tones gives Cantonese nine tones, Mandarin four, and Middle Chinese eight. Within this system, Mandarin merged the so-called "yin" and "yang" tones except for the Ping (平, flat) category, while Cantonese not only preserved these, but split one of them into two over time. Also, within this system, Cantonese is the only Chinese language known to have split its tones rather than merge them since the time of Late Middle Chinese.
 

denzuko1

Alfrescian
Loyal
lang jiao in YOUR ass understand? u bring this academic stuff in this thread for fuck?? telling people that cantonese is better than mandrain, give wat purpose?? FUCK YOU! CANTONESE SUPREMACIST? YEAH, GO HONG KONG AND DIY, PAH CHEW CHENG THERE LAH!

YOU DREAM OF CANTONESE TO BE OFFICIAL LANGUAGE HERE OR IN CHINA AH? KEEP ON DREAMING LAH!

Are you quoting the right fellow? "Lancheow" in "Lancheowman" is more lke Hokkien to me and his sentences are full of hokkien. How can he be Cantonese Supremcist when he is a Hokkien?
 
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