SDP and the coming GE - An interesting journey

[scroobal]

I don't think we ever had such an event anywhere in the world. A Party where all the main identities have literally disqualified themselves but are seeking to contest the GE. Their youth wing have been particularly active on the net, on the ground including door knocking.

The closest has been the wife taking over the husband's mantle when the latter is out for the count. It happened with the Rajiv Ghandi, Peron, and our neighbour's Anwar.

Without an identity or an iconic figure their chances are close to nil. Interestingly while the adults' associate friends have formed alternative parties to avoid getting dragged into bankruptcy and closure of the party, I wonder why the adults have not told this to the youth wing. If they don't have faith in the survival of their own party why let these poor kids waste their time.

Comments anyone?

 

[Perspective]

Have you heard the grapevine that an "iconic" figure is joining?

 

[scroobal]

I actually checked and over 7 months ago there were 3 names bandied around. I did this again after you revealed about this in a few weeks ago. All three are not voter winners in the political sense. There has only been one aggrieved icon in the past who did not dabble in politics but naturally moved into it and Francis Seow.

Notice that voters can tell the difference.

The penny dropped when I realised that TKL and VC had to front their Pre-Elections Rally. In the last elections Ms Chee was a viable candidate but the poor organisational and their tactical blunders ir - Uncle Yap and NKF fiasco put paid to her chances.

I just feel sorry for the youth wing.

Have you heard the grapevine that an "iconic" figure is joining?

 

[lockeliberal]

Dear Scroobal

Honestly I know of well educated liberals who in the last GE would rather spoil their vote than vote for the SDP such was their distaste for the party and the party brand name. This time round such is their disgust with the PAP many would vote for an onion if it stood against the PAP.

Every opposition parties has its flaws and its weaknesses. but what is annoying in that in an era of unprecedented PAP incompetence and mistakes gifted by yes the PAP, we have parties either unproven or unable to take advantage of the weaknesses. If the PAP survives the upcoming groundswell then it will be as much because of luck and the opposition getting it very very wrong at all counts.

1. SDP weaknesses are well known, though credit is to be given for their ability to evolve and move somewhat towards the basic strategy of walking the ground and knocking on doors. They have tried to remedy their organizational weaknesses during the last GE by exercises publicized through the new media and have demonstrated talent in both film making editing and professionalism and consistency in the delivery of their message. Fundamentally however to much belief in the new media and the young as the factors which will give them their breakthrough. To the extent that the PAP has made mistakes which we are sick of, it is still mistakes differing in nature from across the causeway, and treating them as the same only plays to the PAP ground. Another flaw which they share with the RP is the belief that they can FORM or be an alternative government in their style and manner of engagement despite all logic to the contrary.


2. RP, A New Hope a New dawn but a party of English educated liberals at its core. KJ may have a double first like the PM but he is neither the PM nor a PM in the making. Why why is he parroting the PAP line on qualifications when he should be underselling it instead ? Loads of great ideas, but really like the PAP in the fifties they need to bridge the gap with the masses.


3. CST and SPP. A party founded around Chiam which will die with Chiam. I doubt his wife has the ability to hold the fort together after he goes. The coup or attempted coup by his surbodinates over a merger with RP speaks volumes about the same succession issues in the party even after twenty years.

4. NSP, lots of promise and with its Sec GEN NS Captian Goh obviously taking many calculated risk, i,e riding the tiger in both confronting the PAP, mergers and alliances " leaving the DA and marrying the PKMS breakaway faction in order to seriously court the Malay vote. etc etc, but alas has yet to deliver.



5. WP, An inability to really challenge the PAP except on issues fundamental to the party, i.e Low, Hougang and Unfairness of upgrading. These are the big issues they will grapple head on with the PAP about. No strong belief in new media or , strong engagement, an ethos or a belief that they can or win a GRC by being low profile ,avoiding the media and knocking on doors and selling hammer till they win a GRC.
Other issues like transport or floods, or well YOG, question not the general incompetence but ask instead about the individual mistakes made. However both he and chiam have made a contribution to opposition politics, all politics being local they have proven they can RUN your estates fairly and decently.




Locke

 

[david]

SDP seems to attract young Singaporeans these days - well, from what I see from the video. Hope it is not just that handful from the video but a lot more young singaporeans have join the SDP.

 

[shunquan]

SDP seems to attract young Singaporeans these days - well, from what I see from the video. Hope it is not just that handful from the video but a lot more young singaporeans have join the SDP.

If there were more you think they won't sure? Their total membership probably not enough to fill the WP's CEC.

 

[Teo Kok Eng]

Their total membership probably not enough to fill the WP's CEC.

You said probably, I guess that you are unsure and do not have insider info.

One thing I know, their membership increase by 1 , the malay guy who was arrested for facebook YOG posting.

 

[Perspective]

I actually checked and over 7 months ago there were 3 names bandied around. I did this again after you revealed about this in a few weeks ago. All three are not voter winners in the political sense. There has only been one aggrieved icon in the past who did not dabble in politics but naturally moved into it and Francis Seow.

Notice that voters can tell the difference.

The penny dropped when I realised that TKL and VC had to front their Pre-Elections Rally. In the last elections Ms Chee was a viable candidate but the poor organisational and their tactical blunders ir - Uncle Yap and NKF fiasco put paid to her chances.

I just feel sorry for the youth wing.

I put inverted commas around the "iconic" because there is a difference between drawing opposition supporters and drawing votes. The person I heard doesn't draw votes but has the ability to draw a group from the opposition circles.

I feel there's no need to feel sorry for the youth wing. They are grownups with a mind of their own and will reap or pay the price of their choice. In reality, they feel a certain sense of "euphoria" being with SDP and its leaders.

 

[Perspective]

Their total membership probably not enough to fill the WP's CEC.

While I would vote WP over SDP in a 3 corner fight against PAP, I think that's kind of exaggerating.

 

[scroobal]

Good write-up bro.

Couple of things

Absolutely agree on the PAP - its competence, arrogance and its expected hit in the coming GE.

I was one of the first to be delighted that SDP is on the GE trail which should have been its trajectory from the start. Such a shame that they paid too dearly a price for their brand of supposed politics. Knowing their impotency, they should have come out with a strategy does not turn out to waste of time for their folks on the ground. They should throw their support behind one of the new parties created by their associates and still use the Chees and SDP brand to full hilt. I think you do realise that if they receive another round of low votes and end up at the bottom again, it would demoralising for their young recruits.

Agree on KJ, another arrogant chap.

I think that the NSP has to best strategy thus far. I like it and it certainly has an impact having earned a quick and nasty from the old man.

As to WP, I am just praying that they will pull a rabbit out of the hat. There is no doubt that Low will retain his seat and his numbers not because of his parliamentary performance but because of PAP's dismal performance. Sylvia is a bright hope but they are too quiet for their own good. Their media phobia is going to hurt them in the youth and middle aged category.

Chiam on the other had the time but failed to create something that would last. A disappointment.

This is one election that he PAP will be on the backfoot and its up to the opposition to carve out a piece for themselves.

Dear Scroobal

Honestly I know of well educated liberals who in the last GE would rather spoil their vote than vote for the SDP such was their distaste for the party and the party brand name. This time round such is their disgust with the PAP many would vote for an onion if it stood against the PAP.



Locke

 

[scroobal]

Looks like you sensed it as well.

I just feel sorry for these young guys.

I put inverted commas around the "iconic" because there is a difference between drawing opposition supporters and drawing votes. The person I heard doesn't draw votes but has the ability to draw a group from the opposition circles.

I feel there's no need to feel sorry for the youth wing. They are grownups with a mind of their own and will reap or pay the price of their choice. In reality, they feel a certain sense of "euphoria" being with SDP and its leaders.

 

[jw5]

Scroobal

May I ask you a few specific questions.

1. Wife taking over the husband's mantle? Are you referring to SDP/CSJ or SPP/CST?

2. Did you say in another thread that if CSJ were to concentrate on winning elections, he would be a political threat in a short time? Do you really think that will happen? I can't remember in what context, but I thought you made this comment. Please correct if I'm mistaken.

3. Now that TKL has spoken at SDP pre-rally, do you think he will stand for election as an opposition candidate and do you think he will win?
I have read your comments about him and his plans, but if he speaks at a SDP event, he won't be standing as a pap candidate for sure. If that's the case and he stands for mp election, wouldn't he definitely be going up against pap as an opposition candidate or independent, since pap will definitely contest all wards?

 

[Thick Face Black Heart]

SDP

SDP is probably the most perfect weapon to use against the PAP because a vote for SDP hurts the PAP emotionally much more than a vote for any other opposition. If you truly despise the PAP, strike them hard by voting SDP, even if you despise the SDP equally. They won't take it lightly and that's the emotional reaction you want to elicit at the ballot box.

SDP must have hit them at the right places at some point in time. This is not to say SDP has not made grave mistakes. It has. But it needs to move on. The SDP leadership has given a lot of ground to the youth wing in order for it to gain experience. Hope they can grow up fast.

NSP

Made tremendous progress. What it needs now are strong leaders apart from Meng Seng. The Malay Bureau is an excellent move; now it needs to convince people it is not a zero sum game. Still needs to do a huge amount of work to reach the branding of WP, but not impossible. There should be a couple more Meng Sengs in NSP to steer the party. Otherwise, "placebo" effect may kick in.

SDA/SPP

SPP is Chiam, and Chiam is the SPP, and the SDA is just an umbrella to house the SPP. The party is devoid of substance and leadership. It is helmed by a single man and will become irrelevant when that man goes. When SDA/SPP goes, there will be a void, which other oppo parties can take advantage of. I hope NSP can fill that void, but that's another story for another GE. Lets focus on this one first.

WP

Too quiet and non-combative. They are not able to attract talent rapidly enough nor retain existing talent. They have a brain drain problem. Only consolation is gerald giam. WP is too non-communicative with other parties and this will weaken their standing in the long run. With an aloof ruling party, we don't want an aloof opposition. However, the PAP seems to respect WP for being able to mobilize the ground and many PAP members fear WP because WP has played certain cards right. As such, a vote for WP will hurt the PAP tremendously too.

RP

Sole purpose of the party is to get an arrogant bastard into Parliament. While people feel sorry for SDP youth, in fact i feel sorry for RP youth.

To be serious, the whole reason for the special status of RP in cyberspace is because of the Jeyaretnam name. Imagine if it was anyone else helming RP in place of Kenneth, did exactly the same things, and was of the same level of competence minus the arrogance & haughtiness. It would just be another opposition party.

RP has problems connecting to the ground. They are fighting an internet battle but the internet is not as effective in Singapore as across the causeway. RP is not a threat to PAP because it is new and inexperienced.

 

[jw5]

Some general comments on SDP.

For me, the ultimate objective has always been what or who can help to make the lives of ordinary singaporeans better. Not so concerned about the nature of the political party or the individual politician. The pap would get my vote if they could achieve this ultimate objective. Unfortunately, I don't think they can or will, at least for now.

They don't operate like what a country should, but more like a multi national corporation listed on a stock exchange. Grow the company as fast as possible, get as much sales, profits and cash (not necessarily a bad thing if done with other things), get in more employees to help the growth, the cheaper the better, the existing employees had better buck up or risk being laid off or demoted. Reward the senior management with extensive pay packages, they will in turn reward some of their key managers, all employees are needed for the growth spurt, but all had better buck up and compete, be more productive, compete for space in the cafetaria, in the factory, in the pantry, in the office, compete for your pay, there's no free lunch, someone is gunning for your space and job. The impetus is no longer to achieve the ultimate objective.

The SDP under Chee probably started off with good intentions, to achieve the same ultimate objective. But they have gone off in a different tangent. CSJ and his sister are not necessarily bad individuals, probably no better or worse than most other political figures from pap and other parties. In fact, if comparing ideas and ability to articulate, they would probably rank higher than most pap or opposition politicians. Their priority now seems to be getting their party, their issues and the failings of the pap known worldwide, recruiting numbers including youths, making a stand against the supposed tyranny of the pap. Now slowly trying to get back on the election track perhaps, but is it too late?

In my opinion, although they have always meant well and I have respect for their courage, tenacity, intellect and good intentions for SG, I fear that it will be immensely difficult for the current leaders to go further in terms of being an election force. A huge revamp of the party's leadership could be needed, because the current image and reputation have been somewhat tarnished (some might say unfairly with justification) in the typical voter's eyes.

Hence, despite having respect for CSJ and his SDP, I don't think he and his party as it currently is, can help to make the lives of ordinary singaporeans better. Their efforts as civil activists will help to raise alertness to issues and abuses, but it is elected representives making the current government accountable, which will achieve the ultimate objective.

 

[Maximilian Chua-Heng]

To jw5 and all,

Correct me if I'm wrong, if one reads the manifesto of the SDP, getting elected into public office was never their primary objective.

To them, the election hustles are just a part of their bigger scheme of things.

 

[fivestars]

RP, A New Hope a New dawn but a party of English educated liberals at its core.

Ya PAP English Educated Voters That Chinese Speaking English, Malay Speaking English, Indian Speaking English, Eurasian and others races; total 55% of Singaporean vote RP

The Kampong Malay, The Chinese & Indian Kangkar workers and other supporters voted NSP and WP; total 45%.

 

[kingrant]

Scro,

Are you saying that VC could be that iconic figure? Methinks he can be an instant hit with the English-educated middle class. The Chinese educated heartlanders may be a diff bowl of fish, tho.

The penny dropped when I realised that TKL and VC had to front their Pre-Elections Rally.

Locke,

Indeed that's a chilling and sobering thought! With the old man partially incapacitated by his occupation with wife's condition, Opposition politics is at a crossroads. It is also a watershed of some kind (as Scro implied or words to same effect). What with all the monumental cockups of the PAP, if we don't make it a savaging at the hustings, we only have ourselves to blame.

Every opposition parties has its flaws and its weaknesses. but what is annoying in that in an era of unprecedented PAP incompetence and mistakes gifted by yes the PAP, we have parties either unproven or unable to take advantage of the weaknesses. If the PAP survives the upcoming groundswell then it will be as much because of luck and the opposition getting it very very wrong at all counts.

jw5,

Who else could Scro be referring to other than CST. The other pair are siblings, not man and wife.

On yr other pt, how can TKL ever stand as a PAP candidate again? He was an ex-PAP stalwart from way back then.

I thought there was some exchange about him trying for the President post? In a party, his ego may get in the way (from what I heard of him when he was in NTUC Income).

1. Wife taking over the husband's mantle? Are you referring to SDP/CSJ or SPP/CST?


3. Now that TKL has spoken at SDP pre-rally, do you think he will stand for election as an opposition candidate and do you think he will win?
I have read your comments about him and his plans, but if he speaks at a SDP event, he won't be standing as a pap candidate for sure. If that's the case and he stands for mp election, wouldn't he definitely be going up against pap as an opposition candidate or independent, since pap will definitely contest all wards?

 

[jw5]

jw5,

Who else could Scro be referring to other than CST. The other pair are siblings, not man and wife.

On yr other pt, how can TKL ever stand as a PAP candidate again? He was an ex-PAP stalwart from way back then.

I thought there was some exchange about him trying for the President post? In a party, his ego may get in the way (from what I heard of him when he was in NTUC Income).

Bro kingrant

What I didn't understand was that the thread is about SDP (presumably current SDP), yet reference was seemingly made to CST and wife. Wasn't thinking about CSC, don't forget CSJ has a wife who is quite active in some of the party's activities.

About TKL, scroobal has said that TKL will never stand against pap. Does this mean that he will either never be a candidate or be pap candidate, since pap will definitely contest every ward?

Remember the request for petition? I may vote for him, but I'll never sign any petition before any candidate decides whether to stand for election.

 

[kingrant]

Bro,

If TKL runs for the Prez, that still would fit in with what Scro said. I suspect TKL's closets are not empty of skeletal remains and that PAP cld have something on him. After all, even as large and thorny a persona as Devan nair can be anointed and dumped in the same breath.

Of course, we await Scro's elucidation with bated breath.

About TKL, scroobal has said that TKL will never stand against pap. Does this mean that he will either never be a candidate or be pap candidate, since pap will definitely contest every ward?

 

[jw5]

To jw5 and all,

Correct me if I'm wrong, if one reads the manifesto of the SDP, getting elected into public office was never their primary objective.

To them, the election hustles are just a part of their bigger scheme of things.

Max
Who gets elected is not my objective either.
But I think that certain parties and individuals getting elected is now imperative to achieve the objective.