Only 6,600 Out Of 30,000 Agents Applied For Licence

[jixiaolan]

1) If you guys got more brains, you should .....

I know who you are and where you came from. Anyway, I am just sharing what i know with fellow forummers here. There is no need for you to lecture anyone.

 

[silverfox@]

I am a ceha-certified realtor. Therefore, I have no doubt that there may be a conflict of interests when an agent collect a commission from both the seller and buyer. Absolutely no doubt abt it.

Scroobal's view is that a direct buyer should not be paying commission to a seller's agent but however for HDB, it is justifiable to charge a processing fee not amounting to 1%. However, the conflict of interests factor will still exist because a realtor commission is only chargeable upon successfully brokeraging a deal. Most if not all agents will be contended to work with a buyer as long as he is willing to pay the lowest acceptable price of the seller.

Many of the market practices have already long exist before I joined the real estate and will continue to exist after i choose to leave the scene. I will still emphasise on the agent's professionalism, integrity and skills because no matter how the law is changed, most agents guided by their veterans will still be able to go around and beat the rules.

Whenever an agent serve both the buyer and seller at the same time, the conflict of interests element may still exist whether or not the direct buyer is paying a commission or not. This is where busdriver111's point come in. Can an agent be representing both parties?

Given a choice, I would rather not serve direct buyers so that as a lister i can focus my effort on marketing the unit at the highest possible price that i could rather than wasting alot of time on explaining to prospective buyers abt hdb rules and regulations, procedure and doing the required paperwork.

There is no need to prove whether that I am in the wrong, i am just purely SHARING.

Lister is always King.

For HDB, i think they should review to only sellers paying commission and with this change 1st, the next thing that will happen is HDB sellers to pay between 2.5% to 3% commission.

Less conflicts of interests. Most of the time, complaints arise from buyers who ask why should I pay comm?

Once this commission fee is reviewed, HDB transaction price will go up slightly because sellers will want to offset agent comm fee in the selling price of their HDB flat. Then no buyer can complain why this agent want to take comm from them.

Agents should get comm fee on what they deserve, but the current commission fees on getting 2% from seller and 1% from buyer is making this system a whole conflict in itself, even if they deserve it from all the hard work they put in.


Seller: I pay you 2%, get me the best price

Buyer: I pay you 1%, you go reduce the price for me.

Agent: Help who? :(

 

[Ramseth]

That's why I say don't argue about legality, it's legal; don't argue about stupidity, it's human right to be stupid; don't argue about morality, it's up to the indivdual. BTW, please allow me to introduce to you, JXL is GMS' exclusive agent, residential and commercial.

 

[silverfox@]

This is not only unethical, it is a corruption! I will never accept such an offer because unlike a typical biz setting, i dun own a factory and i dun have inventory. The last 2 things i cannot afford not to have is integrity and credibility. That is why alot of my buyers eventually become my sellers. They came to view my listings, like the way i market the house. Hence, they appoint me to sell their properties.

This is business and this is how the world works.

Don't talk about you will never accept such an offer 1st.

In your industry, there are many of these agents who talk about integrity, credibility, reputation. I agree. But its all deal making.

If this agent earns $50K a year and someone offers him $50K to bring the price down, how many agents would refuse this commission. Go think about how many houses they need to sell.

When some agents refuse, it's not because they have integrity, its because the carrot is not big enough. Wake up and smell the roses.

 

[jixiaolan]

That is not true. Assuming you didn't want to read the papers and asked the agent to find a property for you, he would charge you a fee.

IMHO the buyer's agent's fees should not be 1% of the property price because the agent gets rewarded more for a higher price. Buyer and agent should agree on a reserve price and a small fixed commission for the trouble. The variable commission should instead be a percentage of the difference between the reserve price and the actual price. So the agent is incentivised correcly.

Unfortunately like most buyers, you dun quite understand why you are paying yr commission for. Surely you pay 1% is not for yr agent to read newspaper and help you make some phone calls to arrange for viewing appointment.

You should be paying for his market expertise, his negotiation power and the ability to provide you with sound judgment and professional advice to guide you on buying yr next dream home.

 

[silverfox@]

Unfortunately like most buyers, you dun quite understand why you are paying yr commission for. Surely you pay 1% is not for yr agent to read newspaper and help you make some phone calls to arrange for viewing appointment.

You should be paying for his market expertise, his negotiation power and the ability to provide you with sound judgment and professional advice to guide you on buying yr next dream home.

So what's the difference between a new agent and an experienced agent?
An experienced agent has experience, more knowledge of market, and can provide sound judgement right? What about a new agent, what can he provide?
If based on what you said, then new agents should never be given a chance to work.

I put it in very simple analogy. Whether its new or experienced agent, sellers only want 1 kind of agent. An agent who can get the best highest possible price for them.

Buyer only want 1 kind of agent. The agent who can get them their dream home at the lowest possible price.

The rest on negotiation, sound judgement is just technical. classroom talk.

Try talking to GCB owners, an agent is there to negotiate, offer sound judgement, you think they don't know agents like to do staging of offers?

House sell 1.55mill. Buyer offer 1.48 million. Agent knows this price may close. Agent go and tell seller, buyer offer 1.4million. Seller say slightly higher he consider. Agent go in next offer 1.43mill, Seller say want higher, he will reduce a bit. 1.48mill close deal. Bingo. If the agent go in offer at 1.48mill readily, you think Seller will sell at 1.48mill?

 

[xebay11]

Buyer: I pay you 1%, you go reduce the price for me.

(

Nope, it is Buyer pay 1% to get the ideal property, near MRT or near parents, or 4 bedder, or facing sea, or any other characterstic, he serves as a search agent for the best property in the area the buyer is looking for, they also still can work a compromise deal, ie bargain for buyer, yet still get good price for seller and get ideal property, everyone is happy and the agent gets paid. Many investors use such agents to make money by buying the best units.

Sorry but you know nothing about real estate. Many buyers agents have "kangtao" properties only available to special buyers.........people willing to pay 1%.

 

[scroobal]

The fundamental issue is whether the current practice is ethical and fair to a buyer who intends to purchase a HDB property and as a pre-requisite has to appoint the seller's agent to complete that particular transaction.

The following points are irrelevant
1) You are a CEHA certified realtor. Its immaterial if you were certified by them or the Maxwell Hawker Centre Association.
2) That it is the current practice
3) That such a practice precedes you and continues after you have left
4) That it is not forbidden by law
5) That the buyer does not have to agree (unless he still can purchase the transaction)
6) No need to engage lawyer for HDB as agent will do paperwork.

Paying thousands of dollars to the seller's agent as commission for paperwork is unethical, wrong and silly. Try doing that to the private property sector.

An agent is the representative of the principal. An agent acting for 2 principles where one is the first party and the other is the counter-party for the same transaction does not make any sense.

I am a ceha-certified realtor. Therefore, I have no doubt that there may be a conflict of interests when an agent collect a commission from both the seller and buyer. Absolutely no doubt abt it.

Scroobal's view is that a direct buyer should not be paying commission to a seller's agent but however for HDB, it is justifiable to charge a processing fee not amounting to 1%. However, the conflict of interests factor will still exist because a realtor commission is only chargeable upon successfully brokeraging a deal. Most if not all agents will be contended to work with a buyer as long as he is willing to pay the lowest acceptable price of the seller.

Many of the market practices have already long exist before I joined the real estate and will continue to exist after i choose to leave the scene. I will still emphasise on the agent's professionalism, integrity and skills because no matter how the law is changed, most agents guided by their veterans will still be able to go around and beat the rules.

Whenever an agent serve both the buyer and seller at the same time, the conflict of interests element may still exist whether or not the direct buyer is paying a commission or not. This is where busdriver111's point come in. Can an agent be representing both parties?

Given a choice, I would rather not serve direct buyers so that as a lister i can focus my effort on marketing the unit at the highest possible price that i could rather than wasting alot of time on explaining to prospective buyers abt hdb rules and regulations, procedure and doing the required paperwork.

There is no need to prove whether that I am in the wrong, i am just purely SHARING.

 

[scroobal]

Aiyah, Kangtao properties don't go for 1%. In such cases, the agent actually acts for the buyer and fulfills his search needs.

There are agents that are appointed by the buyer to act in his interest.

I don't think you even understand what is going on. In the private property market, those who are looking for certain types of property will appoint a buyer's agent. This is very popular with expats and high end Singaporeans. They will screw this seller and his agent to do the the best price possible.

Sorry but you know nothing about real estate. Many buyers agents have "kangtao" properties only available to special buyers.........people willing to pay 1%.

 

[xebay11]

Aiyah, Kangtao properties don't go for 1%. In such cases, the agent actually acts for the buyer and fulfills his search needs.

There are agents that are appointed by the buyer to act in his interest.

I don't think you even understand what is going on. In the private property market, those who are looking for certain types of property will appoint a buyer's agent. This is very popular with expats and high end Singaporeans. They will screw this seller and his agent to do the the best price possible.

Sorry but you don't understand the business, are you an agent? The buyer's agent starts off as buyer's agent and looks for the requested property for the buyer by door knocking, not simply going through existing data bases, which anyone can do, once he gets a unit the buyer wants and the seller is willing to sell, he becomes the selling agent as well and he wraps the whole deal together with all the parties. If you can leverage on this you will make lots of money.

 

[silverfox@]

Nope, it is Buyer pay 1% to get the ideal property, near MRT or near parents, or 4 bedder, or facing sea, or any other characterstic, he serves as a search agent for the best property in the area the buyer is looking for, they also still can work a compromise deal, ie bargain for buyer, yet still get good price for seller and get ideal property, everyone is happy and the agent gets paid. Many investors use such agents to make money by buying the best units.

Sorry but you know nothing about real estate. Many buyers agents have "kangtao" properties only available to special buyers.........people willing to pay 1%.

You are talking about HDB or pte property? If its pte property, buyers don't need to pay commission. Any commission paid to agents (buyer side) is all special arrangement and under their own discretion.

 

[silverfox@]

Sorry but you don't understand the business, are you an agent? The buyer's agent starts off as buyer's agent and looks for the requested property for the buyer by door knocking, not simply going through existing data bases, which anyone can do, once he gets a unit the buyer wants and the seller is willing to sell, he becomes the selling agent as well and he wraps the whole deal together with all the parties. If you can leverage on this you will make lots of money.

It's part of farming. Agents drop flyers, knock doors, cold calls. They are not there to start off as buyer agent, they are doing this to get listings. Listing is King.

You have houses on hand to sell you are no.1. You have no listing on hand, you have to call all the agents and cobroke with them. Then you have those agents who say sorry no cobroke. sorry cobroke already.

You should understand 1 thing. Buyers have no loyalty. They ask you to help them find a house. (A house that they want). You can't find it, someone else gets them a house that fits their requirement, you think they stick with you and wait or put a deposit and get the option? So don't talk about buyer agent doing all these for buyer. They are doing these to get more listings. Even if the buyer eventually goes away and buy other properties, the agent will continue to get more buyers, because the listing is already on hand and the owner is ready to sell.

 

[xebay11]

It's part of farming. Agents drop flyers, knock doors, cold calls. They are not there to start off as buyer agent, they are doing this to get listings. Listing is King.

You have houses on hand to sell you are no.1. You have no listing on hand, you have to call all the agents and cobroke with them. Then you have those agents who say sorry no cobroke. sorry cobroke already.

You should understand 1 thing. Buyers have no loyalty. They ask you to help them find a house. (A house that they want). You can't find it, someone else gets them a house that fits their requirement, you think they stick with you and wait or put a deposit and get the option? So don't talk about buyer agent doing all these for buyer. They are doing these to get more listings. Even if the buyer eventually goes away and buy other properties, the agent will continue to get more buyers, because the listing is already on hand and the owner is ready to sell.

The cycle goes like this, you start as seller agent, sell for seller, seller becomes a buyer, then you become buying agent and it goes on and on and mixes around so there is no clear cut being a buyer or seller agent as you move along the business.

 

[silverfox@]

The cycle goes like this, you start as seller agent, sell for seller, seller becomes a buyer, then you become buying agent and it goes on and on and mixes around so there is no clear cut being a buyer or seller agent as you move along the business.

Agent (to HDB seller): My fee is 2%
Seller: ok

Agent (to HDB buyer): My fee is 1%
Buyer: ok

Seller: Tell buyer I only want $500K for my flat, nothing less. You get my comm
Agent: ok

Buyer: Tell seller I only offer $450K max for the flat.
Agent: But seller want $500k lowest they accept.
Buyer: What are you here for? I am paying you commission for it, so go and negotiate.
Agent: No sir, the 1% is processing fee.
Buyer: What processing fee?

Buyer and Agents perceive things differently. The one who pays and the one who receives. It's too ambiguous. Especially when there is a conflict of interests.

 

[gnoikj]

Ha! Xebay and Ramseth are bioth wrong. The law has come into effect. no more dual representation!

Xebay, if you continue to engage in this, I hope to see your name in the papers! : )

 

[Ramseth]

Ha! Xebay and Ramseth are bioth wrong. The law has come into effect. no more dual representation!

Xebay, if you continue to engage in this, I hope to see your name in the papers! : )

Thanks for the update. So now it's all co-broke?

 

[xebay11]

Ha! Xebay and Ramseth are bioth wrong. The law has come into effect. no more dual representation!

Xebay, if you continue to engage in this, I hope to see your name in the papers! : )

Dude I am property investor and don't mind paying my buying agent 1%. So what name in papers are u talking abt?

 

[gnoikj]

Property investor? Really? I thought u good friend with mike parikh? So must b agent? In fact, u approve of his actions in ripping off sellers by flipping?

 

[blueblobster]

sad to say, agents seldom act in this way. you mentioned not smart fighting over extra 100 to 200 dollars of commission??? that means you are do not know how agents work. its like your résumé. most agents will want to serve sellers than buyers. when you are able to close higher, you can use it as a track record to show those owner you abilities to close higher. in order for the owners to let you sell their properties. its like the medal of honour to them!!! "i close a deal worth 1.3 miilion!!!"

Dude, I was an agent before to cash in on the boom. The group (not the company) I was in alone has more than 50 agents. I also know many other agents personally. I can assure you that almost no agent I know cares about how high they sell to give their resume a boost. A smart agent will certainly try to manage the seller's expectations with a CMA (sometimes doctored to show only the cheaper units). Even in both company and group training, the emphasis is to push the price down.

Why? Because like someone correctly stated, the final selling price makes no significant difference to an agent's commission, especially for HDB flats. A 10k difference only amounts to 1 - 200 bucks in commission. All agents I know will push the price down to close it and move on to the next deal. The total commission from the next deal is worth more than the extra hundreds from fighting for a higher price.

Also the longer you drag, the more advertising costs incurred. And the biggest problem comes from non- exclusive deals. No agent in his right mind will fight for a higher price for such properties. The longer he drags on, the higher the risk another agent will close the deal. Since the owner did not act in the agent's interest by granting him exclusivity, only a stupid agent will act in the owner's interest.

All top performers I know personally have never bothered to fight for the best price for the sellers. At most, they will promise a high price to clinch the exclusivity and then slowly push the price down once they get the exclusive. I was from a large agency and know many agents from other large agencies. All of them do the same thing.

Don't be naive. Any agent trying to push the price up is trying to pocket the difference or at least split it with the seller. You will know this is a common practice if you are really an insider. There are even buyers' agents who pushed the price up in order to pocket the difference. Most agents almost never act in their client's best interest. Almost all are scums except for a few, mostly unsuccessful ones. Period.

 

[xebay11]

Property investor? Really? I thought u good friend with mike parikh? So must b agent? In fact, u approve of his actions in ripping off sellers by flipping?

I am a flipper and if I wanted to be more serious in flipping I would be an agent, but I am not.