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New S’pore citizen defends PRs during discussion on housing

I_Hate_Pappies

Alfrescian (Inf)
Asset
What I was disagreeing with was blaming the minority for driving the market. And yes, PRs are the minority of the market.

PRs are the minority of the market? When was the last time a 3rm HDB flats cost less than $200k? The answer is 2006. When did the floodgate opened? 2006. Between 2006 to 2013, did you see a large growth in local's population? So where did the demand came from?
FYI, a couple of residential districts have hit the maximum quota for PRs' purchase. Even the gabernment has implemented restrictions on them and here you are talking about PRs being the minority of the market.
 

Thatguy

Alfrescian
Loyal
PRs are the minority of the market? When was the last time a 3rm HDB flats cost less than $200k? The answer is 2006. When did the floodgate opened? 2006. Between 2006 to 2013, did you see a large growth in local's population? So where did the demand came from?
FYI, a couple of residential districts have hit the maximum quota for PRs' purchase. Even the gabernment has implemented restrictions on them and here you are talking about PRs being the minority of the market.

Do your research, they actually are the minority of the market. Prices going up has a lot of other factors beyond who is buying. Also, since we're talking about the flood gate and all, who's selling the flats to the PRs, since they can only by resale? Vastly more complex then you make it out to be.

@Sleaguepunter That the term is new is no surprise. That one doesn't do a quick google check is sad. I do actually say teacher's helper when explaining what it is, but job title is what it is ma. Newspaper ask for job title, I give job title la. As for marrying a girl, that'll happen when it happens. Right now, I'm busy taking care of my father.

You really should meet some of the younger teacher's teaching it now. None of the glossing that most of us talk about before, they can be pretty honest about it all.

@laksaboy Nice of you to say that about my mom. Really classy. I'd respond in kind, but I've never been one to drag parents into a personal fight. Also, I signed in to clear up misconceptions for those genuinely interested. As some seem to have been here. I'm one always up for a discussion, though I guess people who feel the need to bring parents in to back up a point may not get that.

@Scrooball You're right, I do have some major problems. Fixing up some injuries sustained in NS, one after the other. As for my father, yes, that was the crux of our personal issue. Nothing to do with the convo the newspaper was reporting on, but it's his choice. No biggie,we just pay more for stuff and make it work.
 

Thatguy

Alfrescian
Loyal
A lot of you have this misconception that when all that was said, I KPKB. Not true. My only real gripe with HDB was that the family unit is focused on the father(at that time at least. need to check if it's been updated). Even if my mother were alive at that time, even though I'm a citizen, they would only focus on the father when considering the family unit. It's a very strange rule to me, considering that we'd be living together as one family unit no matter what. Otherwise, no issues lor. The lack of grants for PR-only families is a non-issue to me. It's only when you have cases like this(again, a lot. Malaysian parents, Singaporean kids, etc etc etc) where I personally believe there should be some flexibility for the local kids. Heck, HDB could afford to be a lot more flexible in a lot of things for locals, we can all agree on that. But end of the day, most of us just pay more and tahan lor. This article, about me "defending" PRs, was about what happened during the National Conversation on Housing. Some people brought up how PRs have it so good and practically all the benefits with no costs, so I just told them about the differentiations that do exist, the extent of the differentiations, the time those differentiations start(from young) and how uncertain retaining PR status is. The headlines is, as ever, spin. My main point, backed up by figures others had already floated prior, is that PRs as the minority of the market cannot be blamed for driving the market, not completely. Someone has to be selling to the PRs, for one. Also, inflation here and globally, increased amenities, land prices, the lack of transparency regarding land prices, the fact that when they price the flat they are also including the amenities built with the estate, as opposed to that being municipal costs...so many factors.
 

I_Hate_Pappies

Alfrescian (Inf)
Asset
Do your research, they actually are the minority of the market. Prices going up has a lot of other factors beyond who is buying. Also, since we're talking about the flood gate and all, who's selling the flats to the PRs, since they can only by resale? Vastly more complex then you make it out to be.

The locals are selling while the PRs choking up the demand. That's the reason why the prices blew sky high. You see any vast change in prices between 2001 to 2005 when the locals are selling to the locals? If they are the minority, why are the PR quota in a couple of towns maxed out. I m not even taking Malaysian SPR into consideration as they are not affected by the ethnic quota.
 

Leongsam

High Order Twit / Low SES subject
Admin
Asset
The locals are selling while the PRs choking up the demand. That's the reason why the prices blew sky high. You see any vast change in prices between 2001 to 2005 when the locals are selling to the locals? If they are the minority, why are the PR quota in a couple of towns maxed out. I m not even taking Malaysian SPR into consideration as they are not affected by the ethnic quota.

So the locals are selling and the PRs are buying and the prices are sky high. Sounds like a good scenario to me you twit.

It also sounds very much like the locals are the ones responsible for the high prices in the first place. Why are they asking for so much for a poor quality pigeon hole?
 

I_Hate_Pappies

Alfrescian (Inf)
Asset
So the locals are selling and the PRs are buying and the prices are sky high. Sounds like a good scenario to me you twit.

It also sounds very much like the locals are the ones responsible for the high prices in the first place. Why are they asking for so much for a poor quality pigeon hole?

I do not stress myself out with these small things as long as i get my message across. Probably, one of the reason why i have no balding issue.
It is always supply and demand, dickhead.
 

Scrooball (clone)

Alfrescian
Loyal
Come on... The father don't want to convert to Citizen, this rojak son want to come here to talk about fairness? Fuck u La.

(edited error change PR to Citizen)
 
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Leongsam

High Order Twit / Low SES subject
Admin
Asset
I do not stress myself out with these small things as long as i get my message across. Probably, one of the reason why i have no balding issue.
It is always supply and demand, dickhead.

Locals should thank their lucky stars that PRs want to buy their homes. If there was no demand, HDB pigeon holes would be worth nothing and half the population would be on the verge of bankruptcy.

In addition to your loss of hair, you're also suffering from loss of grey matter. :rolleyes:
 

Scrooball (clone)

Alfrescian
Loyal
So the locals are selling and the PRs are buying and the prices are sky high. Sounds like a good scenario to me you twit.

It also sounds very much like the locals are the ones responsible for the high prices in the first place. Why are they asking for so much for a poor quality pigeon hole?

Did u even go through basic Economics? If you sell high, you need to buy low to make a profit. If you sell high, others sell even higher... Then you are twit.

When there is a lower population by kicking out foreigners, demand for rental, resale and new flats are lower. As simple as that. Demand goes down, price goes down.
 
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Devil Within

Alfrescian (Inf)
Asset
Locals should thank their lucky stars that PRs want to buy their homes. If there was no demand, HDB pigeon holes would be worth nothing and half the population would be on the verge of bankruptcy.

In addition to your loss of hair, you're also suffering from loss of grey matter. :rolleyes:

So, Australia allows PRs to buy gov's public housing?
 

I_Hate_Pappies

Alfrescian (Inf)
Asset
Locals should thank their lucky stars that PRs want to buy their homes. If there was no demand, HDB pigeon holes would be worth nothing and half the population would be on the verge of bankruptcy.

In addition to your loss of hair, you're also suffering from loss of grey matter. :rolleyes:

So you do agree that PRs are the main cause for the surge in HDB flats prices, botak Leong?
 

Leongsam

High Order Twit / Low SES subject
Admin
Asset
So you do agree that PRs are the main cause for the surge in HDB flats prices, botak Leong?

No more to blame than the greedy sinkies wanting to make a fast buck by asking for outrageous prices for a piece of shit.

Sinkies are one side of the equation and the PRs are on the other side. If sinkies care so much about other citizens being priced out of the market, they could always give a fellow sinkie a 50% discount.

Just face the fact that sinkies would prefer to see another sinkie starve to death than to sacrifice a big fat profit for the sake of national unity.
 

I_Hate_Pappies

Alfrescian (Inf)
Asset
No more to blame than the greedy sinkies wanting to make a fast buck by asking for outrageous prices for a piece of shit.

Sinkies are one side of the equation and the PRs are on the other side. If sinkies care so much about other citizens being priced out of the market, they could always give a fellow sinkie a 50% discount.

Just face the fact that sinkies would prefer to see another sinkie starve to death than to sacrifice a big fat profit for the sake of national unity.

The 50% discount will come when there's no PRs competing. Infact, Sinkies has been selling to Sinkies at 50% discount in the past consider prices of HDB flats have since doubled after the influx of PRs from 2006.
 

sleaguepunter

Alfrescian (Inf)
Asset
Mr new citizen brought his flat too late. As recent as 2006, a 3room flat in AMK was selling at around S$180K. The rise in property price started after govt announce the building of the 2 IRs. Now, AMK 3rm flat is selling at $400+K, those PR that brought then already double their money. A msian friend was already thinking of selling, use the profit to buy a kia to commute to work from his jb home.
 

I_Hate_Pappies

Alfrescian (Inf)
Asset
One thing i don't understand is why his Dad willing to lay his life for the country but refuses to take up the citizenship.
Isn't it what we have always discussed about? Having the best of both world. Not a benefit a regular sinkie can enjoy.
 

Scrooball (clone)

Alfrescian
Loyal
Blame his own father La. Why new citizen come in to complain about fairness? Is it fair that some foreigners stay here long time but don't want to convert to citizenship?
 

Thatguy

Alfrescian
Loyal
One thing i don't understand is why his Dad willing to lay his life for the country but refuses to take up the citizenship.
Isn't it what we have always discussed about? Having the best of both world. Not a benefit a regular sinkie can enjoy.

I don't get why people say that....What benefits are there? He gets no benefits from a home country he hasn't been home in years, and essential services are much more expensive for him. How is that the best of both worlds?

Really, I would actually like to understand this POV.


@Scrooball Um...never did complain about fairness. May wanna re-read bro, you're missing the point by a huge margin.
 

sleaguepunter

Alfrescian (Inf)
Asset
I don't get why people say that....What benefits are there? He gets no benefits from a home country he hasn't been home in years, and essential services are much more expensive for him. How is that the best of both worlds?

Really, I would actually like to understand this POV.


@Scrooball Um...never did complain about fairness. May wanna re-read bro, you're missing the point by a huge margin.

Your dad fought during the confrontation, so i gathered he a ex brit servicemen who gone asiatic. Even so, he shd be eligable for the army pension. He must be 40s yo when u r born. As much as your dad didnt enjoy any benefits of being a PR here but that because he didnt game the system. The R&Rs of hdb purchase is set in stone by the govt, as much as the PRs had contribute to the state, the state have no obligation to repay the PRs as it shd always the citizens are the priority.

As much as u denied PRs are not a factor in the hdb resales price, i think u r seriously wrong. Only Citizens and PRs are eligable to purchase hdb flats. With only a constant under 3m pink ic holders, the demand for new flats will be flat if not for the 1m plus strong PRs. Most PRs i know brought resale flat via the open market. A ex colleague who only 25yo, single and msian, brought a resale flat together with her single elder sister and elder brother. All three of them are under 35yo are owner of a hdb flat wheras a pink ic holder who is single can only buy after 35yo. Another msian friend brought a flat in amk together with his ep wife. He has no intention to convert to pink ic despite having no love for msia. Without this million plus strong PRs, there will be at least another 100,000 units of flat available in the market. The price would drop like a stone. U at most only 13yo when properties price fell in 97, partly due to asian financial meltdown and parly because hongkies PRs return back to hong kong.
 

peppertail

Alfrescian
Loyal
The 50% discount will come when there's no PRs competing. Infact, Sinkies has been selling to Sinkies at 50% discount in the past consider prices of HDB flats have since doubled after the influx of PRs from 2006.

That is by far the dumbest thing i have read in a long long time. Back on my ignore list!
 
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