Mother-tongue policy undermines education and our future - Good Article

[blueblobster]

Exactly. It's the watering down of the syllabus that turns off Chinese students. Who's interested in 爸爸去做工，妈妈去买菜 kind of chapters. But I believe there's a political agenda behind this. To rid all of the 三字经，四书五经，唐诗宋词 from primary and secondary schools. (SAP schools are allowed some of these, selectively.) These are the foundations of proper Chinese education. These aren't only about language, but also consiensional, social and political stuff that can be very influential during teenage formative years transition to adulthood.

The best post of the day.

Recently I watched a documentary on some Chinese Central channel. It was in very refined Mandarin and I understood at most 50% of it. Subsequent programs on this channel was just as hard to understand. I tried reading the subtitles but alas, they were just as difficult.

I scored an A2 in Chinese and considered myself fluent in conversational Chinese. That's how awful our bilingual education policy is. We have been taught shit, watered down Chinese.

 

[Jah_rastafar_I]

Another thing i remembered while studying chinese and gp in school. Chinese usually talked about so-called confucian values and the usual boring commentary about everyday life and was so preachy and so in your face.

English however was different. English comprehension passages were a joy to read. There were so many topics. Like science, stories of adventure, i still remember one story i read about a dead man being piggy backed and his rigor mortis set in and the man carrying him ended up being strangled to death. Stories like these would never be published in chinese comprehension passages.

There was also a marked difference in the way chinese language and english language teachers dressed and behaved. It was really a world of a difference. You could talk to and make jokes with the english language teacher while the chinese teacher was all stern and boring.

 

[Jah_rastafar_I]

Check the Constitution, Hansard and Statutes of Acts of Parliament. Written in English only.

Oh well, the national anthem is sung in Malay.

you are digressing from the topic how is all of that to do with language usage?


There are 4 official languages in sg none of which is english.

 

[Ramseth]

you are digressing from the topic how is all of that to do with language usage?

There are 4 official languages in sg none of which is english.

I'm not digressing but you seem lost in digression. Name the 4 official languages. If one of them is not English, you win.

 

[Jah_rastafar_I]

I'm not digressing but you seem lost in digression. Name the 4 official languages. If one of them is not English, you win.

I take it back yet earlier you mentioned english as the only official language ignoring the other 3.

 

[besotted]

Think the govt should not indulge the Pinkertons

If they cannot make it because of CL2, let them migrate Australia or US, just fuck off from here

Why cave in to their demands

 

[zeebjii]

I am getting really tired of explaining this. I have no problems with learning multiple languages. But the reality today is that many SGreans are struggling with Chinese. All you need to answer is this: Are you willing to say that if you do not score well enough in Chinese (or another second language), then you are not allowed to pursue higher education levels? You just need to answer Yes or No. This is all that I am after.

Do you have any stats to prove that MANY in SG are struggling with Chinese?

Stats from MOE show that the passing rate is very high in PSLE and O levels.

You and your friends struggling doesnt mean the whole of singapore is struggling.

My answer is yes. If you can't score a pass in 2nd language then you don't deserve to pursue higher education levels.

I reckon your answer is no. you can rant and complain, but the most important thing is our dear government does not agree wth you.

That my friend is the reality.

 

[halsey02]

Do you have any stats to prove that MANY in SG are struggling with Chinese?

My answer is yes. If you can't score a pass in 2nd language then you don't deserve to pursue higher education levels.

That my friend is the reality.

What on earth are you talking about, I lost a few friends, whom I grew up with, to become immigrants; and that is in the 20th century. You can't score 2nd language ...wtf!

These guys I am talking about scored in their academic pursuit, two of them have MBA's...and none have came back here. Why they left, the 2nd language requirement..Reservist etc.

Does it mean I am deficient in a second language I do not deserve to pursue higher education level?, why nation on this earth does this? Look at Canada, it is officially Bi-lingual, does it mean a Canadian, is not proficient in French & vice versa..is condemn ?

You must be smoking too much of the People's Affordable Party purple haze....and is now a real life 'frog in the well' and that is a reality.

 

[halsey02]

The best post of the day.

Recently I watched a documentary on some Chinese Central channel. It was in very refined Mandarin and I understood at most 50% of it. Subsequent programs on this channel was just as hard to understand. I tried reading the subtitles but alas, they were just as difficult.

I scored an A2 in Chinese and considered myself fluent in conversational Chinese. That's how awful our bilingual education policy is. We have been taught shit, watered down Chinese.

I concur with you, but maybe I am slightly better than you, for I am schooled in the old ways of teaching Chinese; the leftovers from the Chinese Middle School Teachers, whom the authorities were trying their best to eradicate at that time.

I admit too that I find some difficulty in comprehending in some of the spoken 'pu tong hua', in those programs. But this is not what we learnt from school that hamper us in understanding, this is due in part only; but the localized spoken language that we have a hard time understanding. This is not restricted to People's Republic of China, the older generation of the Republic of China, you will find a hard time understanding them too.

It is not watered down Chinese you have obtained, it is 'tailored language' that you have to learn to serve their needs, not yours, resulting in a joyless learning process with very little substance.

That is what you got!

 

[cunnosieur]

PRC Bank Exec

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Happen to be at waterloo street doing some bank transaction yesterday lunch time, was told by the counter staff to wait for 15min to half an hour. Went out for a quick puff and saw this gal leaning on my car talking on her phone. The moment she lift up her head, I was WOW..... Not bad leh. She smile back and say sorrie, I told her to carry on leaning in a joking way. We chatted awhile and got to know that she just arrived 3 weeks ago working at the Bank which I just went. So I try to date her out for a drink and she say OK (My Lucky Day).

Pick her up after her work at 5.30pm and we went downtown for dinner. I was trying my best to test water (NO LUCK). We headed to Boat Quay for a drink after dinner and I told myself this time DIE DIE also must ask. All of a sudden, she burst into tear (ALCOHOL EFFECT), saying she misses her parent. I try to console her and told her not to think so much. Time passes and we are now more open up, I pop up the question to her:

Me: Why dun you try to earn more money while you are in SG?
She: How to?
Me: Do part time lor.
She: What is part time?
Me: Must I go into detail, then you can understand.
(Slient for a while) and (Burst into laughter)
She: How much am I worth in your eye.
Me: Hard to say, depends on how good are you.
She: How much do you want to give me, if I say OK to you.
Me: 150 lor (Man Ego).
She: If I am good to you, you give me more is it?
Me: Let see how good are you.
Me: How???
She: Can try. Is it now?
Me: Now lor. If not when?
She: Where?
Me: I bring you there.

10.45pm we check into a hotel at chinatown and the rest is story.....

Name: Txxx Xxxx
Age: 25
Look: 7.5 (Young office exec look)
Stats: 34B / 24 / 34 (I think so)
BBBJ: Yes for me
FJ: 9 (good moaning)
Painting: Yes for me
CIM: No
AR: No
AJ: No
Attitude: Very anticipating
Damage: 150 / 1shot
Overall: Good
RTF: Yes for sure (Bonking a Pretty Bank Exec)

 

[cunnosieur]

Fun Guy
Samster Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Singapore Ltd.
Posts: 107
My Reputation:Points: 77 / Power: 1

Re: PRC Bank Exec

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Hi to all Bros

Bro JJjumper
Bro, I have not mentioned which bank she work in and from what I know not all banks in Spore (Local and Foreign) required english speaking staff.

Local bank do required english speaking staff but that does not mean all are able to. For example (Pantry lady, Cleaner and etc....)

Foreign bank do required english speaking staff at the frontline but how about those at the backend. Those junior staff or lower ranking at the backend may not need to.

No offence to you bro....

Bro DL2UHI
Bro, what you have stated in your post is very true and well said. I can speak, sing and even scold in chinese or dialect but when I come to reading or writing, I am a total BLUR king.

Bro kefuso
Bro, I guess you may have misheard or there are some miscommunication between you and her. She has never told anyone that she is working in a factory. What she has told me is she is rushing some work at her colleague house and need to be handed over the next day. She say she is still very new working there and that why she need to go over to her colleague house to finish her work.

Bro there are many levels in the bank and she maybe a small little fly over there. She may not understand what you have know. There are many frontline staff at our local bank and when ask some question, they always tell us to wait and will ask their senior to talk to us.

I hope I am right bro. No offence to you............

Bro Cunnosieur
Bro, what you have posted up is a profile of a manager and a senior officer position. I have only stated that she work in the bank as a exec.

An exec. could mean = admin, clerk, trainee staff or some backend staff.

No offence to you bro........

http://www.sammyboyforum.com/welcome...k-exec-15.html

 

[cunnosieur]

Last updated at: (Beijing Time) Saturday, March 16, 2002

http://english.peopledaily.com.cn/200203/16/eng20020316_92240.shtml

Bank of China Staff Stealing US$500 Million, and Fleeing: Report
The Bank of China, the country's largest foreign exchange lender, has confirmed five of its employees stole nearly US$500 million before fleeing abroad.

The Bank of China, the country's largest foreign exchange lender, has confirmed five of its employees stole nearly US$500 million before fleeing abroad.

The theft took place at a branch in the southern city of Kaiping over a period of seven years and some of the money was later laundered in Macao and Las Vegas, bank president Liu Mingkang told reporters, according to Saturday's Financial Times newspaper.

The five employees had fake passports at their disposal and fled overseas as the fraud was about to be uncovered, Liu said. Some of the stolen money was laundered in the gambling centres of Macao and Las Vegas.

Chinese media had previously reported that an even larger amount of cash had gone missing. A southern Chinese weekly, the 21st Century Business Herald, in January quoted state auditors as saying officials from two branches in southern Guangdong province transferred US$700 million into overseas accounts over a 10-year period.

Former Bank of China president Wang Xuebing was dismissed as head of the Construction Bank of China in January and is under investigation. The bank's New York has been found with fraud. The US Treasury Department and China's central bank announced earlier this year a joint 20 million dollar fine for malpractices at the bank's New York branch during the past decade.

Liu also revealed that he had ordered audits of Bank of China operations in the southern boom town of Shenzhen and the western city of Chongqing. After the audit in Chongqing, one deputy manager committed suicide, another official was sacked and a third sent to prison.

Chinese Premier Zhu Rongji said Friday the recent financial scandals at the Bank of China would not affect plans to list Chinese banks abroad.

"Problems that have occurred in some individual branches won't affect the reputation of China's banking sector or the objective of listing banking institutions at home and abroad," he told reporters.

Zhu said that given the large size of Bank of China and the country's three other main state-owned commercial banks, it was not surprising that some individual branches had suffered "irregularities".

 

[cunnosieur]

Lure of reliving lost love fells bank's golden boyEmailPrintNormal fontLarge fontNovember 22, 2006

BEIJING: The former head of the Bank of China in Hong Kong has been accused of spending about $740,000 on plastic surgery for his mistress, in the latest of a series of sex scandals exposed in the state-run media.

Liu Jinbao is said to have confessed that he wanted to make his mistress look more like his high-school sweetheart, from whose rejection he had never recovered.

The leaking of court records relating to his conviction for corruption comes as a string of senior figures from the Communist Party and big business fall victim to a nationwide purge, centred on Shanghai.

The purge began with the Vice-Mayor of Beijing, exposed for corruption involving Olympic Games-related developments but was also found to be keeping concubines in a luxury villa.

Liu, 54, the latest figure to be "outed", used to be known for having become head of the Bank of China in Shanghai at the relatively young age of 40.

He was then promoted to chief executive of the bank's subsidiary in Hong Kong, and finally made deputy chairman of the parent company in Beijing, before being implicated in a real estate scandal in Shanghai. His trial last year, in which he received a suspended death sentence, was not held in public, but a specialist legal paper claims to have been leaked court documents.

Liu's main offences were large amounts he got in bribes, and the millions in illegal loans he approved to businessmen in return.

But the details of his relationship with a propaganda officer in the Shanghai branch portrayed a banking "big fish" who never outgrew a schoolboy crush on a girl called Chen Chen who ripped up his first love letter.

When he introduced his "secretary" to old school friends over dinner, they immediately noticed a similarity to Chen Chen, he allegedly confessed.

To make her perfect, he sent her to cosmetic surgery clinics in Hong Kong, Singapore, South Korea and Britain, armed with a photograph of Chen Chen.

http://www.smh.com.au/articles/2006/11/21/1163871403478.html?from=top5

 

[shOUTloud]

I am getting really tired of explaining this. I have no problems with learning multiple languages. But the reality today is that many SGreans are struggling with Chinese. All you need to answer is this: Are you willing to say that if you do not score well enough in Chinese (or another second language), then you are not allowed to pursue higher education levels? You just need to answer Yes or No. This is all that I am after.

YES!

What you are asking for is a system that can adapt to every single child and that is impossible at this stage. As it is, we are (at great cost) starting a sports school and an arts school to cater to those with other needs.

Why should we pander to those who are weak in languages without catering to those who are weak in science or mathematics? The influence of mother tongue (esp in case of Mandarin) has been winnowed down to PSLE level.

For those who said that one does not need Mandarin to do business with the PRCs, my question is where did you get this great theory. Have you even work with them? Unless you are going there as a tourist, you jolly well learn to speak, read and write Mandarin. Anything less will put you at a handicap.

If the PRCs want your business, they will email you in fuckup English. If you want their business, you jolly well email them in Chinese, even if it is half fuck.

 

[Wang Ye]

Another thing i remembered while studying chinese and gp in school. Chinese usually talked about so-called confucian values and the usual boring commentary about everyday life and was so preachy and so in your face.
english language teacher while the chinese teacher was all stern and boring.

Never liked Confucius much prefer Menfucius who pretty much believes that if a govt is f**k-up it deserves to be overthrown

I guess I was lucky. My chinese teachers were mostly males and they were okay, the lady ones ... as you mentioned stern. My chinese tutors were great though.

 

[Jah_rastafar_I]

Never liked Confucius much prefer Menfucius who pretty much believes that if a govt is f**k-up it deserves to be overthrown

I guess I was lucky. My chinese teachers were mostly males and they were okay, the lady ones ... as you mentioned stern. My chinese tutors were great though.

i had mean male chinese language teachers too but the one thing i always noticed from primary to secondary to JC was that it was always easier to joke around and have fun with the english language teacher.

 

[Ramseth]

never liked confucius much prefer menfucius who pretty much believes that if a govt is f**k-up it deserves to be overthrown

大阿哥胤题言道 : 孟子曰，民为重，社稷为次，君为轻。
康熙皇帝大怒 : 好啊，你干脆把这个君给弑了，一了百了。来人！把大阿哥关进理藩院。

众阿哥们都吓得跪着低头。

康熙皇帝又言道 ：孔子曰，静口，平心，修身，养性，齐家而后平天下。先是静口。

That is, shut up! Whoever's in power, what he says or quotes is correct.

 

[jw5]

Even cunnosieur has come to this thread.
Soon, someone will say that the only reason for learning mandarin is to be able to negotiate with prc mei meis.
Well, it might as well be me.