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Jack Ma: To survive at Alibaba, you need to work 12 hours a day, six days a week

Devil Within

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#22
This is same logic as pappy you dun like pap them stand for elections crap.
I’m just giving an opinion.
Yes he’s a multi billionaire so he must be great. He’s rag to riches so must look up to him. Escobar also was a billionaire too so are Russians oligarchs. Even Lky so maybe they are also great men. Even murderous hitler and Mao. They must have done something right so many willing to follow them.
You see these rags to riches as if they are rich automatically, but you never see nor think about the sacrifices and risk they took. 12 hrs of work is nothing to them when they spend almost 24hrs a day in the office and even sleep in the office in the early days.


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ChanRasjid

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#24
I do have respect for Jack Ma. He is one of few in 1.35 billions who made it big time. But still he cannot escape the "Chinese mentality". He cannot be considered a visionary.

As expected, we always like to see our our culture and our ancestors in the best of light. So we often read about what the Chinese have achieved in the past - building the great walls, the grand canals, etc. But we forgot there are other wonders of the world that we often ignore. An example, there was a documentary on the great work of ancient Persian underground irrigation system that was a miracle of engineering.

I am more inclined towards physics. The most famous in ancient Greeks would be Euclid, Archimedes. In more modern times, it was the western astronomers like Tycho Brahe who mapped the sky and enable Kepler, Galileo and Isaac Newton who helped brought about the Industrial revolution. There is almost unanimity that Newton's work "The Principia" is considered the greatest work of science ever. These westerners had something the Chinese lack in general - true spirituality. The spirituality of Newton is not commonly known, but he was a mystic - like the Muslim sufi.

I think the Chinese in general is too attached to materialism, thus lacking the spirit of adventure; they see only the "here and now" - almost the tangible world. When they burn incense in the 7th month, it is for "insurance" - just in case! Copernicus, Galileo, Isaac Newton never ever need to appease any gods.

Another thing about the Chinese mentality, "they want it safe!" - that's why they are so much obsessed with fortune telling. My mother use to say in Cantonese :"jou ji deng hai for, um sai choi kai mo" - If only we knew light is fire, we don't have to grope about in the dark.

With "jou ji", many things in life become nice. "jou ji" the STI index is to drop by 80% in 3 months, I would just sell blind!

Chan Rasjid.
 

laksaboy

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#25
Jack Ma made it big because the Chinese Communist Party allowed it to be so, by letting him have a de facto monopoly in Big Data (大数据).

But what the Chicoms can giveth you, it too can easily taketh away. Jack Ma understands this, after a few high profile mysterious deaths recently. :wink:
 

maxsanic

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Loyal
#26
Jack Ma underpays his staff.

Fucking Chinese mentality.
Alibaba Group is one of the highest paying companies out there. I've interviewed a few people working there before, their basic salaries and cash bonuses are on par with global MNCs while their stock grants put them way ahead of the typical western company.

However, the work hours there are indeed horrible and management style is very typical Chinese top down no holds barred way of working. It's up to individuals to decide whether its worth the money at the end of the day.
 

maxsanic

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#28
What's the hourly pay rate?
Depends on job type and individual, it's hard to generalize. My limited impression is that their work hours are about 1.5-1.8x of a typical work life balance western company while their salaries are about 1.5x. However if one can last long enough to unlock the stocks, total package can easily hit 2.5-3.0x making the hourly rates significantly higher even if you factor in the work hours.

Problem though is one needs serious temerity and passion to last long enough to unlock the real money, so it's not exactly a place for everyone. I once interviewed this girl in her late 20s doing project management for their cloud division. She was making 500k+ yuan factoring in bonuses and share grants and asking us to at least match that, but that was way too high for our China office budget as similar jobs which which we hired had only a budget of 200k even if you factor in big bonus for a good year.
 

borom

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#29
Jack Ma is basically the IT/internet commerce poster boy backed from behind by the CCP.
If you have Malaysian Chinese friends or relatives, you will notice that they all go crazy over all things China, esp Jack Ma and Huawei .
Sometimes I wonder if they want to be Chinese so much, why not migrate back to China, why bother to stay in MALAYsia and KPKB!
And please do not come to Singapore and support the PAP-we have enough of you already.
A lot of them are in Australia-good riddance
 

JohnTan

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Generous Asset
#30
I'm a strong supporter of the 996 idea. Employees who want to keep their jobs at my organization need to accept that working 12 hours a day from 9am to 9pm 6 days a week is expected. But I expect my employees to report to work by 6am. The kitchens wait for no men. There's work to be done!
 

Hypocrite-The

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Loyal
#31
Jack Ma is basically the IT/internet commerce poster boy backed from behind by the CCP.
If you have Malaysian Chinese friends or relatives, you will notice that they all go crazy over all things China, esp Jack Ma and Huawei .
Sometimes I wonder if they want to be Chinese so much, why not migrate back to China, why bother to stay in MALAYsia and KPKB!
And please do not come to Singapore and support the PAP-we have enough of you already.
A lot of them are in Australia-good riddance
Mudland cinas basically have the short end of the stick. Those tat can't make it to ozland will go Singkieland. In the 90s the mud cinas going to ah tiong land were soo proud bcos mudland doing better than tiong land. Now tiong land has surpassed mudland in standard of living n muds basically are in a 3rd world country. So cina muds have all sorts of excuses...want to leave etc. But when go overseas they are nothing but parasites. All suck up to their relatives n distant frens in ozland. Even ozland mud cina are fed up of their fellow mud cina. In ozland they are notorious visa over stayers n work often for cash jobs. IE those illegal jobs. Tat was just like ah tiongs in HK in the 80s. So mudland has gone backward. N the fate of these mudlanders would have been worse if Singkieland never open the doors to them. Just imagine if mad khaw, LBW etc remaining in mudland. Wat will they be doing? Mad khaw probably a pimp, lbw maybe unemployed cina teacher. Only Singkieland give such parasites a chance to talk n act big. All to the detriment of Singkies n to think the 70% voted for such crap
 

winnipegjets

Alfrescian (Inf)
Asset
#32
Alibaba Group is one of the highest paying companies out there. I've interviewed a few people working there before, their basic salaries and cash bonuses are on par with global MNCs while their stock grants put them way ahead of the typical western company.

However, the work hours there are indeed horrible and management style is very typical Chinese top down no holds barred way of working. It's up to individuals to decide whether its worth the money at the end of the day.
Most Americans in Silicon Valley work long hours too. But in the rest of the country, the yanks are goofing around ...that's why the Ah Tiongs dominate.
 

winnipegjets

Alfrescian (Inf)
Asset
#33
I'm a strong supporter of the 996 idea. Employees who want to keep their jobs at my organization need to accept that working 12 hours a day from 9am to 9pm 6 days a week is expected. But I expect my employees to report to work by 6am. The kitchens wait for no men. There's work to be done!
Yet, your business close shop. Enough said.
 

winnipegjets

Alfrescian (Inf)
Asset
#35
Depends on job type and individual, it's hard to generalize. My limited impression is that their work hours are about 1.5-1.8x of a typical work life balance western company while their salaries are about 1.5x. However if one can last long enough to unlock the stocks, total package can easily hit 2.5-3.0x making the hourly rates significantly higher even if you factor in the work hours.

Problem though is one needs serious temerity and passion to last long enough to unlock the real money, so it's not exactly a place for everyone. I once interviewed this girl in her late 20s doing project management for their cloud division. She was making 500k+ yuan factoring in bonuses and share grants and asking us to at least match that, but that was way too high for our China office budget as similar jobs which which we hired had only a budget of 200k even if you factor in big bonus for a good year.
This Ah Tiong is very greedy.
 

sweetiepie

Alfrescian
Loyal
#37
KNN a human usually will be wiser before they are successful KNN problem is before successful what he said will be usually been ignored KNN then after successful people all started to worship someone who start to talk cock without needing any poon ji KNN simply put it they are just advising people to buy backdated toto KNN just think why would anyone want to disclose or acknowledge they manage to ride on you for their success KNN so the way to deal with them is to not be tempted by their success or offers and soon they will collapse KNN
 
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sweetiepie

Alfrescian
Loyal
#38
KNN a human usually will be wiser before they are successful KNN problem is before successful what he said will be usually been ignored KNN then after successful people all started to worship someone who start to talk cock without needing any poon ji KNN simply put it they are just advising people to buy backdated toto KNN just think why would anyone want to disclose or acknowledge they manage to ride on you for their success KNN so the way to deal with them is to not be tempted by their success or offers and soon they will collapse KNN
KNN just a sharing on how to deal with situation whereby you are being challenged by someone high up and you want to beat this person to a puppy without affecting your professionalism and appraisal KNN - last time my uncle worked in a very big US MNC and there was a incident whereby the cto called the regular office number to tekan and check status of incident KNN my uncle happened to be the worker to pickup the call and this cto started to babble and my uncle professionally responded to his queries to the best of his knowledge but he wanted more so my uncle noted his extra queries and replied pls leave your name and contact KNN he immediately say out loud I'm your CTO KNN my uncle replied So What KNN he can't answer him and yet cannot dispute him as he carried out his duty professionally KNN KNN KNN
 

Hypocrite-The

Alfrescian
Loyal
#39
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BUSINESS
Alibaba founder Jack Ma says staff should work 12 hours a day, six days a week
BY BANG XIAO AND HOLLY ROBERTSONYESTERDAY AT 4:54PM
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PHOTO
Jack Ma is estimated to be worth more than $48 billion.
REUTERS: VALERY SHARIFULIN/TASS
Working 9-5? Not if you're employed by Alibaba founder Jack Ma.
Key points:
  • Alibaba founder Jack Ma told his staff that working 12 hours a day was a "blessing"
  • It came after fellow e-commerce titan Richard Liu called workers "slackers"
  • Mr Ma later walked back his comments after criticism from Chinese state media
China's wealthiest man, with an estimated net worth of more than $50 billion, has created a stir on social media after declaring that staff should adhere to a "996" work schedule: from 9:00am to 9:00pm, six days a week.
The 72-hour work week — nearly double the Australian standard of 38 hours a week — has become a subject of controversy in China as tech firms place increasingly high expectations on workers.
In a speech to Alibaba staff that was posted to Weibo, Mr Ma said working 12 hours a day for the company was a "blessing".
"If you don't work 996 at a young age, when will you be able to [do it]? Do you think never having to work 996 in your life is an honour to boast about?" he said.​
"How can you achieve the success that you want without exceeding other people's effort and time?"
However, the tech billionaire later appeared to walk back his comments after facing criticism from netizens — as well as Chinese state media.
"If you find a job you like, the 996 problem does not exist — if you're not passionate about it, every minute at work is torture," he said in the lengthy post to Weibo.

PHOTO Mr Ma poses with employees ahead of the company's initial public offering at the New York Stock Exchange.
REUTERS: BRENDAN MCDERMID

"No one likes working at a company that forces you to do 996. Not only is it inhumane, it's unhealthy and even more unsustainable for long periods — plus workers, relatives and the law do not approve of it.
"In the long term, no matter how high the salary you pay your employees, they will all leave."
China's gruelling overtime work culture
His comments came as Richard Liu, the founder of Chinese e-commerce giant JD.com, also weighed in on the ongoing debate about the Chinese tech industry's gruelling overtime work culture, lamenting that years of growth had increased the number of "slackers" in his firm.
Mr Liu posted on WeChat that in the firm's early days he would set his alarm clock to wake up every two hours so he could offer his customers 24-hour service — a measure he called crucial to JD's success.

PHOTO JD.com founder Richard Liu founded his e-commerce site back in 1998.
REUTERS: BOBBY YIP

"JD in the last four, five years has not made any eliminations, so the number of staff has expanded rapidly, the number of people giving orders has grown and grown, while those who are working have fallen," he wrote. "Instead, the number of slackers has rapidly grown!"
"If this carries on, JD will have no hope! And the company will only be heartlessly kicked out of the market! Slackers are not my brothers!" he added.​
The comments are the latest contribution to a growing discussion about work-life balance in the tech industry as the sector slows after years of breakneck growth.
In an editorial published on Sunday, Chinese communist party mouthpiece the People's Daily newspaper censured the Alibaba and JD.com leaders for their statements, saying that doing "forced overtime" is not equivalent to "working hard".
"With the pressure of economic downturn, many enterprises are facing challenges to survive … but the way to relieve anxiety is not to let employees work overtime as much as possible," the editorial said.
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ChanRasjid

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Loyal
#40
In a speech to Alibaba staff that was posted to Weibo, Mr Ma said working 12 hours a day for the company was a "blessing".
"If you don't work 996 at a young age, when will you be able to [do it]? Do you think never having to work 996 in your life is an honour to boast about?" he said.
"How can you achieve the success that you want without exceeding other people's effort and time?"
This is why I say there is a "Chinese" mentality towards life in general. Man in general has to be materialistic, but in the west they have more balance to this materialism.

Matthew 17:20 King James Version (KJV)
"And Jesus said unto them, Because of your unbelief: for verily I say unto you, If ye have faith as a grain of mustard seed, ye shall say unto this mountain, Remove hence to yonder place; and it shall remove; and nothing shall be impossible unto you."
Given that Britain is just a small island nation, it is rather surprising that it has had such great influence in world history. The King James Version of the Bible is translated by the English and is probably one of the most read and translated book in the world.

The special thing that the westerners have in greater measure is faith: If you have faith and order the mountains to move, it will move. Jack Ma does not have have enough such "faith", so his idea of winning is through quantity in working hours per worker - 996.

"You do not worry that the whole world say Einstein's relativity is the best. If you examined the theory and found it wrong - and have faith - just believe in your own conclusions"
"Einstein's physics wrong":
http://www.emc2fails.com

But the professors in Tsinghua University, Peking University, Fudan University just cast their votes following the leads of the west: "For they do not have faith".

Chan Rasjid.
 
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