I am proud of GMS who attended the anti death penalty gathering yesterday

[hockbeng]

I woud support castrating the rapist in place of death penalty. Giving them a quick death is too easy, they need long term sufferings as punishment.

what about using them as slave labour for the rest of their lives.
maybe gst can be lowered

 

[Velma]

The whole frenzy over death penalty started because someone was caught and convicted.

Consider the case of Yong Vui Kong. The media is trying hard to paint a picture of a filial son and a cute b/f when pics of Yong and his g/f are splashed across every medium, and the same story about his sorry mother.

I'm not sure if Yong was caught on his first mission. He may have carried out numerous sorties before he was caught. And if the law had not caught up with him, he would still be trafficking drugs.

Imagine what would have happened if he had managed to smuggled the drugs successfully ? How would he have spent his ill-gotten money ? Buy a house for the mother ? Or marry the g/f ? And be a filial son and nice husband for the rest of his life ? Or splurge at KTVs ? Become a drug supplier instead of mule ?

TOC and TR have been over-romanticizing Vui Kong as the poor "victim" that had never intended to do evil deeds. Reminiscent of those CSI dramas. I do not give a damn whether his mother is sick or not, that is just a lame excuse to worm his way out.

If he had really cared for his mother, he should have picked up a decent job. Malaysia after all, has cheaper costs of living than Singapore. Picking up a menial job like dishwasher in a hawker centre or even delivery trucker can support just enough for his family.

As for the paragraph in bold, I totally have to agree. He might have smuggled a lot more drugs previously, many families might have been broken because people like Vui Kong are supplying drugs to drug addicts. Drug smuggling is not as simple as the Opposition thinks. Crimes can increase because drug addicts rob store or people to get their kicks.

Of course, now that he has been caught, he is cunning enough to paint himself as the poor young and naive victim, with the help of the alternate media, and play the bad childhood and poor family part. Is he that naive? Don't think so. Family background is bad, hence he committed the crime? There are many children out there with bad family background who can strike out a decent living without resorting to crimes. He should be spared because he is young? Drug suppliers will start using children as drug mules because Singapore starts pardoning the young easily.

I am peeved that the Opposition jump into anti-death penalty campaign without fully understanding how much damage can be done to the society. They are just basically senselessly bashing this death penalty thing because it is started by PAP. I bash PAP when their policies fail to benefit Singaporeans but I also give kudos to PAP when their policies benefit Singaporeans. In this case, I give kudos to PAP for its no-mercy stance. (Except for the German girl case).

I certainly do not wish to contribute more taxes to keep the criminal alive and be eligible for parole in 10 years for good behaviour. Many of these victims in Western non-death penalty countries must have been banging their heads against the wall for contributing to such system that forgives the criminal too easily.

My stance is equivalent to Old Fart's stance that if he has to shoot 100,000 Chinese to keep the PRC stable for 100 years, so be it. Same applies for drug traffickers, murderers, etc.

 

[Ramseth]

My stance is equivalent to Old Fart's stance that if he has to shoot 100,000 Chinese to keep the PRC stable for 100 years, so be it. Same applies for drug addicts, murderers, etc.

Murderers and drug traffickers should be hung. Drug addicts should be rehabilitated to quit the addiction. There's a difference. Singapore doesn't hang drug addicts, only drug traffickers.

The problem comes not with death penalty, but with mandatory death penalty. There's a difference again. Some addicts who traffick drugs are assumed to be traffickers and must be hung by law.

 

[BusNo64]

He's member of Hollandse Club, just like Alamaking.

KNN he so kaypoh go speakers corner but neber see him in Tampines visiting the residents? if he wanto beat malboro tan must work harder lah..knn so free go hongkong, go speakers corner, go massage palours...but not free to do ground work in Tampines?

 

[Velma]

Murderers and drug traffickers should be hung. Drug addicts should be rehabilitated to quit the addiction. There's a difference. Singapore doesn't hang drug addicts, only drug traffickers.

The problem comes not with death penalty, but with mandatory death penalty. There's a difference again. Some addicts who traffick drugs are assumed to be traffickers and must be hung by law.

Thanks for pointing out my mistake. :o

But the fact that the person traffick drugs regardless of status, is still a hideous crime and deserves to be hanged.

 

[Thick Face Black Heart]

how come goh meng seng always wear dat same horrible looking orange polo tee and grey color chino pants ? he got no money to buy new clothes issit? knn make so much money selling his hdb flat, at least go and buy a new shirt and pants lah..instead of wearing dat same clothing everyday ....knn donch know whetehr got wash or not...

Fuck u, bloody chao cheebye. At least goh meng seng dare to put his real name and got out an support his beliefs. How about u, hiding behind stupid nickname and scolding people all the time. Fuck u bastard, understand :oIo:

 

[Queen Seok Duk]

Some addicts who traffick drugs are assumed to be traffickers and must be hung by law.

Clothing can by 'hung', not human beings.

 

[Ramseth]

Thanks for pointing out my mistake. :o

But the fact that the person traffick drugs regardless of status, is still a hideous crime and deserves to be hanged.

You're welcome and you're right in principle. Malaysia and Thailand also hang drug traffickers. China executes them by firing squad. US electrocutes murderers and terrorists. I don't see what's so especially controversial and contentious about death penalty except being statutorily imposed mandatory, i.e. the judge can't decide to lower the sentence even when there're mitigating circumstances.

 

[Goh Meng Seng]

I think people tend to lump it up when it comes to Mandatory Death Penalty.

I have given an interview to TOC, maybe that would clear things up.

Any law of the land must reflect the values of the society. Whether Death Penalty will stay or not, it depends on the society's general sentiment and how it views about taking a person's life. There is no right or wrong here, just social values involved.

At this moment in time, Singaporeans generally hold the values that death penalty is NECESSARY for certain crimes. So be it. Anyone who live in this land should respect that. However, having MANDATORY sentencing is totally another matter after all. It means that the society is supposed to TRUST 100% of the various institutions and establishments, from police, investigators to public prosecutors. I cannot accept that personally. It would mean that this system is based on the belief that human beings in these institutions are PERFECT and do not make any mistakes.

Any mistakes made by them will have GRAVE consequences if MANDATORY sentencing, in particularly, death penalty is involved. The judge is supposed to decide only on Yes or No, no discretion on how much TRUST he has on the evidence and case brought forward by the public prosecutor.

I am more afraid of my family, relatives and future generations getting into certain situations which they were accused of something that they did not do but the system here does not provide adequate space and room for defence. It has proven that the whole police force and investigators could make grave mistakes in coercing confessions from innocent beings which nearly end up in death penalty.

To trust one person 100% is already so difficult. But to ask us to trust 3000 to 6000 people in this establishment 100%, that is really unimaginable.

Thus the question here is not about death penalty alone but rather the Mandatory nature of the law.

Goh Meng Seng

 

[Leongsam]

Thus the question here is not about death penalty alone but rather the Mandatory nature of the law.

Goh Meng Seng

Was the gathering an "anti death penalty" meeting or anti "mandatory death sentence" one?

 

[Ramseth]

Was the gathering an "anti death penalty" meeting or anti "mandatory death sentence" one?

Depends on the intelligence of the gatherers.

 

[scoopdreams]

Was the gathering an "anti death penalty" meeting or anti "mandatory death sentence" one?

It was a gathering to attract proponents of both objectives. The immediate goal is the same, pressure to repeal Vong's death sentence, and while the long-term goal deviates, it is fair cause to say this gathering is for both trains of thoughts.

 

[Goh Meng Seng]

Was the gathering an "anti death penalty" meeting or anti "mandatory death sentence" one?

The meeting was to ask participants to send a petition to President Nanthan to convene a Constitutional court hearing on whether the President has the power to clemency or the cabinet decides.

In my view, at this very moment, we have this Mandatory Death Penalty law which is set by the ruling party, administered by the police, public prosecutors and the court. All these come under the purview of the ministers in the cabinet.

It is intuitively unacceptable to have the power of clemency to be given to the cabinet. i.e. how could the cabinet ministers who are in charged of these institutions decide on what has been done and decided by the very people which is under their command to have made errors on the case? Wouldn't that damage the most important TRUST that is needed to persuade the people that Mandatory Death Penalty is necessary? Or the very people who wanted the draconian law to decide to be lenient? This is really counter-intuitive to human nature.

Thus I feel that the processes of determination of the death penalty must be reviewed and changed for the better. Thus, I was there.

Goh Meng Seng

 

[Ramseth]

Clothing can by 'hung', not human beings.

Sure they can, on a noose instead of a clothesline.

In ancient China, only the head was hung on display as deterrent.

 

[fukyuman]

I am anti-death penalty for its double standards. Maid kills employer and kid. Go buy petrol to burn them. It indicates planning, meaning murder which hanging is compulsory. She was let go because she is Indon. Indonesia does not take kindly to their people hanged so she is let go. The last time we hanged Indon was the terrorist bomber during confrontasi, in retaliation they lynched and hanged a fisherman they caught. Woman got shot by a sniper bullet on broad daylight. People believe its a Indon warning to Lau Lee. German girl Bohl got reprieved, because her ganja is exactly 499gms. One feather short of mandatory hanging. Guy spiked drinking water with poison, grassroot members die but no hanging, methinks he'll have a lot of dirty linen to unload should he stand trial for murder. In UK, poisoning is considered a deliberate and planned and many women were hanged before death penalty is banned. I salute GMS and like spirited people for making a public stand.

 

[Sideswipe]

The meeting was to ask participants to send a petition to President Nanthan to convene a Constitutional court hearing on whether the President has the power to clemency or the cabinet decides.

you got do research how many parliamentary system countries ( not monarchy ) give president power to grant clemency or cabinet decides.

 

[Ramseth]

you got do research how many parliamentary system countries ( not monarchy ) give president power to grant clemency or cabinet decides.

If monarch or president can override statute laws and judicial verdicts at fancy, then I worry.

 

[Goh Meng Seng]

you got do research how many parliamentary system countries ( not monarchy ) give president power to grant clemency or cabinet decides.

Even for the Yang Agong in Malaysia, he has such powers but must go through a tribunal for advice. He has his own discretionary power to decide. Same goes to the King/Queen of England, although at the moment, such powers has been delegated to another person.

But here, it is the cabinet which decides, the ELECTED President is just a rubber stamp. That is the difference.

The Thai King has the discretionary powers to grant clemency as well. So is the President of Taiwan. There are ample examples in the world.

Goh Meng Seng

 

[Ramseth]

The funny thing is people who never attended the court trial proceeding, never read the transcript of the case, decide that death penalty is wrong and the president is wrong not to grant clemency or not being advised by government to grant clemency. Ancient emperors had absolute powers of not only clemency but general amnesty. Could even declare general amnesty 特赦天下 all criminals pardoned just because he's happy on his birthday or something like that. You all want that? Millions of your ancestors fought to death to abolish that.

 

[littlefish]

I am firmly against the mandatory death penalty for drug trafficking for the simple reason that drug addicts are partly responsible for their own situation. If you are stupid enough to take drugs (despite all the warnings about the dangers), you deserve to have a screwed-up life. There are all kinds of addiction, smoking, alcohol, gambling, sex, etc. Why not impose the death penalty also on those who bring about these kinds of addiction? We will probably need to execute the entire Cabinet for allowing the casinos in SG since they are a major contributor to getting a gambling addiction and we all know that gambling addictions destroy lives and families as well.

The other reason is that I do not feel it is right for a human being to decide whether another human should live or die. However, this feeling gets very weak when I come across horrific cases of child abuse and I personally feel like killing the criminal myself. Sadly, perpetrators of child abuse do not have to face the death penalty. Because of this, I can't honestly say I am fully against the death penalty right now.