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Char brings U to North Korea

AceFrehley

Alfrescian (InfP)
Generous Asset

Look! By ASSOCIATED PRESS :eek::biggrin:


The North Korea they want us to see... and the North Korea we saw when press bus took wrong turn

  • Most foreign visitors to Pyongyang on the Communist North Korea never witness a pothole or a traffic jam
  • Journalists saw crumbling apartment blocks and two men in wheelchairs waiting at a bus stop
By ASSOCIATED PRESS PUBLISHED: 20:03 GMT, 12 April 2012 | UPDATED: 16:14 GMT, 13 April 2012

A wrong turning gave a bus full of western journalists a glimpse of a different side to North Korea today. Most foreign visitors to Pyongyang on the Communist heartland never witness a pothole, a traffic jam or a piece of litter bigger than a cigarette butt. Those with physical disabilities are hidden from view as is graffiti. Buses catering for people outside of North Korea only ever take roads which are well-maintained and spotlessly clean which is why photographers couldn’t wait to start snapping away when a Government-run tour inadvertently veered from the official path.

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Towering: A large modern apartment block in Pyongyang, North Korea, which the regime is happy for foreigners to see


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Hidden from view: Grim crumbling buildings inhabited by North Korean residents in the capital city mingle on the side of the street in Pyongyang


Instead of gleaming buildings such as the computer labs at Kim Il Sung University, filled with people whom the authorities insist are representative of the population, reporters saw crumbling apartment blocks and two men in wheelchairs waiting at a bus stop. Old people trudged along the sidewalk, some with handmade backpacks crafted from canvas bags. In place of the well-lit high-rise homes, there were shops shrouded in darkness and pavements lined in dirt rather than smooth tarmac.

There were stores with no lights, and side roads so battered they were more dirt than pavement. 'Perhaps this is an incorrect road?' mumbled one of the North Korean minders, well-dressed government officials who restrict reporters to meticulously staged presentations that inevitably center on praise for the three generations of Kim family who have ruled this country since 1948.

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Grim: A North Korean man pushes a wheelbarrow past a pile of coal in Pyongyang


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Manual labour: North Korean men at work close to the water on an industrial site. The images depict a world that North Korean officials try and hide


The three buses quickly reversed away from the less wealthy area of the city and headed back towards the original intended target, a plush, marbled building called the Hana Music Information Centre where recently deceased leader Kim Jong II made one of his final public appearances before his death in December last year. CBS news reported that Ri Jinju, who was leading the tour, said: ‘I hope that the journalists present here report only the absolute truth.

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How life REALLY is: Poor North Koreans living in a run-down concrete residential compound in Pyongyang, North Korea


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The North Korea they want you to see: University students swim inside a modern gleaming swimming pool complex at Kim Il-Sung University


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Plush: North Koreans relax in a smart new jacuzzi at Kim Il-sung University - but the reality is very different to the life of most people


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Modern: University students stand on a platform at the swimming pool before going down a slide


'The truth about how much our people miss our comrade Kim Jong Il, and how strong the unity is between the people and leadership, who are vigorously carrying out the leaders' instructions to build a great, prosperous and powerful nation.’ So controlling is the regime that police will detain and potentially expel any foreigner who tries to explore further afield than the few hotels that they are permitted to stay in. According to Anthony Brunello, a professor at Eckerd College in St. Petersburg, Florida, those in charge will go to huge lengths to create a system that will keep the Kim family in power.
"They've managed to create a process of control that works," he said.

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Gloom: A woman carries a baby on her back as she walks through an area of the North Korean city which resembles Soviet Russia


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Real life for North Koreans: Two men stood by a concrete wall look up at a plane flying overhead yesterday. To many North Koreans these pictures likely depict a very middle class life as conditions in the countryside are far grimmer


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Rundown highrise: A residential tower block seen in Pyongyang yesterday as a bus full of journalists took a wrong turn into an area that is normally hidden from them

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What they want you to see: THousands of people gather for the unveiling of statues of the North Korean leaders, Kim Il Sung, and his son Kim Jong Il, during an unveiling ceremony in Pyongyang


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Bizarre: Cartoon characters decorate the outside of the Dudan duck factory which employs 1,000 workers and produces 7,000 tons of duck products a year in Pyongyang


At Kim Il Sung University students young people in the swimming pool were seen enjoying the luxurious, well-finished surroundings that feature plastic slides and a jacuzzi. Journalists normally see only the clean streets outside their bus windows, and the showcase buildings - the Victorious Fatherland Liberation War Museum, the palace commemorating the Kims' 'juche' philosophy of self-reliance, the computer labs at Kim Il Sung University - filled with people that the minders insist are everyday North Koreans.

The students in the classrooms don't glance up as dozens of reporters rumble in, and the professor's lecture continues without pause. The young people in the university pool careen down the plastic slide, in front of TV cameras, as if they are completely alone. Ri heaps high praise on her former leader. She says: ‘The more time passes by the more we miss our Dear Leader Kim Jong II. ‘I don't think we can ever find any person so great.’

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Dilapidated old travel car: North Korean commuters pass by in a trolley car in Pyongyang - in a far cry from the modern image of the country the regime want to present


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Salughterhouse: A North Korean woman cleans ducks on a processing line at the Dudan duck factory


It's not clear why the regime hides places like the dusty, potholed neighborhood, which is just a mile or so from the centre of town, across the trolley tracks and just off Tongil Street. It doesn't look like a war zone, or even like a particularly rough New York City neighborhood. Many streets in New Delhi, the capital of one of the world's fastest-growing economies, look far more battered and far poorer.To most North Koreans, one-quarter of whom depend on international food aid, living in homes without electricity or running water, the neighborhood would look upper-middle-class.Special permits are required to live in the capital city, and life here is vastly better than it is for most people in the countryside. There are predictable government jobs here, electricity at least a few hours a day, better-stocked stores, schools that have indoor bathrooms. But the officials still hide the run-down neighborhoods. There's a certain view of North Korea they want visitors to have.

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Urban living: A schoolgirl walks under a bridge in front of residential tower blocks. Although the accommodation wouldn't look out of place in a Western city like New York, the regime are not keen to show it off


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Modern... or technology out of the 1970s? South Korea show off their scientific prowess ahead of their satellite launch - which flopped within seconds

According to defectors North Koreans have similar stresses to those living in capitalist societies. They get frustrated by politics in their jobs, they aspire to buy their own cars and look forward to a holiday at the beach. In times of difficulty such as the famine in the 1990s, they dream of having enough food to prevent their children from starving to death.

Yet the more rundown area the journalists were accidentally driven into today would appear plush to many North Koreans who depend on international food aid and live in homes without electricity or running water.

Special permits are required to live in the capital city, and life there is considerably easier than it is for the majority of people living in the countryside.

There are predictable government jobs in Pyongyang, electricity for at least a few hours a day, better-stocked stores and schools that have indoor bathrooms.

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Urban life: North Korean workers, left, repair a street in the city yesterday as a man rides past on a bicycle


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Workers: Flowers are laid in a street as the country prepares for national celebrations


 

Hysteria

Alfrescian (Inf)
Asset


<iframe src="//www.youtube.com/embed/EeQDykW6BYU?rel=0" allowfullscreen="" frameborder="0" height="360" width="640"></iframe>

How North Korean Girls Settle a Dispute


 

Char_Azn

Alfrescian (Inf)
Asset

This article is redundant. How many country in the world will organize tours to slums. Unless U are blind, they never bother to hide the poor state of North Korea, they just don't show it to U. Just like how 99.99% of any travel tour in the world would do if U visit any other country. No country in the world is eager to show U how poor they are. I've been to many countries way worse than North Korea, those pictures are not even remotely close to what I'll consider poor. I actually seen worse while I was there. Just goes to show how desperate the press is to make a bad impression of DPRK
 
J

JeanGrey

Guest
This article is redundant. How many country in the world will organize tours to slums. Unless U are blind, they never bother to hide the poor state of North Korea, they just don't show it to U. Just like how 99.99% of any travel tour in the world would do if U visit any other country. No country in the world is eager to show U how poor they are. I've been to many countries way worse than North Korea, those pictures are not even remotely close to what I'll consider poor. I actually seen worse while I was there. Just goes to show how desperate the press is to make a bad impression of DPRK

you may be right. he might have flipped the coin too. i think the cat is out of the bag.
 
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Sideswipe

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Asset
This article is redundant. How many country in the world will organize tours to slums. Unless U are blind, they never bother to hide the poor state of North Korea, they just don't show it to U. Just like how 99.99% of any travel tour in the world would do if U visit any other country. No country in the world is eager to show U how poor they are. I've been to many countries way worse than North Korea, those pictures are not even remotely close to what I'll consider poor. I actually seen worse while I was there. Just goes to show how desperate the press is to make a bad impression of DPRK


next time, you travel beyond the best developed Pyongyang and Kaesong and the immediate areas into the central regions. the conditions could be very terrible there.

Pyongyang is comparable to which city in Asia ?
 

sleaguepunter

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Asset
next time, you travel beyond the best developed Pyongyang and Kaesong and the immediate areas into the central regions. the conditions could be very terrible there.

Pyongyang is comparable to which city in Asia ?

i admit areas outside pyongyang can be terrible but within pyongyang itself, it give outsiders a feeling time had stopped in pyongyang since the 1960s/70s where there still electrical trams and buses still ply the roads and fuel stations are few and far between. But unlike those pictures we seen on western news, there are many more cars on the roads that what western news pictures shown. while there the usual Ladas and chinese made boxes, there are also many japanese, S Korean and Conti cars on pyongyang roads. i even saw a proton gen 2 while i was there. There also a mobile phone boom in NK, can see many Nkoreans chatting on their mobile while they are walking on the street. according to the minder, subscription plan is quarterly payment, also have free minutes and sms and within budget of middle class.

as for the article claiming didnt no potholes on Nkorean roads, the farker was lying as the half an hr drive from airport are full of potholes. unlike C A, i didnt went there as tourist, so what i saw are more authentic than him as i was brought to very rundown areas as that the only way to go where i was suppose to go and the minders didnt even bother to hide anything. i was also brought by minders to an eating place frequent by ordinary Nkoreans, maybe middle class level, the price very cheap compare to the hotel. people should at least try to go pyongyang once before they really open up to experience the commie feeling.

as for ah leong, he wont like to go there as cyclists are only allow to ride on pavement and have to get off their bike to push whenever they reach a traffic junction. if the junction dont allow crossing, then they have to push their bike into the underpass which can be find in every traffic junction. i would like this to be implemented in singapore.
 

Char_Azn

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Asset
Yes we were all blindfolded on the way between Pyongyang -> Dandong, Pyongyang -> Kaesong, Pyongyang -> Nampo that's why I saw only the nice parts :rolleyes:

This is getting tiring. Seriously pple, traveled from the northern end of the country to the very south, there is absolutely no way they can hide EVERYTHING from the tourist. U jokers need to stop believing every freaking bullshit U read on the internet

Yes the country is poor, I've been to a lot of poor countries, North Korea is one of them and frankly speaking no where near the worse. Like sleaguepunter mentioned, there were potholes everywhere outside Pyongyang once U get on the expressway, do U think anyone in their right minds would go take pictures of potholes.

Just about every small town and village I came across have no proper roads. Do most normal tourist stop and take pictures of m&d roads? Of coz not. Yes the country is poor, yes they strongly oppose bad images of themselves posted outside the country however this is no where near the worse place I've been to and this is no where near as bad as any of us thinks it is

For comparison sake this is how a village in North Korea looks like
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And this is what a village in India looks like
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This is what a tram/bus in North Korea looks like
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And this is what a bus in India looks like
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With that in Mind is North Korea really that bad? No, I think not. It's not rich, I won't want to live there but it's no where near as bad as the west makes it out to be

next time, you travel beyond the best developed Pyongyang and Kaesong and the immediate areas into the central regions. the conditions could be very terrible there.

Pyongyang is comparable to which city in Asia ?



The state of the city reminds me somewhat of SG probably in the 50-60s with very clean streets and trees and plants that are well kept and very organized
 

singveld

Alfrescian (Inf)
Asset
i was very interested in visiting north korea, so i ask for some information from travel agency in singapore that organise group tour.
i look at the itinerary, i am only interested in the games, which is about 2 hours and the rest of it just too boring, min like 7 days.
So i go back to my first world destination and forget about third world north korea. I seen south korea many times, i dun really feel like meeting stupider version of south korean.
 

Char_Azn

Alfrescian (Inf)
Asset
i was very interested in visiting north korea, so i ask for some information from travel agency in singapore that organise group tour.
i look at the itinerary, i am only interested in the games, which is about 2 hours and the rest of it just too boring, min like 7 days.
So i go back to my first world destination and forget about third world north korea. I seen south korea many times, i dun really feel like meeting stupider version of south korean.

In that case U should do what I did. Tour China and swing by North Korea. Mine was only a 4 day tour.
 

sleaguepunter

Alfrescian (Inf)
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As everyone know North Korea is a poor 3rd world communist country and is pretty restrictive so be prepared for a few things
  1. They will ask U to bow at the statue of Dear Leader and 1 or 2 other locations
  2. Food there is pretty CMI
  3. We were warned not to discuss with them on political and economical matters. U can ask questions with the tour guide about their system, mine was more than happy to explain it to me but I didn't press him on too much about the economy or politics
  4. There isn't much to do after dark. There is a casino at the basement of the hotel and Chinese TV and 1 or 2 English news channels are available but that's about it. They pretty much pack the whole day with activities so there isn't going to be much free time until after dinner.
  5. Be prepared for propaganda heaven. Some of the locations like the Kim old family home and the War museum is propaganda heaven. U'll roll your eyes when they mention stuff like the great revolutionary family and the family well which they call the "Holy Well" coz Kim Il Sung used to drink from it. It's actually pretty easy to tell what's real and what's propaganda.

haha... mine a bit different experience, i almost didnt go to the statues of the dead leaders as my schedule for the trip was too packed. i only went on the last day in the late afternoon because i asked to go look see look see.

as for the food CMI, maybe tour group kenna robert head as the food i had while i was there was very good, the korean food are much better than the fake korean food that spore serve.

the hotel have around 6-7 cable channels, 2 from cctv, 1 fenghuang tai, BBC, a couple of russian channels and that arab news channel (cannot remember the name) and a couple more other channels that i cannot remember. was rather surprise they had BBC available in pyongyang.

didnt encounter any propaganda BS as mine was a working trip but from what i saw on video on Arirang mass display, the NK performance make spore NDP look like child play.
 

Sideswipe

Alfrescian (Inf)
Asset
With that in Mind is North Korea really that bad? No, I think not. It's not rich, I won't want to live there but it's no where near as bad as the west makes it out to be


i just feel that you conclude your opinions on North Korea too quickly based on the short stay. i believe you that the West purposefully exaggerates NK's terrible conditions and problems but much of it is probably true. i have to go there and see for myself...
 

Char_Azn

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Char Siew u ingrate.

I helped u to resurrect your thread and not even a thank you from you but it's ok.

U have way too many clones for me to keep track. The thread didnt really need to be resurrected but thanks.

i just feel that you conclude your opinions on North Korea too quickly based on the short stay. i believe you that the West purposefully exaggerates NK's terrible conditions and problems but much of it is probably true. i have to go there and see for myself...

I've said many times throughout this thread that I do believe some of he stories we read are true to a certain extent. No smoke without fire. I just want to point out that base on my trip the country is nowhere near as bad as we think it is. I do not think it is unfair to assume that we all thought North Korea was probably one of the worse place in Asia if not the world. Like I pointed out it's no where near as bad and in no way was it as restrictive as most pple thought it to be. Yes I agree with U my stay was too short to assume to much but I know what I saw ad whatever I said here was about what I saw. Most seem to just assume they were trying to hide the whole damn country and every bad thing that happen there from the world which wasn't true. In fact when talking about the country my tour guide readily told us about problems like food shortage and electricity shortage
 

Neptune

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Loyal

Life is good for Pyongyang’s elite

But outside the capital, North Koreans struggle to make ends meet

Nov 13,2013

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The gap in the standard of living between Pyongyang and other North Korean cities is widening under the Kim Jong-un regime, sources who recently visited the country told the JoongAng Ilbo.

In the past few months, the North Korean capital has experienced a veritable boom in cutting-edge technology, Western-style businesses and high-rise apartment buildings. And this newfound prosperity, observers speculate, is largely a bid by the country’s young leader to uphold support from the capital’s elite classes and increase revenue in the isolated nation’s political heart. On a visit to Pyongyang last week, one Korean businessman noticed significant changes on Changjong Street in the downtown area.

At Haemaji (Sunrise) Restaurant, foreigners and city residents alike were sitting there browsing the Internet on smartphones or tablet computers, he told the JoongAng Ilbo. “It was a scene just like any you would see in downtown Seoul,” the businessman said. “In Pyongyang, Western-style cafe culture is taking off.”

In fact, Kim Jong-un and his wife Ri Sol-ju recently visited the cafe, one of the waitresses told him. They enjoyed the popcorn, she said.

Similarly, another restaurant, which opened in May, lets its customers peruse the menu on tablet computers rather than on paper. Despite its high prices - a serving of bulgogi (Korean-style marinated beef) costs around $70 - the venue has proven popular with the wealthy class, most likely because of its embrace of modern technology.

“Under Kim Jong-un, business regulations .?.?. have been eased, triggering luxury markets targeted at the wealthy class,” said Lim Gang-taek, a researcher at the Korea Institute for National Unification. “Entertainment and amusement facilities are thriving as North Korean authorities try to increase the flow of U.S. dollars.”

An influx of newly-built apartments and an increase in the number of taxi cabs has also added to the reshaping of Pyongyang.

Previously, there were only 80 cabs in the Communist capital, said the businessman, but since Kim Jong-un’s inauguration, 1,000 have been mobilized. Those cabs provide 24-hour service, with fares starting at 500 North Korean won per kilometer ($3.75 per 0.6 miles) - more expensive than local buses, at 50 North Korean won.

High-rises have also begun to dot the urban landscape, he added, with most averaging between $20,000 and $60,000 in price.

But these changes mean little to the people who live outside of Pyongyang, where the oppression of a sickly economy and scarce resources is an everyday reality.

“Tensions are rising [in these areas],” said another businessman who visited North Korea recently. “Groups of three or more people have been banned from gathering.”

Authorities are also cracking down on those who watch South Korean dramas or video clips critical of the Kim Jong-un regime. Crackdowns are particularly acute in the border regions with China, the man added.

Skyrocketing prices have also contributed to discontent. The rental fare from Pyongyang to Wonsan, he said, which used to cost 10,000 North Korean won per ticket, has now surged to 40,000 North Korean won.

Things have gotten so bad in some areas, he said, that many people are increasingly turning to street markets - commonly known as “grasshopper markets” - to buy scarce goods. To avoid apprehension, vendors are constantly on the move, fleeing or staying out of sight when a crackdown might be imminent.

Some observers say this trend may only serve to strengthen anti-government feelings in North Korea’s greater reaches.

“Money and resources are limited,” said Cho Bong-hyun, a research fellow at the IBK Institute, “so Kim Jong-un has had to focus on taking care of the elite class in Pyongyang.”

Compared to daily life in the countryside, the wealth in the capital is painfully apparent, said a third Korean businessman.

When he visited Pyongyang, he said, he witnessed a military general drive up with his family to the Pothonggang Hotel in a Mercedes-Benz sedan. They dined on a multi-course meal, followed by drinks and shopping in the hotel’s duty-free shop. The businessman estimated that the cost of their dinner was around $400.

So far, the visitors agreed, it appears as though the regime has no intention of reining in its spending or its extravagant projects.

In July 2012, Kim Jong-un orchestrated the construction of the Rungna People’s Pleasure Ground in July 2012 - equipped with a so-called dolphinarium, a swimming pool and mini-golf course.

He also oversaw the construction of the Mirim Horse Riding Club, and the 10,000-square-meter Munsu Water Park, built at the behest of his late father Kim Jong-il.

Construction is also underway in Wonsan City on the 11-course Masikryong Ski Resort.

BY LEE YOUNG-JONG [[email protected]]

 
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