• IP addresses are NOT logged in this forum so there's no point asking. Please note that this forum is full of homophobes, racists, lunatics, schizophrenics & absolute nut jobs with a smattering of geniuses, Chinese chauvinists, Moderate Muslims and last but not least a couple of "know-it-alls" constantly sprouting their dubious wisdom. If you believe that content generated by unsavory characters might cause you offense PLEASE LEAVE NOW! Sammyboy Admin and Staff are not responsible for your hurt feelings should you choose to read any of the content here.

    The OTHER forum is HERE so please stop asking.

Breaking News!Pastor Kong Hee And Pastors Arrested And Charge!

drifter

Alfrescian (InfP)
Generous Asset
i believe all christians will said CHC is a cult and they con ppl money . they even said that other smaller churches dont do that ( i believed those smaller church if even the chance they will also behave like CHC ) . in my years of studies about religions , as long as you believe in god theres high chances you will get con without you knowing it . i have friends who move from churches to churches , religions to religions end of the day they stop believing theres a god .
 

makapaaa

Alfrescian (Inf)
Asset
[h=2]Kong Hee speaks out against charges: I maintain my integrity![/h]Posted by temasektimes on June 30, 2012
Embattled founder of City Harvest Church (CHC) pastor Kong Hee spoke out defiantly against the charges slapped on him by the prosecutors during a service at Singapore Expo Hall this evening.
Kong Hee was charged together with four other CHC members on Wednesday for misusing the church funds to further the music career of his singer wife Ho Yeow Sun after two years of investigations by the Commercial Affairs Department (CAD)
With his wife up on stage with him, Kong Hee declared loudly:
“I maintain my integrity.”
Hugging his wife on stage to win public sympathy, he added:
“There were times when Sun and I just didn’t know what to do…The past few days have been very challenging. Please know that there are always two sides to a story. I look forward to the day I can tell you my side of the story in court.”
Despite the gravity of the offences allegedly committed by him, CHC members continue to support him as evident by packed crowd of 5,000 people with many banners saying ‘I love Pastor Kong.’
Some members also gave testimonies on the church’s “Crossover Project” started in 2002 supposedly as a way to use Ho’s secular music to connect with people and reach out to non-Christians, which was highlighted by the prosecutors as a destination for CHC’s funds via sham companies in the charge sheet.
CHC had earlier threw its weight behind pastor Kong Hee and expressed disappointment that he and seven other members were suspended from the board by the Commissioner of Charities:
“The people currently in the news are our pastors and trusted staff and leaders who have always put God and CHC first. As a church we stand with them and I believe fully in their integrity.”
Meanwhile, Kong Hee has been tweeting and posting on Facebook to rally his supporters. He had earlier implored them to pray for him on Facebook, but the post has since been deleted.
 

makapaaa

Alfrescian (Inf)
Asset
[h=2]VIDEO: “Honor God by your generous giving” – Kong Hee[/h]Posted by temasektimes on June 30, 2012
In one of his sermons, disgraced founder of City Harvest Church (CHC) Kong Hee told the congregation to ‘honor’ God by their generous giving.

CHC found itself in the public spotlight lately after Kong Hee and four other members were charged on Wednesday for misusing the church’s funds and criminal breach of trust.
Watch the video below:
<IFRAME class=youtube-player height=390 src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/PFL-C2Lsaig?version=3&rel=1&fs=1&showsearch=0&showinfo=1&iv_load_policy=1&wmode=transparent" frameBorder=0 width=640 type="text/html"></IFRAME>__________________________________________________________________________________________________​
 

drifter

Alfrescian (InfP)
Generous Asset
Re: Youtube comments supporting Kong Hee!

<iframe width="853" height="480" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/sX7zv10ZiVY" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Now his speeches sound so insincere and fake.
hexmeohdear 4 hours ago

YOU THIS MOTHER FUCKER! DONT LET ME SEE U! I WILL JUST SHOUT AT U! KONG HEE, UR MOTHER CB! SMELLY CB! GIVE BIRTH TO A LIER LIKE U! FUCK UR MOTHER CHIO CB!
blurrliao 12 hours ago

you mother fucker kong hee, u sue Mr Roland 10 yrs ago! when he point out that, the church has use its funding to support KNNBCCB Sun ho music career! u sue him, and he paid all the money he have to you! now, it has proof he is correct! but... during that time, u insist and u even engage lawyer to whack him! you r rich! u can do whatever u can! but, not now, ... u want to sue me??? come... u mother fucker! let me tell u this, now... its not only me that will call u mother fucker!!!!!
blurrliao 12 hours ago


he know nothing but money! 30 fold 60 fold and 100 fold return :smile: now, its time he return everything to the GOD'S! its time he and his fucking cb wife get some real action from the government!
blurrliao in reply to momothebored (Show the comment) 12 hours ago
Reply ShareRemoveFlag for spamBlock UserUnblock User
no no no, its... his mother fucker x 1000000 :smile:
blurrliao in reply to CHris Chow (Show the comment) 12 hours ago

Motherfucker

CHris Chow 1 day ago


1 Timothy 6:9 But those who desire to be rich fall into temptation, into a snare, into many senseless and harmful desires that plunge people into ruin and destruction.
shakirhasrik 1 day ago


He approached all youngsters and Brain wash youngsters to join as Christians and he Live a Luxury Life, all those stupid people !!! Buddhist or Taoist don't do that, cheat the public and for own use!!!
HandsomeBoyboy 3 days ago


yup! thats how they got the money to start business in singapore and enjoying life at U.S :smile: rent a 7.7 million house, and fund her bitchy wife albrum :smile: smart guy :smile:
Topdeckable in reply to atarodg (Show the comment) 3 days ago


hahahahaah thanks u :smile: yes ofcoz, surely u need to say THANKS YOU! so many ppl get brain wash from you and DONATE so much money to you and your bitchy wife :smile: they paid all the expenses while ur bitchy wife enjoying her stay at U.S :smile: surely u need to thanks all of ur supporter bro :smile:
Topdeckable 3 days ago

now he try to preach how his church saves ppl :wink: whahahahaha trying to paint how important his church is and wanted to gain support from his sheeps :wink:
 

laksaboy

Alfrescian (Inf)
Asset
Re: Youtube comments supporting Kong Hee!

The video was uploaded in Aug 2011, so I don't think it's a sermon from this weekend.
 

drifter

Alfrescian (InfP)
Generous Asset
the goverment should close down that cult immediately to stop him from brainwashing his sheeps to support him ...if the goverment dont do that im sure there will be protest in singapore if he kena convicted . dont give him any chance to stage a holy war !!!!!
 

drifter

Alfrescian (InfP)
Generous Asset
Re: Youtube comments supporting Kong Hee!

The video was uploaded in Aug 2011, so I don't think it's a sermon from this weekend.

oh ...im sorry my mistake . i thought its from this weekend sermon thats why is he talking about how important the church is for changing ppl lives .
 

sense

Alfrescian
Loyal
With his wife up on stage with him, Kong Hee declared loudly:
“I maintain my integrity.”
Hugging his wife on stage to win public sympathy, he added:
“There were times when Sun and I just didn’t know what to do…The past few days have been very challenging. Please know that there are always two sides to a story. I look forward to the day I can tell you my side of the story in court.”

clapping.gif


Good. For a simple start, we look forward to you exclaiming "Not guilty" in front of the judge.

More for you later...
 

cleareyes

Alfrescian
Loyal
Below is a very impressive and in-depth analysis from a enterprise perspective by a christian blogger from http://therealsingapore.com/content/depth-analysis-wealth-city-harvest-church ::...


An in-depth analysis into the wealth of City Harvest Church


Although I am aware that City Harvest is one of the richest churches in Singapore, I am still shocked that it is rich enough to pay SGD310 million for a stake in Suntec City. Nevertheless, an entity which is able to amass such wealth is certainly worth studying. I was determined to understand the secrets to the church's wealth.



I apologize upfront if the points raised give offense to loyal followers of City Harvest Church. Please regard this article as a business analysis of the factors that contribute to the wealth of City Harvest Church, not as an insinuation that the Church got rich through questionable means. The fact is that CHC is very rich and this makes for a fascinating academic exercise to examine its sources of wealth. Just treat it as a business case study. I have tried my best to stick to the facts. Please correct me if there are factual mistakes. However, if there are differences in opinions, please disagree with courtesy.



1. Clever packaging of Sunday services

The income of a church is dependent on the tithes collected (10% of income from church-members). Therefore, the earning power of a church is highly dependent on its ability to retain its existing church members and attract new ones. The larger the church membership, the greater its earnings.



I watched a sample of CHC weekend service on its website. Compared to the boring Sunday classes I attended as a kid, CHC church service was most refreshing (Watch "The 10 Laws Of The Harvest"). The beginning part resembles a rock concert with good singing and enthusiastic audience. It is an entertaining way to enjoy your Sunday mornings. Going to church becomes a weekly event to look forward to rather than a chore to attend to.



With church services so well packaged for its customers, its customer retention rate and new customer acquisition figures should look good.



2. Extra revenue in the form of advertisements, sales of CDs

This church is unlike the other churches I know. It generates extra revenue through advertisements during its Sunday service(watch the videos). It sells audio CDs on its website. There is an online shopping cart for convenience to those who want to buy online.



3. Efficient collection of tithes

Church-members can pay their tithe online via credit card, eNets or even Giro!! Once members started donating using Giro, the earnings quality of the church improves. Donation collected via Giro tend to be more stable.



With a globalised economy, people travel round the world a lot and may miss Sunday services. In the past, the churches will lose income when these members fail to turn up to pay their tithe. Now, with online payment, they can continue collecting the tithe even when the church-member is working overseas for an extended period of time. With Giro, the church can continue collecting tithes for a few more months even when the member leaves the church as people have a habit of forgetting what they pay on Giro.



4. 30-fold, 60-fold, 100-fold returns on your church donations

This is where the genius of CHC lies and the secret to its superior earning power. In fact, I have yet to encounter any public-listed company on SGX, HKSE, NYSE, Nasdaq that demonstrates better potential.



The pastor preaches that God will give 30-fold, 60-fold, 100-fold returns on your tithe. But, you have to be generous in your donations first so that you will receive in harvest proportions. I guess that is the origin of the name City Harvest. Please watch the video "The 10 Laws Of The Harvest" yourself in its entirety and interpret for yourself.



It is a message that cleverly uses an astute understanding of human nature to maximize profits. If I were a CHC member, I will be tempted to increase my tithe as much as possible. Not mincing my words, I am doing it out of pure greed. I do not think I will be alone. It is perfectly fine if members of CHC strongly disagree and thinks that I am not representative for most of them. After all, I can only speak for myself.



5. Quality of customers

With the 100-fold return message, the kind of church members attracted will be most conducive to profit-making. Money-minded people will be attracted to the church. These money-minded people tend to be ambitious and have a great desire to make lots of money. Millionaire minds have a higher chance to become rich. Hence, the quality of customers that CHC attracts are of the highest quality. The richer the church-member, the higher is the church's tithe per member.



Customer quality will be enhanced through the passage of time due to survivor bias. Suppose out of this pool of Millionaire-Mind Christians, 50% become satisfactorily rich and the remaining 50% still unsatisfactorily middle-class. The 50% who got rich will donate even more because they think their source of wealth comes from their donations. It is most unlikely they will cut back on their tithes because they will be afraid God will punish them by cutting back the returns. If they are not afraid, the church will be there to warn them not to do so. The remaining 50% who did not get rich will be disillusioned and probably leave the church. The loss is of little significance to the church. These people are not rich and their tithes will not amount to much.



Many Christians will be disgusted with the concept of using tithes to get rich. These people will probably leave the church after attending a few Sunday services. Again, the loss is of little significance to CHC. These people will not be highly profitable to the church even if they are rich because they are not going to tithe as much as the others who believe their tithes is the way to wealth.



To the credit of the Pastor, I think he has devised a wonderful process of filtering out non-profitable customers and sucking in the lucrative ones. There is only so much physical space that a church can have to service its church-members. To maximize profits, the church has to ensure that each unit of space is used for servicing lucrative customers.



6. Kill off competition



CHC has tremendous economic moat that kills off competition. In the video "The 10 Laws of The Harvest", the Pastor cited Law #5 "Your Seed must be planted in Good Ground" which is an effective weapon in killing off his competition - the smaller churches. Many Christians feel that they ought to donate to the needy, smaller churches rather than rich mega-churches like CHC. The Pastor's argument is that you do not get good returns like 100-fold in the small churches. You have to donate to mega-churches to maximize returns on your tithe because they have a track record (rich church members). In other words, the seed is not planted in good ground when you donate to the small churches. In his own words, "I don't always give to the neediest but to the ground that will give the greatest yield". To illustrate his point, he used an analogy on weak banks and strong banks. You do not deposit your money in a weak bank because it desperately needs fresh funds to survive. You deposit your money in a strong bank which invests your money wisely and yields good returns.



The church has an iron-grip on its members who believe its message. As illustrated previously, its customer base is of the highest quality. This is its track record. Existing church-members will definitely not move to another smaller, needier church with poorer track record.

It has a very strong economic moat as it is very hard for its competitors to get its customers to switch over.



7. Providing a place where the rich can network

As the Pastor said, his church provides a good ground on which you can grow your riches. Rightly so, indeed. For property agents or insurance agents trying to hit their sales quota, City Harvest Church will be an ideal place to hunt for lucrative clients. This church concentrates several rich and money-minded people into a single location. The church offers a unique advantage to sell things. In a religious setting, people tend less to be on their guard and can be more easily persuaded to part with their money.





Businessmen also like to network in places where there are rich and powerful people who will come in handy in future. The Pastor has done a good job in gathering such people in his church and it makes good sense to make use of this advantage by joining the church.





The rich will attract more rich and the gathering moss snowballs to provide an ever-rising pool of donation to the church.



8. Preach what people like to hear.

As a teenager, I was discouraged when I read Bible verses like Matthew 19:23-24 "I tell you the truth, it is hard for a rich man to enter the kingdom of heaven. Again I tell you, it is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to enter the kingdom of God." and Matthew 6:24 "No one can serve two masters; for either he will hate the one and love the other, or he will be devoted to one and despise the other. You cannot serve God and wealth."



It seems like if I become rich, I will be condemned to hell.



In the video "Rich God? Poor God?", the Pastor preaches that it is absolutely ok to be rich. Some prophets of God were very rich. (Abraham, David, Solomon)



There is nothing more musical to a money-minded person than to hear that God is on your side in your pursuit of money. The church-members who are more money-minded will love this and donate even more.



9. God pays for the returns, not the church.

The church collects the money, but God pays for the returns. The church does not need to pay a single cent for the 30-fold, 60-fold, 100-fold returns on the donations.

This is as good as you do the work for me, but not only do I not pay you, I shall also collect your salary. You toil and sweat, but I shall eat your bread. God must surely be a miracle worker and people will pay handsomely for his service. I cannot think of a more advantageous economic position to be in to be able to collect money rendered by a miracle worker.



10. Social pressure to conform in church settings and ease of influence

If everyone around you donates, it is hard not to. When everyone else makes sacrifice, the one who does not will look like an outcast. There is tremendous pressure to conform in such a herd setting.



11. Tremendous future earning power

Take a look at the congregation and you will notice the large number of young people. The income growth of young people is the fastest in the population. In the Pastor's words, "You may be poor today, but you will not be poor all your life". That is a long-term business plan in cultivating its customers.



Therefore, if CHC can be viewed as a growth stock, its prospects are very bright as its young customers will accelerate its earnings.



12. Stable earnings in times of depression

Besides being a growth stock, CHC can also be viewed as a defensive and safe stock. People pray hardest when they fall in hard times. Strangely, some people have an urge to tithe when they are in financial troubles.



In fact, in the video (The 10 Laws Of The Harvest), a couple came on stage. They talked about the dire straits they were in when they started out. Things change when God challenged them to GIVE themselves out of poverty (exact words from the speaker). Despite not having any money, they still pledged $250 to the building fund. In his own words again, "we often emptied our savings to give to the House of God knowing that this will be the answer to our financial problems". Hence, not only will the church earnings be stable in times of depression, it may even grow.



13. Using Prosperity as a theme to appeal to customers


The Pastor preaches Prosperity Gospel which resolves around money. His business genius lies in choosing this theme for his church. Money has universal appeal. Everyone worships money regardless of race, culture, age, gender, sexual orientation. In one fell swoop, he has enlarged his market to cover the entire world. It is much easier to convert people to your belief by dangling money and promising great prosperity. After all, who does not love money?



By enlarging his potential market catchment with a greater chance of increasing membership, more donations will flow in.



14. Tax benefits as church is registered as a charity

This creates a huge, unfair advantage compared to all other businesses. This is what landed CHC in controversy. Enough has been said.



If one day the Pastor switches to become a businessman, I will definitely consider investing in the company that he heads and founds.



If City Harvest Church is listed on the Singapore Stock Exchange, I will certainly buy it. It will be one stock that I am confident of hitting a return of 30-fold, 60-fold, 100-fold returns.



PS: People tend not to question critically when it comes to religion. A charming smooth talker can easily sway minds with his interpretation of the Bible. In the final analysis, Faith is about simply believing. You cannot approach it scientifically because there is no way to test religious theories using the scientific method. We will only know the real truth when judgment day comes.



The danger is that there is no accountability on the part of the preacher on whether his teachings are true or not. Even he himself cannot be sure that his interpretations is 100% correct. Given human nature, the interpretations will tend to be self-serving. In fact, it is not only dangerous to the students but to the teacher as well. People will believe their own lies if it yields tempting benefits. That was how Wall Street drank its own Kool-Aid.



While I respect the Pastor for his business savvy, I cannot agree with his interpretations of the Bible. I pray for good health, peace and harmony for my family. Money-minded as I am, I am not comfortable with commercializing my relationship with God by asking for money. The Christian God that I know from my own reading of the Bible is not 财神爷. Of course, if God wants to drop money from heaven on me, I will be more than happy to embrace it.



Source: http://thinking-free-and-fair.blogspot.sg

A very very very good and detail breakdown of the situation

The only problem is: how many people get to read this to understand the situation better??
 

Jumong

Alfrescian
Loyal
the goverment should close down that cult immediately to stop him from brainwashing his sheeps to support him ...if the goverment dont do that im sure there will be protest in singapore if he kena convicted . dont give him any chance to stage a holy war !!!!!

I don't think CHC members have the balls to protest in public. Most, if not all, are basically Sinkies. The stop-gap measure now for CHC management is to portray themselves as victims under siege. If you look at the size of the church, you can count the overheads per month. If contributions drop to a level where overheads cannot be covered, the church will self disintegrate. You can imagine what is going to happen if they admit their wrongdoings. The exodus will be massive! This is the one thing that really frightens them - income from tithes.
 

dredd

Alfrescian
Loyal
I don't think CHC members have the balls to protest in public. Most, if not all, are basically Sinkies. The stop-gap measure now for CHC management is to portray themselves as victims under siege. If you look at the size of the church, you can count the overheads per month. If contributions drop to a level where overheads cannot be covered, the church will self disintegrate. You can imagine what is going to happen if they admit their wrongdoings. The exodus will be massive! This is the one thing that really frightens them - income from tithes.

You are absolutely right. Notice all the "protest" letters to higher authorities are those made by people who stand to lose out big time should the exodus begin and the rot starts. People like the cheebye Aries Zulsimilancheow. Without CHC, he probably will be a pizza delivery mat. Of course there will be the usual wayang of one or some pea-brained mudder farkers who will cry, stand up and proclaim Con Hee as God himself but we all know this is PR bullshit. People will leave, there's no doubt.

.
 

drifter

Alfrescian (InfP)
Generous Asset
I don't think CHC members have the balls to protest in public. Most, if not all, are basically Sinkies. The stop-gap measure now for CHC management is to portray themselves as victims under siege. If you look at the size of the church, you can count the overheads per month. If contributions drop to a level where overheads cannot be covered, the church will self disintegrate. You can imagine what is going to happen if they admit their wrongdoings. The exodus will be massive! This is the one thing that really frightens them - income from tithes.

we should never underestimate the power of brainwash especially using religion as a tools . thats why until now theres many gong kia members still support con-hee still urgue that their pestor never misuse the church funds .
 

laksaboy

Alfrescian (Inf)
Asset
Tithes are just the tip of the iceberg. People who have been to church will know.

There are offerings in every service. An offering bag would be passed around and you put your money inside. This is different and separate from tithes. Tithes are a pledge of 10% of your monthly salary. Offerings, on the other hand, have no limit cap. You can donate as much or as little (or not at all) as you want.

Don't forget the building funds and mission funds. Tickets for plays/movie screenings. Pesterings to buy CDs and certain publications/books.

Lastly, even if you don't give a single cent, as a churchgoer you'll most likely be participating in ministry: choir, ushering, planning, cell groups, prayer meetings etc. That sucks up your time. But if it's your religion, if giving time and money to an institution makes you happy, and if you crave that social connection (fellowship) with other like-minded believers, then go ahead. Personally, I see no point.
 

drifter

Alfrescian (InfP)
Generous Asset
You are absolutely right. Notice all the "protest" letters to higher authorities are those made by people who stand to lose out big time should the exodus begin and the rot starts. People like the cheebye Aries Zulsimilancheow. Without CHC, he probably will be a pizza delivery mat. Of course there will be the usual wayang of one or some pea-brained mudder farkers who will cry, stand up and proclaim Con Hee as God himself but we all know this is PR bullshit. People will leave, there's no doubt.

.

what about those higher authorites order by con hee to lead those sheeps to protest on the streets in the name of "GOD " ?
 

Jumong

Alfrescian
Loyal
what about those higher authorites order by con hee to lead those sheeps to protest on the streets in the name of "GOD " ?

If protest on the streets could have any positive impact, SDP, and not WP, would be in Parliament by now.

Knowing Sinkies, once the shit hit the fan, Sinkies would quickly disassociate themselves from the smell of shit.
 
Last edited:

kingrant

Alfrescian
Loyal
What a pity. What a loss. KH could have run for PM and given even GCT a good run for the money.

Do you think Chan chun sing can match his charisma?
 
Last edited:
Top