Serious 50th Anniversay of 6 Day War and the impact on SAF, and how the Jews fucked us

[scroobal]

I agree on Nasser and his charismatic character bringing the Arabs together. Very similar to Sukarnao, Nehru and together with Chou Eng Lai were the leading lights of the then new World. I do wonder how the world would have evolved if the NAM had met its agenda.

As to the pre-emptive strike, it does not matter if it was an immediate or a genuine or even if sliver of a threat did exist. It was serious error on the part of Nasser and their Armed Forces. I think the World learnt from this alone more than any other event not to do anything that would invite a pre-emptive strike or provide an excuse for a pre-emptive strike. Studies over the years have shown that they were preparing to strike and had mobilised long before and was a looking for an excuse and any excuse.

More importantly pre-emptive strike is now acceptable and a core of part of defensive doctrine even though it began life on a false premise. Closer to home, the Malaysians know this very well.

Isreal has demonstrated very clearly through out its history that they will even screw their own allies and concept of loyalty or using the new term "honest loyalty" is not part of the vocab. Their spies have been caught in the US numerous times, in OZ etc. Obama never trusted them. You only have to look at Sabra and Shatila massacre to see how dirty they can be. It was to an attempt to wipe out a generation by the very people whose folks faced the same issue in the Holocaust.

The fissures within Israel is also getting worse. The economy has never been bedded down. Look at Dubai, Bahrain, Qatar (with a recent minor bleep) bloated with western expats and many of them running their own businesses etc. Who would have thought they would shoot pass Tel Aviv. The idea of encouraging Isreali citizens to hold due citizenships is proving wrong. It has become a parachute. Even for their PM and his wife, home has always been the US.

They may have been the masters of tactics, great strategy and surgical strikes and even opened the playbook wider with their destruction of the Iraq nuclear reactor in 81, I think as a strategy of building a country and building bridges with others, they have failed miserably. The strategy of building settlements in occupied lands is flawed and just keeps extremist on their side engaged. And worse still policy is the barometer to all how sincere they are in finding peace.

Here is a recent documentary (from the Arab perspective) - your view subscribes to an-often cited narrative that even Israelis themselves have accepted is not true (see articles below) - Nasser may have been a "loudmouth" but he galvanised the Arabs across the Arabian Peninsula - they used to be glued to their radios whenever he spoke - the potential for Pan-Arabism resided with him.

http://www.aljazeera.com/programmes/specialseries/2017/05/war-june-1967-170529070920911.html

The thrust here is that the Egyptians miscalculated when they moved their troops into the Sinai as they were not intending to go to war at all - it was a show of force and sabre rattling - Arabist accepted that they was no "war" as such as they were absolutely decimated by the Israelis who had paid USD$1m to an Iraqi pilot (Munir Redfa) who defected in Aug 1966, almost a year before, to get their hands on the Soviet MiG. They has stripped the plane and knew everything they needed. There was also the peacenik Israeli politician who flew right into Egyptian airspace and landed without their radars detecting anything and this was also a glaring hole in their air defence system which delighted the Israelis.

Here are some recent articles (from Israeli press themselves) dispelling the idea that it was a war because Israel was "under threat" (documentary proof shows otherwise) and also how this then created the "myth" of the invincibility of the Israeli army (they got their asses handed to them subsequently during the Yom Kippur War) when the Egyptians decided they would launch an actual assault and Assad of Syria wanted to avenge his loss of face from 1967 because he was in charge as Minister of Defence when they lost the Golan Heights (he subsequently staged a coup and took over as President). And then there was the nuclear option which the Israelis seemed intent on deploying if things went bad in 1967...

Despite its total lack of sustainability from the documentary record, and despite such admissions from top Israeli officials, it is virtually obligatory for commentators in contemporary mainstream accounts of the ’67 war to describe Israel’s attack on Egypt as “preemptive”.

 

[frenchbriefs]

Ok, which part did you not understand? THE ISRAELIS WERE NOT DEFEATED IN THE YOM KIPPUR WAR. The Israelis took 1600 sq km of Egyptian territory and were 100 km from Cairo. They also occupied 500 sq km of Syria and were 20 km from damascus. They were forced to give all that back when the Russians and Americans brokered a ceasefire. Does this sound like they were defeated?

defeated yes.....more than soundly defeated,the fact that the israeli entered syria and eygpt did not matter,that was merely a continuation of an act of desperation.the israelis was morally and psychologically defeated,for the first time in 1973,they looked into the abyss of annihilation and what they saw shook them to the bones,FEAR!!!it sent shivers up their spines like a thousand needles piercing their hearts.on that day in 1973,every single israeli soldier and civilian shat their pants and it was not a lovely sight.its like mike tyson landing an uppercut on you,even if u somehow managed to recover and win the fight,u knew from that very moment,when that fist landed on bone and it shook ur skull,all that pride and confidence u have built up from years of victory have been shattered,ur warrior's ego of invulnerability was gone.the next time that fist comes swinging at you,it would mean death.



the eygptians accomplished what they set out to achieve,which was to regain the land they have lost.....let me ask u one more time....who was defeated here?

[video=youtube;E1bkMtrPZwY]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E1bkMtrPZwY&t=63s[/video]

 

[belnibone]

defeated yes.....more than soundly defeated,the fact that the israeli entered syria and eygpt did not matter,that was merely a continuation of an act of desperation.the israelis was morally and psychologically defeated,for the first time in 1973,they looked into the abyss of annihilation and what they saw shook them to the bones,FEAR!!!it sent shivers up their spines like a thousand needles piercing their hearts.on that day in 1973,every single israeli soldier and civilian shat their pants and it was not a lovely sight.its like mike tyson landing an uppercut on you,even if u somehow managed to recover and win the fight,u knew from that very moment,when that fist landed on bone and it shook ur skull,all that pride and confidence u have built up from years of victory have been shattered,ur warrior's ego of invulnerability was gone.the next time that fist comes swinging at you,it would mean death.



the eygptians accomplished what they set out to achieve,which was to regain the land they have lost.....let me ask u one more time....who was defeated here?

You were born stupid or did you have to work hard at it? Since when have the Israelis lost to the Arabs? just tell us which war.

 

[frenchbriefs]

You were born stupid or did you have to work hard at it? Since when have the Israelis lost to the Arabs? just tell us which war.

i wouldnt call it a victory or defeat exactly......more of a exchange of blows.....of course there can never be a israeli defeat,otherwise they would not exist today.

during the yom kippur war,if u read the report on SAMs,the israeli lost nearly 400 aircrafts to SAM and AAA fire,this showed that the soviet anti air defense deployed by the eygptians were extremely effective......

the soviet anti tank missiles deployed in sinai also proved to be extremely effective and lethal,in u watched the documentary,of 300 israeli tanks deployed nearly half was destroyed within 36 hours.according to wikipedia by october 9 3 days later,the israelis has lost a total of 500 tanks......after suffering such heavy losses in such a short span of time,Israel had no choice but to beg america for help.

if the eygptians had not strayed from their initial strategy and formation,the war would have had an entirely different outcome altogether.

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After Egyptian infantry had successfully crossed the canal and captured the Bar-Lev Line on October 6, Israeli forces made several counterattacks in attempts to push the Egyptians back across the Suez Canal. The Israelis suffered heavy losses in these attacks, and by October 9 Egyptian forces in the Sinai had managed to destroy 500 Israeli tanks.[10] Following this both sides dug in. The Egyptians would not attack for fear of extending their forces beyond the cover of their SAM defences.

In the Golan Heights, Israel had repelled Syrian forces and pushed into Syria itself. By the time the Syrians, now aided by Iraqi and Jordanian expeditionary forces managed to put a halt to the Israeli advance, Israeli forces were 40 km from Damascus. Syrian president Hafez Al-Assad requested his Egyptian ally, Anwar El-Sadat, order an attack in the Sinai, which would draw Israeli attention away from the Syrian front. Sadat consented and ordered the attack. His War Minister, Ahmed Ismail, and his Chief of Staff, Saad El Shazly, opposed the idea; Shazli in particular stated that for Egyptian forces to advance outside their SAM defences would mean their exposure to the Israeli Air Force, which the Egyptian Air Force was too weak to challenge. Sadat insisted that the attack proceed, however, and both Ahmed Ismail and Shazli had no choice but to acknowledge the order.

 

[frenchbriefs]

i wouldnt call it a victory or defeat exactly......more of a exchange of blows.....of course there can never be a israeli defeat,otherwise they would not exist today.

during the yom kippur war,if u read the report on SAMs,the israeli lost nearly 400 aircrafts to SAM and AAA fire,this showed that the soviet anti air defense deployed by the eygptians were extremely effective......

the soviet anti tank missiles deployed in sinai also proved to be extremely effective and lethal,in u watched the documentary,of 300 israeli tanks deployed nearly half was destroyed within 36 hours.according to wikipedia by october 9 3 days later,the israelis has lost a total of 500 tanks......after suffering such heavy losses in such a short span of time,Israel had no choice but to beg america for help.

if the eygptians had not strayed from their initial strategy and formation,the war would have had an entirely different outcome altogether.

&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&

After Egyptian infantry had successfully crossed the canal and captured the Bar-Lev Line on October 6, Israeli forces made several counterattacks in attempts to push the Egyptians back across the Suez Canal. The Israelis suffered heavy losses in these attacks, and by October 9 Egyptian forces in the Sinai had managed to destroy 500 Israeli tanks.[10] Following this both sides dug in. The Egyptians would not attack for fear of extending their forces beyond the cover of their SAM defences.

In the Golan Heights, Israel had repelled Syrian forces and pushed into Syria itself. By the time the Syrians, now aided by Iraqi and Jordanian expeditionary forces managed to put a halt to the Israeli advance, Israeli forces were 40 km from Damascus. Syrian president Hafez Al-Assad requested his Egyptian ally, Anwar El-Sadat, order an attack in the Sinai, which would draw Israeli attention away from the Syrian front. Sadat consented and ordered the attack. His War Minister, Ahmed Ismail, and his Chief of Staff, Saad El Shazly, opposed the idea; Shazli in particular stated that for Egyptian forces to advance outside their SAM defences would mean their exposure to the Israeli Air Force, which the Egyptian Air Force was too weak to challenge. Sadat insisted that the attack proceed, however, and both Ahmed Ismail and Shazli had no choice but to acknowledge the order.

from these reports,i can conclude that syrians were a deadweight,im not sure exactly what their contribution were besides being a punching bag and being the archilles heal and the cause of eygpt's downfall.

 

[frenchbriefs]

You were born stupid or did you have to work hard at it? Since when have the Israelis lost to the Arabs? just tell us which war.

2006 lebanon war.all these time israel has been fighting monkeys and savages,but when faced with a real enemy with good equipment this time.....

Hezbollah engaged in guerrilla warfare with IDF ground forces, fighting from well-fortified positions, often in urban areas, and attacking with small, well-armed units. Hezbollah fighters were highly trained, and were equipped with flak jackets, night-vision goggles, communications equipment, and sometimes with Israeli uniforms and equipment. An Israeli soldier who participated in the war said that Hezbollah fighters were "nothing like Hamas or the Palestinians. They are trained and highly qualified. All of us were kind of surprised."[154]

During engagements with the IDF, Hezbollah concentrated on inflicting losses on the IDF, believing an unwillingness to absorb steady losses to be Israel's strategic weakness.[155]

Hezbollah countered IDF armor through the use of sophisticated Russian-made anti-tank guided missiles (ATGMs). According to Merkava tank program administration, 52 Merkava main battle tanks were damaged (45 of them by different kinds of ATGM), missiles penetrated 22 tanks, but only 5 tanks were destroyed, one of them by an improvised explosive device (IED). The Merkava tanks that were penetrated were predominantly Mark II and Mark III models, but five Mark IVs were also penetrated. All but two of these tanks were rebuilt and returned to service.[126]

The IDF declared itself satisfied with the Merkava Mark IV's performance during the war. Hezbollah caused additional casualties using ATGMs to collapse buildings onto Israeli troops sheltering inside.[126] As a result, IDF units did not linger in any one area for an extended period of time.[154] Hezbollah fighters often used tunnels to emerge quickly, fire an anti-tank missile, and then disappear again.[154]

On 14 July 2006, INS Hanit a Sa'ar 5-class corvette of the Israeli Navy, suffered damage after being struck by a Hezbollah C-802 (or C-701) anti-ship missile. Four crew members were killed during the attack but INS Hanit stayed afloat, extricated itself and made the rest of the journey back to Ashdod port for repairs on its own power.[citation needed] On July 19 a force from the Maglan special forces unit seized a fortified Hezbollah dugout adjacent to the Shaked post; two IDF soldiers and five Hezbollah operatives were killed in the battle.[156]

 

[frenchbriefs]

Ok, which part did you not understand? THE ISRAELIS WERE NOT DEFEATED IN THE YOM KIPPUR WAR. The Israelis took 1600 sq km of Egyptian territory and were 100 km from Cairo. They also occupied 500 sq km of Syria and were 20 km from damascus. They were forced to give all that back when the Russians and Americans brokered a ceasefire. Does this sound like they were defeated?

since when did defeatable equate to being defeated?i never said it happened,only that it was possible,highly possible at that point in time.

If the americans did not stop them,they would have been in damascus?

So why did i look up wiki and this is what is told me......In the Golan Heights, Israel had repelled Syrian forces and pushed into Syria itself. By the time the Syrians, now aided by Iraqi and Jordanian expeditionary forces managed to put a halt to the Israeli advance, Israeli forces were 40 km from Damascus.

of course those jewish bitches have to listen to america,if america did not come to their aid after the initial attack during the yom kippur war,they would have been pulverised......

 

[frenchbriefs]

fucking jewish cowards,my god,they even tried using nuclear weapons and the threat of a nuclear war to coerce the americans into helping them. the cunts knew they had no chance and were prepared to bring the world with them to their graves.

lmao Israeli victory my ass......the more i dig the more i find out how truly close to desperation Israel was......u can win the fight but it will only postpone ur fate for so long,.........why did the arabs give up after 1973 i still dont understand.....and chase the soviets out who is their greatest ally,all the shenenigans and politics.

On October 8, Israeli Prime Minister Golda Meir authorized the assembly of thirteen 20-kiloton nuclear warheads on Jericho missiles and F-4s, which were prepared for action against Syrian and Egyptian targets;[4] their preparation was made easily detectable, likely as a signal to the United States.[5] Kissinger learned of this threatening nuclear escalation on the morning of 9 October. On that same day, Meir issued a personal appeal for military assistance, which European nations declined. U.S. President Richard Nixon, however, ordered the commencement of Operation Nickel Grass, to replace all of Israel's materiel losses.[6] The decision was taken the same day the Soviets began their own resupply operation of Arab forces by sea.[7] Anecdotal evidence suggests that Kissinger had told Anwar El Sadat that the reason for the U.S. airlift was that the Israelis were close to "going nuclear."[4] However, subsequent interviews with Kissinger, James Schlesinger, and William Quandt suggested that the nuclear aspect was not a major factor in the decision to re-supply. These officials cited the ongoing Soviet re-supply effort and Sadat's early rejection of a ceasefire as the primary motivators.[8]

 

[Papsmearer]

You were born stupid or did you have to work hard at it? Since when have the Israelis lost to the Arabs? just tell us which war.

I am leaning towards born stupid myself.