Crumbling of Singapore?

[Leongsam]

You used the SG media, SPH, Business Times to back up your point!!! How laughable. Might as well use PETIR as your source of information and say that it is the gospel truth

It's not who published it. It's whether the info is true or false. If it's false, show where this is the case.

 

[TracyTan866]

It's not who published it. It's whether the info is true or false. If it's false, show where this is the case.

SPH papers and Business Times are known to use data and statistics selectively. It's this selective reporting that turns Singaporeans off SG media. we dont trust what they report . Until they start reporting the whole truth, their credibility will continue to decline

 

[TracyTan866]

It's not who published it. It's whether the info is true or false. If it's false, show where this is the case.

Glorifying good news and ignoring bad news do not present a true picture of the situation

 

[TracyTan866]

It's not who published it. It's whether the info is true or false. If it's false, show where this is the case.

Someone in SPH got kicked by the authorities for reporting floods in SG a few months ago that put the pap, MEWR in bad light.

The SPH reacted to the "kick" and has now reported the last two days floods as "ponding" to make the flood sound less serious so as to lessen the damage to the pap and MEWR.

But Singaporeans see through the wayang. The more SPH does these things, the more the people turn against them and the pap

 

[TracyTan866]

It's not who published it. It's whether the info is true or false. If it's false, show where this is the case.

Who in Singapore uses SPH reports to back their arguments? Obviously you are too out of touch with SG and Singaporeans

 

[TracyTan866]

1. MRT Congestion
2. Housing problem
3. Hospital beds shortage
4. Unemployment of locals
5. Increased suicide rate
6. Unhappiness of citizens
7. Road congestion
8. High ERP rates without easing traffic congestion
9. Bus crowdedness
10. National Service for locals, jobs for foreigners
11. PAP running out of idea how to promote economic growth but having to resort to vices such as gambling.
12. Increased social problems and integration due to high influx of cheap, unskilled and unqualified migrant laboour with their 3rd world social behaviour and lawlessness

Are these signs of the crumbling of Singapore? The pap appears to run out of ideas how to bring SG forward but is taking the obvious easy ways out, bringing long term problems to SG.

Are the recent MRT failures precursors to more failures to come? Will there be forthcoming systemic failures of the Transport system, Medical Institutions, Housing issues, social problems?

The SMRT saga has revealed more than SMRT Mgmt's indiscretion and neglect of system and train maintenance in the pursuit of profits. Hopefully the COI is indeed independent and has the courage to publicly reveal any discovered hidden faults with SMRT.

But for now, the saga has shown the disunity in the pap:

Shanmugan vs Halimah
Hri Kumar vs Zaqy Mohd

Do these show that there is subliminal racial bias in the pap?

 

[TracyTan866]

It's not who published it. It's whether the info is true or false. If it's false, show where this is the case.

SPH papers reported that paying 30years for a loan for HDB flat is affordable public housing.

True or false?

I rest my case abt using SPH reports to back your argument..

 

[TracyTan866]

The term "compensation" describes the ministers' salaries very accurately. They give so much of themselves for the sake of the nation. Money alone simply isn't sufficient to quantify the sacrifices they have to make. They receive a relatively measly salary in return to "compensate" them for the hardships of the office.

Obama doesnt give much of himself to USA? He did it quietly. The Office of the US President receives much respect because of what the US Presidents did.

On the other hand, the pap harps on the sacrifice they made for SG and demands that they be paid market rate. Look at how Singaporeans pour scorn on the SG Premier and SG Ministers nowadays, unlike the respect Singaporeans had for LKY, GKS, TCC, EWB in earlier days.

Indeed money is not everything!!

 

[Leongsam]

SPH papers reported that paying 30years for a loan for HDB flat is affordable public housing.

True or false?

I rest my case abt using SPH reports to back your argument..

"Affordable" is relative. Just point out, in the article that I have quoted, which parts of the story are false. Give me a direct answer and give your data to back up your claim.

 

[zhihau]

Very few who have participated in this thread over the last few days can be classed as "literate" if we go by your definition.

did you receive any gifts from Santa?

 

[Leongsam]

Look at how Singaporeans pour scorn on the SG Premier and SG Ministers nowadays, unlike the respect Singaporeans had for LKY, GKS, TCC, EWB in earlier days.

If Singaporeans had so much respect for them, why did the PAP only garner 46.9% of the popular vote in the 1963 elections??? The team you claim was so admired at the time couldn't even gain a 50% majority.

Compare this with the 60.1% vote in the 2011 elections and you'll begin to realise just how popular the current government is compared to the good old days you refer to. Just because you belong to the 39.9% that are anti PAP doesn't mean the rest of the country thinks like you.

 

[TracyTan866]

If Singaporeans had so much respect for them, why did the PAP only garner 46.9% of the popular vote in the 1963 elections??? The team you claim was so admired at the time couldn't even gain a 50% majority.

Compare this with the 60.1% vote in the 2011 elections and you'll begin to realise just how popular the current government is compared to the good old days you refer to. Just because you belong to the 39.9% that are anti PAP doesn't mean the rest of the country thinks like you.

you have chosen to ignore that 60% was achieved after much manipulation.

 

[TracyTan866]

"Affordable" is relative. Just point out, in the article that I have quoted, which parts of the story are false. Give me a direct answer and give your data to back up your claim.

not relative. if a person cant afford it, he cant afford it

 

[Nice-Gook]

I have been following your posts and I would say u certainly qualify as a literate. Just to add to what I posted earlier. Another reason why S'pore was ahead of our neighbours was really due to the misfortune of others. During the 60s to 70s, countries of Indo-china were having civil wars eg Vietnam and Cambodia. Hence, MNCs from the west looking to invest in south-east asia had to avoid these countries and as a result, their investments went to S'pore instead. Moreover, the North-east Asia countries like China and Korea were also unstable at that time. If these countries were all not having to sort out their legacy problems from their colonial masters, they would have been chosen first by the MNCs. But into the 80s and especially the 90s where stability arrived in such countries, foreign direct investments had been pouring into them. And that's why the PAP who is clueless what to do had to open the floodgates to foreigners and casinos to boost GDP.

Wow,excellent.Simply excellent.My hats off to you.If you care to know I had mentioned exactly the same some 10 years ago in a forum.That PAP was clueless as to how Singapore succeeded....Since they were in the business of collecting only taxes.And when taxes were drying up PAP simply could not figure what actually ticked Singapore and insted resorted to kill the goose that was laying the golden eggs.

As you had said Singapore was the nett beneficiary of our neighbors misfortune.That's how the birth of Singapore begun.,Paramewara,who discovered Singapore who than subsequently ran away to establish the Malacca sultanate in 1402 ;were both in Dutch control.Raffles was commissioned to challenge the Dutch hegemony in this area since Riau was in the control of the Dutch and technically the sultan of Riau controlled Singapore through his temengong based in Singapore.Hence Singapore was built on the ruins and ashes of Malacca sultnate.It was the exodus of skilled labor from Malacca that contributed to the success of Raffles Singapore.

Even 100 years later Singapore attracted a lot of talents by it's very existence.Freedom fighters of both China and India used Singapore as their base.Sun Yat Sen (China) and Subhas Chndra Bose(India) sheltered and were funded here.Chinese higher institution of learning was like a beacon of light for the entire ethnic Chinese community of SEA ; since China was closed after the communist take over.Singapore was the Paris and London clubbed together in this Eastern hemisphere.Here is where the Asian rich can hide their ill-gotten wealth and enjoy that in peace.And here is where the rich can be super rich since all natural commodities grown in the region were marketed and shipped globally.

When PAP took control all these geographical and natural advantages came in a platter.Not to mention all the infrastructures which the British built sold for a token sum of $1/-.There was no need for PAP to beg village idiots from PRC to propagate our population.Today there are about 7 million ethnic Chinese in Indonesia,another 7 million in Malaysia.Similarly also about 7 million in Thailand and about 4 million in Philippines.These are rich source of our supplies.They would be naturally attracted to Singapore if PAP had not killed Chinese education and entrepreneurship .

We had all the advantages only our neighbors can dream of but PAP has to kill it all with their mismanagement.

 

[TracyTan866]

I notice you dare not respond to #702, #703, #704, #708.

Lost for words?

 

[TracyTan866]

Wow,excellent.Simply excellent.My hats off to you.If you care to know I had mentioned exactly the same some 10 years ago in a forum.That PAP was clueless as to how Singapore succeeded....Since they were in the business of collecting only taxes.And when taxes were drying up PAP simply could not figure what actually ticked Singapore and insted resorted to kill the goose that was laying the golden eggs.

As you had said Singapore was the nett beneficiary of our neighbors misfortune.That's how the birth of Singapore begun.,Paramewara,who discovered Singapore who than subsequently ran away to establish the Malacca sultanate in 1402 ;was both in Dutch control.Raffles was commissioned to challenge the Dutch hegemony in this area since Riau was in the control of the Dutch and technically the sultan of Riau controlled Singapore through his temengong based in Singapore.Hence Singapore was built on the ruins and ashes of Malacca sultnate.It was the exodus of skilled labor from Malacca that contributed to the success of Raffles Singapore.

Even 100 years later Singapore attracted a lot of talents by it's very existence.Freedom fighters of both China and India used Singapore as their base.Sun Yat Sen (China) and Subhas Chndra Bose(India) sheltered and were funded here.Chinese higher institution of learning was like a beacon of light for the entire ethnic Chinese community of SEA ; since China was closed after the communist take over.Singapore was the Paris and London clubbed together in this Eastern hemisphere.Here is where the Asian rich can hide their ill-gotten wealth and enjoy that in peace.And here is where the rich can be super rich since all natural commodities grown in the region were marketed and shipped globally.

When PAP took control all these geographical and natural advantages came in a platter.Not to mention all the infrastructures which the British built sold for a token sum of $1/-.There was no need for PAP to beg village idiots from PRC to propagate our population.Today there are about 7 million ethnic Chinese in Indonesia,another 7 million in Malaysia.Similarly also about 7 million in Thailand and about 4 million in Philippines.These are rich source of our supplies.They would be naturally attracted to Singapore if PAP had not killed Chinese education and entrepreneurship .

We had all the advantages only our neighbors can dream of but PAP has to kill it all with their mismanagement.

Great points. Many of us know that the pap is bankrupt of ideas. It has resorted to squeezing every drop of blood from Singaporeans and resorted to vices to keep Singapore going. what we see on the surface do not show the true situation in SG

 

[TracyTan866]

If Singaporeans had so much respect for them, why did the PAP only garner 46.9% of the popular vote in the 1963 elections??? The team you claim was so admired at the time couldn't even gain a 50% majority.

Compare this with the 60.1% vote in the 2011 elections and you'll begin to realise just how popular the current government is compared to the good old days you refer to. Just because you belong to the 39.9% that are anti PAP doesn't mean the rest of the country thinks like you.

SG General Election results:

1968 GE, pap got 86.7%
1972, 70.4%
1976, 74.1%
1980, 77.7%
1984, 64.8%
.
.
2011, 60.1%

Despite all the pap's manipulations and unfair tactics, do the above show that the pap is losing popularity and respect?

 

[freedalas]

Hi freedalas. Allow me to push you a bit if you don't mind.

How is our geographical size got to do with the education system (an example) that was adopted which in turn allow Singaporeans like us to stand out globally? I am also curious if you are suggesting that there is no substance in the pioneer team led by LKY that transformed Singapore into what it is today.

I believe LKY has been writing books way before he stepped down as MM.

I can accept that I am politically naive, but pray tell, are you suggesting that LKY is still cringing on to power behind the scene? If so, pardon me, I thought the basis for your rationale is weak. You may read LKY's antics as cringing on and not letting go. Others, however, may see it as a form of cementing his legacy in Singapore history. In my humble opinion, reading between the lines is at best, subjective.

Last but not least, in my humble opinion, I find it absurd to link everything to Lee Kuan Yew. It is too simplistic and convenient. That is the reason why I decided to express my perspective in the earlier post as I agree with what you and Nice-Gook have written about contributing our thoughts in this forum for the many silent readers out there (that includes me) so that the ideas formed from all sides of perspective can be compiled, analyzed and determined by the respective readers.

That being said, do let me know if my views are not welcomed here. I will gladly moved back to being just a silent reader. Peace.

Hi bro, don't be too upset with my rebuttals. As a forummer here, we've to be thick-skinned. Whenever we made our points, we must stand ready to get whacked by anyone else. I'd been whacked pretty hard too, but then no hard feelings, after all, this is a democratic forum and everyone has the right of speech. In any case, we give this forum much credibility by engaging aggressively with our points but yet let it be just that, nothing personal. We have to raise above the PAP and act differently, not like them who would sue u even u only hurt a strand of their hair.

It is much more easier to push a national education policy in a city-state like S'pore as all segments of the population are easily within reach and therefore can be schooled. In other countries, there are many poor rural areas and provision for schools is in itself already a very huge problem, in fact, almost insurmountable. Hence, many remain unschooled throughout their lives. This is why many business organisations have as their charity projects the provision of schools, textbooks and other educational apparatus to the remote parts of these countries.

As for LKY, I hope u won't get offended by what I'm about to say. Those who think that man can ever give up his power and authority simply don't know that man. Trust me, I've known from many sources throughout these years what sort of a person he is. To put it simply, he thinks he's God, an eternal God for that matter.

Wishing you and your family a Merry Christmas and a Blessed New Year.

 

[Leckmichamarsch]

1. MRT Congestion
2. Housing problem
3. Hospital beds shortage
4. Unemployment of locals
5. Increased suicide rate
6. Unhappiness of citizens
7. Road congestion
8. High ERP rates without easing traffic congestion
9. Bus crowdedness
10. National Service for locals, jobs for foreigners
11. PAP running out of idea how to promote economic growth but having to resort to vices such as gambling.
12. Increased social problems and integration due to high influx of cheap, unskilled and unqualified migrant laboour with their 3rd world social behaviour and lawlessness

Are these signs of the crumbling of Singapore? The pap appears to run out of ideas how to bring SG forward but is taking the obvious easy ways out, bringing long term problems to SG.

Are the recent MRT failures precursors to more failures to come? Will there be forthcoming systemic failures of the Transport system, Medical Institutions, Housing issues, social problems?

+ HDB illegal parking from $30 to $50 (66% increase - are they hinting something??)
++ LTA fine for parking from $50 to $70 ---- man are we printing money or earning lots of them like our beloved ministers????????????? WTF

 

[Leckmichamarsch]

As for LKY, I hope u won't get offended by what I'm about to say. Those who think that man can ever give up his power and authority simply don't know that man. Trust me, I've known from many sources throughout these years what sort of a person he is. To put it simply, he thinks he's God, an eternal God for that matter.


The DPRK dwarf gave up power, so LKY will not be exempted!!