Why no dual citizenship for Singaporeans?

[laksa]

That is, if you get it renewed in the first place if you declare you own a 2nd pp. Highly unlikely, since it would be a dereliction of duty for an immigration officer to knowingly issue a S'pore passport to dual citizenship holder – this is an act of commission. On the other hand, closing one eye and not checking on an ordinary person's declared single citizenship status is an act of omission.

The path of act of omission is to make a false decalration - that is to declare a single citizenship and banking on the officer to close one eye and not to check. Not advisable to make false declaration. Best policy is to be clean.

Even if you're caught making a false declaration, it's not a criminal offence. You'll just get your citizenship revoked at the very worst.

Agree. Citizenship will be revoked. But there may be other penalties for making false declaration. A fine? Jail time? Need lawyer to comment on the penalties.

 

[PrinceCharming]

Not advisable to make false declaration. Best policy is to be clean.......

Your advice will be closely followed by Sinkie cowards.

Fortunately Ah Nehs, Ah Tiongs and Pinoys have more guts. They know what to do to get ahead of the competition.

 

[SgGoneWrong]

What if I let sg passport lapse and just travel with my other country passport, and keep my pink ic? Reason is that I plan to return back to sg to stay as a citizen but I am not willing to forgo my other citizenship.

If I am stopped from renewing my sg passport, will I be forced to renounce one citizenship or they'll just leave me alone so long as I don't renew the passport?

 

[yellowarse]

If I am stopped from renewing my sg passport, will I be forced to renounce one citizenship or they'll just leave me alone so long as I don't renew the passport?

They'll leave you alone.

 

[eatshitndie]

man lost sg citizenship. guess the race. :p

also read the 6 reasons at the very bottom of article how one can lose sg citizenship.

http://news.asiaone.com/News/The+New+Paper/Story/A1Story20090104-112246.html

 

[eatshitndie]

bizarre case of sinkie jap, ogawa ryuju, losing his sg citizenship. it was granted in 2008 and later revoked in 2010 because he did not "follow" deadlines and the rules. 2 strikes (of letters from ica), and you're out!

http://news.asiaone.com/News/The+New+Paper/Story/A1Story20101108-246249.html

 

[eatshitndie]

to keep your sg citizenship, you need to take the "oral" before the deadline. :p

a blow job will guarantee it. :p

 

[tate]

What's the logic when so many countries allow it? Sinkies who feel trapped get more pissed off with pap. Those who retained their sg citizenship and become pr elsewhere may get so pissed off that they continue to vote against pap. Be allowing these Singaporeans to become citizens elsewhere give them more options and maybe more grateful.

How about lobbying your MP to get the govt to allow dual citizenship?

 

[tate]

If they want to catch you on that technicality, they'll have to first check with the embassies of more than a hundred nations to find out if you have a 2nd pp. Doable, but an utter waste of manpower and taxpayers' money.

They already know who are the people to check - before you get PR, you need to get a certificate of no-criminal conviction from CID or SPF. So your name is on their list and the country that you will be getting permanent residence. If they want to find out if you have citizenship, that will be the first country for them to call and check. It is not that hard to find out.

 

[tate]

Even if you're caught making a false declaration, it's not a criminal offence. You'll just get your citizenship revoked at the very worst.

Besides losing the citizenship, you will be charged in the courts and the worst punishment is you may not be able to enter Singapore anymore.

Think about it, the whole purpose of having dual citizenship is to come back to Singapore as citizen, by trying to keep the Singapore passport, now you risk not being able to enter Singapore anymore.

The question then is why do you want to keep both passports? If you love the foreign country so much, then give up the Singapore passport as long as dual citizenship not allowed. But if you love Singapore more, then don't apply for citizenship in the foreign country, just stay on as PR.

 

[eatshitndie]

But there may be other penalties for making false declaration. A fine? Jail time? Need lawyer to comment on the penalties.

depending on the context and severity of the false declaration and the number of times the alleged make those false declarations to whom and under what circumstances, it can be anywhere from a fine to months of jail time. for example, the case against fong poh haut. he received 3 months jail for 2 charges of making false declarations, 1st to the sg consulate-general in ho chi minh city, and 2nd to the ica in sg while renewing his passport. another case again peter tan. he received 21 months jail for 4 charges which include cheating, criminal intimidation and making false statutory declaration (lying) to the ica while getting his passport renewed. i personally know of 3 cases where sg citizenship was revoked and they were made to sign papers and make oaths when they travelled to sg and checked through immigration with foreign passports. if they didn't sign the papers and renounce sg citizenship in an oath they would be given fines of up to sgd1000 and/or jail time of up to 6 months for each charge (and their sg citizenship would still be revoked). they all chose the former option. no kidding.

 

[tate]

I agree with you to use the Singapore pp when entering or leaving S'pore, but if you make a false declaration, they can catch you on the technicality. Renewing yr pp despite you declaring you have another is a discretionary process, so dont give them excuse to deny you one.

Good suggestion and need caution with that. The absence of entry/exit stamps in the Singapore passport may raise red flags. If you have no foreign citizenship, then the Singapore passport should have entry/exit stamps. You may then say you use the Singapore passport to enter your adopted country. If, let's say, Australia, then you need a get a visa for your Singapore passport even though you are a citizen of Australia. Australia may even reject the visa application, they say "you don't need Visa, you are citizen, don't waste my time". Or a tourist visa for 30, 60 days stay and renew after that. And they will tell you the same thing, you don't need to renew, you are citizen. Too troublesome, so chances are you use your foreign passport when entering adopted country. When you do that, your Singapore passport lack the entry/exit stamps.

 

[tate]

What if I let sg passport lapse and just travel with my other country passport, and keep my pink ic? Reason is that I plan to return back to sg to stay as a citizen but I am not willing to forgo my other citizenship.

If I am stopped from renewing my sg passport, will I be forced to renounce one citizenship or they'll just leave me alone so long as I don't renew the passport?

Since you don't have to answer the question, the issue of your dual citizenship does not arise as long as you don't return to Singapore. They will leave you alone as they do not know about it. If they find out about it, then you will be forced to deal with it. This has not happen yet - possible scenario - if you didn't vote in the general elections or presidential elections, your name is struck off the list. As a citizen, you need to reinstate your name on the list. So you need to provide the reason for not voting, and you will say you are overseas. So then they will reinstate your name back to the list. IF, one day, they decide to ask the question if you have foreign citizenship on that reinstatement form, they will then be able to find out who has acquired foreign citizenship.

But the minute you return to Singapore, you will be under their radar as you returned on a foreign passport. There are several questions in the Singapore embarkation card that will alert them to you. The first thing is your name - not unless you changed your name - they now have "Tan Ah Kow" entering Singapore as a foreigner and not a citizen. If you changed your name, you need to answer the question have you ever entered Singapore under a different name. Then you need to fill in country of birth. The country of birth alone will alert them to you.

 

[tate]

depending on the context and severity of the false declaration and the number of times the alleged make those false declarations to whom and under what circumstances, it can be anywhere from a fine to months of jail time. for example, the case against fong poh haut. he received 3 months jail for 2 charges of making false declarations, 1st to the sg consulate-general in ho chi minh city, and 2nd to the ica in sg while renewing his passport. another case again peter tan. he received 21 months jail for 4 charges which include cheating, criminal intimidation and making false statutory declaration (lying) to the ica while getting his passport renewed. i personally know of 3 cases where sg citizenship was revoked and they were made to sign papers and make oaths when they travelled to sg and checked through immigration with foreign passports. if they didn't sign the papers and renounce sg citizenship in an oath they would be given fines of up to sgd1000 and/or jail time of up to 6 months for each charge (and their sg citizenship would still be revoked). they all chose the former option. no kidding.

Not worth making a false declaration. A person with jail time/criminal conviction would find it hard to enter some countries.

 

[SgGoneWrong]

Thanks all for the advice. I really don't see why pap should put sg citizens at a disadvantage compared to citizens from other countries. Not all government are like pap, allowing prs to keep their status even if they live outside sg forever once pr is granted.

 

[PrinceCharming]

Besides losing the citizenship, you will be charged in the courts and the worst punishment is you may not be able to enter Singapore anymore.

Think about it, the whole purpose of having dual citizenship is to come back to Singapore as citizen, by trying to keep the Singapore passport, now you risk not being able to enter Singapore anymore.

No wonder Old Fart prefers Ah Tiongs to Sinkies any time. The former have balls compared to the latter.

Read the following article and tell me Zhou Bin is a special case:

****************************************************

Zhou Yongkang under house arrest: Mingjing News

Retired political heavyweight Zhou Yongkang, who is rumored to be under investigation for graft, has effectively been placed under house arrest, while his son Zhou Bin has been detained by Chinese security officials in Singapore, reports Mingjing News, a website allegedly sourced by political insiders and run by overseas Chinese.

Prior to his retirement last November, the 70-year-old Zhou was a member of the Politburo Standing Bureau, China's top decision-making body, and chief of the Central Political and Legislative Committee, the department in charge of the country's security forces and law enforcement institutions. Earlier in his career Zhou was also the general manager of state-owned oil giant China National Petroleum Corp and the minister of Land and Resources. A WikiLeaks cable from 2009 revealed that the US government believes he heads a group of individuals who control the interests of China's lucrative oil industry.

According to the latest issue of Mingjing's Zhongguo Mibao magazine, Zhou Yongkang's son Zhou Bin, who had reportedly fled to California to evade China's anti-graft authorities, never made it to the United States and was actually apprehended by Chinese officials in Singapore. Mingjing claims, however, that Zhou Bin, who holds American and Singaporean passports, has not been officially placed under arrest though is also prohibited from leaving Singapore.

The magazine report also said that the investigation into Zhou Yongkang's corrupt activities has advanced and that the retired politician has effectively been placed under house arrest.
Zhou's corruption case will implicate a number of other high-ranking government and Communist Party officials, the report added.

Wang Qishan, head of the Central Commission for Discipline Inspection, China's anti-graft watchdog, has allegedly issued an order calling for 24-hour surveillance of all individuals implicated in the Zhou Yongkang case and for the confiscation of their passports. Persons of interest already detained will all be relocated to Beijing, where they cannot be moved unless with the prior joint written authorisation of the investigation team leader and Beijing public security bureau chief Fu Zhenghua.

Rumors regarding Zhou Yongkang's downfall have circulated on the internet since last year, though so far none have proven to be authentic.

Source: http://www.wantchinatimes.com/news-subclass-cnt.aspx?id=20130923000089&cid=1101

 

[soIsee]

Thanks all for the advice. I really don't see why pap should put sg citizens at a disadvantage compared to citizens from other countries. Not all government are like pap, allowing prs to keep their status even if they live outside sg forever once pr is granted.

You don't see why?

Cos the more balless you are, the more PAP going to tekan you and sell your balless soul to the highest bidder.

And of course in doing so, that put Sinkie like you in a disadvantage.

So are you going to find what you had misplaced your BALLS? LOL

 

[eErotica69]

You don't see why?

Cos the more balless you are, the more PAP going to tekan you and sell your balless soul to the highest bidder.

And of course in doing so, that put Sinkie like you in a disadvantage.

So are you going to find what you had misplaced your BALLS? LOL

Tonychat how about you and your parents who kanna tekan by UMNO since 1951?

 

[john_nyc_71]

I think it is highly unlikely that the Singapore government checks with other countries when you apply for a passport.

For one, many countries would probably consider this information subject to privacy laws, or decide that it is against their national interest to let another country have access to their database of citizens.

The UK for example, has a special procedure for people who need to prove they did not become British Citizens. (http://www.ukba.homeoffice.gov.uk/britishcitizenship/proof-that-you-are-not-british/). This indicates that if another country wants confirmation that a particular individual is not British, that individual has to apply and pay for the relevant document.

There are also more problems with asking other countries. Many countries do no have a database of their own citizens. This is especially true of countries like the UK and US, which grants citizenship automatically in many circumstances (eg birth abroad to citizens). These countries have no way of monitoring all these and it is often up to the individual to prove that they are a citizen but submitting the required documentation (eg birth certificate and proof of parents' citizenship). If you look into the link above for the UK, you will note that the reply from the UK government is that they cannot find a record of that individual having acquired citizenship. It doesn't say that the individual is not a citizen because that determination is very very difficult to make with 100% certainty. If you look at the UK government records, you will find that a number of applicants for British citizenship each year find out that they have been British all along without knowing it.

As for the lack of passport stamps - this is become less and less relevant as many jurisdictions (eg Hong Kong) have gone electronic and no longer stamps passports, even for visitors. There are also countries that do not stamp the passports of PRs.

 

[The_Hypocrite]

the Indian chaps case, highlights the whims and fancies of the PAP. In Oz even criminals who are PRs can get citizenship due to the human rights assholes. Me thinks this indian fella was denied as he is odd job worker,,,the sort singkieland wants to get rid off,,,however the shit is, there are heaps of odd job labourers crap and prostitutes from 3rd world shitlands that have never serve NS and are given citizenship for doing fuck all. That is what makes singkieland shit...

man lost sg citizenship. guess the race. :p

also read the 6 reasons at the very bottom of article how one can lose sg citizenship.

http://news.asiaone.com/News/The+New+Paper/Story/A1Story20090104-112246.html