Why do Hakka, Teochew, Cantonese claim pure northern Han heritage?

[Liquigas]

Among the southern Chinese, the Hakka people can lay claim for being closest to the Han heritage of north/central China. Just look at the Hakka dialect which is closest to Mandarin with Hokkien being the one with the lowest intelligibility with Mandarin. Hakka cuisine, opera and folk songs (not many people here understand them though) are indeed close to those of the northern Chinese. The Teochews too like the Hakkas are late arrivals from north China (Shanxi) can can therefore be considered slightly 'more Han' than the Hokkiens or Cantonese.

 

[laksaboy]

Not pure Han, but definitely purer than the Northern Chinese.

Genghis Khan and various other northern barbarian tribes had constantly invaded northern China.

Consequently, the women of those invaded areas get raped and the barbarians deposit their sperm inside those women.

Nine months later, those women gave birth.

Today, those northern China's Chinese in Beijing, Tianjin, the three Dongbei provinces, Chang'an etc are mostly the bastard descendants of those conquests.

Not all is bad though. Mongolian women are quite beautiful, and some of that beauty had rubbed off onto the women of northern China's Chinese women.

It is a similar story with Spain. Southern Spain (Andalusia) had been invaded and ruled over by Moorish Muslims from North Africa. As a result, today's Andalusian women look distinctly different from women from other parts of Spain. Darker hair, darker eyes etc.

 

[Mercury]

Among the southern Chinese, the Hakka people can lay claim for being closest to the Han heritage of north/central China. Just look at the Hakka dialect which is closest to Mandarin with Hokkien being the one with the lowest intelligibility with Mandarin. Hakka cuisine, opera and folk songs (not many people here understand them though) are indeed close to those of the northern Chinese. The Teochews too like the Hakkas are late arrivals from north China (Shanxi) can can therefore be considered slightly 'more Han' than the Hokkiens or Cantonese.

Teochew and Hokkien are more genetically Han Chinese than Hakka. All southern Chinese dialects from Guangdong and Fujian are close to the spoken Han Chinese language. Also Mandarin today is the result of influence and imposing by Altaic, the accent and pronunciation of the Standard Mandarin which was derived from Beijing dialect was influenced by Manchus. The Manchus couldn't pronounced Chinese so they forced the Chinese to speak their version of Chinese.

 

[Mercury]

Not pure Han, but definitely purer than the Northern Chinese.

Genghis Khan and various other northern barbarian tribes had constantly invaded northern China.

Consequently, the women of those invaded areas get raped and the barbarians deposit their sperm inside those women.

Nine months later, those women gave birth.

Today, those northern China's Chinese in Beijing, Tianjin, the three Dongbei provinces, Chang'an etc are mostly the bastard descendants of those conquests.

Not all is bad though. Mongolian women are quite beautiful, and some of that beauty had rubbed off onto the women of northern China's Chinese women.

It is a similar story with Spain. Southern Spain (Andalusia) had been invaded and ruled over by Moorish Muslims from North Africa. As a result, today's Andalusian women look distinctly different from women from other parts of Spain. Darker hair, darker eyes etc.

Spain has only an small quantity of Moorish blood, they look like that because their in the Mediterranean. It's the same reason why Greeks look like that, all people close to the Mediterranean seas have an an darker hair, darker eyes look.

Actually that's exaggerating, there was plenty of rape of Northern Chinese women after they conquered, but there was also some Altaic tribe slave women who married Han Chinese men. But most of the population was result of intermarriage and assimilation, cause like I said Northern China was conquered so many times. Every Northern Han Chinese today have some Altaic blood as reflected from their autosomal DNA study. The average Han Chinese have 27% Altaic blood. But this is not the reason why North Han Chinese are genetically close to East Asian. The Bhutanese Qinghai, Tibetan, North Han Chinese were already genetically mostly East Asian to begin with, with some Southeast Asian admixture. The Altaic made North Han Chinese even more East Asian. Generations half breed Altaic/Half Han Chinese breed married into other Han Chinese have caused most North Han Chinese to have altaic blood. In Manchuria, the Han Chinese have both Y-DNA and Mt-DNA from Altaic. About 25.5% Altaic Y-DNA and 16% Altaic- Mt-DNA. In Northern China they have about 12-18% Altaic Y-DNA and Altaic mtDNA 8-13%. So let's say that 30% Altaic people married with 30% Northern Chinese, and 30% of these mix breeds will marry another 30% Han Chinese ect.


The original Han Chinese would have been maybe 70% East Asian + 30% Southeast Asian. Those Yellow membership in the North Han Chinese in the graph, some of them were definately derived from Altaic. Any Yellow membership in Southern Chinese would not have been from Altaic but from Sino-tibetan East Asian genes that came from Northern Han Chinese before other nomadic empires starting ruling northern China.

Interestingly, most Koreans and Japanese also have some Han Chinese blood, even some Inner Mongolian today also have Han Chinese blood, but Mongolians are very genetically related to Siberians such as Buryats, Evenks, Oroqen.

 

[Jah_rastafar_I]

Among the southern Chinese, the Hakka people can lay claim for being closest to the Han heritage of north/central China. Just look at the Hakka dialect which is closest to Mandarin with Hokkien being the one with the lowest intelligibility with Mandarin. Hakka cuisine, opera and folk songs (not many people here understand them though) are indeed close to those of the northern Chinese. The Teochews too like the Hakkas are late arrivals from north China (Shanxi) can can therefore be considered slightly 'more Han' than the Hokkiens or Cantonese.

teochew sounds so familiar to hokkien though.

 

[Liquigas]

The Minnan speaking people (Hokkiens) being genetically more Han Chinese than the Hakkas? How can that be? Hakka people started arriving from north/central China to Fujian beginning from the 12th century. By that time of their arrival, the region was already inhabited by the Minnan people who are themselves an intermix of Han people who had migrated centuries earlier and the native Min Yue people. The Hakkas built those circular earthen buildings (tulou) to house their large multi-family and do not mix much with the locals. The Hakkas have a stronger Han heritage on account of being late arrivals and they certainly do not carry as much genes of the natives/aborgines of south China compared to people who had arrived earlier.

 

[Mercury]

The Minnan speaking people (Hokkiens) being genetically more Han Chinese than the Hakkas? How can that be? Hakka people started arriving from north/central China to Fujian beginning from the 12th century. By that time of their arrival, the region was already inhabited by the Minnan people who are themselves an intermix of Han people who had migrated centuries earlier and the native Min Yue people. The Hakkas built those circular earthen buildings (tulou) to house their large multi-family and do not mix much with the locals. The Hakkas have a stronger Han heritage on account of being late arrivals and they certainly do not carry as much genes of the natives/aborgines of south China compared to people who had arrived earlier.

Didn't you read the genetic graph on the first page? Hakka is only more northern than Cantonese. In Guangdong, Teochew is most Han Chinese, than Hokkien, than Hakka and Cantonese. But like I said any other Southern Chinese province (aside from Guangxi and Fujian) is already more northern Chinese than any Teochew and Hokkien. So even if Hakka are more northern Chinese than teochew it would still make you very southern Chinese. The historic evidence that your Hakka claimed to be pure north Chinese it not backed up by any modern genetic evidence and these study are done by Chinese scientists . Some Hakkas are even sinicized aborigines not of Han Chinese origin.

YOU CLAIM THAT YOU DID NO MIXED WITH THE LOCALS? Here is an 2nd study of mtDNA maternally inherited DNA. It shows Hakka maternal DNA is dominated by southern aborigines.


Study: Yun Li 1, Su Min, Yellow flowers, Li, TIAN Dong-ping, high Yuxia

[Abstract] the purpose of the Guangdong Department of the Han people or three large Chaoshan, Cantonese and Hakka are the descendants of landlocked Central China the Han immigrants, this study reflect the maternally inherited mitochondrial DNA (mtDNA) evidence of three major differences between the people of the genetic backgrounds . Chaoshan blood samples were collected 89 and 48 landlocked Central Plains high incidence of esophageal cancer among blood Taihang Mountain to build each individual's mtDNA haplogroups; Cantonese and Hakka haplogroup data from the literature. these 3 Department of a large crowd of people haplogroups and the distribution of population and the south of Taihang Mountain comparative analysis of Aboriginal people. Results Taihang Mountain Han people mainly from the north constitute the major haplogroups, Cantonese and Hakka, Aborigines South Main Zeyi haplogroup mainly Chaoshan showed major haplogroups in northern Han slightly above the main indigenous southern haplogroups. haplogroups based on the frequency of the principal component analysis, together Taihang Mountain and Chaoshan, Hakka and Cantonese people are aboriginal groups and the South together. Conclusion 3 large public system, only the Han nationality Chaoshan blood is more pure, and the closest Taihang Mountain population,.

 

[Liquigas]

Not too sure about scientific studies but my own simple analysis is as below...

Han Chinese arrived in Fujian 1,000 years ago, intermixed with the aborigines and gave rise to the Minnan people. Subsequent wave of Han Chinese migration arrived at Guangdong/Fujian 700 years ago, intermixed with the aborigines and the earlier Han settlers and became the Hakkas (guest people). Even later about 500 years ago, yet another group of Han Chinese arrived from north China to the Chaosan region, intermixed with earlier Han settlers and became the Teochew people.

Now looking at the above, it is clear that the Teochews are more Han Chinese than the Hakkas who in turn are more Han Chinese than the Hokkiens.

 

[Jah_rastafar_I]

guys i want to talk about how some chinese look less "han" compared to others.

Take elvin ng for eg, http://starsonscreen.blogspot.com/2008/09/elvin-ng_22.html

He kind of has eurasian malayish type of looks as in high brow ridges here's an example"

He doesn't really look chinese.

Not contrast his looks to that of dai yang tian

https://www.google.com/search?q=dai...&biw=1920&bih=1061&sei=N5m0T5HxN6njiAKj_eWAAg

The thing i want to say is that there are many sinkies with elvin's type of looks that don't look too cheena and i think elvin ng is hokkien or a han dialect group that's not so han.

Contrast his looks to aiyoyo her husband who are teochew and see how much more chinese they look.

Also there are many southern chinese that look like thais especially in singapore and contrast how look with those from the northern part.

Then again isn't looking less chinese nowadays better? since looking more chinese = from china nowadays looking more like a malay is better.

 

[Mercury]

guys i want to talk about how some chinese look less "han" compared to others.

Take elvin ng for eg, http://starsonscreen.blogspot.com/2008/09/elvin-ng_22.html

He kind of has eurasian malayish type of looks as in high brow ridges here's an example"

He doesn't really look chinese.

Not contrast his looks to that of dai yang tian

https://www.google.com/search?q=dai...&biw=1920&bih=1061&sei=N5m0T5HxN6njiAKj_eWAAg

The thing i want to say is that there are many sinkies with elvin's type of looks that don't look too cheena and i think elvin ng is hokkien or a han dialect group that's not so han.

Contrast his looks to aiyoyo her husband who are teochew and see how much more chinese they look.

Also there are many southern chinese that look like thais especially in singapore and contrast how look with those from the northern part.

Then again isn't looking less chinese nowadays better? since looking more chinese = from china nowadays looking more like a malay is better.

South Chinese are mixture of East Asian and Southeast Asian.
North Chinese are mixture of East Asian and Northeast Asian.

The real Han Chinese would have looked like Sino-tibetan speaking or closest to Central Han Chinese. The fact that some Han Chinese think that looking more north equals to looking more Han Chinese is simply ignorant.

 

[Jah_rastafar_I]

Pray tell how does a sino tibetian looks like? Something like the dalai lama?

 

[Mercury]

Pray tell how does a sino tibetian looks like? Something like the dalai lama?

Since Han Chinese is part of the Sino-tibetan linguistic family, I could only assume than they must have looked something like Sino-Tibetan speaking minorities. They would have looked something like these 3 men on the photo, definitely not like today's most northern Chinese or most southern Chinese even though they are the direct descendants of Han Chinese but due to mixing with the Altaic and Southern aborigines their phenotypes changed.

 

[Conqueror]

Why Not ?

Why do Hakka, Teochew, Cantonese always claim pure northern Han heritage when they are not?

But do you guys even know that northern China has been conquered like 12-15 times by non-Han Chinese, and in most of their history they were died the most from wars and famine.

And only South Chinese ruled the Manchus and Mongols today.

Haplogroup can only tell you the path of migration. So, the ancient history text and dna testings have confirmed the account is true. Both Shang people and Hmong migrated from the north to the south whard. So, what's the problem ? The northern people don't know who they marry and the line is quite vague; and no one knows who is actually whom.

Y-chromosomes come from the sperm 'warhead'. Sperm has only half of an entire human chromosomes (total of 46 but sperm or egg, 23). One of the 23 chromosomes is used as detection for haplogrouping. You have forgotten the other 22 are contributed fairly - your mother's genes count too. Genes are gathered and shuffled like cards (ie. mom's red cards and dad's black ones). So, my mum's side are all tall folks and became tall too. Good for me.

 

[Jah_rastafar_I]

Re: Why Not ?

I bet many chinese are actually happy they look less cheena and not so sino tibetian.

 

[Conqueror]

High Ridge Eyebrows Linked To Certain Tribal People ?

guys i want to talk about how some chinese look less "han" compared to others.

Take elvin ng for eg, http://starsonscreen.blogspot.com/2008/09/elvin-ng_22.html

He kind of has eurasian malayish type of looks as in high brow ridges here's an example"

He doesn't really look chinese.

Not contrast his looks to that of dai yang tian

https://www.google.com/search?q=dai...&biw=1920&bih=1061&sei=N5m0T5HxN6njiAKj_eWAAg

The thing i want to say is that there are many sinkies with elvin's type of looks that don't look too cheena and i think elvin ng is hokkien or a han dialect group that's not so han.

Contrast his looks to aiyoyo her husband who are teochew and see how much more chinese they look.

Also there are many southern chinese that look like thais especially in singapore and contrast how look with those from the northern part.

Then again isn't looking less chinese nowadays better? since looking more chinese = from china nowadays looking more like a malay is better.

Shit ! He has a strange look. Neanderthal ? Even Jean Yip is strange too. She's too Yue or Malay (Pinay ?) type. Dark skinned too.

Most Northern people have fairer skin tones as well as being taller too.

 

[Jah_rastafar_I]

Re: High Ridge Eyebrows Linked To Certain Tribal People ?

Conqueror if you actually go and pay attention some chinese have the very south east asian look you can see that they have deep brow ridges which makes the eyes more deep set while ppl that look more like northern chinese, korean, jap have a flatter face but longer nose.

 

[Conqueror]

Cantonese are aboriginal Han mixed race.

After watching the video above I definitely look more northern than southern cos I'm hakka.
People always say I look like China man, even china man also say I look at china man.

Cantonese were said to have only 60% Han blood and Hakka about 80%. My Foochowese language also has words similar to Hakka but without F sounding words like fang, fong, fa, etc just like other ancient languages in Fujianese and Koreans.

I was mistaken twice, by two old Sinkies, as a PRC. My Mandarin sounds more like between ROC and PRC without the irritating "er" sounds for almost everything. Wen Bei still has that northern "er". Not so barbaric lah. I'm tall and exceptionally fair. There you go. Darker skin tone people likely to be Yue (closer to Polynesian type).

These two below cannot be a Han type. More like a Malay.

 

[Conqueror]

Foochowese Is A Far Ancient Han Language

[video=youtube;lMQYuvpgRBA]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lMQYuvpgRBA&feature=related[/video]


Last time, I claimed that some Foochowese were ancient people from Shanxi. Listen to Jin language version of Shanxi at 3:30 ... the dong feng was pronounced as dong hoong just like Foochowese !

Foochowese seems to have more Mandarin words than Hakka ? Sorry, just a guess here.

 

[Conqueror]

Flat Noses

Conqueror if you actually go and pay attention some chinese have the very south east asian look you can see that they have deep brow ridges which makes the eyes more deep set while ppl that look more like northern chinese, korean, jap have a flatter face but longer nose.

One Malay or Polynesian tribal man (I saw the photo) due to his extremely wide and high ridge bone at the eyebrows was identified as dono-whard-man. These so-called scientists talk cock lah.

So, evolution was a fake theory after all. Dinosaurs were extincted creatures not far away from human - possibly only tens of thousands of years NOT tens of millions as they guessed them to be.

They (northern people) said they have straight nose compared to the south with broader and flater noses. Not true lay, north also got whard, but maybe not so many.

 

[Jah_rastafar_I]

Re: Flat Noses

One Malay or Polynesian tribal man (I saw the photo) due to his extremely wide and high ridge bone at the eyebrows was identified as dono-whard-man. These so-called scientists talk cock lah.

So, evolution was a fake theory after all. Dinosaurs were extincted creatures not far away from human - possibly only tens of thousands of years NOT tens of millions as they guessed them to be.

They (northern people) said they have straight nose compared to the south with broader and flater noses. Not true lay, north also got whard, but maybe not so many.

Bro it's of course a generalization but you pay attention yourself southern chinese have deeper set eyes compared to the northerners.