SAF Armour Formation reminiscing thread

[Papsmearer]

Noticed on the "What happened to Lee Hsien Yang" thread that there are many former armour and AI personnel in this forum. ranging from NCO up to I think Major/LTC rank. In fact, that thread started evolving into an armour rendezvous, so I thought I would start this thread. So, all former 40, 41, 42, 46, and yes even you guys in 48 SAR can fall in and TCSS. Same for those from 4 SAB, 8 SAB, and SOA. Happy to meet up, even if anonymously and talk cock with former NSF and regular armour chaps. I will start the ball rolling with.............

What I missed about armour - i have to say the camaraderie and the esprit the corp. because the size of an armour unit is very small in terms of personnel eg. one AMX-13 platoon only has 12 personnel, it was much more informal than an infantry unit. Officers and NCOs mix well together and even with the tank crew who might be private rank. In my days, officers regularly went into NCO mess and vice versa.

And of course, I miss the tank races in Area D. LOL.

What I don't miss about armour - exposure to all sorts of hazardous chemicals from the oil drums used for target practice, breathing the toxic contaminated pink dust in Area D, breathing in the fumes and cordite smoke from the firing of the main tank gun, which equals respiratory problems today. sigh.

 

[sleaguepunter]

i only lousy rifleman, i dunno any of the top brass in armour. i know how to operate every single piece of weapons that a combat team have in its arsenal baring the 75mm SM1 main gun.

i agree armour very close but it due to the severe lack of manpower. during ns, platoon riflemen average only 10-15 per platoon, many sections led by 2IC because the sgt downgraded. my platoon only had 1 sgt sect comd. so instead of a company strength of 110-120 men, most armour company OCs led less than 100 inclusive of tank platoon, the signallers, ambulance driver, bikees, CQ, 84 teams etc etc... basically everyone know everyone inside the company. because my platoon stay on the same level with tankees and hq platoon, so we also every close. When SM1 throw tracks(happen as often as sunrise) in the field, AIs mostly will help and the tankee repay the favour at laager by cooking maggie mee. 84 teams most pitiful as they kenna throw ard to different tag team to increase fire support which mean they(3) ride in M113 that already had 9 person inside the trooper compartment. At laager, nobody will eat the horrid combat rations, all will cook using the vehicle as cover, portable radio tune to provide music while sect comd work out the duty roster for the night while AI PC and tank PC & PS attend commander briefing by OC on the coming mission.

i agree with pink dust damaging health, that why i rather it be wet on the field which is uncomfortable than hot and dry weather. almost without fail, the nosetril hairs turn reddish pink after every field training. i like being in armour, i happy like bird when kenna posting at commando jetty. since cannot go lobo vocation, might as well go for something i like.

 

[Narong Wongwan]

SCE amoured engineers considered amour bo?

 

[KNNBGCB]

SGT Annie reporting in, Sir!

 

[Runifyouhaveto]

SGT Annie reporting in, Sir!

Did she marry the officer from 42?

 

[Jah_rastafar_I]

chiong sua ah chiong sua

 

[Runifyouhaveto]

chiong sua ah chiong sua

We were Soldiers.

 

[Papsmearer]

SCE amoured engineers considered amour bo?

I suppose if they are from 38 SCE and operating the M728, they can be considered armour?

 

[Papsmearer]

i only lousy rifleman, i dunno any of the top brass in armour. i know how to operate every single piece of weapons that a combat team have in its arsenal baring the 75mm SM1 main gun.

i agree armour very close but it due to the severe lack of manpower. during ns, platoon riflemen average only 10-15 per platoon, many sections led by 2IC because the sgt downgraded. my platoon only had 1 sgt sect comd. so instead of a company strength of 110-120 men, most armour company OCs led less than 100 inclusive of tank platoon, the signallers, ambulance driver, bikees, CQ, 84 teams etc etc... basically everyone know everyone inside the company. because my platoon stay on the same level with tankees and hq platoon, so we also every close. When SM1 throw tracks(happen as often as sunrise) in the field, AIs mostly will help and the tankee repay the favour at laager by cooking maggie mee. 84 teams most pitiful as they kenna throw ard to different tag team to increase fire support which mean they(3) ride in M113 that already had 9 person inside the trooper compartment. At laager, nobody will eat the horrid combat rations, all will cook using the vehicle as cover, portable radio tune to provide music while sect comd work out the duty roster for the night while AI PC and tank PC & PS attend commander briefing by OC on the coming mission.

i agree with pink dust damaging health, that why i rather it be wet on the field which is uncomfortable than hot and dry weather. almost without fail, the nosetril hairs turn reddish pink after every field training. i like being in armour, i happy like bird when kenna posting at commando jetty. since cannot go lobo vocation, might as well go for something i like.

Unfortunately, the lack of shortage is even worse now. And that extends to all tracked armoured vehicle units, both from Armour and from Combat Engineers. I heard some current combat engineers Trailblazer units down to almost 50% strenght due to manpower shortage. Now with new Leo 2 tanks which require a 4 man crew versus the AMX-13's 3, I can't imagine it getting better.

Yeah, the pink dust was every where. Tank commanders had to wear a mask in Area D. And the thing was so corrosive that it ate up the exhaust pipe of one instructor's car at School Of Armour. His muffler dropped off. Hahaha. Yes, at that time, throw track very common, and also all sorts of transmission problems also, but that was taken care of by the SM1 model.

I am sure some non armour people wondering now why you mention tankees cooking maggie mee for the AI. LOL. We used to cook even better staff like sharks fin soup, and other canned delicacies out in the field.

 

[LauCheeBye]

I am from School of Armour from the days of Encik Quek...

 

[KNNBGCB]

Did she marry the officer from 42?

Divorced lor...

 

[infra]

I am from School of Armour from the days of Encik Quek...

I will there from 87 -89.

 

[sleaguepunter]

Unfortunately, the lack of shortage is even worse now. And that extends to all tracked armoured vehicle units, both from Armour and from Combat Engineers. I heard some current combat engineers Trailblazer units down to almost 50% strenght due to manpower shortage. Now with new Leo 2 tanks which require a 4 man crew versus the AMX-13's 3, I can't imagine it getting better.

Yeah, the pink dust was every where. Tank commanders had to wear a mask in Area D. And the thing was so corrosive that it ate up the exhaust pipe of one instructor's car at School Of Armour. His muffler dropped off. Hahaha. Yes, at that time, throw track very common, and also all sorts of transmission problems also, but that was taken care of by the SM1 model.

SM1-4 move out, confirm at least 1 go back market garden by recovery vehicle.

46 stand down may have something to do with lack of manpower. Leo2 battalion shd be full strength lah. crew of 4 per leo2, 3 platoons per company plus 8 & 9 vehicle, that only 14Leos and plus the assorted runners,csm,cq etc etc. it only at most 70men per company. atmost add one 40/50BX for csm. compare to the AI combat team TOEs of 120men. Maybe the logistic tail can be smaller no need so many chobolans at HQ company as i doubt the support company will retain the scouts and mortar platoon. mortar platoon replace with atgm platoon while scout render useless and pioneer maybe gone too as their bridging device cannot handle 62ton leo2. with so many no longer need, organic tank battalion need considerable less manpower than AI ABG.

 

[borom]

I used to be at KH and my OC was Chua Tiong Guan.
Anyone remember when the Indian Sgt with the moustache kena blown up ?.

 

[Papsmearer]

SM1-4 move out, confirm at least 1 go back market garden by recovery vehicle.

46 stand down may have something to do with lack of manpower. Leo2 battalion shd be full strength lah. crew of 4 per leo2, 3 platoons per company plus 8 & 9 vehicle, that only 14Leos and plus the assorted runners,csm,cq etc etc. it only at most 70men per company. atmost add one 40/50BX for csm. compare to the AI combat team TOEs of 120men. Maybe the logistic tail can be smaller no need so many chobolans at HQ company as i doubt the support company will retain the scouts and mortar platoon. mortar platoon replace with atgm platoon while scout render useless and pioneer maybe gone too as their bridging device cannot handle 62ton leo2. with so many no longer need, organic tank battalion need considerable less manpower than AI ABG.

Hahahaha, that's a better ratio than the older version of the AMX-13. I have seen 3 move out, and non come back on their own. LOL. Usually at least 2 or 1 will break down. 1 our of 4 is a much better ratio.

Regarding the Leo 2, 48 SAR. I meant to say the Orbat should be the same as the old 40 SAR. which was 3 tanks per platoon, 3 platoons per company, plus OC tank. Should be about 32 tanks in the SAR, same as the old 40 SAR with 32 AMX-13. But now, require extra 32 tank crewmen due to the one extra crew in Leo 2. Logistic tail should be huge for 48, with much more fuel usage, and more rounds in each belly load. Now OCS cadets in the current equivalent of TOCC going to Germany during their cadet training for Leo 2. not bad at all. One ex tankee told me the German army brings a mobile brothel to the field with them. LOL.

 

[Papsmearer]

I used to be at KH and my OC was Chua Tiong Guan.
Anyone remember when the Indian Sgt with the moustache kena blown up ?.

Which Indian Sgt with the mustache is this? the only one I know is Gordon Chitran, and he is doing fine. Still alive.

 

[borom]

Which Indian Sgt with the mustache is this? the only one I know is Gordon Chitran, and he is doing fine. Still alive.

Sorry cannot remember his name-think he was from demo and heard he was blown up while carrying ammonol.
My company was not involved in the exercise.

 

[Papsmearer]

Sorry cannot remember his name-think he was from demo and heard he was blown up while carrying ammonol.
My company was not involved in the exercise.

Really? demolition not normally done by armour. Sometimes company CSM might go out to butt to blow unexploded tank rounds. But i did not hear of this one.

 

[vtran2684]

Last time I play wargames, we as a infantry brigade used AH-64 support to wipe out all enemy armour.

 

[sleaguepunter]

Hahahaha, that's a better ratio than the older version of the AMX-13. I have seen 3 move out, and non come back on their own. LOL. Usually at least 2 or 1 will break down. 1 our of 4 is a much better ratio.

Regarding the Leo 2, 48 SAR. I meant to say the Orbat should be the same as the old 40 SAR. which was 3 tanks per platoon, 3 platoons per company, plus OC tank. Should be about 32 tanks in the SAR, same as the old 40 SAR with 32 AMX-13. But now, require extra 32 tank crewmen due to the one extra crew in Leo 2. Logistic tail should be huge for 48, with much more fuel usage, and more rounds in each belly load. Now OCS cadets in the current equivalent of TOCC going to Germany during their cadet training for Leo 2. not bad at all. One ex tankee told me the German army brings a mobile brothel to the field with them. LOL.

3 leo2 per platoon? That dumb, not balance at all. Tank view very narrow, it always better to have another tank in support, machiam like Air Force wingman tactic. 4 tank platoon also better for fire movement. Hull down defense also better with 4 tanks as 2 can give covering fire while the other 2 race backward to pre-prepare positions to cover the front 2 when they hop backward.

Anyway trained tank crews are not as exposed as AI to dangers that may cause downgrade. So 90% of them will ord intact while AI are known to be half strength when ord. For example, during reservist, SM1 platoon full strength plus one spare driver and gunner each. But my platoon only has 2 sections because there only 9 riflemen in total.

If really only 3 tank platoon, that even less manpower. As for need more fuel and ammo, at least it the same types. Less complex. Ammo just restrict to 7.62, 120mm, some 5.56, smoke pots, 9mm and some atgm and that it. Got rid of matador, 84, 40mm grenade, mortar, landmines, claymore, Bangalore torpedo etc etc.... Also no need for many supplies that AI need to set defense fortifications. Ie... Iron pickets, coils upon coil of concentina, etc etc...