Opposition to Siew Kum Hong as NMP

[MarrickG]

I'm sure Siew will continue as NMP...

 

[KuanTi01]

Fuck lah..If the botak head NMP so confident of himself, he should go for election..be it independent or join a opposition party..he now can KPKB in parliament becos PAP give him the oppotunity. Tell him be a man, stand for a election. BTW how much pay does a NMP get?

Wahseh well said. Exactly how I feel also about this botakhead! Be a man, be a real elected oppo MP. Fight for the underdogs as you hv so eloquently shown inside Parliament! Let us see whether you still sing the same song once you are elected!

 

[bellepepper02]

Appreciating what PAP did in the past or even present does not mean that we should not contest against them. In fact, by providing the real political competition against PAP, it keeps PAP alive by being nimble and responsive to citizens' views and needs. This is ironic but it is true. Else, PAP may have a prolonged life but in the end, it will be totally destroyed by its own monopoloy of power that corrupts its moral authority totally. Many ancient Chinese dynasties have gone through that different phases in history.

Steve Chia is really not that bad. We are not expecting SAINTS to be in politics; in fact I would be very worried if every politicians portray themselves as SAINTS or PERFECT HUMAN BEINGS or GOD-like in anyway. Many politicians in history that portray themselves as GOD-LIKE one time or another had created great pain, harm and destruction to their people. Prime examples are Chairman Mao, Japanese Emperors, Hilter.... the list goes on.

Democracy exists basically because we must always keep in mind that politicians are IMPERFECT human beings that need to be put into checks and balances. Any politicians that claim that they are PERFECT and do not need anyone to check on them are not to be believed at all.

Steve Chia may have erred on few instances but it only put reality in perspective; politicians are just human beings. You have never seen flaws of other politicians exposed does not mean that they are perfect at all.

Goh Meng Seng

Yes, I appreciate the need for an opposition to absolute power. That's why I think it's essential in Singapore to vote opposition whenever one gets the chance, no matter if they put up a star PAP performer against a low grade opposition politician. But while I may vote for an inept opposition politician, I am not sure I would do so for a maid abuser or a married man breaking his vows. The opposition parties have a responsibility to field people of some moral standing.

Politicians have access to power, money, and are also given the opportunity to legislate for the nation. Anyone would die to be in their position. The least they can be expected to do is lead decent lives like other human beings. Aren't they required to sacrifice anything for all those advantages they enjoy?

You see their morality as irrelevant to their politics, but it is usually hugely relevant. Let's take extra-marital sexual relationships. That tells me the person is not in control of himself. It tells me that his role in the nation does not consume him thoroughly or satisfy him--that he needs other distractions. What you get here is a politician only half-committed to his political role. All that money and we only get half-committment? A serial extra-marital sexual offender in this regard suggests that he has poor attitudes towards women, and that will be reflected in his work on women's matters in Parliament.

Steve Chia's behaviour showed absolute contempt for women. He betrayed his wife as well as his domestic helper. He actually had the cheek to say that the helper consented to him taking pictures of her! Were they in an equal position for her to give any authentic consent? Obviously, he is a guy who abuses power--and that is very relevant to know about a politician. His wife had to publicly expose him in order to get him to stop. I would assume here that her previous entreaties, appeal to love and decency and his responsibility towards her in marriage had not worked. No woman would easily subject her own sexual life to public scrutiny because a story like this coming out in patriarchal society would point to her as sexually lacking (hence the husband strayed). Chia only capitulated when he had been found out.

You're telling me that is not relevant to his political performance? Would you expect him to lead or support legislation to support the rights of domestic workers or to empower women in marriage?

Politicians use morality arguments all the time in selling domestic and foreign policies. Shouldn't they then be expected to be moral? Bill Clinton was found out towards the end of his second term. What if they had found him out at the beginning? Could he have continued to be able to appeal to moral legitimacy in his role as president?

But also, I wonder if the ease about excusing Steve Chia and others goes back to patriarchal values. What if Sylvia Lim had been found to have patronised male prostitutes, that she was having an affair with a married family man or was into S&M, etc? Would everyone excuse her and say politicians shouldn't be expected to be saints?

I don't expect politicians to be saints. I don't care if a politician has marital trouble that leads to divorce, or if his wife or children do something unsavoury. I don't care if single men or women politicians have a hectic sexual life. But breaking marital vows that were legally grounded carries political implications. I think politicians should be expected to observe the country's laws.

 

[commoner]

you don't expect the politicans to be saints yet you commented on Steve Chia on betrayal wife and domestic help,,,,,

will you condemn him if he go Geylang and call prostitute?
if he scold his maid in public will you accept?
if he litters, will you accept?
if he sneeze without covering the mouth, will you accept?
obey the country's law to the dot?

polticians may even lose their place when they refuse to shake hand with a fish monger,,,

 

[KuanTi01]

While a politician should rightly not be expected to be perfect specimens of the human race, they above others who are non-politicians, must strictly observe certain parameters of what is deemed basic and socially acceptable behaviour. No abuse/misuse of authority, no betrayal of relatives and close friends, no cheating and no sexing around are among some of these parameters. Cross the line at their own peril! If they want to fool around and have fun, don't go into politics simply because expectations are always very high. While to err may be human, a scandalised politician is still no good for the society. Trust and respect must be earned the hard way! A fallen politician not only suffers for himself, others who have backed him suffers along too!

 

[leetahbar]

some troll was instigating ng teck siong to be a PM even b4 he could be MP but suay suay he got booted out of RP even b4 he could steady poon pee pee.:p

 

[Eurekas]

Good point especially when we are all "imperfect" as you put it.

In fact, for decades, PAP used the strategy of modelling a politician as clean and with high academic grades. It was a successful strategy for years as it painted the opposition badly. Only Chiam and Chee managed to manouveure, nothwitstanding old man's assualt on Chiam school academic results which led to an apology by old man for getting it wrong.


Our generation must cast aside that sainthood associated with anyone running for politics. The fundamental attributes should be
- act as an effective backstop to the PAP
- effective in representing the constituents
- effective in parliament
- desire to look after this country and its people

Dr Chee don't have much support of the Singaporeans, the results of SDP in the last election is only 20+. Mr Chiam and Mr Low managed to know how to maneuver over PAP so they stayed in the Parliament for 25 years and 18 years respectively

 

[scroobal]

If the maid did not consent, the police would have charged him for outraging her modesty. I am sure the PAP would have relished that. Since the wife reported the matter to the Police, the opportunity for the maid to come out of the situation would have become available and the question in terms of imbalance in position would have been reduced significantly.

Did I miss out on something else that was reported in terms of maid abuse.

As to infidelty, that puts an awful lot of pressure on possible oppostition candidates. PAP has a string of chaps that had more than a roving eye. I know of well known MP who was beating his wife and this was known to her family and people close to him and mind you they were educated and well placed people. Then the well known shennigans of our Minister of Home Affairs who was given a month to get married to square off the conservatives before the appointment. The Press or anyone else will not carry such stories.

I do not condone infidelty but either your conviction are too strong or you might have been conditioned like many of us to think that PAP is squeeky clean morality wise. I would suggest the "it takes a thief" approach until this despotic govt is set aside. Then the purge on immoraility can begin.

The playbook has to be practical.

Of course, there has to be a line when thiefs and philanderers plan move to more immoral activities and no such individuals should be nominated.

I am not sure I would do so for a maid abuser or a married man breaking his vows. The opposition parties have a responsibility to field people of some moral standing.

 

[leetahbar]

what about running away with the client's wifey? that one would definitely make a bigger news!

 

[leetahbar]

Dr Chee don't have much support of the Singaporeans, the results of SDP in the last election is only 20+. Mr Chiam and Mr Low managed to know how to maneuver over PAP so they stayed in the Parliament for 25 years and 18 years respectively

the next erection would be worst for sdp. they stand firmly to lose most of their balloting deposits. anyway, do they still pleading and begging for money? do u guys really heed their alms calling and donate? if u do, u r donating to the paps indirectly.

 

[bellepepper02]

If the maid did not consent, the police would have charged him for outraging her modesty. I am sure the PAP would have relished that. Since the wife reported the matter to the Police, the opportunity for the maid to come out of the situation would have become available and the question in terms of imbalance in position would have been reduced significantly.

Did I miss out on something else that was reported in terms of maid abuse.

As to infidelty, that puts an awful lot of pressure on possible oppostition candidates. PAP has a string of chaps that had more than a roving eye. I know of well known MP who was beating his wife and this was known to her family and people close to him and mind you they were educated and well placed people. Then the well known shennigans of our Minister of Home Affairs who was given a month to get married to square off the conservatives before the appointment. The Press or anyone else will not carry such stories.

I do not condone infidelty but either your conviction are too strong or you might have been conditioned like many of us to think that PAP is squeeky clean morality wise. I would suggest the "it takes a thief" approach until this despotic govt is set aside. Then the purge on immoraility can begin.

The playbook has to be practical.

Of course, there has to be a line when thiefs and philanderers plan move to more immoral activities and no such individuals should be nominated.

As far as I recall, the maid never talked throughout the saga. If she said she consented, she would have been shipped off. If she said he had imposed on her, she would likely never have been employed here by any family with all the doubts about her behaviour clinging to her. And what if he had given her a pay raise to keep quiet? Too many unknowns about the issue--which is actually what struck me as intriguing. If it had been a PAP MP, there would have been a solid investigation and the person would have been booted out, no matter what the outcome.

You think the ruling party would have relished a charge of outrage of modesty being brought against him? Why help to clean up another party's image and give the other party a chance to disavow him and get rid of him? Much better to have a morally compromised opposition member in Parliament. Chia will then start to symbolise the opposition as being morally dubious. People will wonder if all opposition MPs are like that. It was very intriguing for me to see ruling party folks come out in Chia's support and excusing him when they would never have condoned such behaviour from their own.

I do have a thing about infidelity within marriage. I don't see why people can't have the decency to at least separate from their partner (if not divorce) before they start on another relationship. It's basically about not taking responsibility for their action. It also involves secrecy and breaking somebody's trust, and causing suffering within the family. I don't see why we should allow a person who is capable of causing such unhappiness to lead the country. Private morality is linked to public morality. If he can cheat on his wife and family, he can cheat Singaporeans too.

Remember how shocked and betrayed Americans felt when John Edwards' affair during his presidential campaign was exposed? The wife had been supporting him for the campaign, she had just been in remission from cancer, and he does this? How can you accept someone like that into politics.

Affairs prior to entering politics aren't important. We can always give the benefit of the doubt--that the person has learned from the incident. But during his political tenure, no way.

In principle, I would excuse a couple who between them have agreed to have a "liberal" marriage. They should have the freedom to shape their own marital relationship. If a wife/husband can turn up and say, yes, I know s/he has other relationships but that's fine with me, then other citizens shouldn't hold it against the politician. But usually, in Singapore, extra-marital relations involve a betrayal of trust and secrecy and unhappiness being caused to other disempowered parties like the partner and children.

 

[Porfirio Rubirosa]

i think there is something to be said for the french political culture which does not encourage prying into the private lives of their politicians...

btw i wonder who leaked steve's wife's police report to ben nadarajan @ ST

If the maid did not consent, the police would have charged him for outraging her modesty. I am sure the PAP would have relished that. Since the wife reported the matter to the Police, the opportunity for the maid to come out of the situation would have become available and the question in terms of imbalance in position would have been reduced significantly.

Did I miss out on something else that was reported in terms of maid abuse.

As to infidelty, that puts an awful lot of pressure on possible oppostition candidates. PAP has a string of chaps that had more than a roving eye. I know of well known MP who was beating his wife and this was known to her family and people close to him and mind you they were educated and well placed people. Then the well known shennigans of our Minister of Home Affairs who was given a month to get married to square off the conservatives before the appointment. The Press or anyone else will not carry such stories.

I do not condone infidelty but either your conviction are too strong or you might have been conditioned like many of us to think that PAP is squeeky clean morality wise. I would suggest the "it takes a thief" approach until this despotic govt is set aside. Then the purge on immoraility can begin.

The playbook has to be practical.

Of course, there has to be a line when thiefs and philanderers plan move to more immoral activities and no such individuals should be nominated.

 

[Porfirio Rubirosa]

flesh is weak my dear...but that does not necessarly mean that it shall affect and compromise one's performance as a political leader save for perhaps the issue of blackmail...now i wonder why PAPs recently passed legislation preventing private surveillance being carried out on elected officials

I do have a thing about infidelity within marriage. I don't see why people can't have the decency to at least separate from their partner (if not divorce) before they start on another relationship. It's basically about not taking responsibility for their action. It also involves secrecy and breaking somebody's trust, and causing suffering within the family. I don't see why we should allow a person who is capable of causing such unhappiness to lead the country. Private morality is linked to public morality. If he can cheat on his wife and family, he can cheat Singaporeans too.

Remember how shocked and betrayed Americans felt when John Edwards' affair during his presidential campaign was exposed? The wife had been supporting him for the campaign, she had just been in remission from cancer, and he does this? How can you accept someone like that into politics.

Affairs prior to entering politics aren't important. We can always give the benefit of the doubt--that the person has learned from the incident. But during his political tenure, no way. .

othman wok springs to mind...and mind you he was 'allowed' to take on another wife:p

. But usually, in Singapore, extra-marital relations involve a betrayal of trust and secrecy and unhappiness being caused to other disempowered parties like the partner and children.

 

[Porfirio Rubirosa]

don't underestimate Wayang Party's 'power' bro

THREE Nominated Member of Parliament (NMP) hopefuls, Mr Siew Kum Hong, Ms Loretta Chen and Ms Beatrice Chia-Richmond, have come under heavy criticism from netizens for being 'homosexuality' activists.
Mr Siew - who is seeking a second term as an NMP - has been bearing the brunt of the flak and was flamed on several popular forums, including a discussion thread on the government's Reach website, over his recent involvement in the Association of Women for Action and Research (Aware) leadership tussle.

Several postings accuse him of 'promoting homosexual lifestyle' and creating 'outrage among the majority of Singaporean', especially among parents.

One netizen wrote: 'I strongly feel that Siew Kum Hong is not suitable to be an NMP at all. His recent behaviour is really questionable. Why is he pushing so hard for the GLBT (Gay, Lesbian, Bisexuals and Transgender)? There are so many more pressing issues during this recession and yet he devoted so much of his time to the Aware saga.'

Another wrote: 'Does his views reflect the views of Parliment? He is dragging the whole reputation of the Singapore Govt and Parliment down with his actions. Stop wasting our time in Parliment and polarising Singapore society.'

But a small group is defending him. Said one of them: 'The more comments I read here, the more I realise that Siew Kum Hong has stood up for the advancement of very basic social and human rights issues that far too often goes unspoken or ignored by other representatives in the country.'

First opened for comments on May 1, the thread has gathered over 114 comments, with over 1,800 page views on Thursday morning.

Reach is a government-run website which encourages Singaporeans to contribute feedback and ideas on issues that concern them.

Known for his controversial views on several issues, including the repeal of of Section 377A which criminalises sex between consenting males, Mr Siew, 34, has supported the Aware's old guard who were ousted from office. He then actively campaigned for them and acted as their legal advisor during the Extraordinary General Meeting (EOGM) on May 2, which booted out the new executive committee and brought back the old guard.

Socio-political website Wayang Party said on its site that it has received notice that a campaign is underway to 'swarm' Reach with feedback to exert pressure on the Parliamentary Select Committee to reject Mr Siew's application.
The committee, led by Parliament Speaker Abdullah Tarmugi, will make its recommendations on NMPs to the President after the interview process.

Ms Chen, a theatre director, has been accused of being 'no different' in advocating a gay agenda.

'She's openly gay and has also directed films with mainly controversial themes. She's supposed to be a nominee from the arts community but is this again a back door for more pro LGBTs to represent voice in Parliament for education?' wrote a netizen on Reach.

Another critic says of Ms Chia-Richmond: 'She has directed and acted in many movies and mostly, if not all, are extremely provocative, dark and controversial, and many based on theme on homosexuality...'

Mr Siew has also been flamed on his personal blog for his so-called 'gay agenda', which prompted netizen to complain to the Prime Minister's Office.

This letter, which is posted by Mr Siew's blog site, says: 'We want to complain to the govt that an NMP Siew Kum Hong was not only openly taking sides in this internal affair of a secular organisation, but was part of the orchestrated disorder and mayhem on that day. He showed no regard for protocols until challenged by a member from the floor.'

Mr Siew remains unfazed by the torrent of criticisms. He told The New Paper (TNP) on Thursday that 'at no point did I seek to leverage on the fact that I am an NMP'.

'I am anti-discriminatory.... these people are ignoring the existence of the middle ground,' TNP quoted him as saying.

You must be bored to cook up something like this or there is no item to sensationalise.

I.

 

[scroobal]

I am mindful that in the kingdom of the blind, the one eyed is king. In cricket, you can read the type of ball bowled by watching an orthodox pace bowler. When it comes to an unorthodox sling bowler, you have no clue where the ball is going including the bowler himself. These are the ones you never ever underestimate.

don't underestimate Wayang Party's 'power' bro

.

 

[scroobal]

I think its wrong to suggest that the maid did not consent. Neither am I suggesting that she consented. I would suggest that its very much unknown. As the Police was involved, she could just as well seek embassy help and screw the Chias for all they got plus a criminal conviction.

I am well aware that morality is an issue for the vast majority. The point that I make it is to judge both the PAP and the opposition on equal footing.

Too many unknowns about the issue--.

 

[scroobal]

The Police regulary leak everything where gossip is concerned. Note the Toh Chin Chye matter. Lionel de Souza was very well known for it.

i think there is something to be said for the french political culture which does not encourage prying into the private lives of their politicians...

btw i wonder who leaked steve's wife's police report to ben nadarajan @ ST

 

[bellepepper02]

I think its wrong to suggest that the maid did not consent. Neither am I suggesting that she consented. I would suggest that its very much unknown. As the Police was involved, she could just as well seek embassy help and screw the Chias for all they got plus a criminal conviction.

I am well aware that morality is an issue for the vast majority. The point that I make it is to judge both the PAP and the opposition on equal footing.

Oh yeah, of course, we need to judge them equally.

Also, yes, we don't know enough about the case to consider whether she consented or not. But whether she consented or not does not let Chia off the hook. It's maid abuse. It's not on her contract is it that she should allow him to take semi-nude pix of her?

I looked up the Employment Act, and it said the place where someone works is a public place. Hence, the home where she works becomes a public place for a domestic worker. So, Chia did the picture taking in a public place. Can he be prosecuted for an act of indecency then?

 

[bellepepper02]

flesh is weak my dear...but that does not necessarly mean that it shall affect and compromise one's performance as a political leader save for perhaps the issue of blackmail...now i wonder why PAPs recently passed legislation preventing private surveillance being carried out on elected officials

Flesh is weak? Does that mean marriage, with all its conditions, is an unnatural institution? Maybe we should change it then. Allow both husband and wife to have affairs outside the marriage. Or abolish marriage altogether.

But as long as we want to keep the institution, we should respect its conditions and not make excuses for ourselves. It's not the flesh that is weak--it is the mind. Sexual desire is a mental thing.

Did you read John Edwards' explanation for why he had an extra-marital affair? He said he wanted to see what he could get away with. Somewhat like kleptomaniacs. Would we accept kleptomaniac political leaders?

 

[SIFU]

Oh yeah, of course, we need to judge them equally.

Also, yes, we don't know enough about the case to consider whether she consented or not. But whether she consented or not does not let Chia off the hook. It's maid abuse. It's not on her contract is it that she should allow him to take semi-nude pix of her?

I looked up the Employment Act, and it said the place where someone works is a public place. Hence, the home where she works becomes a public place for a domestic worker. So, Chia did the picture taking in a public place. Can he be prosecuted for an act of indecency then?

u pissed that steve chia never chio u to take your nude pics is it

lau char bor of cos not good photographic material lah..