• IP addresses are NOT logged in this forum so there's no point asking. Please note that this forum is full of homophobes, racists, lunatics, schizophrenics & absolute nut jobs with a smattering of geniuses, Chinese chauvinists, Moderate Muslims and last but not least a couple of "know-it-alls" constantly sprouting their dubious wisdom. If you believe that content generated by unsavory characters might cause you offense PLEASE LEAVE NOW! Sammyboy Admin and Staff are not responsible for your hurt feelings should you choose to read any of the content here.

    The OTHER forum is HERE so please stop asking.

How Jesus ended up as God

JohnTan

Alfrescian (InfP)
Generous Asset
In his lifetime, it is on record he had 12. Its in your bible.

Wrong.

Jesus had 12 disciples, aka 'close followers'. He had more than 12 disciples.

After this the Lord appointed seventy-two[a] others and sent them two by two ahead of him to every town and place where he was about to go. - Luke 10 : 1

Which flaws?

Excluding pedophilia, slavery, banditry, executing of critics, tortured people for their money, faking his quran?
 

Loofydralb

Alfrescian
Loyal
Which in simple english, means muhammad performed no miracles. His only so-called miracle was to emerge from his mother's vagina alive, like billions of other people.
Thanks for your admission.

It is a miracle considering your bible contains contradictions, lies, forgeries, corruptions, numbers that don't match, number that don't add up, the original is forever lost, translated and transliterated into Greek, Latin, Spanish, English back and forth and back and forth until all meaning is lost, innuendoes, some bibles contain more chapters that others, some verses contain more sentences than other bibles, some words totally changed, some words totally deleted, some words totally added, copies copied unto copies unto copies ad infinitum with dozens of wrong translation and mistakes added, and all these is still continuing practise until today.

Wrong. It has already been established long ago that the quran has been edited and changed. moslems are just brainwashed into thinking that it hasn't been changed. And moslems will stage riots and looting under the excuses of blasphemy when presented with the evidence. So people refrain from doing so just to preserve the peace.

Even christian scholars and the pope grudgingly admit the Quran is original. Those who commit acts that don't conform to the Quran, please blame it on the person and not the book.
 

Loofydralb

Alfrescian
Loyal
Wrong.

Jesus had 12 disciples, aka 'close followers'. He had more than 12 disciples.

After this the Lord appointed seventy-two[a] others and sent them two by two ahead of him to every town and place where he was about to go. - Luke 10 : 1

Those were not disciples. They are employed to do a job. And written by Luke. Who is Luke?


Excluding pedophilia, slavery, banditry, executing of critics, tortured people for their money, faking his quran?

Haha, where you got all this from, an Islamophobe website?
 

JohnTan

Alfrescian (InfP)
Generous Asset
the original is forever lost, translated and transliterated into Greek, Latin, Spanish, English back and forth and back and forth until all meaning is lost,

What crap! So your fake god can only communicated in arabic? Change arabic into english and all the meaning is lost? Your god sounds incompetent to pass down his message.

Even christian scholars and the pope grudgingly admit the Quran is original.

Yawn.

Even muhammad himself allowed his quran to be changed if it sounded better to his ears. The quran, on several occasions, was changed by muhammad's scribe, Abdullah ibn Abi Sarh. So that settles any issue regarding the quran being changed during muhammad's time, let alone after he kicked the bucket from poison.

He started saying, "I used to direct Muhammad wherever I willed. He would dictate to me 'Most High, All-Wise', and I would write down 'All-Wise' only. Then he would say, 'Yes it is all the same'. On a certain occasion he said, 'Write such and such', but I wrote 'Write' only, and he said, 'Write whatever you like.'"

So when this scribe exposed Muhammad, he wrote in the Qur'an, "And who does greater evil than he who forges against God a lie, or says, 'To me it has been revealed', when naught has been revealed to him."

So on the day Muhammad conquered Mecca, he commanded his scribe to be killed.

But the scribe fled to `Uthman Ibn `Affan, because `Uthman was his foster brother (his mother suckled `Uthman). `Uthman, therefore, kept him away from Muhammad. After the people calmed down, `Uthman brought the scribe to Muhammad and sought protection for him. Muhammad kept silent for a long time, after which he said yes. When `Uthman had left, Muhammad said "I only kept silent so that you (the people) should kill him."
 

JohnTan

Alfrescian (InfP)
Generous Asset
Those were not disciples. They are employed to do a job. And written by Luke. Who is Luke?

They were disciples of Jesus. So what did those employees get paid with? Jesus disciples didn't plunder and loot like mahomet's companions.

Luke was your father. Go figure that out yourself.

Excluding pedophilia, slavery, banditry, executing of critics, tortured people for their money, faking his quran?

Haha, where you got all this from, an Islamophobe website?

From the quran and the hadith.

You may be ashamed of your own prophet's actions, but many moslems are not. They view his actions as a huge inspiration and as the deeds of a great warrior or king.
 

Loofydralb

Alfrescian
Loyal
They were disciples of Jesus. So what did those employees get paid with? Jesus disciples didn't plunder and loot like mahomet's companions.

Luke was your father. Go figure that out yourself.

Oooo....JT triggered. Normally that happens when in your heart you can no longer defend the falsehood. Anyway Luke did not write the Gospel of Luke. Somebody else wrote it and assumed the name Luke. Go ask your own scholars.

From the quran and the hadith.

You may be ashamed of your own prophet's actions, but many moslems are not. They view his actions as a huge inspiration and as the deeds of a great warrior or king.

If that was the case all your previous prophets did mostly the same. So now christians will start disbelieving their earlier prophets?
 

JohnTan

Alfrescian (InfP)
Generous Asset
Oooo....JT triggered. Normally that happens when in your heart you can no longer defend the falsehood. Anyway Luke did not write the Gospel of Luke. Somebody else wrote it and assumed the name Luke. Go ask your own scholars.

Yawn. Book of Luke is authentic enough. Don't islamists like you cherrypick bible verses you like to support your fake religion when it suits your purposes?

If that was the case all your previous prophets did mostly the same. So now christians will start disbelieving their earlier prophets?

All the Christian prophets did mostly the same? All?

I doubt Elijah raped women like mahomet did. Did Samuel ask other men whether they liked to fuck little girls instead of adult women? That was what your only prophet, mahomet, did. Only retards like you take such a messed up character as a prophet.
 

tanwahtiu

Alfrescian
Loyal
The centre verse of the Bible book says

Psalms 118 v 8
It is better to trust in God than in confident of man.

There are a total of 1188 verses in the Bible book. And smack right in the centre, middle of the book is Psalms 118 v 8.

Meaning Bible written by man. Don't trust man.

Prophecy:
"Then God said, 'Yes, but your wife Sarah will bear you a son, and you will call him Isaac. I will establish my covenant with him as an everlasting covenant for his descendants after him'" (Genesis 17:19).

Fulfillment:
"Nor because they are his descendants are they all Abraham's children. On the contrary, 'It is through Isaac that your offspring will be reckoned'” (Romans 9:7).

Prophecy:
"Therefore the Lord himself will give you a sign: The virgin will conceive and give birth to a son, and will call him Immanuel" (Isaiah 7:14).

Fulfillment:
"The angel answered, “The Holy Spirit will come on you, and the power of the Most High will overshadow you. So the holy one to be born will be called the Son of God" (Luke 1:35).

Prophecy:
"But you, Bethlehem Ephrathah,
though you are small among the clans of Judah,
out of you will come for me
one who will be ruler over Israel,
whose origins are from of old,
from ancient times." (Micah 5:2).

Fulfillment:
"When he had called together all the people's chief priests and teachers of the law, he asked them where the Messiah was to be born. 'In Bethlehem in Judea,' they replied, 'for this is what the prophet has written:

"'But you, Bethlehem, in the land of Judah,
are by no means least among the rulers of Judah;
for out of you will come a ruler
who will shepherd my people Israel.'" (Matthew 2:4–6).

Prophecy:
"The animals you choose must be year-old males without defect, and you may take them from the sheep or the goats" (Exodus 12:5).

Fulfillment:
"How much more, then, will the blood of Christ, who through the eternal Spirit offered himself unblemished to God, cleanse our consciences from acts that lead to death, so that we may serve the living God!" (Hebrews 9:14)
 
Last edited:

syed putra

Alfrescian
Loyal
Even muhammad himself allowed his quran to be changed if it sounded better to his ears. The quran, on several occasions, was changed by muhammad's scribe, Abdullah ibn Abi Sarh. So that settles any issue regarding the quran being changed during muhammad's time, let alone after he kicked the bucket from poison.
They carbon date a early Koran stored in Birmingham to have been written during the time of Mahomet. Just several pages. But its the same as current copies,
 

syed putra

Alfrescian
Loyal
The Koran is not unique. It seems to be a derivative of the original Jewish stories. Names and angels and promises all similar, just adapted. If you believe in this, I'm sorry to say their god has specifically stated there is no place in heaven for non-Jews
Several verses in the quran are actually meant for the jews. It gave examples how the jews have erred. Quran is actually a book that is anti religion. Most muslims just don't get it. They change way if like into religion.and stsrted rituals, just like how the jews in 9ne of the examples started praying to a heifer after they were saved by Moses. Became idol worshipper when Moses was away.
 

JohnTan

Alfrescian (InfP)
Generous Asset
They carbon date a early Koran stored in Birmingham to have been written during the time of Mahomet. Just several pages. But its the same as current copies,

Looks like a slightly different version of the quran, one of the two moslem religious scriptures.

In July the University of Birmingham made headlines when it revealed two leaves of worn parchment recently rediscovered in its archives were probably made between AD568 and 645.

Muhammad is traditionally believed to have lived between AD570 and 632.

But there are twists and turns in the tale.

Dr Mustafa Shah, from the Islamic studies department at the School of Oriental and African Studies in London, has questioned this date.

He says the writing itself "is evolved and elaborate, intimating that it represented a mature form" of Arabic writing and places it several decades later.


https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-35495035
 

Loofydralb

Alfrescian
Loyal
Yawn. Book of Luke is authentic enough. Don't islamists like you cherrypick bible verses you like to support your fake religion when it suits your purposes?

Luke didn't write Luke. SOmeone stole Luke's name. Christian scholars admitted that much. Who are you to dispute your own scholars?

All the Christian prophets did mostly the same? All?

I doubt Elijah raped women like mahomet did. Did Samuel ask other men whether they liked to fuck little girls instead of adult women? That was what your only prophet, mahomet, did. Only retards like you take such a messed up character as a prophet.

None of the prophets raped anyone. You don't even read your bible and what the prophets did.
 

mojito

Alfrescian
Loyal
Rubbish. You sinkies should be reading From Third World to First! Written exactly when our Lord and savior was alive and well, like his last will. None is more power full here. :cool:
 

JohnTan

Alfrescian (InfP)
Generous Asset
None of the prophets raped anyone. You don't even read your bible and what the prophets did.

Muhammad and his warriors killed other men and took their women for themselves. It is considered as rape, even if that practice was common long ago and deemed acceptable. You really whitewash your own prophet's history like you are ashamed of him.

Unlike you, I read extensively. The Bible, unlike the quran and hadith, does not whitewash crimes and sins of their prophets.

FROM THE qURAN - 33:50

"Prophet, We have made lawful to you the wives whom you have granted dowries and the slave girls whom God has given you as booty;..."

Another example:
Mariyam was a Christian slave girl and she was given to Muhammad as a gift by the governor of Egypt. Muhammad got her pregnant and she gave birth to a son. Afterwards Muhammad married her. The son died 18 months later.

In the "Kitab al-Tabaqat al-Kabir", mention is made of Mariyah. On page 151, it says

"He [the Lord of Alexandria] presented to the prophet Mariyah, her sister Sirin, a donkey and a mule which was white....The apostle of Allah liked Mariyah who was of white complexion and curly hair and pretty.... Then he cohabited with Mariyah as a handmaid and sent her to his property which he had acquired from Banu al-Nadir."


Bible Old Testament

And here's a sex scandal in the Bible. King David got his warrior Uriah the Hittite killed, and took the man's wife for his own. In this encounter, it is evident that Uriah the Hittite was a man of honor, and conducted himself better than David, a man who was anointed by God.

Then it happened one evening that David arose from his bed and walked on the roof of the king’s house. And from the roof he saw a woman bathing, and the woman was very beautiful to behold. 3 So David sent and inquired about the woman. And someone said, “Is this not [a]Bathsheba, the daughter of Eliam, the wife of Uriah the Hittite?” 4 Then David sent messengers, and took her; and she came to him, and he lay with her, for she was cleansed from her impurity; and she returned to her house. 5 And the woman conceived; so she sent and told David, and said, “I am with child.”

6 Then David sent to Joab, saying, “Send me Uriah the Hittite.” And Joab sent Uriah to David. 7 When Uriah had come to him, David asked how Joab was doing, and how the people were doing, and how the war prospered. 8 And David said to Uriah, “Go down to your house and wash your feet.” So Uriah departed from the king’s house, and a gift of food from the king followed him. 9 But Uriah slept at the door of the king’s house with all the servants of his lord, and did not go down to his house. 10 So when they told David, saying, “Uriah did not go down to his house,” David said to Uriah, “Did you not come from a journey? Why did you not go down to your house?”

11 And Uriah said to David, “The ark and Israel and Judah are dwelling in tents, and my lord Joab and the servants of my lord are encamped in the open fields. Shall I then go to my house to eat and drink, and to lie with my wife? As you live, and as your soul lives, I will not do this thing.” 2 Samuel, 11 : 2 - 10
 

Nice-Gook

Alfrescian
Loyal
Sorry. I dont ustand ur post? Highlighted in red.

Quran is unique cos its the only Holy book in this world that the whole 114 chapter of the Quran is being stored in Muslims heart. Letter by letter, word by word. And tere are million of hafiz four corners of the world. Nothing surprising if teres similarities between the Quran and the OT. To me is the same God, different name. But not jesus pbuh ya. The Prophet was a humble man. How could he proclaimed himself to be a King or a Prophet?

Yes. The Prophet experience is mentioned in the Quran. Read the whole context.


Also mentioned in the hadiths... Tabari and Ibn Ishaq write that Muhammad told Zubayr:

“When I was midway on the mountain, I heard a voice from heaven saying “O Muhammad! you are the apostle of Allah and I am Gabriel.” I raised my head towards heaven to see who was speaking, and Gabriel in the form of a man with feet astride the horizon, saying, “O Muhammad! you are the apostle of Allah and I am Gabriel.” I stood gazing at him moving neither forward nor backward, then I began to turn my face away from him, but towards whatever region of the sky I looked, I saw him as before.”

When we say the message is in manuscript u say written by human. Corrupted. When we say its by verbal transmission, u also say corruption. Like tat head or tail u win leow lah. C'mon lah.

Again in the Quran...prophethood mentioned:

O you who believe, obey Allah, the Messenger, and those in command among you. If you disagree about something, refer it back to Allah and the Messenger, if you believe in Allah and the Last Day. That is the best thing to do and gives the best result. (Surat an-Nisa`: 59)


وَمَا مُحَمَّدٌ إِلَّا رَسُولٌ قَدْ خَلَتْ مِنْ قَبْلِهِ الرُّسُلُ

Muhammad is not but a messenger. [Other] messengers have passed on before him. So if he was to die or be killed, would you turn back on your heels [to unbelief]? And he who turns back on his heels will never harm Allah at all; but Allah will reward the grateful. [Q3:144]


مَا كَانَ مُحَمَّدٌ أَبَا أَحَدٍ مِنْ رِجَالِكُمْ وَلَٰكِنْ رَسُولَ اللَّهِ

Muhammad is not the father of [any] one of your men, but [he is] the Messenger of Allah and last of the prophets. And ever is Allah , of all things, Knowing. [Q33:40]
Myself hardly comment on anything religious

but I must take my hat off to you

you are defending single handedly your faith , whreas a whole lot of vultures are descending on you and your faith

this topic of Islam being violent and your prophet being a pedophile had been discussed to death , but those christians and Hindus who points finger at Islam couldn’t explain the dirt within their religion themselves , eg how is it possible for Christ to be born without a father ? And Hindus have numerous of their gods born out of wedlocks as well

than the question of Mohammed’s marriage to many and very young Aisha , in today’s context it’s totally unacceptable but certainly not in his era , because marriage was one way of protecting woman to begin with ,in Mohammed days ...and many of our grandmothers were married at the age of 13 as well , not to mention that marriages of kids as young as 8 are still practiced in some parts of the world where the consumption is put on hold till their late teens but done to protect their self interests

Many of the oft repeated arguments against your faith are selective and propagated by online hate cites .

jews were the most protected community in the Islamic world but most hated in the Christian world , but today they join hand to belittle and tarnish anything and everything Islamic , so much for Jews gratefulness ...not to mention that the creation of Israel itself was paying a price for Germans atrocities of the Jewish people but it was the Palestinians who ended up as refugees

if the west was so humanitarian , Australia or US could have housed the Palestinians whose lands were given to the Zionists

In any respect , lots of respect for you having to explain single handedly against all the hatred manufactured against your faith
 
Top