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A reply to State propagandists

Singa Crew

Alfrescian
Loyal
Dr Chee's recent interviews on America's talk shows have sparked a wave of criticisms from PAP propagandists and supporters. These propagandists have repeatedly claimed that by granting interviews to the foreign press, Dr Chee is trying to 'do us in'. So really, they are merely parroting our own MM Lee when they said that by alerting the world to our plight (lack of human rights), our economy will suffer and we will get done in.

The nonsense spouted by these propagandists is nothing more than unwarranted extrapolation and a desperate attempt to mislead Singaporeans.

First of all, let us take a look at Dr Chee's intention and statement, and see how that was mangled by the PAP propagandists to mislead the public.

"He will call on the US to deal with Singapore on the basis of equality where America's political and business leaders don't collaborate with the Singapore Government on trade at the expense of democracy and human rights.

Such an approach only allows and even encourages the PAP to continue its exploitation of Singaporeans where wages are depressed while the cost of living continues to rise."

From: http://yoursdp.org/index.php/news/singapore/3041-chee-soon-juan-to-do-a-series-of-radion-shows-in-us

No rational person can possibly misunderstand Dr Chee's call on the US to deal with Singapore on the basis of equality to mean 'severing business ties' or 'don't invest in Singapore'. It is clear that these PAP propagandists simply highlighted the 'don't collaborate with the Singapore Government' bit, and purposely misunderstood it to mean 'severing business ties'. They are simply taking advantage of the fact that many Singaporeans do not understand the subtle nuances of the English language, and that many skim through web articles and focus on highlighted portions.

Surely, foreign businesses that respect workers' rights can only be a good thing! Surely foreign businesses that do not wantonly retrench Singaporeans in favour of cheaper Third World labour can only benefit Singaporeans!

But of course, it doesn't bother officers working in ISD offices whether Singaporean workers are paid lesser and lesser despite growing living costs.

While they are in the throes of their 'righteous' rant, these propagandists also cleverly omitted the fact that the PAP are the ones collaborating with foreign powers!

"The PAP even consults these foreign companies on how much Sinaporeans' should be paid. The National Wages Council has on its 2007/2008 board representatives from the US (Douglas Miller), Japanese (Shigeru Kobayashi), and German (Alexander Melchers) chambers of commerce."

From: http://yoursdp.org/index.php/news/singapore/3063-chee-stop-the-exploitation-of-workers

Dr Chee's interviews have given him greater access to the American public and helped spread the message of Singapore's struggle for democracy and freedom. The PAP are getting worried. With increased international scrutiny, they will have to learn to curb their excesses. And with the typical PAP paranoia of losing even a small fraction of their power and wealth, we see an increase in propaganda messages both online and in the print media. I wonder who is paying for all that overtime our hardworking State propagandists are putting in?

Crew
 

TeeKee

Alfrescian
Loyal
<object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/qLcc19mt4eA&hl=en_US&fs=1&"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/qLcc19mt4eA&hl=en_US&fs=1&" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></object>
 

TeeKee

Alfrescian
Loyal
But of course, it doesn't bother officers working in ISD offices whether Singaporean workers are paid lesser and lesser despite growing living costs.

to my lovely dear ISD:

today is world's kindess day...

please practise what you preach okay? :biggrin:
 

lockeliberal

Alfrescian
Loyal
Dear Singa

Dr Chee and his supporters might want to consider the following points about living in a globalized economy and a globalized world. Firstly Dr Chee is not messiah and is not a god, he cannot in any way create jobs or foreign investment or get foreign businesses to set up invest and trade from Singapore all in the name human rights and democracy. Businesses do not care ABOUT the issues he cares about and yes in this globalized world other places like CHINA will gladly take in the investment the trade and the JOBs which he so derides because the PAP is in his view exploiting "workers" or the foreign corporations are taking advantage of our inherent labor flexibility.

Whilst the balance between profit, social welfare, costs and businesses can be adjusted and should be adjusted in some ways. No ONE with the interests of Singapore and Singaporeans at heart will say to STOP Inhibit trade or the flow of investment of jobs because the balance is not in his view correct at present

I am all for correcting or improving the balance, I am NOT for inhibiting trade and investment until that BALANCE is well more in favor of Dr Chee's view or for my view.




Locke
 

TeeKee

Alfrescian
Loyal
you are wrong....govt. interference with businesses are killing off entrepreneuship and small biz....and stifling the nation's economy.

if CSJ or any oppositions gain into power will forbid govt. from interfering with business interests....because they are both conflicting each others..by putting MIWs into positions of GIC related company are stifling it's growth.

a country should be run like a country, not a company. business run by businessmen, not by politicians...

because the funding comes from taxpayers, i.e. peasants...

the economy should be modelled after HK....where really free enterprise reign and govt. only plays the regulatory role and allocates peasants money fairly...

why do you think foreign investments will come to SGP instead of cheaper SEA?
 

Froggy

Alfrescian (InfP) + Mod
Moderator
Generous Asset
I heard from a "blue" taxi driver before that his company went to schools to question principals if they can trust private school bus drivers and their so call small companies. However what the "blue" company can offer is comprehensive insurance from their powerful insurance company backed by MIW & Co. Principals panicked signed contract with them and chased the private company out.

Then they went to tell drivers that they had lost their jobs and its better that they sell their buses to them and continue to drive for the company. So end up buses changed colour and drivers changed uniforms. same buses, same drivers, but all kanna makaned.
 

TeeKee

Alfrescian
Loyal
I heard from a "blue" taxi driver before that his company went to schools to question principals if they can trust private school bus drivers and their so call small companies. However what the "blue" company can offer is comprehensive insurance from their powerful insurance company backed by MIW & Co. Principals panicked signed contract with them and chased the private company out.

Then they went to tell drivers that they had lost their jobs and its better that they sell their buses to them and continue to drive for the company. So end up buses changed colour and drivers changed uniforms. same buses, same drivers, but all kanna makaned.


why so troublesome?
 
D

Darth Vader

Guest
you are wrong....govt. interference with businesses are killing off entrepreneuship and small biz....and stifling the nation's economy.

if CSJ or any oppositions gain into power will forbid govt. from interfering with business interests....because they are both conflicting each others..by putting MIWs into positions of GIC related company are stifling it's growth.

a country should be run like a country, not a company. business run by businessmen, not by politicians...

because the funding comes from taxpayers, i.e. peasants...

the economy should be modelled after HK....where really free enterprise reign and govt. only plays the regulatory role and allocates peasants money fairly...

why do you think foreign investments will come to SGP instead of cheaper SEA?

Right my boy forget about the Men in White. Come to the darkside and join me, together we will rule the universe!

 

Goh Meng Seng

Alfrescian (InfP) [Comp]
Generous Asset
Dear Tee Kee,

In a strange way, I totally agree with you for the first time on this post. :wink:

Goh Meng Seng

you are wrong....govt. interference with businesses are killing off entrepreneuship and small biz....and stifling the nation's economy.

if CSJ or any oppositions gain into power will forbid govt. from interfering with business interests....because they are both conflicting each others..by putting MIWs into positions of GIC related company are stifling it's growth.

a country should be run like a country, not a company. business run by businessmen, not by politicians...

because the funding comes from taxpayers, i.e. peasants...

the economy should be modelled after HK....where really free enterprise reign and govt. only plays the regulatory role and allocates peasants money fairly...

why do you think foreign investments will come to SGP instead of cheaper SEA?
 

Watchman

Alfrescian
Loyal
Chee Soon Juan is a prick ! USA is no better than Singapore. In fact much worst !

We got not much friends now . Every country for himself, every man to himself .
 

scroobal

Alfrescian
Loyal
Firstly nobody with a brain will put any value on articles, opinions, commentary etc coming from SPH rags or state media when its comes to domestic politics.

Singaporeans base their criticism of Chee on the following channels
- chee's comments and interviews made to foreign entities and that appear on foreign media, UTube etc
- SDP articles etc

Its over 20 years since he came on the political stage and by now a reasonably informed singaporean can drawn his own conclusions about what Chee is all about.

Constantly attributing negative criticisms of Chee to state propaganda and PAP apologists is just burying one's head in the sand. Worse, it does not help the man change his approach to be effective .

Nobody disputes the issues such as various facets of freedom being curtailed and the oppressive measures of the PAP. Its the way that it is tackled. In short, a monotone, tone deaf singer to trying his level best over 20 years to sing the same song.

Bear in mind, I am not suggesting that he is stupid or silly. The fact that he travels to the US regularly tells me that he is a smart man. Just that he can't sing for his supper.

In a nutshell, we all agree with the issues and I don't see anyone disagree. He just can't peel that onion despite trying for 20 years. Pointless blaming the audience.

He performed the worst of all opposition candidates minus some crackpots at his last crack at politics and that should have prompted some sort of critical post mortem. It was not flash in the pan. The performance has been going downhill since he joined the fray. It is also not a surprise that he disqualified himself rather than face further embarrasment. The litmus test is his performance versus the other opposition candidates at the polls. Nothing to do with the tyrant of an old man or his Nazi party masquerading as some sort of grassroots organisation.

Maybe it is also time to get rid of some party members that are idealists and not realists. At least attempt to get some competent individuals instead of a failed scholar ( i am being generous here with the scholar tag), a 3rd rate academic and people who no one has a clue about their bona fides.



Dr Chee's recent interviews on America's talk shows have sparked a wave of criticisms from PAP propagandists and supporters. These propagandists have repeatedly claimed that by granting interviews to the foreign press, Dr Chee is trying to 'do us in'. So really, they are merely parroting our own MM Lee when they said that by alerting the world to our plight (lack of human rights), our economy will suffer and we will get done in.

The nonsense spouted by these propagandists is nothing more than unwarranted extrapolation and a desperate attempt to mislead Singaporeans.

First of all, let us take a look at Dr Chee's intention and statement, and see how that was mangled by the PAP propagandists to mislead the public.
 
Last edited:

Einfield

Alfrescian
Loyal
Put Singapore up for Tender, the highest bidder get the country.
Split the money with the citizen and let them decide if they want to stay or migrate.
Dirty Harry is very good at this, he always get huge profit from selling us out.
 

Liquigas

Alfrescian
Loyal
People say many things about him ; he is mad, is arrogant, confrontational, aggressive, out to destroy this country. But to me, he is just an opposition politician and the things that he believes in like having a just, caring, open, transparent and fair society are also the values in our national pledge. Anything wrong? Mind you, he is not advocating violence, breaking the law nor is he out to create a divisive society.

He is certainly ahead of his times and could be understood only many years later. It is the political climate that we are living in now. When one man is long gone and when the ruling party loses its stranglehold on local politics, trust me, people will start to see him as well as opposition politics very differently.
 

scroobal

Alfrescian
Loyal
Lets not exaggerate. He is not mad and neither is he arrogant or aggressive. Where did you get these attributes from. JBJ can be arrogant and aggressive but not Chee. I have never seen Chee lose his cool, neither have I seen him flay his hands wildly etc. He is mild mannered, strong yet confrontational. He is also well groomed. Those are not the issues that Singapore are unhappy about.

Its his approach - strategy and tactics. Unable to resonate with the voters. Targetting western media but not singaporeans.

How is ahead of his times? Seems like a throw away line similar to mad, aggressive.

Thats the trouble with you guys. You have no clue what ticks about the very people that you care about. If you say that his determined, strong willed and passionate, that quite accurate.

Everyone wants a "just, caring, open, transparent and fair society". I have yet to hear someone say otherwise. Name me one forummer or singaporean who claimed that he wanted an uncaring, secretive, unfair and unjust society.

How to overthrow a tyranny, if you can't even describe what you want?







People say many things about him ; he is mad, is arrogant, confrontational, aggressive, out to destroy this country. But to me, he is just an opposition politician and the things that he believes in like having a just, caring, open, transparent and fair society are also the values in our national pledge. Anything wrong? Mind you, he is not advocating violence, breaking the law nor is he out to create a divisive society.

He is certainly ahead of his times and could be understood only many years later. It is the political climate that we are living in now. When one man is long gone and when the ruling party loses its stranglehold on local politics, trust me, people will start to see him as well as opposition politics very differently.
 

jw5

Moderator
Moderator
Loyal
Lets not exaggerate. He is not mad and neither is he arrogant or aggressive. Where did you get these attributes from. JBJ can be arrogant and aggressive but not Chee. I have never seen Chee lose his cool, neither have I seen him flay his hands wildly etc. He is mild mannered, strong yet confrontational. He is also well groomed. Those are not the issues that Singapore are unhappy about.

Its his approach - strategy and tactics. Unable to resonate with the voters. Targetting western media but not singaporeans.

How is ahead of his times? Seems like a throw away line similar to mad, aggressive.

Thats the trouble with you guys. You have no clue what ticks about the very people that you care about. If you say that his determined, strong willed and passionate, that quite accurate.

Everyone wants a "just, caring, open, transparent and fair society". I have yet to hear someone say otherwise. Name me one forummer or singaporean who claimed that he wanted an uncaring, secretive, unfair and unjust society.

How to overthrow a tyranny, if you can't even describe what you want?
I agree that he is neither mad nor arrogant, but he has been aggressive at the wrong time and possibly to the wrong people.
He should not have been so confrontational and bitter about his dismissal from NUS and the perceived political persecution.
He should have taken it in his stride, put on a smile, stood for elections and got into parliament.
And then make his speeches forcefully with the protection of parliamentary priviledge, all the time relating his points back to the materialistic and livelihood concerns of Singaporeans, whilst putting on a fake smile.
 

jw5

Moderator
Moderator
Loyal
People say many things about him ; he is mad, is arrogant, confrontational, aggressive, out to destroy this country. But to me, he is just an opposition politician and the things that he believes in like having a just, caring, open, transparent and fair society are also the values in our national pledge. Anything wrong? Mind you, he is not advocating violence, breaking the law nor is he out to create a divisive society.

He is certainly ahead of his times and could be understood only many years later. It is the political climate that we are living in now. When one man is long gone and when the ruling party loses its stranglehold on local politics, trust me, people will start to see him as well as opposition politics very differently.
He may be ahead of the times, but many Singaporeans are ignorant, stupid, cowardly, easily brainwashed, materialistic, greedy and well behind the times.
 

scroobal

Alfrescian
Loyal
It may not be the asian way of standing up to issues but I felt that it was appropriate and not aggressive. He was neither violent nor unruly but certainly confrontational. The fact that his style was perceived by some in our society as aggressive was another tactical error that has yet to be corrected.

I do agree with you thus that voters would prefer a less confrontational style and do the damage in parliament. Also acknowledge the point that his bitterness got the better of him.



I agree that he is neither mad nor arrogant, but he has been aggressive at the wrong time and possibly to the wrong people.
He should not have been so confrontational and bitter about his dismissal from NUS and the perceived political persecution.
He should have taken it in his stride, put on a smile, stood for elections and got into parliament.
And then make his speeches forcefully with the protection of parliamentary priviledge, all the time relating his points back to the materialistic and livelihood concerns of Singaporeans, whilst putting on a fake smile.
 

SamuelStalin

Alfrescian
Loyal
"The PAP even consults these foreign companies on how much Sinaporeans' should be paid. The National Wages Council has on its 2007/2008 board representatives from the US (Douglas Miller), Japanese (Shigeru Kobayashi), and German (Alexander Melchers) chambers of commerce."

Oh okay, the world's advanced powers. UK is probably hopeless (also they have the same problems like foreign immigrants and the need to construct casinos) so they were left out.

Japan was molded by Germany and US too in the past, so it should be wise for Singapore to be guided by them in as well as their star pupil.
 
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