MM Lee say Mahathir built port to 'undercut & 'sabotage' Singapore

[bella]

Scroobal - you are right on the dot.
Like i said before it is unfair for MM to call this a sabotage. Malaysia has every right to have a port build wherever they like in thier own country to protect thier own interest. They are taking what is thier right i.e. to have their goods flow through thier ports and not others - what is wrong with that.
Malaysia can also claim sabotage when singapore brings in F1 and built the casinos.

 

[NoelVermillion]

All is fair in war. Why MM Lee is complaining, I fail to see the light. Instead of trying to stop the competition, one should be better than the competition.

 

[GoldenDragon]

I do hope people here understand the difference between sabotage and competition.

MM is legally trained. If it was indeed sabotage, he would have taken the M'sian govt to an international court to amicably settle the matter. And he would not have the patience to disclose 'sabotage' many years after TP was initiated.

MM"s disclosure of sabotage is an insult to all S'poreans. He expects us to believe him? It's a joke. But believe me, many will believe anything that comes out of MM's mouth, even if it is shit.

 

[Ramseth]

MM is legally trained. If it was indeed sabotage, he would have taken the M'sian govt to an international court to amicably settle the matter. And he would not have the patience to disclose 'sabotage' many years after TP was initiated.

MM"s disclosure of sabotage is an insult to all S'poreans. He expects us to believe him? It's a joke. But believe me, many will believe anything that comes out of MM's mouth, even if it is shit.

Maybe he's reverting to bengish Singlish:

Beng 1 : Weh, I sell char kway teow at coffeeshop, why you also sell char keow at hawker centre next door? Want to sabo me is it?

Beng 2 : Sabo your silangtao! I do my biz and you do your biz. :oIo:

 

[po2wq]

... Malaysia can also claim sabotage when singapore brings in F1 and built the casinos.

even provide free transport 2 ferry ppl 2 gambling dens sum mor ...

 

[po2wq]

... how come when shanghai ports undercut PSA nobody make noise?

bcos ah u din say dat, wat! ... :o

bcos ah u din say dat, ppl dunno how 2 say dat! ... :o

 

[potato29]

MM is legally trained. If it was indeed sabotage, he would have taken the M'sian govt to an international court to amicably settle the matter. And he would not have the patience to disclose 'sabotage' many years after TP was initiated.

if that's the case then the iran & n korea nuclear issue, the palestine israel conflict, etc would have been settled long ago.

 

[kukubird58]

hahaha.....reading from 1st post, old fart used "undercut", old mudhatir added "sabotage"............
so where is it that said old fart cried "sabotage"??????

 

[myo539]

......Malaysia can also claim sabotage when singapore brings in F1 and built the casinos.

Now you know why we did all these things - the results of Malaysian sabotage. LKY purposely bring in the F1 and casinos because LKY believed that Malaysia sabo us.

When bringing in the casinos didn't LKY mentioned that Singaporeans lost a lot of money to casinos in Genting and Batam - even though both are Muslim countries and gambling is illegal in Indonesia? Didn't we bring in budget airlines because Malaysia AirAsia was cutting into SIA business?

Moral of the story - you can do it so can we - and even better!

 

[johnny333]

When bringing in the casinos didn't LKY mentioned that Singaporeans lost a lot of money to casinos in Genting and Batam - even though both are Muslim countries and gambling is illegal in Indonesia?

Hey, do you know that the Indonesian authorities have cracked down on gambling in Batam I think it was 7+ years ago that those illegal casinos were forced to close.

While the gambling ship operating off the seas of Batam is still operating. I heard rumours that LHL is part owner

 

[Windsor]

A correction here. It is because TP was not profitable, that 30% of TP was sold to Maersk.

The fact that Maersk owns 30% of Tanjong Pelepas and that TP is the world fastest growing port in the world seems to be lost to many. They honestly think that Maersk is undercharging to screw its own profitably and that it is the world's largest shipper does not seem to throw light on anyone. Looks like Old man and the Straits Times are the only fountain of knowledge.

I remember that when Maersk went to TP, everyone predicated they will return to PSA as the scenarios of lazy malays, crane breakdown, corruption etc loomed high in the air. Then Evergreen went and the penny fell. 10 years later and we still have people talking about sabotage.

 

[Windsor]

Edit for double post

 

[Windsor]

Dear Scroo, they are not losing millions at all that is true, but neither are they making millions from TP's operations. Firstly, as you mentioned, port servicing and port operations are not cheap. Mahathir offered the facilities plus cheap land, but he is not getting back the capital cost nor getting good rental rates from the land use. Moreover, they port requires frequent dredging. The 2 giants have their own feeders to support their operations but not the other large shipping corporations. Another point, to enter the port the vessels has to enter a narrow channel, and has to turn around to get out. This is a sheer waste of time as turning a vessel takes some time.

So if you are not Mahathir, it is not a viable business because the bulk of the business is not the goods going in and out of the port but is in transhipment and port of call to change crews, get supplies and minor repairs.

So the old man is right to a certain degree that TP was build to undercut PSA. Who else want to sacrifice so much, yet gain so little?

I am getting the impression that people think that the Malaysians are undercutting the Singaporeans and therefore losing millions. They are not. There is a huge scandal over corruption at Port Keleng but that is a different matter.

The pricing that Maersk and Evergreen were facing were not ridiculously low prices. When major companies make such significant shift, they go into detail studies including throwing out ridiculously short term cheap price and looking at viability. In shipping port clearence and timing is vital as they traverse the ocean and land in many port to keep and also have to keep to a schedule.

It should be noted that a number of Malaysians who graduated here and on scholarships working for PSA were hired by the Malaysians.

Only Evergreen had some issues with the terms offered by the Malaysians and needed some comfort on the political front. A chinese MP from JB who spoke Hokkein sealed the deal when Evergreen bosses met up with him. His first name was Jimmy but can't recall anything else.

Port servicing business is not cheap neither is it unsophisticated. We all seem to fall into the trap that all Malaysians are lazy, can't do simple maths and nothing works. The North South Highway was built in record time, first class quality and beyond expectation. That highway was so good that it crippled MAS. It resulted in the Singapore and British Intelligence community to reassess the Malaysian capacity to do things.

The PAP and old man have ingrained in us to accept excuses for everything that does not go well. Competition has the been the heartbeat of mankind the moment we left the caves and engaged in trade. Even before that it was over women. Us Chinese of all people should know the meaning of competition.

Lets take it simple lowest common denominator. The bulk of the goods coming in and going out of PSA before TP was for Malaysia. If you had an ounce of brain and you are Malaysian, what would you do. Here are the options
1) Don't do anything on the basis that you will be seen to sabotage Singapore's economy
2) Get your own port going if is viable.
3) Sit on your butt and sing Kumbaya

This Malaysia sabotage thing is yet another fear factor of old man and ST. When PSA was doing very well, they had a ex-minister, heaps of scholars including the daughter of old man's long standing press secretary. Now no ones want to move to PSA as they have to regain their former profit flow and that means hard work.

 

[kukubird58]

they are not losing millions at all that is true, but neither are they making millions from TP's operations.

hahaha...not sure what is the present situation but there were a lot stories (from pple in transportation lines) about missing containers and very poor efficiency plaquing TP in the past.

 

[bella]

i'm surprised that if the port is inefficient how come it is growing at such a fast pace that singapore has to worry about it
by the way, thot that TP is owned by a private company under syed moktar?

it is competition not sabo

if it is sabotage, then singapore will definitely have taken action

singapore is worried becos port and airport are our lifeline ..unlike malaysia where they have natural resources

 

[potato29]

if it is sabotage, then singapore will definitely have taken action

what action do u have in mind?:o:o:o

 

[Coolsaint77]

... they are not losing millions at all that is true, but neither are they making millions from TP's operations. So the old man is right to a certain degree that TP was build to undercut PSA. Who else want to sacrifice so much, yet gain so little?

I hate to embarass people, but I am just about to prove you are spouting nonsense.

PTP might be a very much smaller operation than Singapore... ranking #17 vs Singapore's #1 position, but it IS making money and yes, millions. What undercut? What sabotage?? What sacrifice???

Open your blahdy eyes and have a look at its 2009 annual report (a very bad year for PTP) ==> it made 173m profit out of a revenue of 679m.

For the benefit of ignorant people like Windsor, the information can be found in page 35 of the 2009 annual report:

http://www.mmc.com.my/download/MMC_Annual_Report_2009.pdf

 

[GoldenDragon]

if that's the case then the iran & n korea nuclear issue, the palestine israel conflict, etc would have been settled long ago.

MM did not even try. How to stand a chance without even trying? If all conflicts cannot be settled, why border to study conflict resolution? It is only a matter of time - Middle East conflict, nuclear issues in Iran and NK. Nothing is impossible.

My point remains - why is MM bringing this up after so many years? Is he one who can suffer in silence for so long? Didn't both S'pore and M'sia settle its dispute on some faraway rocks before an international court whereby Jayakumar, Tommy Koh and Chan Sek keong represented our kampong?

 

[Ramseth]

MM did not even try. How to stand a chance without even trying? If all conflicts cannot be settled, why border to study conflict resolution? It is only a matter of time - Middle East conflict, nuclear issues in Iran and NK. Nothing is impossible.

Singapore have no say on global political and military matters, call yourself PM, SM, MM or whatever, nobody gives a damn except diplomatic courtesy. Singapore do have some say in global financial matters though.

My point remains - why is MM bringing this up after so many years? Is he one who can suffer in silence for so long? Didn't both S'pore and M'sia settle its dispute on some faraway rocks before an international court whereby Jayakumar, Tommy Koh and Chan Sek keong represented our kampong?

PB was settled, yes. What has PB got to do with TP?

 

[GoldenDragon]

Singapore have no say on global political and military matters, call yourself PM, SM, MM or whatever, nobody gives a damn except diplomatic courtesy. Singapore do have some say in global financial matters though.

I doubt if S'pore has a say in global financial matters. We are nobody in this world - finance, politics, military, diplomacy. Only the PAP thinks they are big fucks in this world.

PB was settled, yes. What has PB got to do with TP?

Well, PB was brought in to highlight avenues open in the event of conflict, serious allegations, threats to national interests etc. If MM had opined that TP was sabotage, surely there is a world body that could arbitrate on whether it was indeed a sabotage.