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Why I don't buy China stocks on SGX

Confuseous

Alfrescian (Inf)
Asset
Joined
Dec 30, 2010
Messages
12,730
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A fire at the Shandong Province of CHINA PAPER HOLDINGS has destroyed many of the firm's financial records, the company announced yesterday (17th Dec). The fire did not destroy any of the machinery but its 2011 financial records were destroyed and those for the first 8 months of this year suffered partial damage.

There will be a delay of auditing process as the company contacts suppliers, customers and other transactional records so that it can re-construct its financial records. (Wonder if the shareholders list is also destroyed...)

Last year, Sino Techfibre said its financial records were destroyed in a fire at its Shandong province premises.

In 2009, China Sun Bio-Chem Technology Group said its records were lost when a truck transporting them was stolen while the driver was having dinner.
 
Very convenient such loss of papers....

But there are some good ones, you just pick carefully. I recently bought into Midas...if all of Sammy bros go and buy it, can get out with some profit :-)
 
Yishun construction site boss lost his car so no pay vouchers to pay those foreign construction workers.

Any difference between them and SG bad hats?
 
A fire at the Shandong Province of CHINA PAPER HOLDINGS has destroyed many of the firm's financial records, the company announced yesterday (17th Dec). The fire did not destroy any of the machinery but its 2011 financial records were destroyed and those for the first 8 months of this year suffered partial damage.

There will be a delay of auditing process as the company contacts suppliers, customers and other transactional records so that it can re-construct its financial records. (Wonder if the shareholders list is also destroyed...)

Last year, Sino Techfibre said its financial records were destroyed in a fire at its Shandong province premises.

In 2009, China Sun Bio-Chem Technology Group said its records were lost when a truck transporting them was stolen while the driver was having dinner.

When you reach 65 years old, CPF inform you that, due to a power outtage on one of their servers, your lifetime of contribution records have been wiped out & they don't have record that you have ever contributed to CPF?? something like this??
 
Yishun construction site boss lost his car so no pay vouchers to pay those foreign construction workers.

Any difference between them and SG bad hats?


Ah Tan went to China & learn from the Chinese over there & employ Chinese from there..sound like the "marshes story"?... ha ha ha ha
 
When you reach 65 years old, CPF inform you that, due to a power outtage on one of their servers, your lifetime of contribution records have been wiped out & they don't have record that you have ever contributed to CPF?? something like this??

Bro, for goodness sake, please at least keep your last statement. It's the same for banking records.

Maybe I'm old school, but I don't understand why people are so comfortable with online records. It only takes a glitch to wipe everything out, and the glitch may not even be an "accident". And not all glitches and the backups may be recoverable. Keep the latest paper record, and they will have to prove that you have made a withdrawal if their records now show zero or much less than your latest record.
 
Bro, for goodness sake, please at least keep your last statement. It's the same for banking records.

Maybe I'm old school, but I don't understand why people are so comfortable with online records. It only takes a glitch to wipe everything out, and the glitch may not even be an "accident". And not all glitches and the backups may be recoverable. Keep the latest paper record, and they will have to prove that you have made a withdrawal if their records now show zero or much less than your latest record.
No way lah, unless the entire sinkieland is nuked. There's daily backups in multiple sites. So even if today entire system down due to virus or fire, they can still retrieve from off site backups done yesterday, or the day before up till at least seven years ago. All these backups are on standalone storage media, so even hackers also cannot touch.
 
No way lah, unless the entire sinkieland is nuked. There's daily backups in multiple sites. So even if today entire system down due to virus or fire, they can still retrieve from off site backups done yesterday, or the day before up till at least seven years ago. All these backups are on standalone storage media, so even hackers also cannot touch.

I understand about offsite backups.
What I'm trying to prevent against is also deception, not just accidents or mishaps like virus or fire.
Obviously even if you have paper record, you don't have irrefutable evidence, but at least you have some record or evidence for yourself, whether it's for claim, lawsuit or just to back your argument. Rather than to just depend solely on their records.
 
An account from an individual who got burnt by another Chinese con-job, China Paper.




I learnt a painful lesson from this counter, and paid a heavy price for it. I should have been more decisive when I detected something is not right with this company, but I either chose to ignore it or refuse to face it. What can go wrong with a counter that is trading way below NTA, PE of < 5, profitable every year and have load of cash? If something is amiss with this company, it would have been uncovered by the auditors long ago since this company was listed for so long already. I was dead wrong!

This is one of the counters that I hold for a long time, since 2005 to be exact. I attended every AGM and follow every announcement. I was bought over by all the promises the company gave and truly believes that the board of directors are honest and hardworking people. In my mind I am painting a beautiful picture that one day this company will grow to be a big and profitable organization and people will realized how undervalued this company is and I will be grinning by the handsome rewards. What a joke! Now I fully understand the famous saying, “love your stock but don’t fall in love with your stock.”

I should have realized that something is wrong when a cash rich company is not paying any dividends for years. I was really annoyed by fellow SH at each AGM who keep on grilling the BODs for not paying out dividends. In my heart, these people are so shortsighted.

While not paying dividends to shareholders was still acceptable, but to continuously raising money in the market via right issues should have raised a big red flag. The reasons given by the board of directors for these actions is to preserve or raise cash for plant expansion, for new products development, for adding new production lines etc… it sounded so damn convincing to me.

And then one fine day in March this year, a long term independent director tendered his resignation abruptly. I was alarmed, but it was still not enough an impact to upset my love for this company. However, the next day after this ID announced his resignation; my beloved company once again announced another big right issue and priced it at a big discount to the last traded price! The stock price crashed the following day. It broke my heart and I started to realize that I was taken for a ride. My sweet dream was turning into a nightmare. After some soul searching, I decided that enough is enough. Few days after this rights announcement, I wielded my sword and in one swift decisive move I chopped off this rubbish at 4.1c completely. Strangely, I felt more relief rather than pain. A burden is now off my back, I do not have to hope for a hopeless hope anymore.

I thought I got it cheap each time I average it down at lower price. It is a steal, I thought, only that it is the company that is stealing my money. Wise Warren Buffet said: “It is better to buy a good company at a fair price than to buy a fair company at a good price.” This is so wise, so wise…..

Now that this is behind me, I really feel very relieved and lighthearted. I tell myself that I would rather miss a boat that to hit a rock.

Even despite this, I still know of friends who are die-hard fan of Chinese Paper and are still holding on to their dear shares. I wish them well.

Just sharing this with fellow investors and I hope you can learn a thing or two from my mistakes.
 
Most Chinese stocks that are listed on SGX are similar to Chinese prostitues..
some are cheap and some are expensive ..but both are just a transactional fucks..you pay to get fucked by the PRC whore..
 
Bro, for goodness sake, please at least keep your last statement. It's the same for banking records.

Maybe I'm old school, but I don't understand why people are so comfortable with online records. It only takes a glitch to wipe everything out, and the glitch may not even be an "accident". And not all glitches and the backups may be recoverable. Keep the latest paper record, and they will have to prove that you have made a withdrawal if their records now show zero or much less than your latest record.

I m old school too, I came from the "ledger" generation, I bet many of you reading this, don't even know what that is. Ledge to record a customer deposit & withdrawal but with manual machine to print out the transaction & balance in customer book... hmm

I still want CPF statement printed...of course mind not printed in gilt-edged paper & delivered daily, like some "clown", even bank statement on paper...:)
 
Most Chinese stocks that are listed on SGX are similar to Chinese prostitues..
some are cheap and some are expensive ..but both are just a transactional fucks..you pay to get fucked by the PRC whore..

I thought you pay to f$#$@k the PRC Whore? oh! like the "whities" here ah!?? you pay & you get f%$#k by them? but then again, why so many pay??
 
An account from an individual who got burnt by another Chinese con-job, China Paper.

I remember once being in the presence of a former top remisier cum trader who lost heavily in the debacle of Clob meltdown. He was into margin trading, easily holding millions of dollars of Clob shares that turned into "nothing" and resulted in his big debts. Then he had to slog into many jobs to make ends meet. There was another top player whom I met driving a taxi and he recalled this period with much lamentations and sighs. He too lost everything. There were easily many stories of that generation of stock players as Clob shares dominated the stock market back then. There was no way not to play Singapore stock market if you do not engage in Clob shares.

The Clob fiasco was a result of Singapore government insisting that the local exchange had a right and it was safe to trade in Malaysian shares in Singapore system. Back in the nineties and eighties, Clob shares was the rage. It was a period of ruin for many who lost almost "everything" when the Malaysian government decided to "screw" the Singaporean investors and traders as it made the decision that all stock trading in their counters outside Malaysia is illegal. The Malaysian government did it when it realised that the Singapore government was not going to help in bailout funds with "no strings attached'. So it had its revenge by undertaking this action on Clob shares and Singapore stock investors in Clob shares were "forced" to sell them at a pittance to a holding company who scooped it all up at a very huge discount to resell them in Malaysia and this holding company was linked to the very top in Malaysian government - Dr Mahathir and his kaki, the finance minister dude, Daim. We were thoroughly screwed by these fellows.

This was in conjunction with the entry of Indonesian companies to Singapore stock exchange in the name of "takeover" and big connections with President Suharto. Those stocks were the rage and again fell to near "nothing" when the Asian financial crisis emerged and Suharto fell. At least on this count, I will perhaps say "caveat emptor".

But I cannot say of subsequent ruinous one, allowing the entry of dubious Chinese firms into Singapore stock market which to me, is fraud and the government for all its acclaimed regulatory fame, performed miserably and to date, nobody has been called to account for it. Its lack of controls over the IPO listing managers who did not do its due diligence exemplified their greed in promoting these fraudulent firms. These IPO listing managers have meanwhile conveniently disappeared from the present scene if you can recall these names. The key question is how could they not know when they were supposed to do their due diligence. The financial figures were all fraudulent - the non-existing profits and revenues. In US, for fraud cases like Enron etc, people were called to account for them. Here it is nothing. There is no way you can get the owners and key management figures to account for them. The law does not apply as long as they do not want to come back here. Have not the government figure it out when they allow these BVI companies to do their listings here?

Singapore becomes the sucker. Its investors and players are the suckers cum victims. For one thing, you cannot believe everything the Government here say. They are mere mortals and they did make terrible mistakes which in this case, has not been called to account for.

Before you commit your CPF funds into professionally-managed unit trust and Singapore second-liner stocks, so far the return has been terrible and if not, very much worse off then doing nothing in the first place. The liberalisation of CPF funds for stock trading was to help usher the entry of so called professional fund managers here, but it has been a bad piece of cake overall. There are more charlatans in the financial industry than you realise. Mark my words.
 
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Never trusted the china stock from day one.
Those Chinese think we are suckers and SGX was desperate for more capitalisation to compete with Hang Seng.
 
To: Merl Haggard

It took you so long and after a few expensive lessons to learn the truth?
 
A fire at the Shandong Province of CHINA PAPER HOLDINGS has destroyed many of the firm's financial records, the company announced yesterday (17th Dec). The fire did not destroy any of the machinery but its 2011 financial records were destroyed and those for the first 8 months of this year suffered partial damage.

There will be a delay of auditing process as the company contacts suppliers, customers and other transactional records so that it can re-construct its financial records. (Wonder if the shareholders list is also destroyed...)

Last year, Sino Techfibre said its financial records were destroyed in a fire at its Shandong province premises.

In 2009, China Sun Bio-Chem Technology Group said its records were lost when a truck transporting them was stolen while the driver was having dinner.

So they poh mata liao buay?
 
Never trusted the china stock from day one.
Those Chinese think we are suckers and SGX was desperate for more capitalisation to compete with Hang Seng.

That's why Michael goes l.ong on local stocks
 
if possible, dont buy anything from China...low quality products and often fakes
 
I just wonder why are teh shareholders of SGX still allowing all their fatcat management to take home MILLIONS for doing such a damm bad job....

it is as if they are unaccountable and answerable for any of their screw ups.....
 
No way lah, unless the entire sinkieland is nuked. There's daily backups in multiple sites. So even if today entire system down due to virus or fire, they can still retrieve from off site backups done yesterday, or the day before up till at least seven years ago. All these backups are on standalone storage media, so even hackers also cannot touch.

Ya, when the LEEgime got kicked out of the parleement, they will sell the company that handles these standalone storage media to 3 donkeys just like the Town Council software. The 3 donkeys will then disappeared without a trace.
 
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