What is made for sinking US aircraft carriers?

[motormafia]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/VA-111_Shkval

The pictures are very high resolutions if you followed photo links.

The are under-water rockets that goes at 2 twice the speed of sound (faster than Concorde Planes).

Actually they don't really travel inside water but steam created by it's own speed instead.

That that speed, there is no avoidance nor counter-measure possible, once aimed and fired, it is like unstoppable bullet.


http://www.articlesextra.com/supercavitation-torpedoes.htm

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/a/a8/Shkval.jpg
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/3/32/Shkval_rear.jpg

 

[longbow]

Much would depend on how this thing is tracked. But if one can get within a certain kill zone it might be very effective. but it only goes 300kph not 3000kph according to wiki.

Another problem is noise. That thing is large and makes lots of noise. After all super cavi is very noisy. So that makes it easy to spot.

The Chinese are developing a ballistic satellite tracked anti carrier weapon. That thing flies at mach 10 and very hard to shoot down on re entry.

 

[Ramseth]

The pictures are very high resolutions if you followed photo links.

The are under-water rockets that goes at 2 twice the speed of sound (faster than Concorde Planes).

Actually they don't really travel inside water but steam created by it's own speed instead.

That that speed, there is no avoidance nor counter-measure possible, once aimed and fired, it is like unstoppable bullet.

Think you're either mistaken or you've exaggerated. The speed is about 300km/h and the range is about 10km. That's about the distance from Changi Airport start to Bedok exit on ECP, a very small distance at ocean.

300km/h is not Mach 2, nowhere near Concorde speed. It's about half the speed of Boeing 747 only. The mothership must also get within 10km range to launch the torpedo. No US aircraft carrier battlegroup will allow non-friendly surface warships or submarines within that range without warning them to f*ck off or failing that, simply sink them.

 

[motormafia]

Much would depend on how this thing is tracked. But if one can get within a certain kill zone it might be very effective. but it only goes 300kph not 3000kph according to wiki.

Another problem is noise. That thing is large and makes lots of noise. After all super cavi is very noisy. So that makes it easy to spot.

The Chinese are developing a ballistic satellite tracked anti carrier weapon. That thing flies at mach 10 and very hard to shoot down on re entry.

There is no chance to intercept even if they can spot or hear.

With this sort of torpedo, it is once within effective range = deadmeat.

 

[motormafia]

Think you're either mistaken or you've exaggerated. The speed is about 300km/h and the range is about 10km. That's about the distance from Changi Airport start to Bedok exit on ECP, a very small distance at ocean.

300km/h is not Mach 2, nowhere near Concorde speed. It's about half the speed of Boeing 747 only. The mothership must also get within 10km range to launch the torpedo. No US aircraft carrier battlegroup will allow non-friendly surface warships or submarines within that range without warning them to f*ck off or failing that, simply sink them.

The wiki does not have the full specs.

The current figure I got is exceeding Mach 2.

German already reached Mach 2.2

The Russians are now doing a homing version that slows down after a distance to re-adjust the aiming then fire up at highest speed for the final lap of range. It needs to slow down in order to have more time to measure target, too fast means little time to readjust course / trajectory to get a good hit.

http://archive.newsmax.com/archives/articles/2001/4/23/220813.shtml

Iranians also made their own:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/4871078.stm

 

[longbow]

Much would depend on effective range given how noisy and easily detectable it is.

At 50 miles it will take 15 minutes which is still lots of times for countermeasure. And not easy to get within 50 miles of a carrier. Carriers are very well protected and have a 300mile bubble. They will intercept anything that comes within that 300 mph bubble. One weak point is from the top. That is why a ballistic carrier killer can be very deadly - provided enemy has sophisticated sat based tracking. Radar signature of a missile coming straight down at you is very small and these missiles can do mach 10 and are difficult to shoot down. If enemy unleashes a few it might be difficult to defend against.

Carriers are great when enemy do not have satellite tracking and very quiet nuclear subs. After all you cannot find them and even if you do you cannot get withing striking range as you are in the middle of Ocean. But many countries have their own sat which mean they can see where your carriers are.

But say in the straits of taiwan, Chinese diesel electric subs are deadly. Coastal waters are great for diesel electric subs and once it is on electric mode it is hard to detect. Given advances in batteries - lithium ion - subs may now have larger range while running on batteries.

 

[Ramseth]

The wiki does not have the full specs.

The current figure I got is exceeding Mach 2.

German already reached Mach 2.2

Airborne missile speed and seaborne torpedo speed are different. Range is also different. Airborne missile can reach even Mach 3, suprises nobody. Seaborne torpedo reaching supersonic speed even just Mach 1, that defies physics. For two basic logics of physics: 1. the resistance of water when even the measure of sonic, i.e. speed of voice is slowed down drastically, and 2. the propelling engine of the device must be completely encased without open exhaust to boost its speed and range. Flame is extinguished underwater, that's commonsense.

That said, this has been overcome with submarine-launched nuclear intercontinental ballistic missile. It's launched like a vertical torpedo just to surface out of water, then jet engine ignited only when high and dry. A typical one carries enough fuel to go mach 2 to 3 over 5,000km. But that's not for shooting at aircraft carriers; that's meant to destroy whole cities.

 

[longbow]

Agree about tradition role of ballisitc missiles.

But what the Chinese are trying to do is to use it as anti carrier weapon. Much of it lies in its ability to track and manouver when in reentry phase. Apparently rentry speed is in excess of Mach 10.


No idea how that is going but Chinese have been doing quite a number of space activities. Being land based it could be effective in a brute force attack - fire a dozen at a time. Pretty sure US has a countermeasure but just fact that Chinese could reach them would deter US Navy from coming close to Straits of Taiwan -which is the desired effect to begin with.


The US Department of Defense has stated that China is developing a conventionally-armed[7] high hypersonic[1] land-based anti-ship ballistic missile (ASBM) based on the DF-21, with a range of up to 3,000 kilometres (1,900 mi). This would be the world's first and only ASBM and the world's first weapons system capable of targeting a moving aircraft carrier strike group from long-range, land-based mobile launchers.[8][9] These would combine manoeuvrable reentry vehicles (MaRVs) with some kind of terminal guidance system. Such a missile may have been tested in 2005-6, and the launch of the Jianbing-5/YaoGan-1 and Jianbing-6/YaoGan-2 satellites would give the Chinese targeting information from SAR and visual imaging respectively. The upgrades would greatly enhance China's ability to conduct sea-denial operations to prevent US carriers from intervention in the Taiwan Strait.[10]

 

[motormafia]

Theoretically there is no chance to detect it acoustically or by sonar since it is faster than speed of sound (mach 1).

That means you get hit by it 1st before you can hear it, like the case of rifle bullet.

However the catch here is speed of sound in water is 4X than in air.



There is still too little time for any avoidance or counter-measure for this high speed torpedo to be protected from any vessel. At 320km/h in range of e.g. 1km range, there is only about 11 to 12 seconds to impact. This is the tiny amount of time you have to detect and react to it!

If you could detect it coming your way within 3 sec, then you are left with only 9 seconds to react. What are you going to do within 9 S? Not even enough to say your own last prayer!

 

[motormafia]

The whole victory is attainable just by merely to get within range with the target un-detected. Once the carrier is in range it is deadmeat.

For a straits like between SGP and Batam, it is almost point blank to sink any warship with this kind of torpedo, because any warship from our shore to Batam is well within range.:p

Just whack & say Tah-Tah-Bye-Bye!

 

[Ramseth]

US lost quite a number of carriers before to Japan and maybe one or two to Germany during WWII. No big deal.

 

[Ramseth]

For a straits like between SGP and Batam, it is almost point blank to sink any warship with this kind of torpedo, because any warship from our shore to Batam is well within range.:p

Just whack & say Tah-Tah-Bye-Bye!

Guess what they'd say? Vice versa same to you.

It's amazing how some still don't realise, US warships could launch such torpedoes too, probably even better and faster. Also probably more expensive, but they can afford them.

 

[Ramseth]

Tee Kee, good picture. That's a an aircraft carrier battlegroup.

Want to get within torpedoable range? Try reaching the standard of Japan and Germany in WWII, i.e. continental scale world power.

The battlegroup doesn't protect at sea level or from submarine only, anything that flies in the air, they protect against also.

Two groups like that from US 7th fleet, enough to deter China from invading Taiwan for more than 60 years now.

The British fleet used just one group even smaller than that, could beat Argentina at their doorsteps at Falklands.

Of course they did lose a couple of ships and planes, but that's warfare, no such thing as no loss.

Like I said, even US had lost some aircraft carriers and warships and many planes to Japan and Germany, Britain too of course.

 

[motormafia]

Guess what they'd say? Vice versa same to you.

It's amazing how some still don't realise, US warships could launch such torpedoes too, probably even better and faster. Also probably more expensive, but they can afford them.

War against US is always in unequal grounds. To fight the US you must take advantage of unequal cost. Use a cheap resource to exchange something that cost 1 million X on their side. All of US enemies had learned this since before Vietnam War, Bin Laden became very good at it.

This torpedo is very economical compared with it's target. So what if the US could hit you? What are you afraid of? Let them hit you! Kill 10 of you so what? When just 1 out of 100 of you sink their carrier you hit JACKPOT!

North Korean used a low cost micro-sub to finish off South Korean Cheonan, the micro-sub is just 1 man or 2 only cost 5% of Cheonan which had 104 men of which nearly half died. High-Tech war weapons always at disadvantage.