what good is joining the Unions

[Asterix]

An employee can do the same if he loses his job so why should he get retrenchment benefits?

All your arguments are stacked against the hardworking and productive members of society while doling out money to the lazy and useless.

Interns for Oppo parties, please check this out:

http://siteresources.worldbank.org/...SP-Discussion-papers/Labor-Market-DP/1111.pdf

By the way, I simply googled "Retrenchment Benefits Rationale" and checked out the links that looked most promising. I most definitely have NOT read that World Bank Report which is 83 pages long! I simply glanced through and focused on the pages that looked most promising.

Now, Oppo parties' interns, roll up your sleeves and get to work before ultra right wing PAPzi LeongSam accuses you of being lazy bums.

Extract:

The historic overview of the prior Section and Annex 1 suggests the following features:

- Many severance pay disbursements occurred during large-scale industrial restructuring, with
provisions directly negotiated between firm and workers (trade unions) in an ad-hoc manner
and adjusted to the specific restructuring process. They often happened outside legislated
rules or collective agreements.
- There are various firm-based indications of how severance pay provisions together with
occupational pensions have been used early on in knowledge-intensive sectors to establish a
commitment technology both for employer and employee. The loss of an occupation
(defined benefit) pension for early leavers was balanced with severance pay commitments
and hence firing costs for the employer.
- Firm or industry-specific agreements still play a role in most countries above and beyond
legislated rules or collective agreements with little information about the terms of references.
In some countries, most prominently Germany, Japan and the US, they are the basis of
severance pay as a mandated scheme does not exist.
- Mandated severance pay provisions are a primitive form of social protection. They were
introduced in most but not all countries prior to other social protection mechanism, in
particular unemployment and retirement benefits.
- In developed economies severance pay was not abolished once related social security
benefits had been established. In most developing countries severance pay is still the key
provision for the formal labor force as access and eligibility to unemployment and retirement
benefits remain limited.
- In countries with limited formal sector employment, severance pay is often seen as a key
instrument for job protection. Severance pay together with long notice periods and firing
restrictions serve to protect workers in formal jobs from the main income loss in case of a
dismissal.
- The difference in coverage for unemployment and pension benefits between developed and
developing economies suggests that the rationale for severance pay, its design features, and
its interactions with related social benefits are different. This suggests a need to differentiate
conceptual frameworks between high and low income countries. Middle income countries
have characteristics for some group of workers closer to the first, for others closer to the low
income group.

 

[Leongsam]

Now, Oppo parties' interns, roll up your sleeves and get to work before ultra right wing PAPzi LeongSam accuses you of being lazy bums.

This has got nothing to do with the political spectrum. People keep harping about fairness well tell me what is fair about an employer having to pay retrenchment benefits according the length of service but an employee can just walk off the job with no penalties whatsoever.

If the employer is forced to pay retrenchment fees, then the employee should compensate the employer in a similar manner when he quits. If he's worked in the company for 20 years and leaves, he should pay back 20 months of salary as compensation.

 

[Asterix]

This has got nothing to do with the political spectrum. People keep harping about fairness well tell me what is fair about an employer having to pay retrenchment benefits according the length of service but an employee can just walk off the job with no penalties whatsoever.

If the employer is forced to pay retrenchment fees, then the employee should compensate the employer in a similar manner when he quits. If he's worked in the company for 20 years and leaves, he should pay back 20 months of salary as compensation.

It is not done the other way around because there is a real imbalance of power between the employer and the employee. The societies that adopted severance pay before they implemented comprehensive welfare systems saw this imbalance of power and acted to protect the weak from being treated unfairly.

Now I see your point that the durian seller is not in the same class as a GLC or an MNC. This can be dealt with by exempting small businesses from the severance pay regime. Bear in mind that Sinkieland's economy is by some accounts 70% controlled by the Gahbrament through GLCs, stat boards and what not. No exemption should be given to these jokers.

Can I leave it to the Oppo parties' interns to do their work? This is getting tiresome especially since I am comfortably ensconced in some First World country.

 

[Leongsam]

Can I leave it to the Oppo parties' interns to do their work? This is getting tiresome especially since I am comfortably ensconced in some First World country.

These exchanges are good because it is civilized debate. The oppo IB are not capable of responding the way you do by countering each point logically with references and data to back up your views.

However, you almost lost your voice of reason when you started cursing a 90 year old man in another thread.

 

[escher]

anyone knows what good is joining the unions besides the year end dinner and dance, some outing and annual gift ?

I see the people that benefit most from the unions are the office bearers / committee members

look at NTUC - the committee members / central committee go on endless overseas trips - and it doesn't provide any benefits or improvements to the members or the unions

Everything in Stinkapore bastardised and transmogrified to be appendages of smear of shit on sole of shoe LKY

When we sing muckjulah stinkapura, LKY and his gang of PAP maggots cockroaches stole billions from all of us
When we say the stupid stinkapore pledge, LKY and his gang of PAP maggots cockroaches kangaroos stole our country from under us

Unions in Stinkapore are holding pens for LKY running dogs and for his dogs to feed from

 

[escher]

These exchanges are good because it is civilized debate. The oppo IB are not capable of responding the way you do by countering each point logically with references and data to back up your views.

However, you almost lost your voice of reason when you started cursing a 90 year old man in another thread.

FUCK YOU

May that 90 year old smear of shit on sole of shoe die painfully and slowly and go under the ghouls and demons to be rape and screwed and fucked the way he and his gang of thugs and kangaroos been doing to sinkies the last 40 years

And not even given time off to eat joss sticks and candle wax

And he can see from the other world the hooting done to his Ah Loon and family to get at the fucking hundreds of billions he stolen from all of us and now acting as bullseye on Ah Loonie and gecko families

 

[Leongsam]

FUCK YOU

May that 90 year old smear of shit on sole of shoe die painfully and slowly and go under the ghouls and demons to be rape and screwed and fucked the way he and his gang of thugs and kangaroos been doing to sinkies the last 40 years

And not even given time off to eat joss sticks and candle wax

And he can see from the other world the hooting done to his Ah Loon and family to get at the fucking hundreds of billions he stolen from all of us and now acting as bullseye on Ah Loonie and gecko families

Did you read the latest articles regarding the futile search for dark matter? What are your views on the subject. Please discuss in the serious zone.

 

[Poomer]

This has got nothing to do with the political spectrum. People keep harping about fairness well tell me what is fair about an employer having to pay retrenchment benefits according the length of service but an employee can just walk off the job with no penalties whatsoever.

If the employer is forced to pay retrenchment fees, then the employee should compensate the employer in a similar manner when he quits. If he's worked in the company for 20 years and leaves, he should pay back 20 months of salary as compensation.

A company that you've worked for 20 years have been earning profits for at least a good 15 years, or you won't last as long as twenty years. I don't see the reasoning behind compensating a company which have been profiteering from one's labours all this while. Yet under the current lax labour laws, it makes sense to lay off older workers due to their higher remuneration as compared to new employees. The companies are not penalised whatsoever as long as they give a dodgy answer on reason of termination and they can avoid paying retrenchment benefits.

The scenario you put forth where you ask your former employees to share the losses with you if they want profit sharing, and they refuse, yet if we consider that when times are bad, they will be the ones you will be laying off(likely without a severance package), so isn't that also sharing the losses with you?

 

[Leongsam]

A company that you've worked for 20 years have been earning profits for at least a good 15 years, or you won't last as long as twenty years. I don't see the reasoning behind compensating a company which have been profiteering from one's labours all this while. Yet under the current lax labour laws, it makes sense to lay off older workers due to their higher remuneration as compared to new employees. The companies are not penalised whatsoever as long as they give a dodgy answer on reason of termination and they can avoid paying retrenchment benefits.

The scenario you put forth where you ask your former employees to share the losses with you if they want profit sharing, and they refuse, yet if we consider that when times are bad, they will be the ones you will be laying off(likely without a severance package), so isn't that also sharing the losses with you?

When a company keeps an employee for 20 years, he has gained valuable knowledge and experience thanks to that company. If he quits, he will take this experience to a new company and his salary will rise significantly thanks to his 20 years of experience.

The company that he is leaving should therefore be compensated as they are losing all the investment they made in this individual. If he was sent for overseas training, seminars etc, he should be made to pay back the cost of those too.

As for my company I have never retrenched anyone. I kept paying salaries on time through 18 months of losses.

 

[soIsee]

When a company keeps an employee for 20 years, he has gained valuable knowledge and experience thanks to that company. If he quits, he will take this experience to a new company and his salary will rise significantly thanks to his 20 years of experience.

The company that he is leaving should therefore be compensated as they are losing all the investment they made in this individual. If he was sent for overseas training, seminars etc, he should be made to pay back the cost of those too.

As for my company I have never retrenched anyone. I kept paying salaries on time through 18 months of losses.

Get over it , Sam.

Your view is like you 'own' the employee and they are beholden to you for their success.

It's a free world. Just like Sinkie are beginning to discover why they are being replaced back in their own homeland.

Works both ways. Chow kuan employer vs ungrateful employee. LoL

 

[Leongsam]

It's a free world. Just like Sinkie are beginning to discover why they are being replaced back in their own homeland.

Works both ways. Chow kuan employer vs ungrateful employee. LoL

That's the way it should be... you're not happy working for me, by all means fuck off and if I don't like your face anymore, you're fired. I ask for no favors and give no mercy.

 

[shittypore]

All i noe i join UNion is for the discount i rec at
all NTUC Fair Price stores.

 

[Asterix]

When a company keeps an employee for 20 years, he has gained valuable knowledge and experience thanks to that company. If he quits, he will take this experience to a new company and his salary will rise significantly thanks to his 20 years of experience.

Knock, knock ... we are now in a knowledge based economy! If you have a lazy storeman who worked in the company for 20 years, he would be nothing without the company and probably did not learn anything during those two decades either.

However, in the professions where life long learning is a must, it is a different story. The new recruit will be employed by the company because he had the necessary training in university i.e. the right kind of degree - be it medicine or architecture or whatever. His parents funded him not the company twit.

Between two recruits from the same university, one may be able to learn more in two months what it takes the other two years to do and that is not because of the company but his intelligence, hard work, resourcefulness, etc.