Tan Kin Lian - An Opportunist? Let see the Facts

[Porfirio Rubirosa]

technically u may be right...

however u appear to forget the moral authority n political capital that a properly elected PE wif the proper mandate fm the electorate wld hv on the dynamics of singapore's political order...like i said in another post abv...a possible comparison cld be made wif the position of King Bhumiphol of Thailand...not to the extent of semi-diety status of course...but there wld no doubt be some form of political influence becoz of the abv reasons n the fact that the PE is independent as well...

hahaha...all the hot air but nobody can answer the simple question...
"can the EP be removed if he refused to follow the advice of the cabinet/presidential council???"

i think we are giving too much credence to the post of EP....thinking that a strong independent minded person
can redefine the role of EP on his own.
it doesn't matter if you are yes or no man.....
the rules are pre-defined and you have to play along with it......

give you an analogy......if you want to play football or any other game, you follow the rules......
you cannot said you are your own man and you do things your own way.....
if not happy, you don't join in the game.

 

[Porfirio Rubirosa]

first sensible thing u hv said in this thread thus far dude...!

People questioning why TKL did not take the forms himself but never question why George Yeo didn't pick up the forms himself? Strange. George Yeo may be out of town but the closing date for submission is still far away!

Goh Meng Seng

 

[Porfirio Rubirosa]

pls lah GMS...dont dig yr grave even deeper can r not??!!...

how can TKL be shy of the limelight after hsi bo liao 100k petition request to run for PE last yr complete wif mainstream media coverage!!!...u gotta be kidding right?!...

oh n as matter of record...it is a 3 man committee not a 5 man committee...

Different people do things differently. Some will want the limelight and go and collect the forms themselves. Some want to shy away from the limelight first because there is one hurdle to cross... the 5 wise man committee. Nothing special here.

Goh Meng Seng

 

[Porfirio Rubirosa]

pls dont do that dude...u may well then be helping TKL to win...perhaps better to choose to the 'devil' u know

My answer as to who I will support for the RP is - "who cares?".

With the very limited power of the EP and all the wayangs going on, I wish voting is not compulsory.

If need to, I will put in a "blank" vote.

 

[Porfirio Rubirosa]

beg to differ bro...me thinks GY may well swing it if he actually throws his hat in...no doubt a close shave...but a win is a win based on first past the post system...even by a single vote...

also not too sure of SDP's support for TKL...bearing in mind TCB's apparent closeness to Ang yong Guan n Tan Jee Say...

GY is a nice guy and would make an excellent President. However he is not electable despite what he folllowers think. While in the Office, he did not object or even dissent publicly prefering to be a team player. OTC was the same and to his shock he got 59% against a total unknown who did not unfurl a flag.

The reason is that you are in the bag. So is SDP. I am sure that he if asked SDP, they would organise a whole formation with flags and drums and make a real scene.

 

[Porfirio Rubirosa]

to me a pretty as good as it get's candidate wld probably be Ho Kwon Ping warts, flaws foibles n all...but like u say "not the way the presidency is being set up"...

My view is that there are more capable, more qualified with excellent attributes that will do a sterling job and bring credit to the Office but they will never stand for elections. Not the way the presidency is being set up.

 

[Porfirio Rubirosa]

actually think u shall get yr wish...third candidate still unknown...maybe even a fourth...n i am not alluding to those 2 crackpots ooi n rafi!!...

For me personally, I would like to see both TKL and TCB pass the nomination and stand for election.
Then let the voters decide and live with their decision, whatever it may be.

 

[Porfirio Rubirosa]

hear...hear...good stuff bro...

So in summary guys, be yourselves, believe what you believe & back our beliefs with action or non-action or small actions for a start depending on your conviction, your passion & your resources & circumstances.....

Just be authentic.

Not be like the hypocritical Tan Kin Lian who long ago announce he would only consider running for EP if there is a petition numbering 6 figures.
I promptly lost all respect for him since.

TCB & GY are PAP men once but not sycophants or lose their principled selves. That I can accept. I agree that some are entitled to believe it is better to work from within then tear down & rebuild.

EP .... fucking forget about losing face PAP & hear me, WP MPs, move a motion to strike away the E from EP & revert to the days of a regal Presidency as personified by the likes of Sheares & Wee Kim Wee.

For that to happen if i recall correctly, this constitutional change would require a referendum & hey man, let our respectable leaders learn from the new Singaporean electorate who don't give a shit about serial numbers behind ballots & dare to live up to the PAP-crafted ideal of 'active citizenry' !

 

[Porfirio Rubirosa]

LOL...hv u noticed Balji suddenly lying low after his shameless pr spin in the jakarta post...30 pieces of silver...bwhahahahaha...

Ok, will cool down on the press folks but Balji's recent action must have indicated that paying good money does help in getting your point of view and no different to the streetwalkers of old.

 

[Porfirio Rubirosa]

hey why did u leave out Tony & Hazel??...

You guys notice Goh Meng Seng now behaves like he is a Political Opposition heavyweight? A top Dog. My lanjiao to his face! Without Nicole Seah and Jeanette Aruldoss, he is just another fucking once in five years GE clown! !

 

[bhoven]

i suggest u just read TCB's speech at the SMA annual dinner on 14may11...where he 'cuts n paste's' fm his 'hard truth' speech in parl in mid 80s after the 84GE where there was the largest swing vote since independence even larger than the swing in GE11...of 12.5%...after which he got a bollicking fm harry n was not v much liked in pap for a long time...news.sma.org.sg/4305/Feature.pdf

compare the abv to TKL...who only suddenly got a 'political epiphany' after he was apparently 'pushed' out of his beloved income...n u helping TKL to try n get 100K signatures for the PE bid really struck me as pathetic...like i hv said before n say again...want to run just run lah...what is this all abt getting petitions to persuade potential candidate to run...i mean TKL ain't no cory aquino k?!...

no doubt TCB has his flaws n foibles...n his long association wif pap does not help either...however let's face it...overwhelming majority of individuals who hv the stature to run for the PE r invariably linked to the local establishment in one way r another...n hence linked to pap as well...wtd...singapore is a small nation n still developing civic society...but just on the face of it...TCB stands far n abv TKL...i wld say TKL wld only stand abv the likes of andrew kuan n crackpots like ooi n rafi...

agree with you...TKL has shown from even his NTUC Income days that he has an egoistic streak and yearns for publicity...perhaps thats why he never made it to MP altho he 'worked' hard in then PM's MP consituency

 

[scroobal]

Though picking up the papers personally shows confidence and commitment there might be an extenuating circumstances. In Tan Kin Lian case, the way he brought in WP is the issue.It shows how sly this chap is. This is not the only case within the last few weeks. He also conducted to a survey using Tan Cheng Bock as a surrogate to see how people would lean. The questions asked especially the PAP association tells me this chap is devious. Go to his blog. Note how he answers sensitive question. He will not answer directly and often someone else's comment on the same subject. This fellow has not changed at all.

I asked one chap to list his accomplishments and all he could provide is mini-bonds. I asked the chap to get TKL is sign a stat dec stating that he did not recommend mini-bond to anyone and I am still waiting.

The saddest part is the attempt to give the impression that he can influence the investment practices of Temasek and GIC. There is a clear distinction between reserves and the conduct of such businesses.

Ask him what charity has he been doing all these years. What social work has he been engaged in.

 

[scroobal]

Maybe GMS can get TKL to tell why he was removed from Marine Parade party work.

agree with you...TKL has shown from even his NTUC Income days that he has an egoistic streak and yearns for publicity...perhaps thats why he never made it to MP altho he 'worked' hard in then PM's MP consituency

 

[kingrant]

Porfiro,

I see it in a contrarian way. In the wake of the GE2011, it may not always proved to be a good thing if you are govt endorsed. A govt-approved TCB or GY may well lose to a non-govt supported TKL because of the PAP label. And I do not nec see PAP going out on a limb to endorse TKL. The corollary is that if the govt wants to blunt his edge, they may just endorse him as well.

If the voters are sophisticated enough not to go by labels if the govt finally takes yr approach, then TCB will still have a more than fair chance to beat TKL to the punch.

Or is my view too contrarian?

my own take is that the 3 'wise men' shall approve both TKL n TCB for obvious reasons...the rubicon has been crossed since GE11 n PAP is now in unknown territory...so to further piss off the public so close after GE11 wld probably be a no go...

 

[Perspective]

Maybe GMS can get TKL to tell why he was removed from Marine Parade party work.

The fella prefers to run away, after attempts to get personal failed. Both screwed up the 100,000 signatures boast and have the cheek to proclaim angelic.

He also had the audacity to think WP's Huat was naive and on top of that said it by putting it into my mouth then turn around thus let the impression stay. Friends no matter how smart can be made use of if the other guy has no friendship in mind. And this is where TKL failed as friend. He himself has also failed by getting personal over a few small things.

Another that comes to mind is SDP Alec Tok's letter to Ivan Heng (when Alec was still in RP) probably that put the end to the friendship.

 

[Goh Meng Seng]

He also had the audacity to think WP's Huat was naive and on top of that said it by putting it into my mouth then turn around thus let the impression stay. Friends no matter how smart can be made use of if the other guy has no friendship in mind. And this is where TKL failed as friend. He himself has also failed by getting personal over a few small things.

Haha, who is the one who "gets personal"?

You have put up information which hardly anybody would know, like having lunch, calls from TKL etc... to paint a picture. But please, even picture has a shadow in it!

And rightfully, Scroobal comes to the conclusion that your Huat Ah is so naive to be made used by TKL! Anyone who reads what you wrote will come to the same conclusions. Yeah, you are trying to say TKL is manipulative, but at the same time, there is one guy, your Huat Ah, who is so naive or even stupid, to be made used by him!

Who puts words into your mouth? Nope. It is what you have done which shows your intentions as well as your unintended, ill-conceived showing off of private information which make you look stupid as well. Don't complain about how I put it. It is plain simple and others could see it as well.

There is really nothing personal here, just a laugh off of some stupid comments you made that backfired. But since you want to make it personal, so be it.

I asked the most fundamental question, does your Huat Ah know that they are going to collect the forms together that day? If he is the willing party to play along, why do you complain? That's the gist; it just exposed your intention.

Goh Meng Seng

 

[Porfirio Rubirosa]

i fail to c any legitimate compelling "extenuating circumstances" in TKL's case...

busy?...does not fly as there appears to be no definitive milestone apart fm when the present PE'
s term ends...

shy of limelight n issue of certification?...also does not fly...particularly when u look at TKL's apparent PE strategy fm time when he started the ludicrous pathetic 100K petition n mainstream media 'limelight'...

Though picking up the papers personally shows confidence and commitment there might be an extenuating circumstances. .

 

[Porfirio Rubirosa]

perhaps i did not make myself clear bro...i hv never been under the impression that PAP wld endorse TCB...

also agree that a PAP endorsement may well be a kiss of death...especially under the current public sentiment...but then again a week is a long time in politics...however i am certainly enjoying all the wayang n dramarama...expect more to come...now even Tommy Koh has weighed in on his view on PE's role, functions n powers...!...hope to c the views of kevin tan n teoh li ann in the near future...

Porfiro,

I see it in a contrarian way. In the wake of the GE2011, it may not always proved to be a good thing if you are govt endorsed. A govt-approved TCB or GY may well lose to a non-govt supported TKL because of the PAP label. And I do not nec see PAP going out on a limb to endorse TKL. The corollary is that if the govt wants to blunt his edge, they may just endorse him as well.

If the voters are sophisticated enough not to go by labels if the govt finally takes yr approach, then TCB will still have a more than fair chance to beat TKL to the punch.

Or is my view too contrarian?

 

[Zombie]

I asked the most fundamental question, does your Huat Ah know that they are going to collect the forms together that day? If he is the willing party to play along, why do you complain? That's the gist; it just exposed your intention.

I asked the most fundamental question, do SBForumers know what to expect from the posts here? If they are the willing party to agree, why do you complain? That's the gist; it just exposed your intention.

 

[Debonerman]

A classic from sammyboy member Ah Hai.

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