Sulphur in Petrol - Yaboob Caught Off Guard Yet Again!

[makapaaa]

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Coffeeshop Chit Chat - Sulphur content of petrol: NEA dont know</TD><TD id=msgunetc noWrap align=right> </TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE class=msgtable cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=0 width="96%"><TBODY><TR><TD class=msg vAlign=top><TABLE border=0 cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=0 width="100%"><TBODY><TR class=msghead><TD class=msgbfr1 width="1%"> </TD><TD><TABLE border=0 cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=0><TBODY><TR class=msghead vAlign=top><TD class=msgF width="1%" noWrap align=right>From: </TD><TD class=msgFname width="68%" noWrap>kojakbt_89 <NOBR></NOBR> </TD><TD class=msgDate width="30%" noWrap align=right>3:52 am </TD></TR><TR class=msghead><TD class=msgT height=20 width="1%" noWrap align=right>To: </TD><TD class=msgTname width="68%" noWrap>ALL <NOBR></NOBR></TD><TD class=msgNum noWrap align=right> (1 of 8) </TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></TD></TR><TR><TD class=msgleft rowSpan=4 width="1%"> </TD><TD class=wintiny noWrap align=right>40896.1 </TD></TR><TR><TD height=8></TD></TR><TR><TD class=msgtxt>Sulphur leaves a bad taste


It seems impossible to find out the sulphur content of petrol sold in Singapore
http://www.todayonline.com/Voices/EDC101105-0000069/Sulphur-leaves-a-bad-taste

Letter from Prithpal Singh
05:55 AM Nov 05, 2010

I WANT to share my experience with the National Environment Agency (NEA) and the Ministry of the Environment and Water Resources in getting information on the different sulphur levels in the various types of petrol sold in Singapore.

I wanted the information so that I can choose which petrol to use based on which one has the lowest sulphur levels. Lower sulphur means cleaner fuel, which means less pollution. It also means better fuel economy.

I had hoped the NEA could share the information with the public, empowering the public to choose to use fuels based on sulphur levels. This, I hoped, would in turn lead the petrol companies to take action on their own regarding sulphur levels in their products, instead of waiting for legislation to compel them to do so.

Sulphur content is measured in parts per million (ppm); the lower the number the better. But it seems here in Singapore no one wants to tell you the ppm level of the different types of petrol on the market. I have been told that "it's below 500 ppm" and "within acceptable limits".

In Singapore, we use the Euro II vehicular emission standard as the bar - but this is a Third World standard. In Europe they are down to 10 ppm! So, are we closer to 10 ppm or 500 ppm? I have been asking but no one has given me a definitive reply.

I started my quest for an answer two months ago but I have found myself back at square one, with an NEA officer informing me that "there is currently no regulatory requirement for oil companies to disclose such information". He would only state that "the sulphur content in all the brands of petrol are well within the specifications required for the prevailing vehicular emission standard".

Someone from one of the petrol companies apologised to me, via email, that "we are not able to tell which grade of petrol has the lower sulphur. A number of factors such as selection of available blending component might affect the outcome of sulphur content in the petrol. Hence we are not able to ensure (if any given) grade of petrol sold always has low sulphur content".

Another petrol company told me that they "do not disclose such information to the general public".

Petrol emission is one of the biggest sources of pollution around and is an issue that urgently needs to be addressed. Surely the authorities should be able to get the petrol companies to divulge the sulphur content of their products sold in Singapore, and display this information at the petrol pumps and on the NEA website?


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[makapaaa]

<TABLE border=0 cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=0 width="100%"><TBODY><TR class=msghead><TD class=msgbfr1 width="1%"> </TD><TD><TABLE border=0 cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=0><TBODY><TR class=msghead vAlign=top><TD class=msgF width="1%" noWrap align=right>From: </TD><TD class=msgFname width="68%" noWrap>Toby Kuntakinte (PouletGeorge) <NOBR></NOBR> </TD><TD class=msgDate width="30%" noWrap align=right>5:24 am </TD></TR><TR class=msghead><TD class=msgT height=20 width="1%" noWrap align=right>To: </TD><TD class=msgTname width="68%" noWrap>mrbell1009 <NOBR></NOBR></TD><TD class=msgNum noWrap align=right> (5 of 8) </TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></TD></TR><TR><TD class=msgleft rowSpan=4 width="1%"> </TD><TD class=wintiny noWrap align=right>40896.5 in reply to 40896.4 </TD></TR><TR><TD height=8></TD></TR><TR><TD class=msgtxt>[FONT=Comic Sans MS,Sans-Serif]Just need to know,[/FONT]
[FONT=Comic Sans MS,Sans-Serif]Are you a diesel engine expert, particularly motor vehicle?[/FONT]
[FONT=Comic Sans MS,Sans-Serif]My new lorry, a fucking EURO4 standard still emits black smoke. Was hailed up by NEA and these fucking minions can't offer a definitive solution to the problem. These irresponsible bastardized minions just casually said that I have to do regular maintenance. My fucking lorry maintenance is more regular than any women's period !!! But, the same problem still perisists.[/FONT]
</TD></TR><TR><TD> </TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE border=0 cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=0 width="100%"><TBODY><TR><TD class=msgleft width="1%"> </TD><TD class=msgopt width="24%" noWrap> Options</TD><TD class=msgrde width="50%" noWrap align=middle> Reply</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>

 

[rollingmon]

when there is a problem, we peasants are always the problem in the eyes of our leaders. wat a shame

 

[Papsmearer]

<TABLE id=msgUN border=0 cellSpacing=3 cellPadding=0 width="100%"><TBODY><TR><TD id=msgUNsubj vAlign=top>

Coffeeshop Chit Chat - Sulphur content of petrol: NEA dont know</TD><TD id=msgunetc noWrap align=right> </TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE class=msgtable cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=0 width="96%"><TBODY><TR><TD class=msg vAlign=top><TABLE border=0 cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=0 width="100%"><TBODY><TR class=msghead><TD class=msgbfr1 width="1%"> </TD><TD><TABLE border=0 cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=0><TBODY><TR class=msghead vAlign=top><TD class=msgF width="1%" noWrap align=right>From: </TD><TD class=msgFname width="68%" noWrap>kojakbt_89 <NOBR></NOBR> </TD><TD class=msgDate width="30%" noWrap align=right>3:52 am </TD></TR><TR class=msghead><TD class=msgT height=20 width="1%" noWrap align=right>To: </TD><TD class=msgTname width="68%" noWrap>ALL <NOBR></NOBR></TD><TD class=msgNum noWrap align=right> (1 of 8) </TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></TD></TR><TR><TD class=msgleft rowSpan=4 width="1%"> </TD><TD class=wintiny noWrap align=right>40896.1 </TD></TR><TR><TD height=8></TD></TR><TR><TD class=msgtxt>Sulphur leaves a bad taste


It seems impossible to find out the sulphur content of petrol sold in Singapore
http://www.todayonline.com/Voices/EDC101105-0000069/Sulphur-leaves-a-bad-taste

Letter from Prithpal Singh
05:55 AM Nov 05, 2010

I WANT to share my experience with the National Environment Agency (NEA) and the Ministry of the Environment and Water Resources in getting information on the different sulphur levels in the various types of petrol sold in Singapore.

I wanted the information so that I can choose which petrol to use based on which one has the lowest sulphur levels. Lower sulphur means cleaner fuel, which means less pollution. It also means better fuel economy.

I had hoped the NEA could share the information with the public, empowering the public to choose to use fuels based on sulphur levels. This, I hoped, would in turn lead the petrol companies to take action on their own regarding sulphur levels in their products, instead of waiting for legislation to compel them to do so.

Sulphur content is measured in parts per million (ppm); the lower the number the better. But it seems here in Singapore no one wants to tell you the ppm level of the different types of petrol on the market. I have been told that "it's below 500 ppm" and "within acceptable limits".

In Singapore, we use the Euro II vehicular emission standard as the bar - but this is a Third World standard. In Europe they are down to 10 ppm! So, are we closer to 10 ppm or 500 ppm? I have been asking but no one has given me a definitive reply.

I started my quest for an answer two months ago but I have found myself back at square one, with an NEA officer informing me that "there is currently no regulatory requirement for oil companies to disclose such information". He would only state that "the sulphur content in all the brands of petrol are well within the specifications required for the prevailing vehicular emission standard".

Someone from one of the petrol companies apologised to me, via email, that "we are not able to tell which grade of petrol has the lower sulphur. A number of factors such as selection of available blending component might affect the outcome of sulphur content in the petrol. Hence we are not able to ensure (if any given) grade of petrol sold always has low sulphur content".

Another petrol company told me that they "do not disclose such information to the general public".

Petrol emission is one of the biggest sources of pollution around and is an issue that urgently needs to be addressed. Surely the authorities should be able to get the petrol companies to divulge the sulphur content of their products sold in Singapore, and display this information at the petrol pumps and on the NEA website?


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Firstly, he should check with the various petrol companies. If he cannot get the answer from them, he should check and see if the information is avalable from Malaysian petrol companies. Both countries are using essentially the same petrol.

But I think he is missing the main point, i.e. too much sulphur will damage your catlystic converter, and hence inthe long run negate all the pollution control system.

 

[nickers9]

Dont make my talents in my PAP gang do so many work ok ah???

The more work they do, the more they will tax you. The more they tax you, the more increment in my salary I will get ah???

If you dont want me to have increment in my salary, dont make me do so much work ok ah???

 

[Watchman]

Corruption at the highest level .

Quality assurance in Singapore sleeping on the
job again or taking some kickbacks .

But they ready to implement " carbon tax " .

Singapore should not be allowed to implement
carbon tax since certain levels are seeing
rampant corrution and inconsistencies .

 

[rollingmon]

there is no corruption cos our leaders are getting better than world class pay. anyhow say they corrupt later they sue you.

 

[sadfcuk]

I think Singaporeans are more concerned with "bread-and-butter" issues, i.e., cost of living, availability of housing.

It is simply a case of "self-preservation over morality".

While it is a commendable thing to be concerned about the environment for our future generations, Singaporean simply do not give a flying frak about it.

 

[myo539]

Wah, this Singh is so civic-conscious and wants to contribute less to pollution, and by extension, saving the Earth. He should Google a bit to find out more instead of always troubling the gahment. I thing he justwan some publicity. I don't wish to call Makaapa a running dog for copy & paste article here.

Here is what I found within 5 minutes.

Sulphur is present to a greater or lesser extent in all crude oils. When crude oil is distilled into petrol and diesel fuel blending components, some sulphur finds its way into those components. The amount of sulphur allowed in petrol and diesel is limited because of the undesirable effects it causes during combustion, such as its odour, its corrosiveness, and its tendency to produce acidic by-products...

Different countries have different level of tolerance for sulphur in petrol :
Maximum allow in petrol :
Singapore • 150 ppm
Hong Kong • 150 ppm
China & Taiwan • 150 ppm
Australia • 150 ppm
New Zealand • 350 ppm regular, 150 ppm premium
European Union • 50 ppm for all petrol
USA • 300 ppm

Bottom line :
1. Singh should use premium petrol and not regular; better still use Shell V-Power. More expensive petrol = less sulphur
2. Singh should not drive over to Johor to pump petrol

Just for laugh :

1. What do you call a Singh who wants to save the Earth and rides a bicycle instead of looking for sulphur-free petrol?

Answer : BAI SIKH-GUR Singh

2. What do you call a Singh who loves to write to the Newspaper to complain about this and that?

Answer : Paper Singh aka Prith-pal Singh

3. Finally to thank the Singh who contributed to Singapore :
A Riddle : How does Singapore get its name?

When Raffles sailed up the Singapore River for the first time, he saw a Malay woman taking a bath in the river. She had left her sarong on the river bank. As Raffles sailed by, he saw a turbaned Singh sneak up and steal her clothes. The upset Minah started waving at Raffles and shouting "Singh kapoh! Singh kapoh!"

More Singh jokes can be found in :
http://www.talkingcock.com/html/jokexec.php?op=JokeView&lexicon=jokes&jcat=Mama and Bhai

 

[zuoom]

all euro 4 n onwards will require ultra low sulphur content diesel.

otherwise, within about 2, 3 years, the fuel pump n injectors go bonkers.
and they are not cheap to replace.

 

[numero uno]

<TABLE id=msgUN border=0 cellSpacing=3 cellPadding=0 width="100%"><TBODY><TR><TD id=msgUNsubj vAlign=top>

Coffeeshop Chit Chat - Sulphur content of petrol: NEA dont know</TD><TD id=msgunetc noWrap align=right> </TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE class=msgtable cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=0 width="96%"><TBODY><TR><TD class=msg vAlign=top><TABLE border=0 cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=0 width="100%"><TBODY><TR class=msghead><TD class=msgbfr1 width="1%"> </TD><TD><TABLE border=0 cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=0><TBODY><TR class=msghead vAlign=top><TD class=msgF width="1%" noWrap align=right>From: </TD><TD class=msgFname width="68%" noWrap>kojakbt_89 <NOBR></NOBR> </TD><TD class=msgDate width="30%" noWrap align=right>3:52 am </TD></TR><TR class=msghead><TD class=msgT height=20 width="1%" noWrap align=right>To: </TD><TD class=msgTname width="68%" noWrap>ALL <NOBR></NOBR></TD><TD class=msgNum noWrap align=right> (1 of 8) </TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></TD></TR><TR><TD class=msgleft rowSpan=4 width="1%"> </TD><TD class=wintiny noWrap align=right>40896.1 </TD></TR><TR><TD height=8></TD></TR><TR><TD class=msgtxt>Sulphur leaves a bad taste


It seems impossible to find out the sulphur content of petrol sold in Singapore
http://www.todayonline.com/Voices/EDC101105-0000069/Sulphur-leaves-a-bad-taste

Letter from Prithpal Singh
05:55 AM Nov 05, 2010

I WANT to share my experience with the National Environment Agency (NEA) and the Ministry of the Environment and Water Resources in getting information on the different sulphur levels in the various types of petrol sold in Singapore.

I wanted the information so that I can choose which petrol to use based on which one has the lowest sulphur levels. Lower sulphur means cleaner fuel, which means less pollution. It also means better fuel economy.

I had hoped the NEA could share the information with the public, empowering the public to choose to use fuels based on sulphur levels. This, I hoped, would in turn lead the petrol companies to take action on their own regarding sulphur levels in their products, instead of waiting for legislation to compel them to do so.

Sulphur content is measured in parts per million (ppm); the lower the number the better. But it seems here in Singapore no one wants to tell you the ppm level of the different types of petrol on the market. I have been told that "it's below 500 ppm" and "within acceptable limits".

In Singapore, we use the Euro II vehicular emission standard as the bar - but this is a Third World standard. In Europe they are down to 10 ppm! So, are we closer to 10 ppm or 500 ppm? I have been asking but no one has given me a definitive reply.

I started my quest for an answer two months ago but I have found myself back at square one, with an NEA officer informing me that "there is currently no regulatory requirement for oil companies to disclose such information". He would only state that "the sulphur content in all the brands of petrol are well within the specifications required for the prevailing vehicular emission standard".

Someone from one of the petrol companies apologised to me, via email, that "we are not able to tell which grade of petrol has the lower sulphur. A number of factors such as selection of available blending component might affect the outcome of sulphur content in the petrol. Hence we are not able to ensure (if any given) grade of petrol sold always has low sulphur content".

Another petrol company told me that they "do not disclose such information to the general public".

Petrol emission is one of the biggest sources of pollution around and is an issue that urgently needs to be addressed. Surely the authorities should be able to get the petrol companies to divulge the sulphur content of their products sold in Singapore, and display this information at the petrol pumps and on the NEA website?


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I used to coomplain to NEA written countless of letters and all these Euro 2 and 3 vehicles are damn pollutive and highly dangerous to health. In Three German cities, including the capital Berlin, began implementing a new air pollution system a long time ago that bans the dirtiest vehicles from their centers.
Drivers in Berlin, Cologne and Hanover are now required to display a colored badge showing the level of pollution caused by their vehicle, with a scale of red, yellow and green.
They are NOT even talking about Euro 4, they are going to adopt Euro 5 soon!!!!! and here in cr@p singapore they are sleeping on the job NEA and allowing euro 1 and 2 and 3 vehicles to run around killing us. The germans are not stupid. there are numerous studies in medical line that show ALL DIESEL VEHICLES IRRESPECTIVE OF euro class are dangerous and full of carciniogens and what have you. anything more than 2.5 PPM (microparticulates 2.5 micron is very unhealthy and even NEA does not achieved PPM 10 standards which is why they refused to publish all these data despite my request. Now you why diesel cars are not popular in USA as they are alot of state health regulations against them . Even in Euro they are using euro 4 a s minimum standards and cahnging to euro 5 and 5 soon and we are still talking about euro 1 and 2 vehicles plying singapore roads. no wonder so many heart attacks and stroke. cr@p NEA and LTA

http://newsinfo.inquirer.net/breaki..._begins_ban_on_polluting_cars_in_city_centers
http://europa.eu/legislation_summaries/environment/air_pollution/l28186_en.htm

http://www.toytowngermany.com/lofi/index.php/t45910-45.html

 

[Papsmearer]

Wah, this Singh is so civic-conscious and wants to contribute less to pollution, and by extension, saving the Earth. He should Google a bit to find out more instead of always troubling the gahment. I thing he justwan some publicity. I don't wish to call Makaapa a running dog for copy & paste article here.

Here is what I found within 5 minutes.

Sulphur is present to a greater or lesser extent in all crude oils. When crude oil is distilled into petrol and diesel fuel blending components, some sulphur finds its way into those components. The amount of sulphur allowed in petrol and diesel is limited because of the undesirable effects it causes during combustion, such as its odour, its corrosiveness, and its tendency to produce acidic by-products...

Different countries have different level of tolerance for sulphur in petrol :
Maximum allow in petrol :
Singapore • 150 ppm
Hong Kong • 150 ppm
China & Taiwan • 150 ppm
Australia • 150 ppm
New Zealand • 350 ppm regular, 150 ppm premium
European Union • 50 ppm for all petrol
USA • 300 ppm

Bottom line :
1. Singh should use premium petrol and not regular; better still use Shell V-Power. More expensive petrol = less sulphur
2. Singh should not drive over to Johor to pump petrol

QUOTE]

This is not correct. More expensive petrol DOES NOT EQUAL less sulphur. The sulphur content should be the same whether in the lowest grade or the highest grade of the petrol. Same refinery, same processing, etc, produces same level of sulphur. More expensive petrol is just higher Octane rating petrol. 20 years ago and more, when engines were less sophisticated, higher octane petrol was needed to prevent knocking in engines. Older engines today might still knock, and u can solve this by either an engine tune up or a fuel additive like an octane booster to the tank every fill up, or just buy higher octane fuel. Most newer cars now have an anti knocking sensor in the engine. When knocking is detected, it instantly changes the fuel air mixture in the direct injection to enrich the combustion mix. Higher Octane petrol is basically a con job by petrol companies to get u to buy more expensive petrol. The car companies are in collusion with them too, in stating higher octane petrol for their cars. I guarantee u if you take a brand new BMW 7 series out for a drive, and u put in the cheapest petrol, u will not detect any knocking, or hesitation in the engine. It will perform flawlessly. Also, most petrol companies put in the same detergent additives in their petrol, to clean the engines, whether its their cheapest petrol or most expensive petrol, the additive is still there. Hence, u can't even say cheap petrol will dirty the engine in the long run.

 

[pegasus]

Papsmearer is correct, Newer cars don't need V power and other high octane fuel. Its the KS Sporeon who is dying to pay more for something he does not need!! a friend of mine who bought the MB 250 CGI Blue Efficiency told me that the agent told him NOT to use high octane fuel as it would damage the engine and that he should use RON95 only. In fact its written on the inside of the petrol cap. He was also told that the sulphur levels in Spore petrol still too high thats why other models with higher engine capacity CGI Blue Efficiency not being brought in by C& C . The agent said that the petrol in singapore is still too dirty to bring in over 3 L blue Efficiency engines .This was a direct quote from the C & C agent himself. U can chk with C & C and ask them why they don't bring in MB350 CGI only the lower capacity engines. I think Audi, BMW will also like to bring in BLue Efficiency type engines but the fillty petrol probably the reason for not doing so.

 

[Papsmearer]

Papsmearer is correct, Newer cars don't need V power and other high octane fuel. Its the KS Sporeon who is dying to pay more for something he does not need!! a friend of mine who bought the MB 250 CGI Blue Efficiency told me that the agent told him NOT to use high octane fuel as it would damage the engine and that he should use RON95 only. In fact its written on the inside of the petrol cap. He was also told that the sulphur levels in Spore petrol still too high thats why other models with higher engine capacity CGI Blue Efficiency not being brought in by C& C . The agent said that the petrol in singapore is still too dirty to bring in over 3 L blue Efficiency engines .This was a direct quote from the C & C agent himself. U can chk with C & C and ask them why they don't bring in MB350 CGI only the lower capacity engines. I think Audi, BMW will also like to bring in BLue Efficiency type engines but the fillty petrol probably the reason for not doing so.

Yeah, sinkies are really uneducated when it comes to petrol. I blame CASE and also AAS for not doing a better job educating consumers. In fact, RON 91 is already suitable for most cars. but the local companies will not sell it, the lowest they will go is Ron 92. They want to make u pay more. As for Ron 98, that is hard to find even in European countries. In North America, the highest equivalent petrol u can get in most stations is Ron 95. Most cars brought into Singapore are low CC equivalents of the same models sold elsewhere in the world, because they want to save on the road tax and the COE. Smaller displacement engines are usually designed for fuel economy, and have a lower compression than high performance cars. These engines do not need even Ron 95. But the real issue is what u raised. The sulphur content will damage the catalytic converters of the cars in the long run, making them pollute more and lowering the fuel efficiency of the car. Most cars here are scrapped after 10 years, but if they were retained longer, the owners will have to replace the catalytic converters which is really expensive.