Property prices CRASHES ..........you wait long long......

[Narong Wongwan]

Nobody is talking up the market. Want to blame then blame pap.
Pap will never allow the market to crash.
It is in their interests.
Sinkieland is small and easy to manipulate,

 

[The_Hypocrite]

My thoughts exactly. But those that are wanting a crash believe that external factors will do the job. They do not understand the extent of manipulation the PAP can do to prop up property prices. Also is supply greater than demand? or vice versa?

Nobody is talking up the market. Want to blame then blame pap.
Pap will never allow the market to crash.
It is in their interests.
Sinkieland is small and easy to manipulate,

 

[numero uno]

if the market is so easy to manipulate as you say, then there would not be any crash in 1997 or 2000 or 2003 or 2008. this is beyond PAP.
ultimately it not the land which is the deciding factor as alotof property agents like to bullsh!t to you creating an illusion taht it would not drop.
almost everyone(99.9% of buyers take out a huge mortgage as evidenced in teh household debt ration which is the second highest in the world). it is the finacial aspect that they don't tell you. you sign away your life when you take a 30 or 40 nyr mortgage and ifineterst goes up you are crewed as bank can foreclose. Now we are talking about hundred of billions in debt in sinkieland/ if you can manipulate it so easily, the job of chairman of feds USA would be yours literally. alotof brilliant economists can't and liek I said talk is cheap.
like I said alot of property agents are spineless worms. most of them are already offloading their units behind your back and yet tell you the opposite in front of you. real b@stards

 

[The_Hypocrite]

U think Singapore banks can be sued? Look at the deposit boxes fuck up, the lehman brothers issues etc...how have MAS reacted? they protected the banks...

and Singapore traditionally have low rates hence investment in housing,...if rates go up..the economy will tank...u think pap will allow that? its self interest is at stake.

for your info your are dead wrong. ALL banks whetehr US or UK and singapore are interlink. The LIBOR scandal has thrown open a can of worms and US feds and FBI are investigating the rate fiixing scandals in US. already a few heads have rolled in Barclay and UK. Go read yesterday papers, even SIBOR rates were fixed for a long time and MAS have reprimanded them. In US and UK tehre are now huge lawsuits from depositers against these banks about the artificially low rates. Go ask those in the financial industry. the rates were low because of these "fixers" which are anticompetitive and illegal. Now with the huge lawsuits nobody would think twice about doing it. a few got sack and fined billion of dollars
the lawyers are in for the long haul to suck the banks dry!!!!!!!!
expect interest rates to go up, for the suckers out there!
http://www.economist.com/news/finan...punishing-year-fines-and-lawsuits-year-lawyer

http://www.ibtimes.co.uk/articles/475861/20130607/eu-price-fixing-libor-oil-probe-gas.htm
http://www.cpmlegal.com/cases-164.html
http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/64acde8c-b012-11e2-8d07-00144feabdc0.html

 

[winnipegjets]

About property prices, is there an over supply or housing? has all families who need a house got a house? if supply is less than demand than how prices drop ah?

The government controls the demand and supply ...the demand is pumped up by opening the flood gates for more foreigners to invade this island, the control of supply is obvious.

 

[numero uno]

nope. its quite impossible to sue the banks in sinkieland. the lahman fiasco shows it. the banks here are protected by garmen. but when interest rates goes up, the garmen must pump in more money or print more(like in USA) but it cannot do that as inflation would worsen and unemployment go up. since most of our resurces are tied up in CPF, and they have to protect the banks , then they would let the hoi polloi suffers. its complex and exactly what happen in US. at least in US they have a buffer by creating a gold price inflation(Fort knox have one of the largest reserve of gold) and that's exactly what happened in past few years.in spain and UK , as part of EU bargain, they ahve to sell the gold stocks to keep the ppound and euro form collapsing into worthless toilet paper, hence the sudden drop in gold. taht's as simple as it is. all the bankers plots

 

[winnipegjets]

like I said alot of property agents are spineless worms. most of them are already offloading their units behind your back and yet tell you the opposite in front of you. real b@stards

Property agents are overpaid for what they do.

 

[winnipegjets]

My thoughts exactly. But those that are wanting a crash believe that external factors will do the job. They do not understand the extent of manipulation the PAP can do to prop up property prices. Also is supply greater than demand? or vice versa?

There is a limit to the extent that PAP can manipulate the prices. If foreigners don't want to come or those who come are the cheap kinds, demand for properties is reduced, thus lowering the prices. The PAP can't prop the market up indefinitely without showing a big hole in government coffers.

 

[The_Hypocrite]

How can there be a big hole in gahmen coffers when the price of Gahmen property transactions gives it huge profits??? For example, brand new HDB flats,,selling for about 500K,,,how much is the profit margin for gahmen coffers? what about BTOs and land sales..? how much gahmen earn?

Ok lets say gahmen cut price for brand new flats,,,500k to 400k, how much is gahmen profit? The guesstimate for construction cost is 50k per flat. When we say gahmen prop up the price is like, capping demand.

For example (and these are tools used by gahmen before)

1) Restrict land sales hence capping supply.
2) Keep interest rates low
3) Let in more PMETs
4)maybe even come up with foreign investment visa like buy a 4million property get PR...
5) Do u think foreign crap dont want to come to spore? Indons, pinoys, viet etc are still queuing up to enter singapore,,,

And for those that keep harping on SARS, 2008 GFC etc,,those shit lasted less than 1 year and after that all normal again. And I said this many times, those that bought in SARs and 2008 have already benefitted from housing appreciation today. And do not forget..PAP has huge self interest in property..they will just cap supply and it will still remain high. They have done it before,,,that is why we have this BTO fiasco,,they build flats in fuck up location like Sengkang and many did not want it,,,that is why MBT came up with the BTO shit in the 1st place,,,than after that say caught off guard,,,

The bottom line is PAP manipulation for such a small market can dampen any external factor...

There is a limit to the extent that PAP can manipulate the prices. If foreigners don't want to come or those who come are the cheap kinds, demand for properties is reduced, thus lowering the prices. The PAP can't prop the market up indefinitely without showing a big hole in government coffers.

 

[watchman8]

The property market can crash or surge over the short term, and only the minority will suffer real losses, for all these are just pricing volatility, it only has psychological impact on most families.

Only those with high leverage and lost their income will suffer real losses as they are forced to sell in a down market.

 

[zeebjii]

You make it seem so easy like talk cock sing song. It tooks us long long time to recover from the crash of 97/98. If so easy, why such a long itme?

I read an article some time back that it's pointless to argue with someone who holds opposite viewpoint from you. He will never change his viewpoint just becasue you spend a lot of time trying to do so.

For me , i just look at cold hard facts to form my own conclusion.

One of us will be wrong. We will know in due time.

 

[xebay11]

Property agents are overpaid for what they do.

Wrong, property agents let u sell your property at higher prices than u can achieve yourself and can get you bargains and hidden discounts if buying. They are paid only on a success fee basis too, no sale, no purchase, no pay, how many professionals can u engage this way? Also u can always choose not to engage one...... So why are you so bitter about what they earn? Next time sell and buy property yourself, it's a free country.

 

[The_Hypocrite]

The point is I have been hearing this harping about property price crash since time in memorial and they were wrong since than. after 97/98 prices stabalise and many were hoping that prices continue to drop but it did not. It stabilised. That was when PAP came up with all its tactics like BTO and stop building HDB flats etc,,,than open the floodgates etc. The more you harp on it the more it will come true, but I hope those naysayers do their homework before sprouting shit. what about 2011? Everyone say price will drop and the market went the other direction. U can harp on it long enough and it will happen, but I do not believe that price will crash like what nay sayers are sprouting.

One point I need to bring up is in Singapore rent is higher than mortgage. This itself creates a market for buying property.

In conclusion, PAP can manipulate the market with greater influence than typical free market economies. Do not underestimate the manipulation and also has the support of home owners to keep prices.

You make it seem so easy like talk cock sing song. It tooks us long long time to recover from the crash of 97/98. If so easy, why such a long itme?

I read an article some time back that it's pointless to argue with someone who holds opposite viewpoint from you. He will never change his viewpoint just becasue you spend a lot of time trying to do so.

For me , i just look at cold hard facts to form my own conclusion.

One of us will be wrong. We will know in due time.

 

[Reddog]

For those who cannot secure a proper job, being a property agent is still better than asking your wife to work at Geylang. So please be merciful and spare you distain towards property agents please.

 

[Jah_rastafar_I]

Actually what constitutes a proper job? I suppose insurance, car salesman and lord knows maybe investment bankers would be in the same cat as property agents all holding improper jobs. Come to think of it private tutors, driving instructors don't really hold proper jobs too.

 

[The_Hypocrite]

A proper job is whereby one earns well can feed the family and let the employee achieve his/her financial objectives. Pinky and Gang has a proper job. Civil Serpents have a proper job.

About property agents, their job is to help their customers get the best price for a property. However Singapore rules are damn crappy. For HDB flat both the buying agent and selling agent get commission from the seller right??? Where is the logic in that? It should be a straight forward rule whereby only the seller pays the commission. Less distortions the better. There are good agents whereby they really help their customers get a good deal on property. The bad ones are those that try to sell property like vegetables.

In Oz, I went for a few home viewings being managed by the same property agent. And there was one house the moment I walked in and he saw me, he recommended I do not buy it as it was not suitable for me. It was in a trailer park trash suburb did not fit my profile

Now not all agents are like that. If an agent sells property like vegetables he will not have a good profile of clients. and its a law of diminishing returns. But when market is good and prices keep going up, it makes it easier to sell.
And buyers will take the risk for fear it will go higher. In bad market is when a good agent thrives. As bargain hunters will come out.

Actually what constitutes a proper job? I suppose insurance, car salesman and lord knows maybe investment bankers would be in the same cat as property agents all holding improper jobs. Come to think of it private tutors, driving instructors don't really hold proper jobs too.

 

[watchman8]

In Oz, I went for a few home viewings being managed by the same property agent. And there was one house the moment I walked in and he saw me, he recommended I do not buy it as it was not suitable for me. It was in a trailer park trash suburb did not fit my profile

Now not all agents are like that. If an agent sells property like vegetables he will not have a good profile of clients. and its a law of diminishing returns. But when market is good and prices keep going up, it makes it easier to sell.
And buyers will take the risk for fear it will go higher. In bad market is when a good agent thrives. As bargain hunters will come out.

You are too naive. This is one of tricks of trade for any good salesman. They will show you a series of properties, and some will deliberately be lousy ones so as to highlight the qualities of the better ones. Some agents will be very honest on the lousy property, that will help gain some brownie points with potential buyers.

 

[The_Hypocrite]

Tat why the buyer needs to do homework,,,if everything depend on the agent than the buyer might as well go jump..

You are too naive. This is one of tricks of trade for any good salesman. They will show you a series of properties, and some will deliberately be lousy ones so as to highlight the qualities of the better ones. Some agents will be very honest on the lousy property, that will help gain some brownie points with potential buyers.

 

[blissquek]

nope. its quite impossible to sue the banks in sinkieland. the lahman fiasco shows it. the banks here are protected by garmen.

DBS sold the same Lehman product both in DBS HK and in Singapore.....I think it is High Note 5

However, in HK, the depositor were able to bang at the bank"s door and demand repayment..

whereas in Singapore, some depositors lost heavily...

Why is this so, double standard...here the govt cowed u and largely Singaporeans are powerless and being shut out and muted....by the use of the strong arm of the authorities.

 

[Simbian]

Lesson learnt is that monetary stimulus can only bring you so far - like begging can only bring you so far. Since the banks have already tightened up credit + lending, at most what the QE has done is to give more money to those who already have the money to gobble up even more assets. The well off would thank you very much but for the rest of the population who is still living in uncertainty, its not going to help them very much.

At one point of QE, some economists cynically remarked that it would have been better if the Fed did something bold and printed money to throw at the man on American streets to pay off their existing credit card debts or housing mortage or just spend it. At least you relieve the personal debt problem and perhaps boost consumer confidence+spending.

Locally, don't expect too much since if it really goes south, the government will do massive stimulus. As mentioned before, Singapore is a small place and due to a somewhat superficial perception of our economy, Singapore enjoys a reputation that we have not really earned. Not to mention due to being spoilt by an environment which favors the real estate sector, most Singaporeans start with a base perception that all property investment will have some form of return even when it is not in Singapore. It is the reason why Profitable Plots can actually con people into doing land banking for a piece of land marked as green belt in UK and why so many uncles and aunties can be persuaded into buying property in ulu places in foreign places where they have never gone before.