Pro PAP Facebook user : CSM vis Yakut

[steffychun]

The Tale of Two Births - Chen Show Mao vs Yacoob Ibrahimby Davian Lee on Tuesday, 06 September 2011 at 03:14
I thought the Wikileaks leaks on Minister Yacoob's children's citizenship status was very timely because it bring back memories of a similar incident which happended to opposition MP, Mr Chen Show Mao during the run up the general elections.

I am forced to contrast the responses from both these individuals because it speaks volumes about what they stand for and believe in.

In the case of Minister Yacoob, it was clarified that dual citizenship was confered to both the children till the age of 18 because his wife's citizenship at birth was American. He added that both his children Singapore citizens and attended national schools. The son in particular will serve national service, just as he did.

In contrast, when posed with a similar query to Mr Chen Show Mao, Show Mao remarked that "he hopes his 11 year old son will do national service, even though the boy can choose not to when he comes of age". He said that he would let his son make the decision on NS on his own but added that "I would certainly hope that he would decide to do what I did"

The way that these twp individuals have responded to similar queries speaks volumes about their priorities as a Singaporeans and fundamentally underlines their stand on a citizen's obligation. As a parent, I would have expected Mr Chen to make a strong stand with his child and influence him to do national service as I would regard it as a fundamental obligation of every Singaporean son to this nation.


http://www.facebook.com/davian-lee/

SCREW HIM

 

[ssrrvv11]

Davian fucktard lee,

Maybe u can try asking your dog god yakult to Stand in aljunied Grc for the next ge. Try kicking out Chen fair n square ok.

 

[Char_Azn]

It's a fair comment, if Yaacob dares to commit that his son is doing NS, it's a big contrast with one that haven't. CSM could just as easily came out and declared the same. If we expect our the sons of our ruling party to be doing NS shouldn't we expect the same about the opposition? Would U still respect the opposition if all their sons and daughters run road overseas?

 

[ssrrvv11]

It's a fair comment, if Yaacob dares to commit that his son is doing NS, it's a big contrast with one that haven't. CSM could just as easily came out and declared the same. If we expect our the sons of our ruling party to be doing NS shouldn't we expect the same about the opposition? Would U still respect the opposition if all their sons and daughters run road overseas?

woof woof

woof woof

 

[sukhoi-30]

The difference is CSM openly let people know, while the latter are known only when wikileed expose the stuff.

 

[Annoyed]

I'm afraid I have to respectfully disagree with the Facebook user, and some of the comments posted here.

Personally, I was impressed by Chen Show Mao's response to queries about his son. He is only being truthful when stating that he will leave the decision on whether or not to serve NS to the boy. To say that he will ensure his son fulfils those NS obligations smacks of scoring political points. How can you reasonably expect him to enforce something like that, anyway? Tie the boy up and drag him to Tekong? Threaten to disown him if he doesn't serve NS?

Conversely, while I appreciate Yacob's clarification, I think he might have just been overcompensating that little bit for the embarrassment of being outed by Wikileaks. What choice does he have, but to insist that his boys will pay their debts to the nation? More so after the Patrick Tan debacle, coupled with the all-time low public opinion against the PAP. And again, pray tell, how does Yacob plan to enforce this?

Citizenship is not a natural reflection of where one's loyalties lie. There are plenty of people out there who would love to carry a Singapore passport, simply because of the conveniences that come with it. Conversely, there are those who were born and bred here, but who feel nothing for the country and would take flight at the slightest opportunity.

If you ask me, this issue isn't one of loyalties. It's a battle between the haves and the have-nots. With public policy seemingly on a downward trend, people are naturally aghast that the millionaire ministers and their brood have the option of taking refuge in another country, when majority of "sinkie peasants" will never have such recourse available to them. Moreover, the anger isn't just directed at the ministers alone. A lot of overseas Singaporeans are similarly accused of taking the easy way out, and choosing to jump ship instead of staying behind to fight the good fight.

Loyalty to nation, IMHO, shouldn't just be restricted to the color of one's passport, or to whether one chooses to be a "stayer" or "quitter" (to quote the Great Emeritus SM Goh Chok Tong). It is hardly a sign of progress - in this highly globalized world - if we chose to view ourselves and our options so narrowly.

 

[ssrrvv11]

The difference is CSM openly let people know, while the latter are known only when wikileed expose the stuff.

Don't bother explaining to hardcore pap dogs. Just woof woof to them ok already.

 

[Alamaking]

It's a fair comment, if Yaacob dares to commit that his son is doing NS, it's a big contrast with one that haven't. CSM could just as easily came out and declared the same. If we expect our the sons of our ruling party to be doing NS shouldn't we expect the same about the opposition? Would U still respect the opposition if all their sons and daughters run road overseas?

I dun agree with you at all, Yacoob hold the Minister of Information, Communications and the Arts position, while CSM is just an opp MP, CSM no need to answerable to anyone at all. Yacoob is stupid and selfish to decide the fate for his son. I would let my son decide his own fate.

 

[HedgeTrader]

I dun agree with you at all, Yacoob hold the Minister of Information, Communications and the Arts position, while CSM is just an opp MP, CSM no need to answerable to anyone at all. Yacoob is stupid and selfish to decide the fate for his son. I would let my son decide his own fate.

I agree and lets be honest to ourselves. Heaven above and hell below. If I have a son and have the money and opportunity for him to run, I'll tell my son to take the money and run as far as he can dont come back.

 

[bullfrog]

Blurfucks like Davian continue to talk about Yaacob's sons doing NS.

The elephant in the room is his wife being an American citizen and continuing to hold a foreign citizenship. Why can't Yaacob convince her to renounce her US citizenship and become a whole spirited Singapore citizen so as to set a good example of leaders who will stay behind when the chips are down and not abandon ship? The question is whether he intends to use his wife's passport to US as an escape route if S'pore goes down.

CSM does not have such a conundrum. He is far more exemplary in his loyalty.

 

[Checker]

Loyalty to nation, IMHO, shouldn't just be restricted to the color of one's passport, or to whether one chooses to be a "stayer" or "quitter" (to quote the Great Emeritus SM Goh Chok Tong). It is hardly a sign of progress - in this highly globalized world - if we chose to view ourselves and our options so narrowly.

Agree. Expats are often a highly valuable source of talent and influence in this globalized world. The Israeli/ Taiwanese and other expat groups, for example, lobbied hard in the US for the benefit of their motherland. Many returned to fight / work in their homelands, bringing expertise and other allies.

And BTW, CSM's wife is a US-citizen also. He's come back to serve, and supposedly brings with him a new brand of expertise not found in govt-scholars/ministers.

 

[red amoeba]

I'm afraid I have to respectfully disagree with the Facebook user, and some of the comments posted here.

Personally, I was impressed by Chen Show Mao's response to queries about his son. He is only being truthful when stating that he will leave the decision on whether or not to serve NS to the boy. To say that he will ensure his son fulfils those NS obligations smacks of scoring political points. How can you reasonably expect him to enforce something like that, anyway? Tie the boy up and drag him to Tekong? Threaten to disown him if he doesn't serve NS?

Conversely, while I appreciate Yacob's clarification, I think he might have just been overcompensating that little bit for the embarrassment of being outed by Wikileaks. What choice does he have, but to insist that his boys will pay their debts to the nation? More so after the Patrick Tan debacle, coupled with the all-time low public opinion against the PAP. And again, pray tell, how does Yacob plan to enforce this?

Citizenship is not a natural reflection of where one's loyalties lie. There are plenty of people out there who would love to carry a Singapore passport, simply because of the conveniences that come with it. Conversely, there are those who were born and bred here, but who feel nothing for the country and would take flight at the slightest opportunity.

If you ask me, this issue isn't one of loyalties. It's a battle between the haves and the have-nots. With public policy seemingly on a downward trend, people are naturally aghast that the millionaire ministers and their brood have the option of taking refuge in another country, when majority of "sinkie peasants" will never have such recourse available to them. Moreover, the anger isn't just directed at the ministers alone. A lot of overseas Singaporeans are similarly accused of taking the easy way out, and choosing to jump ship instead of staying behind to fight the good fight.

Loyalty to nation, IMHO, shouldn't just be restricted to the color of one's passport, or to whether one chooses to be a "stayer" or "quitter" (to quote the Great Emeritus SM Goh Chok Tong). It is hardly a sign of progress - in this highly globalized world - if we chose to view ourselves and our options so narrowly.

u signed up to reply to this post? or r u one of the clones?

anyways...PAP always claim themselves to be pure, honest, uncorrupted, etc. As the government (yes, they are the government), their behaviour & actions are magnified 10x more than any one else...if on one hand, PAP or the government is waving the banner to say - hey be cohesive, stand united and come together be Singaporeans...the other side, you have your kids having dual citizenship...what msg are you trying to get across?

suppose wikileak dun reveal this, Yaccob's children will continue like this and then have the option of dropping one citizenship for the other. Yes, now he being revealed, he has only one answer to give - which will be in line with party whip. the question is, why din he do it earlier? Why must he wait till he was revealed? He shld automatically inculcate these values already to his children / or make the decision for them.

Just because they are public figure, they ought to conduct themselves much higher than the rest of us - this is the price to pay for being a politican, the price to pay for being a highly paid government. All the more PAP who are proud of their clean and above all conduct.

 

[Annoyed]

I have been following this forum for some time now, but have never felt the need to post until recently. I have one other response in the Glenda Han thread. I am most certainly not a clone, although you are at your discretion whether or not to believe me.

The point I was trying to make - which may not have come across as clearly as I hoped - is that Yacob's promise of this sons fulfiling their NS obligations is simply a PR thing, and not necessarily a demonstration of his loyalty to this country (as opposed to Chen Show Mao's or anybody else's). To have said otherwise is tantamount to committing political suicide, simply because the rest of us will be compelled to ask the same question you did, ie. What message are you trying to get across? Of course, I am not here to question Yacob's loyalties. I am merely saying that you can't draw simplistic conclusions, as the Pro-PAP Facebook User whose post is the subject of this thread, seems to have done.

I used the term "overcompensating" because to me, Yacob had to come clean on the citizenship status of his children, which had been kept out of the public eye until Wikileaks came along. More than that, he needed to "appease" an already-upset electorate, and the only way to do so is to promise, on his children's behalf, that they absolutely WILL take on Singapore citizenship like the rest of us. Of course, having heard him say that, the question we should be asking is "how does he intend to enforce it?" But I don't suppose the public will care. They just want to hear what they want to hear.

I can agree with the "inculcating of values" part, but not the "decision-making on their behalf" part. Simply because I believe that everybody - including Yacob's children - should be allowed to decide what they want to do with their own lives. Moreover, these kids are entitled to US citizenships because their mother is an American citizen. If they see more value in holding one, why penalize them just because their father is a public figure from a whiter-than-white party? And while I agree that public figures have to be accountable for their conduct, I don't think the same expectations need to be extended to their children. It's not as if they chose to be born into such families.

u signed up to reply to this post? or r u one of the clones?



if on one hand, PAP or the government is waving the banner to say - hey be cohesive, stand united and come together be Singaporeans...the other side, you have your kids having dual citizenship...what msg are you trying to get across?


suppose wikileak dun reveal this, Yaccob's children will continue like this and then have the option of dropping one citizenship for the other. Yes, now he being revealed, he has only one answer to give - which will be in line with party whip. the question is, why din he do it earlier? Why must he wait till he was revealed?


He shld automatically inculcate these values already to his children / or make the decision for them.

Just because they are public figure, they ought to conduct themselves much higher than the rest of us - this is the price to pay for being a politican, the price to pay for being a highly paid government. All the more PAP who are proud of their clean and above all conduct.

 

[I_Hate_Pappies]

Nabeh cheebye if nobody knows Yakult's situation, you think the motherfucker will come out to say his son will serve NS? This Davian cheebye kia Lee even more funny, want to force others to force their son serve NS. Fucktard!:oIo: