Heartbreaking reaction of bull when he recognizes his feeder

[whoami]

Slitting the throat of an animal and letting it bleed out, as it wriggles in pain from the cut and slowly dies off is not a good way to slaughter. Yes, it may be prescribed in your holy book, but it is an outdated mode of slaughter. I have mentioned in other threads that islam needs to bring its followers to the 21st century. Let's be logical here, wouldn't a head shot be better? Instant death.

I used to kill the fish I catch by delivering a hard and quick blow to its head with a Priest.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Priest_(tool)

Sounds quite legit. But i have no authority on tat. Who knows...maybe next time slaughtering may be done with one shot in the head.

 

[nightsafari]

KLN

Day & Night Safari,

Once again,

My apologies.

no need to apologize. your opinion is to aired. that's what this forum is for. If you're not doing so out of malice, I have no problems even if you don't agree. Always welcome your opinions.

But as mentioned, I do not wish to reflect on my life as someone taking the easy path, but the right path if I can discern it.

 

[nightsafari]

Sounds quite legit. But i have no authority on tat. Who knows...maybe next time slaughtering may be done with one shot in the head.

At the beginning of this thread you were mentioning how Islam is best practice. Now you say who knows. The truth is Islam is no longer best practice. 1400 years ago maybe. If you're still stuck in that time period then that's up to you. There have been many studies done to establish best practice. One of the most intense researchers on this is subject this professor, Temple Grandin

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Temple_Grandin

https://www.grandin.com/welfare/intro.welfare.html

10 minutes of reading will tell you that Islamic practices are behind the times and are definitely NOT in the best welfare of the animal.

In your very 1st post, it is full of contradictions. I now realize why I don't wish to research into Islam further and the reason is this. You mention Islam no contradictions. I've found nothing but contradictons. I realize I just don't wish to fight with you. If you want to learn and improve yourself, by all means we can discuss. But I think for you Islam is perfect and when confronted with contradictions, you would prefer to elak.

One thing I think we both agree on is when we die, we will have to answer for all our actions. All of them. I'm ready to answer for mine. I sincerely hope you don't consider the stance that 1 right thing can wash out 1 wrong thing as you suggested in an earlier post. I don't think god is to be bargained with like at pasar malam.

all the best.

 

[whoami]

At the beginning of this thread you were mentioning how Islam is best practice. Now you say who knows. The truth is Islam is no longer best practice. 1400 years ago maybe. If you're still stuck in that time period then that's up to you. There have been many studies done to establish best practice. One of the most intense researchers on this is subject this professor, Temple Grandin

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Temple_Grandin

https://www.grandin.com/welfare/intro.welfare.html

10 minutes of reading will tell you that Islamic practices are behind the times and are definitely NOT in the best welfare of the animal.

In your very 1st post, it is full of contradictions. I now realize why I don't wish to research into Islam further and the reason is this. You mention Islam no contradictions. I've found nothing but contradictons. I realize I just don't wish to fight with you. If you want to learn and improve yourself, by all means we can discuss. But I think for you Islam is perfect and when confronted with contradictions, you would prefer to elak.

One thing I think we both agree on is when we die, we will have to answer for all our actions. All of them. I'm ready to answer for mine. I sincerely hope you don't consider the stance that 1 right thing can wash out 1 wrong thing as you suggested in an earlier post. I don't think god is to be bargained with like at pasar malam.

all the best.

Ehh....most of ur post i entertained, no? I didnt elak cos at times i notice u no double standard. So worth the time yo discuss with u. Unlike sm keyboard warrior here, so free no life 24/7 badmouthed Islam.

Regardg on slaughterg of animal, i m not a ulama, scholar, mufti to give fatwa. Yes...who knows? Maybe one day stunng of animal maybe halal. Leave it to the religious expert.

Bro, y nid to fight? I cm to tis forum to tcss. Argument last thing on my mind. Wat more fight just to win? Sorry..if ur into fightg i will just ignore u. Discussion boleh. Didnt i tell u several times if i got time i will try my best to answer ur question with regards to Islam. Again i must stress i m still a student, still learng n nvr an expert in islamic studies/jurisdiction. So if my answer doesnt satisfy ur queries, my apology. Ok....so wat contradiction u referrg to? Which part i "elak". Normally i wld try ans all ur questions.But i hope u focus on a particular topic. One at a time.

Btw prophets/messengers been sent by the Almighty since day 1. So happened the last Prophet was fm Saud. All prophets teaches the same message i.e. worship one true God. So nothg wrong if some of the Quranic teachg similar to Torah. So Allah azzawajal is my God. I have found HIM. Have u found ur god?

 

[rushifa666]

Howmany steaks did he become?

 

[nightsafari]

Ehh....most of ur post i entertained, no? I didnt elak cos at times i notice u no double standard. So worth the time yo discuss with u. Unlike sm keyboard warrior here, so free no life 24/7 badmouthed Islam.

Regardg on slaughterg of animal, i m not a ulama, scholar, mufti to give fatwa. Yes...who knows? Maybe one day stunng of animal maybe halal. Leave it to the religious expert.

I will not leave it to some priest to decide how I choose to live my life. If I'm going to eat an animal, I will do my best to ensure that I give it a good death. If you want to hand over your decisions about your life, your family and everything else to those people that's your prerogative. If I'm going to eat an animal that's my problem. I will take responsibility for my own actions. Not pass the buck to an expert priest. That's why I said you're just trying to relieve your guilt and let the priests worry about it.

Bro, y nid to fight? I cm to tis forum to tcss. Argument last thing on my mind. Wat more fight just to win? Sorry..if ur into fightg i will just ignore u. Discussion boleh. Didnt i tell u several times if i got time i will try my best to answer ur question with regards to Islam. Again i must stress i m still a student, still learng n nvr an expert in islamic studies/jurisdiction. So if my answer doesnt satisfy ur queries, my apology. Ok....so wat contradiction u referrg to? Which part i "elak". Normally i wld try ans all ur questions.But i hope u focus on a particular topic. One at a time.

I agree. Betul. one at a time. Let's continue if you willing ok?

Btw prophets/messengers been sent by the Almighty since day 1. So happened the last Prophet was fm Saud. All prophets teaches the same message i.e. worship one true God. So nothg wrong if some of the Quranic teachg similar to Torah. So Allah azzawajal is my God. I have found HIM. Have u found ur god?

I cannot support this statement. There is no way to prove it. Only belief and ownself believe own writings.

Do you really think you've found god? Let me tell what I think after these last few months of thinking. I think you've found Jewish control. It is absolute. America wages war on the Middle East because of Jewish teachings. The Middle East under Islamic flag but really Jewish teachings fights back. China under Jewish teachings starts telling it's people to mistreat others.

All the while, the angmohs are used by Christian(Jewish) to fulfill their goals, Middle Easterners and South Asia used by Islam(Jewish) to fulfill their goals and China and Russia and the other communist countries(Jewish) used to fulfill their goals. Their conquest is absolute. The whole world fighting and killing each other while they laugh all the way to the bank. All led by Jewish, all profits to Jewish while all the deaths and suffering by other people.

Islam like the two other Jewish ideologies sells god, but really what they are offering is Jewish control. Whole of American, Russia, Middle East and China now under this mad control. Now you want to sell Malays into it? I cannot support it.

If you can get mad at America launching at invasion in the Middle East, you can get mad at Islam launching an invasion of Iraq and Syria and you can get mad at China treating other people miserably. I count all three. Why should I have double standard? All guilty. You pick and choose sides is nothing short of hypocrisy. All fueled by Jewish ideas.

So I said as long as this book exists, no one will know peace. Because it is not a book of peace. It is a book of war. This is the biggest contradiction I've found. Mohammed was a man of peace as was Jesus. The religions always start wars.

To be clear, I've nothing against Jewish people. Only this stupid idea of ownership of god. People are people, but lies are lies. I choose to believe in people, not books.

Your choice to sell your family into slavery and idol worship. I've made mine.

 

[whoami]

I will not leave it to some priest to decide how I choose to live my life. If I'm going to eat an animal, I will do my best to ensure that I give it a good death. If you want to hand over your decisions about your life, your family and everything else to those people that's your prerogative. If I'm going to eat an animal that's my problem. I will take responsibility for my own actions. Not pass the buck to an expert priest. That's why I said you're just trying to relieve your guilt and let the priests worry about it.

I agree. Betul. one at a time. Let's continue if you willing ok?

I am following the commandment of the Quran. Most of the ulama in Spore follow the teaching of the Quran. So their advice is valid. U can call it guilt or watever definition. But to Muslim, we have faith in God, HIS book and the Prophet s.a.w.

I cannot support this statement. There is no way to prove it. Only belief and ownself believe own writings.

Do you really think you've found god? Let me tell what I think after these last few months of thinking. I think you've found Jewish control. It is absolute. America wages war on the Middle East because of Jewish teachings. The Middle East under Islamic flag but really Jewish teachings fights back. China under Jewish teachings starts telling it's people to mistreat others.

All the while, the angmohs are used by Christian(Jewish) to fulfill their goals, Middle Easterners and South Asia used by Islam(Jewish) to fulfill their goals and China and Russia and the other communist countries(Jewish) used to fulfill their goals. Their conquest is absolute. The whole world fighting and killing each other while they laugh all the way to the bank. All led by Jewish, all profits to Jewish while all the deaths and suffering by other people.

Islam like the two other Jewish ideologies sells god, but really what they are offering is Jewish control. Whole of American, Russia, Middle East and China now under this mad control. Now you want to sell Malays into it? I cannot support it.

If you can get mad at America launching at invasion in the Middle East, you can get mad at Islam launching an invasion of Iraq and Syria and you can get mad at China treating other people miserably. I count all three. Why should I have double standard? All guilty. You pick and choose sides is nothing short of hypocrisy. All fueled by Jewish ideas.

So I said as long as this book exists, no one will know peace. Because it is not a book of peace. It is a book of war. This is the biggest contradiction I've found. Mohammed was a man of peace as was Jesus. The religions always start wars.

To be clear, I've nothing against Jewish people. Only this stupid idea of ownership of god. People are people, but lies are lies. I choose to believe in people, not books.

Your choice to sell your family into slavery and idol worship. I've made mine.

The Quran is the word of God. U can go check tere were many verses on making peace and only retaliate when being attacked. Beautiful dont u tink so? Only retaliate when provoke with extreme harm to oneself. How can u say its a book of war? Remember its year 1400 and the Prophet was on a mission to spread Islam. One man against so many enemy of Islam. Will u keep quiet when a thief armed with parang charge against u? So no contradiction tere.

 

[nightsafari]

I am following the commandment of the Quran. Most of the ulama in Spore follow the teaching of the Quran. So their advice is valid. U can call it guilt or watever definition. But to Muslim, we have faith in God, HIS book and the Prophet s.a.w.

when the day comes that Allah comes and tells you that, you should believe it, otherwise you are just choosing to believe other people.

The Quran is the word of God. U can go check tere were many verses on making peace and only retaliate when being attacked. Beautiful dont u tink so? Only retaliate when provoke with extreme harm to oneself. How can u say its a book of war? Remember its year 1400 and the Prophet was on a mission to spread Islam. One man against so many enemy of Islam. Will u keep quiet when a thief armed with parang charge against u? So no contradiction tere.

as above. Who was ISIS retaliating against? Women and children who fought back to keep from being raped? Not even 1 week ago, Muslims attacking people Paris who were sitting and minding their own business. Retaliating against who? If you understand the concept of jihad as the priests explain it, it need not even include war. Anything goes.

France will 'never give in to Islamist terrorism,' says Macron after policewoman's killing
Issued on: 23/04/2021 - 16:01Modified: 23/04/2021 - 22:08

French police officials stand near a police station in Rambouillet, south-west of Paris, on April 23, 2021, after a woman was stabbed to death in the town. © Bertrand Guay, AFP
Text by:FRANCE 24Follow
|
Video by:Clovis CASALIFollow
15 min
French prosecutors opened a terror inquiry Friday after a police employee was stabbed to death at a station southwest of Paris by a suspected Islamist extremist from Tunisia who was then shot dead by the security forces. Three people have been detained in connection with the attack.


President Emmanuel Macron said France would never give in to "Islamist terrorism" after the attack in Rambouillet, a tranquil commuter town about 60 kilometres (40 miles) from Paris, which revived the trauma of a spate of deadly attacks last year.
France's national anti-terrorism prosecutors said they had opened a terror investigation, also involving the DGSI domestic intelligence service, into the murder of a person holding public authority. Three people from the suspect's "entourage" were detained on Friday, according to a judicial source.
A source close to the inquiry told AFP the attacker shouted "Allahu Akbar" (God is Greatest) during the attack.
Chief anti-terror prosecutor Jean-François Ricard, who spoke outside the station along with Prime Minister Jean Castex, confirmed that "comments made by the assailant" indicated a terror motive, without giving further details.

If you choose to criticize the US and China, equally Islam is not free of criticism. They are all the same system. Change the identity of the people, the race, the colour of their book, but the system is the same. Don't believe me, go and investigate for yourself.

I will happily protest the US should not invade the Middle East and that China should not bully others. But suddenly Islam can do no wrong because some people make up some stories about how it's god's will?

tak mungkin lah...

If you believe so, as long as China believes in Communism it will do the same. They are free of blame because their system tells them it's their right to bully other people because they follow the teachings of communism. America's system tells them they are doing god's will to help the Middle East. Everyone who made the decision to invade was convinced they will be rewarded by Allah for being righteous. What's the difference? As long as you people choose to follow this exclusive ideology, there will always be conflict.

Not more than 2 weeks ago, I spent some talking to an Irani Muslim. He told me he feared for his life. Why? Too successful. You can research someone like him : Behdad Esfahbod. Two Islamic theocracies, Iran and Saudi Arabia. It's citizens live in fear. China the same. You really want to sell your people into Jewish-Arab slavery? Your sons as cannon fodder for Islamic army and your daughters as wives for Islamic army? Like that they win already. That was the purpose of the religion. Go and find god, not heaven insurance salesman from company of only-I-know-god teachings.

I understand the problems Malays face in Singapore. I really dislike it. But turning to Islam is exactly the same as those people who turn to ning how. Exactly the same and for the same reason. Go and investigate with your own eyes lah. Don't just believe 1 person whether me or your priests. Those ning how irritate you, is exactly the same as how Islam and it's practices exclude other people and create friction. Instead of bringing people together like Mohammed, Islam is driving people against each other. It is not Mohammed's teaching. This is so basic and so opposite how to reconcile Mohammed and Islam. Like two opposites. Spend 10 minutes thinking about it and it will become apparent to anybody that the religion and Mohammed's teachings opposite.

If you can criticize ning how which I understand and agree, demanding people serve only halal is the same thing you are protesting against.

 

[whoami]

when the day comes that Allah comes and tells you that, you should believe it, otherwise you are just choosing to believe other people.

I spoke to Allah everyday/nite. HE also speaks to me every day/nite. I am never tired of the conversation we had.

as above. Who was ISIS retaliating against? Women and children who fought back to keep from being raped? Not even 1 week ago, Muslims attacking people Paris who were sitting and minding their own business. Retaliating against who? If you understand the concept of jihad as the priests explain it, it need not even include war. Anything goes..

Hmm...l hope u dont go dug out such info fm most anti-Islamic xtian propaganda website. I would rather u read the Quran and spar with me on the verses mentioned. ISIS is a product of US/Israel. U can chose not to believe. As for ISIS teaching, does the main stream Muslims support ISIS? U guys, just like the media, like to pick up crimes committed by some Muslim or individual. Then blame it entirely on Islam/Quran with the same brush. C'mon lah. Muslim population is 1.9 Billion. Bound to have rotten apples, no? I had mentioned many many times. Bombing here and tere by individual once a while i would not be surprised. Look at the damaged US and western allies did to ME. Million of orphans. Rambut hitam hati lain. I cant read their feelings but i can understand their anguish in them. Just imagine their whole family being massacred by xtians US! Although i dont agree with wat they did but it has nothing to do with Islam. I am talking to u now and the killing still going on in Syria, Afghanistan and civil war in other parts of ME.

If you choose to criticize the US and China, equally Islam is not free of criticism. They are all the same system. Change the identity of the people, the race, the colour of their book, but the system is the same. Don't believe me, go and investigate for yourself.

I will happily protest the US should not invade the Middle East and that China should not bully others. But suddenly Islam can do no wrong because some people make up some stories about how it's god's will?

tak mungkin lah...

If you believe so, as long as China believes in Communism it will do the same. They are free of blame because their system tells them it's their right to bully other people because they follow the teachings of communism. America's system tells them they are doing god's will to help the Middle East. Everyone who made the decision to invade was convinced they will be rewarded by Allah for being righteous. What's the difference? As long as you people choose to follow this exclusive ideology, there will always be conflict.

Not more than 2 weeks ago, I spent some talking to an Irani Muslim. He told me he feared for his life. Why? Too successful. You can research someone like him : Behdad Esfahbod. Two Islamic theocracies, Iran and Saudi Arabia. It's citizens live in fear. China the same. You really want to sell your people into Jewish-Arab slavery? Your sons as cannon fodder for Islamic army and your daughters as wives for Islamic army? Like that they win already. That was the purpose of the religion. Go and find god, not heaven insurance salesman from company of only-I-know-god teachings.

I understand the problems Malays face in Singapore. I really dislike it. But turning to Islam is exactly the same as those people who turn to ning how. Exactly the same and for the same reason. Go and investigate with your own eyes lah. Don't just believe 1 person whether me or your priests. Those ning how irritate you, is exactly the same as how Islam and it's practices exclude other people and create friction. Instead of bringing people together like Mohammed, Islam is driving people against each other. It is not Mohammed's teaching. This is so basic and so opposite how to reconcile Mohammed and Islam. Like two opposites. Spend 10 minutes thinking about it and it will become apparent to anybody that the religion and Mohammed's teachings opposite.

If you can criticize ning how which I understand and agree, demanding people serve only halal is the same thing you are protesting against.

I dont agree Islam same system as communism. Quran is the word of God. The rest are not. Quote me some verses fm the Quran to prove ur point. Remember one cant judge the Quran simply by the performance of the Muslims. Not all race/ Muslim are perfect. And u are contradicting urself. U said the Prophet, pbuh, brought people together but Islam is against each other? Allah, Prophet, Quran, Islam....semua sama. But the followers can differ. Some good, some hypocrites.

Alamak. I tot we focus one at at time. Now u talk about Halal. We dont demand. If we feel teres no halal food, we simly wont patronise tat stall. Just like some hindu and buddhist who stay away fm beef. Some totally stay away fm meat.

Btw wat is "ning"?

 

[nightsafari]

I spoke to Allah everyday/nite. HE also speaks to me every day/nite. I am never tired of the conversation we had.

and I'm happy to for you.

Hmm...l hope u dont go dug out such info fm most anti-Islamic xtian propaganda website.

why would I dig out hateful crap? Anti-Islamic Christian hate is the same as anti-Christian Islamic hate. Both crap. Many other varieties.

I would rather u read the Quran and spar with me on the verses mentioned.

I would rather not. All I foresee is making you unhappy and/or me frustrated. I am not here to make you unhappy. But neither will I sit quietly and allow lies to pass unchallenged.

ISIS is a product of US/Israel. U can chose not to believe. As for ISIS teaching, does the main stream Muslims support ISIS? U guys, just like the media, like to pick up crimes committed by some Muslim or individual. Then blame it entirely on Islam/Quran with the same brush. C'mon lah. Muslim population is 1.9 Billion. Bound to have rotten apples, no?

right and wrong. The people committing the crimes claim Islam as inspiration. Allahu Akhbar they always shout. You boleh tahan meh someone say like that? I will find out the cause if I am part of that religion. If need be, I will try to convince those of my religion not to follow. Day and night I will do it if I belong to it. Instead, you say cannot blame. Senang sahja. Wrong lah. Can blame. Find out the reason and dig it out. Not tutup mata, telinga, mulut. Someone or someone is causing those people to say Allahu akhbar and attack other people. Tell me how many often do you hear of other religions leaving their country and going overseas to join holy war in 2020?

I had mentioned many many times. Bombing here and tere by individual once a while i would not be surprised. Look at the damaged US and western allies did to ME. Million of orphans. Rambut hitam hati lain. I cant read their feelings but i can understand their anguish in them. Just imagine their whole family being massacred by xtians US! Although i dont agree with wat they did but it has nothing to do with Islam. I am talking to u now and the killing still going on in Syria, Afghanistan and civil war in other parts of ME.

I have imagined and as I've said before that is wrong and I've fought people until they don't want to talk to me. I don't care. If they want to support wholesale invasion, it is wrong and I will speak out. But how can you say that is wrong and then turn a blind eye when people from your own group do something wrong? Equally they can say you cannot be mad against Christians in the US because most protested against the war.

Yet here you are, complaining about what the US did, but if a person does it in the name of Islam, it's not Islam's fault. Mana boleh... This kind of one-sided thinking is why the world has so much shit.

I dont agree Islam same system as communism. Quran is the word of God. The rest are not. Quote me some verses fm the Quran to prove ur point. Remember one cant judge the Quran simply by the performance of the Muslims. Not all race/ Muslim are perfect.

Who says Quran is the word of god? god? please tell me. we can continue this part when you do.

And u are contradicting urself. U said the Prophet, pbuh, brought people together but Islam is against each other? Allah, Prophet, Quran, Islam....semua sama. But the followers can differ. Some good, some hypocrites.

oh really? this is the simplest thing to prove. Mohammed is a person who says he is not the prophet of god. His wife says he is, but he says he's not. Already husband and wife contradicting.

You say he is the same as a religion and a book. Is he a book? No, he's a person. The Quran is not a person and a person is not a religion and neither are books.

Are you a religion or a book? Mana ada sama?

Alamak. I tot we focus one at at time. Now u talk about Halal. We dont demand. If we feel teres no halal food, we simly wont patronise tat stall. Just like some hindu and buddhist who stay away fm beef. Some totally stay away fm meat.

this thread is about treating bulls. It's the original topic. Those hindus and buddhists can do what they want. Because they are not mistreating the animal, I have nothing to say. They can believe whatever they want. Then you posted and said Islamic slaughter is good for animals. That is no longer true. As I've said before, if you wish to present untruths, I will not sit quietly. simple only.

Btw wat is "ning"?

You remember telling me about people answering the telephone in your office?

 

[whoami]

and I'm happy to for you.


why would I dig out hateful crap? Anti-Islamic Christian hate is the same as anti-Christian Islamic hate. Both crap. Many other varieties.

I would rather not. All I foresee is making you unhappy and/or me frustrated. I am not here to make you unhappy. But neither will I sit quietly and allow lies to pass unchallenged.

Lies? Plse show proof fm the Quran?

right and wrong. The people committing the crimes claim Islam as inspiration. Allahu Akhbar they always shout. You boleh tahan meh someone say like that? I will find out the cause if I am part of that religion. If need be, I will try to convince those of my religion not to follow. Day and night I will do it if I belong to it. Instead, you say cannot blame. Senang sahja. Wrong lah. Can blame. Find out the reason and dig it out. Not tutup mata, telinga, mulut. Someone or someone is causing those people to say Allahu akhbar and attack other people. Tell me how many often do you hear of other religions leaving their country and going overseas to join holy war in 2020?

Just cos he invoked name of Allah, tat means they are doing the right thing? Hey, even bomoh doing evil deed also involve God name. So how? Is it acceptable by majority Muslims? No of course. And again i must ask u. Is tat how u view Islam when a very small faction of Muslims committed evil deed and u paint the same brush on the rest of the 1.9billion Muslims? U should be asking urself did majority Muslims supported, such as ISIS. I happen to google for ISIS strength. 30,000 in strength and u say they represent 1.9 billion Muslims? I am really disappointed with ur narrow view on Islam. I used to respect u. With ur intelligence I love to discuss on any matters pertaining to Islam. However, past couple of ur post had cast some doubt. Now ur are thinking and talking the same wavelength as the_hypocrite, john tan, duluxe, devil within, laksaboy.....wah long list. But is ok with me. This type of echo chambers..once i get tired of it i will just ignore them. Just hope along the way we still can discuss intelligently.

If u attend Friday sermon, then u will understand. Who told u MUIS not doing anything abt terrorism? U never seen banner hanging outside the Masjid condemning terrorism? Open ur eyes lah. U go to MUIS FB. At times u will see discussion of such. And i have yet to read any comment tat support terrorism/ISIS. As for some joining "holy" war, i would say they were being brainwashed. Again how many actually join ISIS? Wheres the stat? Why are they doing such? Before US caused mayhem at Iraq, Iran, Egypt, Lybia, Syria, Afghanistan....u heard of muslims joining "holy" war? U should be asking who causing all these shits. Cause and effect. If teres no mayhem at ME there wont be ISIS

A Defense Department inspector general report puts the number of ISIS members in Iraq and Syria as high as 30,000.

I have imagined and as I've said before that is wrong and I've fought people until they don't want to talk to me. I don't care. If they want to support wholesale invasion, it is wrong and I will speak out. But how can you say that is wrong and then turn a blind eye when people from your own group do something wrong? Equally they can say you cannot be mad against Christians in the US because most protested against the war.

View attachment 109632

Yet here you are, complaining about what the US did, but if a person does it in the name of Islam, it's not Islam's fault. Mana boleh... This kind of one-sided thinking is why the world has so much shit.

Didnt i tell u i dont support terrorism? I mana ada turn a blind eye. I am just telling u the cause and effect fm those mass killing in ME caused by US and western allies. Ok. good they protested against the war. But the culprit go scot free? Millions were killed by lies. Of course, u will still blame Muslims. Cos media protrayed such. Look at ur above post. US protest against the war. But do u see any photos on mass slaughtering of innocents at Palestine, Iraq, Iran, Lybia, Egypt, Syria, Afghanistan? No!

Who says Quran is the word of god? god? please tell me. we can continue this part when you do.

1.9 billion Muslims. NP. We can discuss on this alone. We been doing tat on many occasion. Even thru PM. Looks like going in circle again.

oh really? this is the simplest thing to prove. Mohammed is a person who says he is not the prophet of god. His wife says he is, but he says he's not. Already husband and wife contradicting.

You say he is the same as a religion and a book. Is he a book? No, he's a person. The Quran is not a person and a person is not a religion and neither are books.

Are you a religion or a book? Mana ada sama?

The Quran is not about wat Muhammad pbuh says abt anything. Muhammad pbuh is supposed to be reporting wat Allah s.w.t. says....and Allah s.w.t says tat Muhammad pbuh, is His Prophet. The Quran testifies Muhammad pbuh as the prophet! If u dont study the Quran, that means u only know half truth about Islam i.e. fm social media. Mcam mana nak discuss intelligently?

"Allah (swt) sent us Muhammad (s.a.w.) as the prophet at a time when we knew nothing. Whatever we saw Muhammad do, we do the same, in the same way." (al-Nasa`i, Taqsir 1)

Yes. Allah s.w.t., Prophet pbuh, Quran, Islam. Semua r related one another. So u contradicted urself by saying the Prophet bind people together whereas Islam divide people. I may be fastg but i can tink n know wat i m writg. Hope u r sober.

this thread is about treating bulls. It's the original topic. Those hindus and buddhists can do what they want. Because they are not mistreating the animal, I have nothing to say. They can believe whatever they want. Then you posted and said Islamic slaughter is good for animals. That is no longer true. As I've said before, if you wish to present untruths, I will not sit quietly. simple only.

You remember telling me about people answering the telephone in your office?

OK. Whether is true or othewise, we leave it as it is. We already show our proof. At this junction, i would give u my humble advice. Stay away fm Malay/halal food. It does u no good as it would prick ur conscience.

As to why ur kind reacted such. I can simply said due to ignorant and also no thanks to social media. When a muslim committed a crime, all over the world broadcasted 24/7 for several days. But when a non Muslim committed same, they only broadcasted it a single day with small caption. Islamophobia!

 

[nightsafari]

Lies? Plse show proof fm the Quran?

proof from fiction is not proof.

Just cos he invoked name of Allah, tat means they are doing the right thing? Hey, even bomoh doing evil deed also involve God name. So how? Is it acceptable by majority Muslims? No of course. And again i must ask u. Is tat how u view Islam when a very small faction of Muslims committed evil deed and u paint the same brush on the rest of the 1.9billion Muslims? U should be asking urself did majority Muslims supported, such as ISIS. I happen to google for ISIS strength. 30,000 in strength and u say they represent 1.9 billion Muslims? I am really disappointed with ur narrow view on Islam. I used to respect u. With ur intelligence I love to discuss on any matters pertaining to Islam. However, past couple of ur post had cast some doubt. Now ur are thinking and talking the same wavelength as the_hypocrite, john tan, duluxe, devil within, laksaboy.....wah long list. But is ok with me. This type of echo chambers..once i get tired of it i will just ignore them. Just hope along the way we still can discuss intelligently

If u attend Friday sermon, then u will understand. Who told u MUIS not doing anything abt terrorism? U never seen banner hanging outside the Masjid condemning terrorism? Open ur eyes lah. U go to MUIS FB. At times u will see discussion of such. And i have yet to read any comment tat support terrorism/ISIS. As for some joining "holy" war, i would say they were being brainwashed. Again how many actually join ISIS? Wheres the stat? Why are they doing such? Before US caused mayhem at Iraq, Iran, Egypt, Lybia, Syria, Afghanistan....u heard of muslims joining "holy" war? U should be asking who causing all these shits. Cause and effect. If teres no mayhem at ME there wont be ISIS

A Defense Department inspector general report puts the number of ISIS members in Iraq and Syria as high as 30,000.

It appears that my message is not getting through. Islam is not the same as all Muslims. Muis is not Islam. It is one small little corner of it. If your experience of Islam is Muis, you seriously need to see more of the world before you comment on Islam. And I will say that if the rest of the Islamic world is like Muis you won't have this brainwashing nonsense. But Muis is actually an outlier. In fact, with Pakistani and North African congregations, the brainwashing is the mainstream. NOTHING like Muis. They spend all their religious time inciting hatred.

I have the benefit of Muslims from all over the world telling me their version. The only ones that tend not to talk about it openly are non-ME Muslims. Malays and Pakistanis. Iranis will tell me different versions, I listen to all. Turkish will tell me non-stop day and night whether I ask or not. Egyptians are moderate mainly. I have discussions with them all the time. The other exception is Saudi Arabs. They look down on everyone else and won't talk at all.

You are changing the narrative again. If I disagree with you I am Islamophobic. It seems that you are only concerned with protecting your beliefs and will throw shade on any logic I provide. So what's the point? You are literally hell-bent on advertising Islam even when I have given you ample proof that you are contradicting yourself. I don't wish to pinpoint all the flaws in your arguments because it will lead to unhappiness for you.

Anyone reading your posts on this thread alone will have no problem seeing you change the goalposts every few posts. First it's Islam's ways are the best most humane. When I point out that it's not, you say not up to you, leave it to the priests. Then you mention must give donation to cancel your sins, then when I tell you you still have to answer to god, you tell me I own air.

I am just telling u the cause and effect fm those mass killing in ME caused by US and western allies. Ok. good they protested against the war. But the culprit go scot free? Millions were killed by lies. Of course, u will still blame Muslims. Cos media protrayed such. Look at ur above post. US protest against the war. But do u see any photos on mass slaughtering of innocents at Palestine, Iraq, Iran, Lybia, Egypt, Syria, Afghanistan? No!

and you still miss the point. You can shoot me if you want. I'm only trying to be a messenger. What you mention I don't disagree with. But equally without terrorism, the exact same thing is enacted in Muslim theocracies in Saudia Arabia and Iran. Just change the names and the face and skin colour of the people and the situation is the same. You might as well call me America-phobe at the same time.

1.9 billion Muslims. NP. We can discuss on this alone. We been doing tat on many occasion. Even thru PM. Looks like going in circle again.

Yeah going in circle because you won't answer a direct question with a direct answer. Sidestep and kick up a new fuss. Talk plainly and straight. I will answer for my actions here. So will you.

The Quran is not about wat Muhammad pbuh says abt anything. Muhammad pbuh is supposed to be reporting wat Allah s.w.t. says....and Allah s.w.t says tat Muhammad pbuh, is His Prophet. The Quran testifies Muhammad pbuh as the prophet! If u dont study the Quran, that means u only know half truth about Islam i.e. fm social media. Mcam mana nak discuss intelligently?

good grief. Have you even tried thinking carefully about your above statement? Talk about going in circles. You have just provided a very good example of contradictions and "circulus in probando". Circular reasoning.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Circular_reasoning

If you cannot see the flaws in what you wrote, then nothing I point out to you is of any benefit. I am only trying to benefit you. If I you wish to believe in what you wish, so be it. As we both agree 100%, we will answer to god when we die.

So let me get straight to the punchline ok? You want 100% to believe in Islam without criticisms. Anything given to question the logic, you sidestep, change the topic, change the argument, pass the responsibility, call people names.

I tell you that Islamic slaughter is not the most humane way, you want to upgrade me to hating Malay food Islamophobic. Instead of you noting my criticisms and digging deeper to do better for the animals, you turn on me instead. Baiklah.

I'm not the one arrogant enough to tell you I know everything. Only that I see falsehoods. That's all I have to offer. If you wish to believe in obvious falsehoods, I only hope that you live well enough to be judged well. You probably already do, but still I still hope everything turns out well for you.

oh. my own opinion is that I'm a bs-phobe. If you bs, I will call it out. I've only pointed out inconsistencies regarding humane slaughter and my opinion of those inconsistencies without passing sweeping judgment on an entire religion. I said that your statements given are false. But you have dragged the rest of your entire religion into the argument all by yourself, and I followed which was my mistake. That's one of the reasons why I say guilty conscience, but maybe for you it's more victim mentality. You can decide for yourself. You are more of an Islamophobe than me by your own actions.

if nothing else, read the lines in bold.

peace be upon you.

 

[whoami]

proof from fiction is not proof.

Watever u say must come with proof? U say u saw spirit? Proof?

It appears that my message is not getting through. Islam is not the same as all Muslims. Muis is not Islam. It is one small little corner of it. If your experience of Islam is Muis, you seriously need to see more of the world before you comment on Islam. And I will say that if the rest of the Islamic world is like Muis you won't have this brainwashing nonsense. But Muis is actually an outlier. In fact, with Pakistani and North African congregations, the brainwashing is the mainstream. NOTHING like Muis. They spend all their religious time inciting hatred.

I have the benefit of Muslims from all over the world telling me their version. The only ones that tend not to talk about it openly are non-ME Muslims. Malays and Pakistanis. Iranis will tell me different versions, I listen to all. Turkish will tell me non-stop day and night whether I ask or not. Egyptians are moderate mainly. I have discussions with them all the time. The other exception is Saudi Arabs. They look down on everyone else and won't talk at all.

I already told u no one is perfect. So are the Muslims. U dont judge Islam by how they practice. Cos of cultural, tradition mixing up with Islam. U want the true Islam, check up the scripture. So u blame Islam simply a Muslim did such and such? So u judge ISIS as true "Muslim"?

You are changing the narrative again. If I disagree with you I am Islamophobic. It seems that you are only concerned with protecting your beliefs and will throw shade on any logic I provide. So what's the point? You are literally hell-bent on advertising Islam even when I have given you ample proof that you are contradicting yourself. I don't wish to pinpoint all the flaws in your arguments because it will lead to unhappiness for you.

U can disagree. NP. But i have to correct u if ur assumption is wrong. Look at ur 1st post i can already say u cant come up with any proof fm the Quran. When i argue with xtians, i show proof from their scripture. Same as with Hindu. Tat should be the way. Oh ya....ur an atheist. But some atheist i know are intelligent. They quoted me verses fm the Quran. Fm there we can have a friendly meaningful dialogue/discussion. Not just say itu fiction, lies blah blah. And when i show proof u simply say 1400yrs ago people already know this and tat but u never show any proof or link. Like tat my 10yr old nephew also can argue ya.

Anyone reading your posts on this thread alone will have no problem seeing you change the goalposts every few posts. First it's Islam's ways are the best most humane. When I point out that it's not, you say not up to you, leave it to the priests. Then you mention must give donation to cancel your sins, then when I tell you you still have to answer to god, you tell me I own air.

U yang change goal post. Talk about bull. Suddenly talk about rape lah. The way u talk now is not the same nightsafari i know before. Of course leave it to ulama or MUIS lah. They handle islamic matters and as Muslim i have to abide by their fatwa. How can u be so naive? Yes, giving donations and helping the poor one of the many ways to clear our sins. Of course i am speaking with a Muslim. He will undestand wat i mean. And yes, we still have to answer to God. U tink so simple...just give charity and all is forgiven? But u an unbeliever will never understand cos u dont read the Quran. But remember u came to this world naked and bathed by others. Same sop when u kick the bucket. The only difference is initially u will be subjected to torture in the grave. Come judgement day blazing fire waiting for the unbelievers. Oh ya....fiction to u. Say tat when u face the Creator.

and you still miss the point. You can shoot me if you want. I'm only trying to be a messenger. What you mention I don't disagree with. But equally without terrorism, the exact same thing is enacted in Muslim theocracies in Saudia Arabia and Iran. Just change the names and the face and skin colour of the people and the situation is the same. You might as well call me America-phobe at the same time.
Yeah going in circle because you won't answer a direct question with a direct answer. Sidestep and kick up a new fuss. Talk plainly and straight. I will answer for my actions here. So will you.

I already gave u straight forward answer. U keep saying Saud lah, Iran blah blah. Committed this and tat. Now i ask u plain and simple. Are u perfect. Tell me?

good grief. Have you even tried thinking carefully about your above statement? Talk about going in circles.

You have just provided a very good example of contradictions and "circulus in probando". Circular reasoning.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Circular_reasoning

If you cannot see the flaws in what you wrote, then nothing I point out to you is of any benefit. I am only trying to benefit you. If I you wish to believe in what you wish, so be it. As we both agree 100%, we will answer to god when we die.

So let me get straight to the punchline ok? You want 100% to believe in Islam without criticisms. Anything given to question the logic, you sidestep, change the topic, change the argument, pass the responsibility, call people names.

I tell you that Islamic slaughter is not the most humane way, you want to upgrade me to hating Malay food Islamophobic. Instead of you noting my criticisms and digging deeper to do better for the animals, you turn on me instead. Baiklah.

Wat contradiction? Name me. But one at a time. U can criticise Islam. But u must show me proof fm the Quran. But u simple say is fiction. Like tat wat kind of discussion is tat? U reminded me of Syed. He said teres no Muhammad name, no mention of Masjid in the Quran.

Aiyoh. Abt islamic slaughter again. Tis is the main topic tat pissed u off. I am well aware. Since u think its very barbaric, then i advise u refrain fm taking halal food cos its against ur principal right? Anything wrong with my advice? Wat name did i call u? Just like recently i discovered Indian product mixed with cow dung and urine. So i decided to boycott their product. No more curry powder fm hindu stall. Tats my principle. Nothing to do with race/religion. I will still buy papers fm their shop though.

I'm not the one arrogant enough to tell you I know everything. Only that I see falsehoods. That's all I have to offer. If you wish to believe in obvious falsehoods, I only hope that you live well enough to be judged well. You probably already do, but still I still hope everything turns out well for you.

First fiction. Then falsehood. Bro, proof proof proof fm the Quran. Tats God words. Show proof. Otherwise we are wasting our time. But i will respect u and ur religion.

oh. my own opinion is that I'm a bs-phobe. If you bs, I will call it out. I've only pointed out inconsistencies regarding humane slaughter and my opinion of those inconsistencies without passing sweeping judgment on an entire religion. I said that your statements given are false. But you have dragged the rest of your entire religion into the argument all by yourself, and I followed which was my mistake. That's one of the reasons why I say guilty conscience, but maybe for you it's more victim mentality. You can decide for yourself. You are more of an Islamophobe than me by your own actions.

if nothing else, read the lines in bold.

peace be upon you.

Halal slaughtering again. Dah. I ready replied earlier post. U can disagree with the link. Its ok. But now u insist its false. When slaughtering, we have faith. We uttered Basmallah. Heres another link. Watch 5.10...see how submissive the goat was? Total submission to Allah s.w.t. No camera trick ya. Hope the vid doesnt irk u. Just wish to show u how peaceful and willing was the animal. Tats exactly wat a true practicing Muslim would do to a goat before slaughtering them In the Name of Allah s.w.t..



See. U contradicting urself again. Bold in red. U just said the Quran is fiction. Falsehood, no? Tat means entire religion i.e. Islam. Now u turn around and ask me to read in bold black. Aiyoh. U make a good businessman. Guilty conscience, me? Which part do i sound i am guilty? Islamophobia is u. By quoting ISIS, only with 30K members, u are telling us tat is the true Islam. Even say am i ready to sacrifice daughter blah blah blah. Wat nonsense u are talking? 1.9 billion rejected ISIS which is a product of US/Israel and a terrorist group. And here u kip telling us (directly or indirectly) tats Islam. But when asked to show proof, all u can say is Quran is fiction and falshood. Oh ya...i may add in. U claimed Quran is a book of war. Hahaha...Proof proof. Rem, 1400 yrs ago. Now is 2021. Hope u understand wat i mean. So, show proof proof. One at a time.

Peace be to u too

 

[waitifcuk]

and I'm happy to for you.

You remember telling me about people answering the telephone in your office?

KLN

Day & Night Safari

I still catch no bola on "NING".

 

[waitifcuk]

W

Peace be to u too

alayhi as-salām


Correct?

 

[whoami]

alayhi as-salām


Correct?

Replied with ....Wa'alaikum Asalam.

 

[whoami]

KLN

Day & Night Safari

I still catch no bola on "NING".

Oh. Tis "ning how" is hw my Msian cheena reply when answerg office phone call. Hardcore chicom supporter my Msian cheena staffs.

 

[glockman]

Sounds quite legit. But i have no authority on tat. Who knows...maybe next time slaughtering may be done with one shot in the head.

At the beginning of this thread you were mentioning how Islam is best practice. Now you say who knows. The truth is Islam is no longer best practice. 1400 years ago maybe. If you're still stuck in that time period then that's up to you. There have been many studies done to establish best practice. One of the most intense researchers on this is subject this professor, Temple Grandin

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Temple_Grandin

https://www.grandin.com/welfare/intro.welfare.html

10 minutes of reading will tell you that Islamic practices are behind the times and are definitely NOT in the best welfare of the animal.

In your very 1st post, it is full of contradictions. I now realize why I don't wish to research into Islam further and the reason is this. You mention Islam no contradictions. I've found nothing but contradictons. I realize I just don't wish to fight with you. If you want to learn and improve yourself, by all means we can discuss. But I think for you Islam is perfect and when confronted with contradictions, you would prefer to elak.

One thing I think we both agree on is when we die, we will have to answer for all our actions. All of them. I'm ready to answer for mine. I sincerely hope you don't consider the stance that 1 right thing can wash out 1 wrong thing as you suggested in an earlier post. I don't think god is to be bargained with like at pasar malam.

all the best.

I chanced upon this video, and remember our discussion on the humane slaughtering of sheep. This is a good example.

 

[zhihau]

I kena stunned like vegetables...