Dr Mahathir : Democracy has its limits

[RonRon]

PETALING JAYA, Malaysia - Democracy can only work when people understand its limitations, former prime minister Tun Dr Mahathir Mohamad said.

"When people think only of the freedom that democracy brings and know nothing of the implied responsibilities, democracy will not bring the benefits it promises.

"Instead, it will only result in instability, which will not allow development to take place," Dr Mahathir said in a speech delivered at the University Santo Tomas's special convocation in Manila yesterday.

Dr Mahathir was relating what he had observed in Malaysia and other countries, particularly the new democracies, which he said had desperately tried to practise democracy only to receive negative results.

"One of these countries has been unable to progress because of too much democracy," he added. "No sooner is a government elected when the losers would hold demonstrations and general strikes accusing the government of malpractice.

"The government has to deal with these disruptions and neglect the work of governing it is expected to carry out."

These disruptions could be so serious to cause the new government to resign, Dr Mahathir said, which caused new elections to be held only to end with the same results.

"Why has democracy not delivered the good life we had expected of it?" Dr Mahathir asked. "Simply put, it is impossible for the people to rule themselves. There are too many of them and they cannot agree on anything.

"Government of the people, by the people and for the people will result in a stalemate, in no government at all, in anarchy."

"So what do we do?" Dr Mahathir asked. "Do we accept the failures of democracy, or do we make some adjustments and sacrifice some of the liberalism of democracy so we may extract something from the system?"

"I will admit freely that Malaysia is not a liberal democracy," he said. "We see democracy principally as providing an easy way' to change governments.

"No revolution, no civil war, no Arab spring. Just vote and the government will be brought down or re-elected according to the wishes of the people."

Dr Mahathir said that in Malaysia, the candidates of Opposition parties could win, and had captured many of the state governments.

Clearly, if the people so wished, he added, they could overthrow the ruling party under the present election system.

 

[BuriramUnitedFC]

democracy hinders decision making

 

[Cruxx]

democracy hinders decision making

Agree. Look at how decisive non-democracy is:

[video=youtube;naK9gf_X85g]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=naK9gf_X85g[/video]

 

[steffychun]

Mahathir has long been criticised by the West by taking this stance. On the contrary, Lee took the same view but the West kowtowed to him.

 

[Grago]

PETALING JAYA, Malaysia - Democracy can only work when people understand its limitations, former prime minister Tun Dr Mahathir Mohamad said.

"When people think only of the freedom that democracy brings and know nothing of the implied responsibilities, democracy will not bring the benefits it promises.

"Instead, it will only result in instability, which will not allow development to take place," Dr Mahathir said in a speech delivered at the University Santo Tomas's special convocation in Manila yesterday.

Dr Mahathir was relating what he had observed in Malaysia and other countries, particularly the new democracies, which he said had desperately tried to practise democracy only to receive negative results.

"One of these countries has been unable to progress because of too much democracy," he added. "No sooner is a government elected when the losers would hold demonstrations and general strikes accusing the government of malpractice.

"The government has to deal with these disruptions and neglect the work of governing it is expected to carry out."

These disruptions could be so serious to cause the new government to resign, Dr Mahathir said, which caused new elections to be held only to end with the same results.

"Why has democracy not delivered the good life we had expected of it?" Dr Mahathir asked. "Simply put, it is impossible for the people to rule themselves. There are too many of them and they cannot agree on anything.

"Government of the people, by the people and for the people will result in a stalemate, in no government at all, in anarchy."

"So what do we do?" Dr Mahathir asked. "Do we accept the failures of democracy, or do we make some adjustments and sacrifice some of the liberalism of democracy so we may extract something from the system?"

"I will admit freely that Malaysia is not a liberal democracy," he said. "We see democracy principally as providing an easy way' to change governments.

"No revolution, no civil war, no Arab spring. Just vote and the government will be brought down or re-elected according to the wishes of the people."

Dr Mahathir said that in Malaysia, the candidates of Opposition parties could win, and had captured many of the state governments.

Clearly, if the people so wished, he added, they could overthrow the ruling party under the present election system.

No truer words spoken.

Down size to the family unit, would you allow your child to tell you what they would like you to do rather then you being the parent, guiding them to do the right things!!!!!

 

[Cruxx]

No truer words spoken.

Down size to the family unit, would you allow your child to tell you what they would like you to do rather then you being the parent, guiding them to do the right things!!!!!

Downsize to the family unit, would you allow your father to tell you what he would like you to do rather than you making your own decisions in life?

 

[Cruxx]

Mahathir has long been criticised by the West by taking this stance. On the contrary, Lee took the same view but the West kowtowed to him.

There's a distinction between the two countries that they led after all. Malaysia is a corrupt, developing country. Singapore, on the contrary, is a modern, prosperous money laundering hub.

 

[Grago]

Downsize to the family unit, would you allow your father to tell you what he would like you to do rather than you making your own decisions in life?

While I live under his roof, his rules. I have my own roof now and own children, MY Rules....
I have until now having left his house, done pretty OK. I have seen my childhood friends who have had very "understanding" parents die off drug overdose, drink and Carousing and generally behaving as if they did not responsibilities to the point that the family struggles to make ends meet. Trying to console parents of friends who have "left the path". what do you tell them when they tell you "why can't he be a bit like you".......
Expand that, do you think you would have done equally as well as Dr. M, given the opportunity. This may sound like an unfair question, But what I'm trying to point out, is basically most of us were brought up responsibly by our parents, some not so, and if you let everyone to do their own "thing" there will be chaos.
The dream of "Democracy" is just an ideal dream. Look at the Easten Bloc, former Soviet Union and Middle East. The so called "Quest for Democracy" has degenerated into atrocities and blood shed. Would you like to see that here in Singapore for the sake of DEMOCRACY!!! While policies here may not be ideal, there is at least an avenue to voice a dissent without overt fear of life or liberty. This may not have been the case 15-20 years ago, but with the advent of social media, the likelihood still may exist BUT is somewhat held in check.
I do no claim to know what's best for everyone. But at least from what I can see and experience, I and my family can go out in the evenings and come back late without fear that something untowards will happen to us. That's because there is a viable if not perfect govt. that is at least not paralyzed into inaction, trying to win votes every 6 or 18 months. The role of govt. is to govern, sometimes badly but hopefully well to the point that the citizen reap the benefit of the trust that they have entrusted to the incumbent govt. That I'm afraid is another topic of discussion.

Coming back to your retort, we all go back to our father for guidance whenever the need arises do we not?

 

[Grago]

There's a distinction between the two countries that they led after all. Malaysia is a corrupt, developing country. Singapore, on the contrary, is a modern, prosperous money laundering hub.

AAAHHH, but that' s capitalism at work for you. It may come under other so called style of governance i.e. communism or to put it politely, Socialism, however it exists Globally, unfortunately.........

 

[whoami]

Mahathir has long been criticised by the West by taking this stance. On the contrary, Lee took the same view but the West kowtowed to him.

Mahathir dont kowtow to the West, especially to US.

Mahathir is right in taking his stance especially during the 97 Asian Fin crisis when he introduced capital control and peg $3.80 to a Dollar. No need to borrow funds fm IMF. And i still remember Richard Hu, commented tat Mahathir is not doing the right thing, if my memory serves me right. Hmm.....

While I live under his roof, his rules. I have my own roof now and own children, MY Rules....

Yup! Happy for u. And dont share to much good things over at MY with those scepticals fm tiny red dot.

 

[steffychun]

There's a distinction between the two countries that they led after all. Malaysia is a corrupt, developing country. Singapore, on the contrary, is a modern, prosperous money laundering hub.

Prosperous with negative birth rate

 

[steffychun]

Mahathir dont kowtow to the West, especially to US.

Mahathir is right in taking his stance especially during the 97 Asian Fin crisis when he introduced capital control and peg $3.80 to a Dollar. No need to borrow funds fm IMF. And i still remember Richard Hu, commented tat Mahathir is not doing the right thing, if my memory serves me right. Hmm.....

Where is Richard Hu now?

 

[Cruxx]

While I live under his roof, his rules. I have my own roof now and own children, MY Rules....

How does it feel having the freedom and power to impose your own rules? Any idea why so many have sacrificed their lives, fighting for democracy?

I have seen my childhood friends who have had very "understanding" parents die off drug overdose, drink and Carousing and generally behaving as if they did not responsibilities to the point that the family struggles to make ends meet. Trying to console parents of friends who have "left the path". what do you tell them when they tell you "why can't he be a bit like you".......

I've relatives who went off the track under the strict, "disciplined" control of their parents too. If only their parents were more understanding of the growing pains of their children rather than to persist in the archaic Chinese belief of children being the property of parents, the tragedy in their family would have been averted. I'm sorry but your dogmatic faith in the exceptionalism of authority is not supported by reality.

Expand that, do you think you would have done equally as well as Dr. M, given the opportunity

Do you think 28 million Malaysians are so dumb that they need a Dr Mahathir or a Lee Kuan Yew to dictate their lives? Lee Kuan Yew's ignorance and incompetence have been exposed so many times. Only brainwashed sinkies like you would worship him as some kinda demigod.

But what I'm trying to point out, is basically most of us were brought up responsibly by our parents, some not so, and if you let everyone to do their own "thing" there will be chaos.

Indeed. Just look at the number of human beings that governments had killed in the 20th century when they did their own thing unrestrained: 60 million in the USSR, 5 million Jews during the Holocaust, 34 million during Mao Zedong's reign.

The so called "Quest for Democracy" has degenerated into atrocities and blood shed. Would you like to see that here in Singapore for the sake of DEMOCRACY!!!

I'm sure there are no atrocities and blood shed in undemocratic North Korea and China today. Democracy doesn't kill. Violent people do. Do you want me to enumerate every single peaceful transition to democracy for the past 100 years?

While policies here may not be ideal, there is at least an avenue to voice a dissent without overt fear of life or liberty. This may not have been the case 15-20 years ago, but with the advent of social media, the likelihood still may exist BUT is somewhat held in check.

I don't know about you but I would demand more from the world highest paid politicians than policies that are less than ideal and the mere freedom to use the internet.

But at least from what I can see and experience, I and my family can go out in the evenings and come back late without fear that something untowards will happen to us. That's because there is a viable if not perfect govt. that is at least not paralyzed into inaction, trying to win votes every 6 or 18 months.

The residents of liberal democracies such as Switzerland, Germany, Norway can do the same too. What's your point?

Coming back to your retort, we all go back to our father for guidance whenever the need arises do we not?

Guidance? That would be too democratic. No, what we need are know-it-all fathers telling children what to do. Fathers know best.

AAAHHH, but that' s capitalism at work for you. It may come under other so called style of governance i.e. communism or to put it politely, Socialism, however it exists Globally, unfortunately.........

Seems like my rhetoric is too subtle for the Sinkie mind.

 

[Grago]

Mahathir dont kowtow to the West, especially to US.

Mahathir is right in taking his stance especially during the 97 Asian Fin crisis when he introduced capital control and peg $3.80 to a Dollar. No need to borrow funds fm IMF. And i still remember Richard Hu, commented tat Mahathir is not doing the right thing, if my memory serves me right. Hmm.....

In doing so gave ASIANS, particularly Malaysians, a sense of pride, BUT I suspect it was all SHOW. I doubt the US would allow such show of defiance without consequence........ eg. Those fallen despots who were once allies!!!

 

[jw5]

I've relatives who went off the track under the strict, "disciplined" control of their parents too.

Some parents are even bigger idiots than their moronic badly brought up children.

 

[Cruxx]

Some parents are even bigger idiots than their moronic badly brought up children.

But so many brainwashed, unthinking Sinkies wanna surrender their lives to these idiots at the top.

 

[jw5]

But so many brainwashed, unthinking Sinkies wanna surrender their lives to these idiots at the top.

Since they are already idiots, don't expect them to do much thinking and don't be surprised that they are easily brainwashed.

 

[Narong Wongwan]

No truer words spoken.

Down size to the family unit, would you allow your child to tell you what they would like you to do rather then you being the parent, guiding them to do the right things!!!!!

What kind of dumbfuck analogy is this?

Pap or the govt of the day is not my father.
They did not give me life or give birth to me.
My father's house belongs to him, Singapore does not belong to the govt of the day...she belongs to me and my fellow Singaporeans.
The govt is chosen by the people to lead us, if they cannot lead then we will replace them with others who can. They are not our father neither are we their children.
Get this into your brain washed mind if you can.

 

[whoami]

How does it feel having the freedom and power to impose your own rules? Any idea why so many have sacrificed their lives, fighting for democracy?

I wonder whether it was the right thing to do when late Suharto was overthrown in the name of reformasi? Yes, we all know his childens were corrupted here and tere. But look at it this way. During Late Suharto reign was better or now? Yes, the indonesians got their "freedom" now. But are they happy? Look at the Rupiahs...and millions are presently jobless.

 

[kingrant]

All forms of government are bad. Only democracy is the least.