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SDP will withdraw.

ChaoPappyPoodle

Alfrescian
Loyal
Voters will be cautious and are not seeking to replace govt. They are trying to rein in the PAP and get them to be more accountable.

As long as the PAPzis keep on getting money-faced, low calibre personalities to join their party there will be no accountability because the rot has set in for decades. The only solution is a complete change of the piping system since the system is not able and are not willing to put in the effort to clean the pipes. How many PAPzi MPs have made sacrifices versus those that are there for monetary gain and power.

The Malaysians have done well to group their resources to have BN voted out. Singapore politics has not matured and there are too many idiots and selfish people in every party to make any significant change here. The sooner people realize that there is only one way to change the PAPzis and that is by making them change by voting them out then Singapore can have a new a vigirous political system. With a new political system there will be changes to foreign employment here, housing costs, transportation services and costs, health care and costs, CPF and all these will be positive changes that puts the people first instead of sacrificing taxes to pay for PAPzo minions to the tune of billions upon billions.
 

SgParent

Alfrescian
Loyal
Why you so anti-SDP? I thought you were the "competition always always benefits the consumers" guy?

With CSJ/SDP latest "stunt" which reinforced my suspicion about their agenda, I dun see how I am now inconsistent with my consistent wish for competition that always, always benefits the consumers.

Do you?
 

SgParent

Alfrescian
Loyal
Since the performance of SDP in 2006 and 2011 are so wildly inconsistent, there is no actual way to tell how well the SDP is doing now. If they were to contest, it's extremely hard to tell.

Could SDP's inconsistency due to their inconsistent engagement on the ground?
 

SgParent

Alfrescian
Loyal
The other way to look at it is that SDP is the most improved party at the 2011 general elections. In 2006 they were polling in the 20s. Now they could get almost 40% in a GRC. At this rate by 2016 they would be winning landslides.

Does that mean in a few more GEs, SDP will get 100% votes anywhere they contest?
 

metalmickey

Alfrescian
Loyal
With CSJ/SDP latest "stunt" which reinforced my suspicion about their agenda, I dun see how I am now inconsistent with my consistent wish for competition that always, always benefits the consumers.

Do you?

Yes. Your statement that competition always always benefits the consumers means that you encourage multi-corner fights because that is more competition.

There is no need for me to speculate on how well the SDP is doing because 1 month from now we will know for sure.
 

SgParent

Alfrescian
Loyal
No threat had been cast,

That depends on who side you are on.

If we assume there was no threat, then act of publishing the content means CSJ/SDP slapped WP in the face WITHOUT warning. Which is worse.


CSJ only request WP to meet and negotiate. .

Maybe I was reading something else instead of the content of CSJ's request. But I thought I saw "INVITE" repeatedly.

In a normal World with common understanding of the English language, only a host INVITES a guest.
 

SgParent

Alfrescian
Loyal
SDP only think about themselves and didn't even bother to assess the ground sentiment. go look at the SDP facebook page, so many people asking them to back down.

Sure or not? SDP web master never do his job to remove such stupid comments?

Are they still there?
 

SgParent

Alfrescian
Loyal
Yes. Your statement that competition always always benefits the consumers means that you encourage multi-corner fights because that is more competition.

In a market where the monopoly has absolute control of just about everything, there is no competition to talk about. Even if there is, it is artificial ones, cannibalism among the many much smaller fish. This point has been well elaborated by many already.


There is no need for me to speculate on how well the SDP is doing because 1 month from now we will know for sure.

Their latest "stunt" is just like a rerun of those "hunger strike", "loudhailer" incidents decades ago. I dun need another day to see where these are all going.
 

SgParent

Alfrescian
Loyal
Let's face it, the letter has been widely viewed as being rude.
It is rude in any context, but more so in an Asian context.

Well said. Agree.

So what would any fake 40% tried to twist and turn on something so obvious? In this time and age, does such propaganda/whitewashing still work anymore?
 

metalmickey

Alfrescian
Loyal
In a market where the monopoly has absolute control of just about everything, there is no competition to talk about. Even if there is, it is artificial ones, cannibalism among the many much smaller fish. This point has been well elaborated by many already.

A market is not a monopoly, a monopoly is not a duopoly, a duopoly is not full competition. When people talk about competition, it really means competing between many many people and not just two. I hope you're aware of that and not merely bluffing when you say you know economics.

So, more competition always always benefits the consumers, except when the competitor is SDP, except when there is a three corner fight, except when there is paralysis by analysis.

You have asked me to argue with you 10 times and 10 times I have refused because I do not argue with people who can use "always always" and "except" in the same sentence.
 

PTADER

Alfrescian
Loyal
How can LTK be a Chinese Chauvinist when he is surrounded in the CEC by a vociferous Indian, Malay, English educated colleagues? How can he be a Chinese Chauvinist when he started as an only Teo Chew and Mandarin speaking politician, forced himself to learn English and now only speaks English in parliament? Before using this as an excuse to play racial politics, think carefully before you speak.

15 years after JBJ brought him into the WP and after his re-election in the January 1997 elections (I can't be sure of the date and will have to check the recordings but believe it to be sometime in September/October 1997), Low Thia Khiang started showing his chauvinism, disloyalty and true colours.

The old guards in the WP were startled and alarmed to hear his chauvinistic and brazenly racist views and disparaging remarks about Singapore minorities (Malay and Indian) culture, practices and heritage and also his disdain for English educated Chinese Singaporeans (like us, the old guards) who he felt had no respect for the Chinese culture, language and heritage.

It was also about this time that LTK started his whispering campaign (in Mandarin no less!) against JBJ.

The old guards (including yours truly) realised, much to our shock and dismay, that JBJ had brought in a Chinese Chauvinist into the Workers Party. We warned JBJ and our Indian and Malay colleagues about LTK. JBJ was urged to sack Low Thia Khiang lest his racism and chauvinism affected the WP standing amongst the minority Malay and Indian communities. However, even after listening to the recordings, JBJ was loathed to do so fearing the WP would alienate the Chinese educated ground if the WP did so. JBJ also stubbornly refused to believe that Low Thia Khiang was disloyal to him, backstabbing him and was plotting behind his back to remove him. LTK even had the temerity to try convince the old guards who were intensely loyal to JBJ that JBJ's Sri Lankan Tamil heritage was a drag on the Workers Party.

It took the WP old guards 15 years (after JBJ first brought him into the WP in 1982) to discover Low Thia Khiang's well hidden racism and racial chauvinism and for him to emerge from his racial closet. Hence, I am not surprised that you and your younger WP members are still unaware of Low's sinocentric world view and how he sees and disparages Singapore's minorities, their culture and their practices through his racist and chauvinist eyes.

But rest assured, we will continue to unmask this Chinese Chauvinist. We will continue to warn our Malay and Indian brothers and sisters about the well hidden but pungent world view of this Chinese Chauvinist.
 
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Fook Seng

Alfrescian (Inf)
Asset
Let's face it, the letter has been widely viewed as being rude.
It is rude in any context, but more so in an Asian context.

When you invite somebody you have good things to offer somebody. What does SDP have for WP? The possibility of not contesting in PE? And what does it have to offer WP if SDP insists on contesting and wants WP to get out? I don't think there is anything.

When you invite someone and you have nothing really concrete to offer, in common language that is not invite. That is summon. These people need to respect people before they can talk about governing people.
 
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metalmickey

Alfrescian
Loyal
When you invite somebody you have good things to offer somebody. What does SDP have for WP? The possibility of not contesting in PE? And what does it have to offer WP if SDP insists on contesting and wants WP to get out? I don't think there is anything.

When you invite someone and you have nothing really concrete to offer, in common language that is not invite. That is summon. These people need to respect people before they can talk about governing people.

I think you have to compare

A: SDP just ownself go compete in BE
B: SDP go compete in BE but offered to talk to WP first.

You don't like A, you don't like B, but you still have to say that B is less bad than A. Personally I think that if WP thinks there is nothing to talk about, and doesn't engage in the dialogue, that is not unreasonable either. It is just for wayang, it could even be a trap.

If you want to borrow something, and you asked the guy, and even if the guy didn't respond and you take it, it is strictly not really borrowing, but at least it is not stealing either.
 

PTADER

Alfrescian
Loyal
Why don't you force yourself to learn to speak and read Chinese as a token of your support for racial harmony?

What makes you think I don't although I must admit I failed in Mandarin. But my Hokkien is lumber one.

Many years ago, people like yours truly were allowed to study Malay as a second language. As such, I am very fluent in Malay and proud of it. In fact, Malay, much to Low's dismay and annoyance, was taught to Chinese in schools as a national language subject.

As a Chinese, my small contribution to racial harmony is to stand up for the Malays and Indians against the "Guess the race" WP racists and bigots and against Chinese Chauvinism such as that held by Low Thia Khiang.
 

metalmickey

Alfrescian
Loyal
15 years after JBJ brought him into the WP and after his re-election in the January 1997 elections (I can't be sure of the date and will have to check the recordings but believe it to be sometime in September/October 1997), Tang Liang Hong started showing his chauvinism, disloyalty and true colours.

No doubt that WP is a more Chinese speaking place than SDP, PAP or even NSP.

How will WP hope to appeal to a more Malay place like Joo Chiat? Is this why they left Marine Parade to NSP? They are in the East which is more Malay. Do you think that LTK has changed his mind on the minorities in the meantime?

How do you explain Pritam Singh? Aljunied was required to have 1 minority. It now has two.

You have the recordings? Why talk about the recordings if you don't intend to actually leak them out on youtube?
 

jw5

Moderator
Moderator
Loyal
What makes you think I don't although I must admit I failed in Mandarin. But my Hokkien is lumber one.

Many years ago, people like yours truly were allowed to study Malay as a second language. As such, I am very fluent in Malay and proud of it. In fact, Malay, much to Low's dismay and annoyance, was taught to Chinese in schools as a national language subject.

As a Chinese, my small contribution to racial harmony is to stand up for the Malays and Indians against the "Guess the race" WP racists and bigots and against Chinese Chauvinism such as that held by Low Thia Khiang.

The person you should speak to is Pritam Singh.
Ask him why he was included in the Aljunied GRC team when the obligatory minority slot was already taken by Faisal.
You might learn something about yourself after speaking to him.
 

watchman8

Alfrescian
Loyal
Rapist and murderer are different. Rapists has victims, murderer has dead bodies. Racist is just a thought. You cannot cover up your actions as easily as your thoughts. Even keeping a secret like being gay (this is called staying in the closet) is difficult. I was reading the Steve Jobs biography and Tim Cook (former COO and now CEO of Apple) was described as unmarried. I laughed because it's quite well known that he's gay.

What a person is like, what a person is thinking, you never know. I give you one real life example, George Bush 2, former governor of Texas. When he was governer, he behaved like a moderate conservative. Everybody thought he was going to be a moderate conservative as a president. When he became president, he turned out to be extremist conservative.
You just prove yourself wrong. In all these public figures you cited, all of them eventually show their true self, voluntarily or not. LTK is a known public figure in Singapore for two decades. He's recognized everywhere he goes. There is not a shred of evidence for more than two decades in spite of widespread availability of recording devices. Out of the blue right before a by election, an anonymous post on sammyboy says he is a racist, and you choose to believe. Are you that gullible?

In sammyboy, we can joke that pinky is gay, but we all know there is no evidence to prove it for more than three decades. Would a reasonable man truly believe that pinky is really a gay, or even say that there is still a chance that pinky is gay?

There has to be a line drawn, otherwise you can go insane and start to suspect everything without any evidence over prolonged period of time. For example you can suspect, without any evidence for years, that your spouse is cheating on you, or your son is sleeping with your maid.

BTW, George bush II is not even close to ultra conservative. He raised taxes and run deficits. Being conservative does not mean being trigger happy. That requires stupidity.
 
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