Excellent post from one of the numerous sammyboy clone forums on the Delphi platform

[Leongsam]

Most of the new hosts seem to have limited intellect and don't have a clue what they want in the first place... much less actually going about achieving anything.

However, this guy has actually invested loads of time and effort into penning this lengthy preamble...

http://forums.delphiforums.com/anymos/messages/?msg=2.1

[FONT=tahoma,arial,helvetica,sans-serif]Dear forumers,

This forum is created as a bridging forum to allow Sammyboymod(Sam's Alfresco Coffeeshop) alumni to gather and keep in contact through the Delphiforums platform.

Most who have visited Sam's new www.sammyboy.com kopitiam forum will know that it is nothing impressive upfront - just the same old VBulletin software used by another gazillion forums out there.

Here're my reasons/rationalization of why I prefer to stick to Delphiforums:

1. I like the Delphi interface - much more than the VBulletin format. This is subjective, but I believe many others feel the same way.


2. I'd trust Delphiforums more than I trust the person or group operating behind the moniker LeongSam('Sam Leong'). Delphi is a US-based company. As most know, the US has stronger free speech and privacy laws than most other countries in the world. I don't have to say much about Singapore. The problem with Sam Leong, intentions and character aside, is that I don't know where exactly he operates from, under which country's jurisdiction he comes under. Sam has repeatedly claimed to live and work out of an HDB flat in Toa Payoh. That's supposedly in jest, but therein lies the problem, we have ABSOLUTELY no idea who/where the person/group Sam Leong is/operates from.

In any case, assuming Delphi cannot be trusted (actually we can't and should not fully trust anyone), we have at least been using it, and for old-timers continuing to use it, entails no more risk of being 'sold out' then previously. Migrating to a new forum entails further risks - is it worth it to do so for a disappointingly run-of-the-mill one despite the 'Sam Leong' brand ?


3. As an aside, here's my personal take on Sam Leong:

a) Most old-timers will probably agree with me on this - the current Sam Leong does not seem to be the old Sam Leong. How do I know ? Language, style, wit.... it's hard to pin down exactly what, but something's lacking in the current LeongSam's ability to retort and give witty rejoinders that are the hallmarks of the 'original' LeongSam. Meanwhile, the stale "advice/advise" lessons continue to be flogged as a dead horse.

The current one has also been saying that he is a 'new' LeongSam, doesn't like porn (could be true since he stopped using sammyboy.com as a porn site), blah blah blah.... This could be in jest, but there's probably quite a bit of truth there.


b) I do not like the way LeongSam has orchestrated this move to his sammyboy.com site. He revealed that the new site was being planned about 1 year ago. Then he said both will operate concurrently. Then suddenly, [/FONT][FONT=tahoma,arial,helvetica,sans-serif]a few days ago,[/FONT][FONT=tahoma,arial,helvetica,sans-serif] he shuts the Delphi kopitiam down. Yeah many saw it coming, but the pattern of inconsistencies and lies/half-truths has surfaced over time. This shifty behaviour is something I don't quite like.

When asked over the past year, why it took so long, he said it took time to plan for the new forum, blah blah. Now what we see is a run-of-the-mill Vbulletin forum not unlike the many proliferating out there. Again, this really sounds like typical government bureacracy at work - long time to deliver, excuses, inconsistencies, doesn't listen to customers/users (many like the Delphi interface), and then at the end, they deliver a #### off-the-shelf product tendered by the lowest* bidder.[/FONT]
[FONT=tahoma,arial,helvetica,sans-serif] (* ok not exactly the lowest but you get the drift).


c) Having said all this, I do not personally believe Sam Leong is going to outright sell us out, or is necessarily a government agent. I believe the motivation is simply money money money, his own site, his own online ads, his income.

The old Sam could have sold his online assets to this new Sam, whose primary motive is profit - not a very comforting thought for the more vociferous ones amongst us prone to making vituperative posts about the government.

Or it could still be the same old one (albeit, as I said above, a quite different and subdued one from the past Sam - old age perhaps ?) So, it is still possible, plausible that the old/original Sam Leong simply got tired of being a pornster, and decided to switch. Another factor: it is getting harder and less profitable to run an online porn biz. Proliferation of free or pirated porn sites/videos, might have caused his porn site profit/revenue to drop (a check on Alexa shows dropping traffic over the past months). This general phenomenon has been reported in news articles as far back as a few years ago too.

Having said all the above, I must say Sam's(old+new) setting up and running of the Alfresco Coffeeshop has been one of the best things to happen on the local online forum scene. Take a look at the juvenile posts in fuckwarezone.com and you'll know what I mean.
[/FONT]
[FONT=tahoma,arial,helvetica,sans-serif]
4. Legal Muscle, Free Speech and Privacy Concerns. Assuming we could trust Sam (and his good character ;-), in terms of not being sold out for profit, we should recognize that he(or the group behind) probably does not have as much resources as Delphi to fight legal battles over privacy and free speech issues with the government should the need arise.

Sam, with his own site(sammyboy.com) is accountable and has the responsibility to answer to any request(especially a legal one) to provide IP addresses and email addresses of users/posters as logged in his servers. While the server hosts may be in a different location and even be third party hosts(ISPs), the registrant/owner of the domain sammyboy.com holds the ultimate responsibility. The fact that the site might be hosted in the US accords no protection when the owner(s) of the websiite come under local jurisdiction.

Delphi has many more other forums visited by citizens of other countries, in particular US citizens (although it is known that a large proportion of traffic comes from Singapore). Any revelation of identity, be it [/FONT][FONT=tahoma,arial,helvetica,sans-serif]indiscriminate [/FONT][FONT=tahoma,arial,helvetica,sans-serif]or through an official capitulation without putting up a good fight will have grave PR repercussions and could hit its business hard.

A sell-out, whether willingly or forced, by Sam, if publicized, will put his website(s) at risk of losing much traffic too, but the quantum and magnitude of profit at risk would be much less than Delphi's, so it is questionable whether Sam would put up as vigourous a fight as Delphi when challenged.
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[FONT=tahoma,arial,helvetica,sans-serif]With that, I leave you to decide if it is wise to leave the Delphiforums platform.[/FONT]
[FONT=tahoma,arial,helvetica,sans-serif]Comments welcome. [/FONT]

 

[Leongsam]

Re: Excellent post from one of the numerous sammyboy clone forums on the Delphi platf

BTW how many people here grew up in sinkieland in the 70s?

Remember what happened when the Waterloo St Indian Rojak stall was forced to move from it's original location across the road from the St Joseph School field.

Within weeks, a whole host of "Original Waterloo St India Rojak" stalls sprouted up all over the Island. Nobody ever pinned down the genuine article. Every stall operator would claim that he was the only genuine article.

The sammyboy forum saga is almost identical. The shutdown of the "one and only" has spawned about 20 new "originals" in less than THREE DAYS!...all claiming to be offer the best chance of recapturing the sammyboy spirit.:p

Uniquely Sinkieporean? You tell me!

 

[jbsmith]

Re: Excellent post from one of the numerous sammyboy clone forums on the Delphi platf

Sam,

Would you mind to answer the concerns (highlighted in red)?

2. I'd trust Delphiforums more than I trust the person or group operating behind the moniker LeongSam('Sam Leong'). Delphi is a US-based company. As most know, the US has stronger free speech and privacy laws than most other countries in the world. I don't have to say much about Singapore. The problem with Sam Leong, intentions and character aside, is that I don't know where exactly he operates from, under which country's jurisdiction he comes under. Sam has repeatedly claimed to live and work out of an HDB flat in Toa Payoh. That's supposedly in jest, but therein lies the problem, we have ABSOLUTELY no idea who/where the person/group Sam Leong is/operates from.

 

[Leongsam]

Re: Excellent post from one of the numerous sammyboy clone forums on the Delphi platf

Sam,

Would you mind to answer the concerns (highlighted in red)?

Me? I'm just a humble Singaporean who lives in a rented room in Toa Payoh. :p

 

[jbsmith]

Re: Excellent post from one of the numerous sammyboy clone forums on the Delphi platf

Me? I'm just a humble Singaporean who lives in a rented room in Toa Payoh. :p

That is not a honest answer.

 

[Leongsam]

Re: Excellent post from one of the numerous sammyboy clone forums on the Delphi platf

That is not a honest answer.

Whatever I write here is just words. If you want to know what's going on with any domain, do a whois.

 

[ahbengsong]

Re: Excellent post from one of the numerous sammyboy clone forums on the Delphi platf

Much like the bubble tea euphoria.... expect the sbf wannables to spring up.... the only concern is the one hosted by marksimone which old timers know its cheapjustice aka tong hyui koh...

I'll stick to this new forum meanwhile..... rather be taken to task by sgp government [if they really bother to] than blackmail by a conman host....

beng [the original]

 

[jbsmith]

Re: Excellent post from one of the numerous sammyboy clone forums on the Delphi platf

Whatever I write here is just words. If you want to know what's going on with any domain, do a whois.

I have done that. :p

IP: 208.79.202.26

66.40.15.181
66.40.15.241

Answer:

 

[Leongsam]

Re: Excellent post from one of the numerous sammyboy clone forums on the Delphi platf

I have done that. :p

IP: 208.79.202.26

66.40.15.181
66.40.15.241

That's an IP lookup, if you do a domain whois, you'll get all the info regarding the domain... who owns it... where it is registered. where the servers are located etc etc.

 

[jbsmith]

Re: Excellent post from one of the numerous sammyboy clone forums on the Delphi platf

That's an IP lookup, if you do a domain whois, you'll get all the info regarding the domain... who owns it... where it is registered. where the servers are located etc etc.

I did that before the IP lookup.

 

[Leongsam]

Re: Excellent post from one of the numerous sammyboy clone forums on the Delphi platf

I did that before the IP lookup.

Don't ask forum nicks questions on internet forums. All you'll get is a load of bull. :p

A bit of research and the answers can be tracked down easily.

 

[ahbengsong]

Re: Excellent post from one of the numerous sammyboy clone forums on the Delphi platf

IP: 208.79.202.26
City: Glen Allen
StateProv: VA
PostalCode: 23059
Country: US



Administrative Contact:
leong, samuel [email protected]
Harold Rose Associates
209, great south road
auckland, ni 1709
US

 

[scroobal]

Re: Excellent post from one of the numerous sammyboy clone forums on the Delphi platf

Most of the new hosts seem to have limited intellect and don't have a clue what they want in the first place... much less actually going about achieving anything.

However, this guy has actually invested loads of time and effort into penning this lengthy preamble...

http://forums.delphiforums.com/anymos/messages/?msg=2.1

[FONT=tahoma,arial,helvetica,sans-serif]Dear forumers,

Both anymos and Otak are really swell guys with solid reputation. They however tend to be on the gullible side and tend not to read between the lines. You taking the piss out of forummers has a price as well.

 

[Leongsam]

Re: Excellent post from one of the numerous sammyboy clone forums on the Delphi platf

Both anymos and Otak are really swell guys with solid reputation. They however tend to be on the gullible side and tend not to read between the lines. You taking the piss out of forummers has a price as well.

They're loads of swell guys there for sure. I'd be happy if they moved here to share their wisdom.

The problem with the Delphi forum is that it became so devoid of humour and wit and so full of characters who seemed to take everything so seriously it simply wasn't funny! I can tell you that on some days, it looked like a life or death battle of galactic proportions.

The worst thing of all though were those attempted character assassinations, by anonymous ghosts, of people who were unfortunate enough to reveal their true identities. I really felt sorry for the victims regardless of their political affiliations. It was dirty politics at its worst and I was hosting it!:(

Then there were those awful threads started about Mrs Lee or the "Lau Gheko" ...urging her to die with the hope that she's suffer horribly before she kicked the bucket!!!! Good Gawd... what sort of people post such messages??? I can't believe they exist. It's one thing to take LKY to task for his policies. It's quite another to wish a horrible death upon a non political character in the twilight of her life who happened to be married to him. I mulled over deleting all those threads but I knew that if I did that, another 10 would spring up which I wouldn't be aware of so what was the point. I cringed and looked away and hoped for the best. That was the best I could do given the moderator tools Delphi offered.

What disgusted me even further is the perpetrators of such threads seemed to consider starting these horrendously nauseating threads to be a badge of honor! They were brave!. they were champions of free speech... they were taking on the establishment!.. from a position of an anonymous loser of course as none of them would ever have to balls to show up at a public event to expose their dislike for the govt in the real world. Cyberspace was (and is) their haven where they feel 10 feet tall. Real life is a different story altogether. Keyboard heros are alive and well in Sinkiepoor.

Today's forum participants draw a line in the sand and anyone who steps across is dead meat and a sworn enemy for life!!!!!!

In the good old days, many members would take me to task for my views while at the same time, following up with an email containing a "no hard feelings" message. People agreed to disagree in a civilized manner.

These days, I'd probably have a hitman at my doorstep if people could pin down which Toa Payoh apartment I was renting a room from.

Their resistance to what amounts to nothing more than a new platform run by the same old host they have been with for the last 9 years reveals alot about what makes these characters tick... or rather.. what doesn't.:p

All of them could be happily flaming each other and those damned pappies to death in this forum if they wanted to. However... the paranoia over what they perceive to be lack of anonymity transcends the boundaries of all reality! It certainly shows a shocking degree of ignorance of the net despite the fact that the current cyberspace structure has been around for more than a decade.

I have not even begun to go into the ridiculous talk about pappies buying forums for the purpose of IP address harvesting. I mean...duh.. come on!!! What are these people inhaling?? Has the SG govt REALLY screwed the minds of some people so badly that they are now consumed by a constant state of extreme paranoia? If that's the case, I feel really sorry for the Singaporeans and I say that in all honesty.

Oh well.. life goes on. I'm sure that with your intellect, you'll know exactly why I've moved here. I'll spell it out in as simple a manner as possible for the rest of the people who happen to read this thread:

1. I was getting really bored with whole forum and disgusted with the tone and the content and spent less and less time trying to keep order as I seldom read the crap. Delphi introduced no new features and didn't really seem interested in their forums either. I was reduced to fooling around with scripts that detected when "advice/advise" was not used appropriately. (I managed to get them to work quite well too)

2. I would regularly be accused of deleting threads and banning members that I had never even heard of. It turned out that the culprit was Delphi... not me. I was never kept in the loop.

3. I like fiddling with tech stuff. Vbulletin is great as it can be hacked and configured in a thousand and one ways.

4. A year or so ago, I decided that I would not be renewing my delphi plus membership forever and without plus membership, I can't run a forum. I lose admin status and the forum becomes ownerless. That's when I told everyone that I would be setting up a new forum.

5. I was contemplating just leaving the Delphi coffee shop with no owner and letting it drift along rudderless. However, I realised that without the power to administer the forum, I could still run foul of international copyright laws or even child porn laws if I could not control content and left it open for posting indefinitely.

6. I therefore decided to shift here and close the other forum from accepting new posts. Those who like it here are most welcome even if they hate my guts. If they want to abuse me, be my guest. :p

7. Those who prefer the Delphi format are welcome to go to the numerous Delphi sammyboy replacement forums that have sprung up.

8. I don't expect this forum to make any money at all. My aim is for it to break even. I am already covered for 6 months with my first sponsor. (see the sports/hobbies section banner). If it does make money, it will mean that traffic is heavy and that in turn will mean that I'll have to spend money on more servers to add to a load balancer daisy chain. If the forum gets too big, the database will need it's own server too.

9. I'm happily retired and set for life however long that may be... 10 / 15 years max is my guess as I enjoy doing dangerous things. Anything more will be a bonus. I don't need to SELL IP addresses in order to make ends meet.:p:p:p

Have a nice day everyone and enjoy the forum and all it's features. DELPHI SUCKS along with many of the losers that populated the delphi coffee shop and spewed their hatred towards the rest of the world.

 

[Big Sexy]

Re: Excellent post from one of the numerous sammyboy clone forums on the Delphi platf

It staggers me that people are still trying to play down the mess that was in the delphi forum...... that place was full of Shite... It's time to move on now and thankfully consign the Delphi issue to the dustbin of history.

Good natured banter is the way forward with perhaps the odd nasty insult just for fun which this forum will provide..

i hope you people will start to appreciate what Sam is doing....

 

[zhihau]

Re: Excellent post from one of the numerous sammyboy clone forums on the Delphi platf

In the good old days, many members would take me to task for my views while at the same time, following up with an email containing a "no hard feelings" message. People agreed to disagree in a civilized manner.

and i thought you mellowed over the last 2 years... :p

nonetheless, my humble 2 cents:

you've been running forums since mid90s~late90s if i'm not mistaken and you'd have known that the clones ain't a budding issue.

over the last 2 years in the old Delphi, it is certainly sad to see some good folks not posting anymore, am not sure if they were still hanging around to see if there were any improvement to the deteriorating situations back there... the clones didn't make anything better.

i reckoned that folks ought to learn to control their emotions a lil' better and they had better learn how to take a chill pill :p

looking forward to more great posts from the good folks from the past, i sincerely hope they would be injecting their valuable and honest opinions in this forum, so we all can continue to learn

 

[scroobal]

Re: Excellent post from one of the numerous sammyboy clone forums on the Delphi platf

They're loads of swell guys there for sure. I'd be happy if they moved here to share their wisdom.

The problem with the Delphi forum is that it became so devoid of humour and wit and so full of characters who seemed to take everything so seriously it simply wasn't funny! I tell you that on some days.. it looked like a life or death battle of galactic proportions.

Firstly, let me thank you for the wonderful ride over the years. Your tolerance and patience are unbelievable. SBF gave voice and it allowed dissent in a form that was unheard of. More importantly it was accessible to one and all. It even made Time Magazine. It became a valuable source for journalist for many years. Interestingly it became a barometer for some aspect of society.

Do agree that it became morbid when people bay for death. It became irresponsible when people will little understanding and education attempt to pass falsehoods about organ transplants. It became silly when conspiracy theories abound faster than a speeding bullet.

There are days when you have to laugh for the sake of sanity.

Hopefully this new life will reshape exchanges and behaviour without losing the gems that we know it for.

Till today, I doubt that the majority will realise that its the lack of censorship that drove the forum's success. It was real irony that your post in one of the SBF clone sites was deleted yesterday by one of the "swell guys". And he is still looking for brotherhood spirit.

 

[scroobal]

Re: Excellent post from one of the numerous sammyboy clone forums on the Delphi platf

and i thought you mellowed over the last 2 years... :p

looking forward to more great posts from the good folks from the past, i sincerely hope they would be injecting their valuable and honest opinions in this forum, so we all can continue to learn

I second that bro.

 

[scroobal]

Re: Excellent post from one of the numerous sammyboy clone forums on the Delphi platf

It staggers me that people are still trying to play down the mess that was in the delphi forum
Good natured banter is the way forward with perhaps the odd nasty insult just for fun which this forum will provide..
i hope you people will start to appreciate what Sam is doing....

Absolutely agree.

 

[SneeringTree]

Re: Excellent post from one of the numerous sammyboy clone forums on the Delphi platf

Thanks for this detailed post. But you know it won't stop those crazy conspiracy theorists. I think if anything, this new forum will have a better chance of keeping clones and cowards in check.